No announcement yet.

Combine Overrated?

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Combine Overrated?

    Didn't see this after a quick perusal of the forums. Sorry if it's a repost.

    Peter King is a guy whose analysis in most things is pretty lacking. However, he has excellent NFL sources and gets great info. I really agree with his and his contact's perspective here. Judge the football player, not the athlete.


    The Scouting Combine is coming ... but I wish you wouldn't get very excited about it.

    In my calls around the league in the last few days, I spoke to one club architect who shall remain nameless at his request. He told me his team had changed its way of doing business in the scouting realm this year, and his team's draft board is "90 percent set.''

    Quoth this architect: "You know why it's 90 percent set now? Because guys go to the Scouting Combine and they change their grade on a player based on things that have nothing to do with playing football. I'm convinced if you took the stopwatches away from a lot of these guys, most of 'em would not be able to tell you whether they liked a player or not.

    "These guys go out and watch players all fall, then we all watch the tape of all these guys, and we see what kind of football players they are. That's scouting. Who plays good football in pads? That's scouting. Now we need the combine for the medical evaluations and the personal baggage stuff. But don't come in after the combine and tell me you want to change some guy and move him way up because he ran faster than you thought he would. That's where you get in trouble, and that's why our draft board is pretty well set.''

    If I told you who this speaker was, you'd all say, "Whoa, we have to listen to this guy. We respect him.'' Just take my word for it. He's legit.

    I enjoy the combine. It gives me the chance to meet a lot of players I'll be covering in the future and to see people in the NFL and get team-by-team updates. It's valuable. But it's way overrated in terms of deciding who should get picked where in the draft, and it always will be.

  • #2
    Not one bit. It's pretty much teams sort out the noise, and the interviews are way more important than the show of workouts.


    • #3
      I agree it's mostly about the interviews I think. The stuff in the weight room and track usually is already sorted out on the feild.


      • #4
        Don't forget the medical examinations.

        I'd also like to add that nobody ever talks about the guys who boost their stock at the combine and do pan out in the NFL because everybody is too busy pretending that they were mega-stoked over Pat Willis before before he ran a 4.4 at his pro day (or whatever he ran).


        • #5
          It can be by some but the Scouting Combine definitely has its place in the evaluation process.

          It's a piece of the puzzle. It shouldn't be a major slice but it's ignorant to dismiss it completely.
          Scott Wright, President


          Draft Countdown Podcast, Every Tuesday at 8 PM EST
 and on iTunes


          • #6
            I for one enjoy the combine. I see where he is coming from, because cones can't tell you how good/ bad an NFL prospect is going to be. But I like watching it. It gives me insight.

            sig by fenikz
            Originally posted by ImBrotherCain
            You are just a terrible person.
            Originally posted by bigbluedefense
            I have an iPhone.


            • #7
              I think the Combine is valuable in differentiating between individual prospects. Say Prospect RB A and Prospect RB B both come from SEC schools, both played at a high level, have a similar style of play, etc. You have them ranked evenly, so they come into the Combine and Prospect RB A runs a 4.45 while Prospect RB B runs a 4.6. You now have a number that can be used to better place the two RBs on the big board.


              • #8
                The combine gets the attention it does because it's easily the largest blip on the map prior to the draft. There's no question that it should play a rather small role in talent evaluation, but a lot of teams will meet their prospective draftees for the first time, which is sort of a big deal.


                • #9
                  Definitely. The only things needed from the combine are height, weight, and injury evaluations.


                  • #10
                    I don't think it's overrated. Like someone said previously, it's a piece of the puzzle.

                    That said, I'd love it if the Chiefs stayed away from "workout warriors" completely. That's where I think teams get themselves into trouble.. falling for a guy with limited production but off the charts numbers. I know there have been a few drafted the last few years who fit into that category.

                    Originally posted by fenikz
                    His soft D really turns me off
                    ** RIP themaninblack. You will be missed. **


                    • #11
                      I enjoy watching it and everything but I do think it is overrated to an extent in the sense that it seems to be SOOO closely scrutinized by the media, fans, etc. I don't think real scouts put nearly as much stock into it as we do.

                      A recent example of this would be Andre Smith. After his 'showing'(or lack thereof) at the combine everyone was all up in arms and then when he ran at his pro day without a shirt on it seemed as though his draft stock had plummeted, yet he was still chosen 6th by my Bengals and ended up doing very well when he finally cracked the lineup after a holdout and subsequent foot injury.

                      I think everyone who watched him once he became acclimated came away impressed and there's very little reason to believe he's not going to be a successful player in this league.

                      Offensive Line coach Paul Alexander was quoted as such, "Andre is going to be a good player. He had a high percentage of ‘Wow blocks.’ He had some of the best pancakes I’ve ever seen."

                      ^A Bonekrusher production^
                      Gamertag= ELDUDERINO1165


                      • #12
                        I should have clarified, but I do think the combine is important for the interviews and medical evals. The other testing is interesting, and somewhat relevant.

                        I just tend to agree with what King's source said about setting their board based on what they see on tape. They weight the results of the combine with about a 10%. That's important in differentiating like players as someone mentioned earlier in the thread.

                        What jumps to mind is that Crabtree killed his top 5 status by acting like a prima dona last year.


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by JoeJoeBrown View Post
                          What jumps to mind is that Crabtree killed his top 5 status by acting like a prima dona last year.
                          The 49ers say thank you ;)


                          • #14
                            I think the combine gets hyped by the media and "draftniks" as it is the only singularly "draft" thing that happens between the end of the regular season and the actual draft. Its no televised, its draft talk 24 hours a day while it is going on and people get excited.

                            That being said - the combine serves a purpose. The major purpose would be interviews, injury examinations and then finally a few position drills. The actual "numbers" (40, Vertical, Cone drill ect.) are definitely the smallest factor of the event.

                            Something that really cant be quantified, but does stick out to scouts (IMO) is seeing who takes the process seriously. Who shows up in the best shape of their lives, who looks like they have been working, who is willing to participate and compete with the other guys. I think this small tidbit could be a determining factor between equally rated players.

                            The combine matters - it just doesnt matter as much as the media would like it to. That being said, the "amount" that it matters certainly changes from team to team with different draft philosophies.


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Scott Wright View Post
                              It can be by some but the Scouting Combine definitely has its place in the evaluation process.

                              It's a piece of the puzzle. It shouldn't be a major slice but it's ignorant to dismiss it completely.
                              King is full of sh-t. There isn't a GM or HC who doesn't want to see the prospects workout against each other before reaching a final decision. King had a close relationship with Matt Millen and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Millen put this idea into King's head. Certainly, somebody was pulling King's strings to make him look ridiculous and King fell for it.
                              If there is a GM who actually believes in this idea, I feel sorry for that team's fans but in every sport I guess there are some GM's who are idiots(see Matt Millen).
                              I've seen King make ridiculous statements before but this takes the cake and is beyond comprehension.
                              And proud of it!!!



                              Debug Information