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  • #31
    Originally posted by Modano View Post
    And you're trying to telling me that we need help in the redzone?!.
    Yes, I am.

    Originally posted by Modano View Post
    By the way, there's no way Rice is better than Bennett, Doucet or Jackson. And they're guys we can pick in next year's draft.
    We will see.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by robert_in_bigd View Post
      We don't have an alley option in our O. TO does not have the hands and Glenn does not have the size. Regardless, Rice's size brings a dimension we do not have and I would love to have.
      boy it just gets better with you, this is probably the most far fetched thing ive ever heard you say...oooo wow rice has size yay, its not like we dont have one of the best goal line backs in the NFL, one of the most complete TE's, and a WR who led the NFL in td receptions last yr...


      but your right, we could always get better in the redzone, as well as LT could be just a little bit faster....smh, your getting out of hand with these bold opinions as if your opinion holds some sort of weight around here that merits it being credible





      Originally posted by Scott Wright
      I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by robert_in_bigd View Post
        Yes, I am.

        why do we need 2 get better n the redzone, and please tell me whats an acceptable number of td's to score in a season, for us to be "fine" in the redzone, im just curious how many td's more we need to score this yr to not need help...because you know, what you say matters so much, and with your football knowledge its easy to see how you got a job on the field with a team, oh wait..





        Originally posted by Scott Wright
        I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by LonghornsLegend View Post
          boy it just gets better with you, this is probably the most far fetched thing ive ever heard you say...oooo wow rice has size yay, its not like we dont have one of the best goal line backs in the NFL, one of the most complete TE's, and a WR who led the NFL in td receptions last yr...

          but your right, we could always get better in the redzone, as well as LT could be just a little bit faster....smh, your getting out of hand with these bold opinions as if your opinion holds some sort of weight around here that merits it being credible
          To say I would draft Rice just for 2007 Red Zone is once again a distortion of the position. Completely and totally misses the point.

          To say, I think Rice could have contributed in 2007 in the red zone and developed in to a 1/2 in the coming years as TO and TG get old is a better way. Rice, Hurd, Austin is a nice 4,5,6 in 2007 and future 1/2/3.

          But I can't expect individuals involved in hyper sensitive emotionalism would understand a nuanced arguement. They just prefer to not read, not understand, react and attack.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by LonghornsLegend View Post
            boy it just gets better with you, this is probably the most far fetched thing ive ever heard you say...oooo wow rice has size yay, its not like we dont have one of the best goal line backs in the NFL, one of the most complete TE's, and a WR who led the NFL in td receptions last yr...


            but your right, we could always get better in the redzone, as well as LT could be just a little bit faster....smh, your getting out of hand with these bold opinions as if your opinion holds some sort of weight around here that merits it being credible
            Would you like to listen to a technical explanation to why a Rice type receiver would really help?

            It is very much linked to Romo not being able to follow through on his release because of his height and natural side armish release.

            ** hint **

            Comment


            • #36
              Well, if you guys don't like Spears...i'll give you the Browns entire starting DL for him!!! I am positive he is better than those old farts. Plus, we play the NE style 3-4 which means the DL doesn't really need be great in pass rush department, since that seems to be the problem with spears.

              DChess resizing inc.

              Reality is relative.

              We don't give a DAMN for the whole state of Michigan

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              • #37
                One of the reasons Tony does not step into his throws is his height and side arm release. He need the exta trajectory to avoid getting passes knocked down. Even with a passing lane, he seems to throw off his back foot (which is why I am upset with his progress).

                Inside the 10, a five or seven step drop is not the best option and usually one uses 3 step drops. Particularly in the Zampese/Coryell system.

                For Tony, a 3 step drop in the pocket inside the 10 means he is throwing toward the sidelines moreso than between the hashes. For Tony to throw between the hashes inside the 10 means an OL must open up throwing lanes for those slants and hook patterns.

                Getting throwing lans inside the ten is very very hard. DEs typically are lining up in a 5/7. DT are 1/3. LBers are not taking deep drops and frequently blitz to create more pressure. To boot, DL tend to get their hands up lots more b/c they know the passes will have a lower trajectory.

                **This is the one part of the field having a Carson Palmer is a huge advantage. At the point of release he probably has 6 inches over Tony (Height plus Arm Length plus over the top Release Point). A big differentiator.**

                So, Tony has a few options with better chances of postive plays -- passes outside the has mark and roll outs........

                Sidney Rice on a fade pattern is much more attractive than TO or Glenn. Particularly if you line up Rice on the narrow side of the field where lanes are tighter and maybe a TO on the wider side where a slant is still a possiblity.

                To think Tony is going to zip in slants ala Aikman Irvin inside the 5 is not likely. Fact is Troy had that play taken away from him by 1995/6 when D's learned how to defend it. And Troy was tall with a text book release and great accuracy.

                So, whatever. I am sure this is all baloney and Madden but figured I would try to explain a nuance of the game and why a Sidney Rice type for this team with a short QB and side arm release would be nice.

                That alley oop pass in the end zone worked well for Brees in SD and NO .. but he has the horses for the play -- Gates, Jackson, etc
                Last edited by robert_in_bigd; 09-04-2007, 06:54 PM.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Freddy G View Post
                  Well, if you guys don't like Spears...i'll give you the Browns entire starting DL for him!!! I am positive he is better than those old farts. Plus, we play the NE style 3-4 which means the DL doesn't really need be great in pass rush department, since that seems to be the problem with spears.
                  No, Spears has a problem in that NE 3-4 system... it's basically the same one Parcells ran. The Phillips 3-4 is an attacking style and that is what Spears has said fits him better. That is what we are all waiting to see... many have doubts. I hope he starts to show up on Sundays.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by robert_in_bigd View Post
                    One of the reasons Tony does not step into his throws is his height and side arm release. He need the exta trajectory to avoid getting passes knocked down. Even with a passing lane, he seems to throw off his back foot (which is why I am upset with his progress).

                    Inside the 10, a five or seven step drop is not the best option and usually one uses 3 step drops. Particularly in the Zampese/Coryell system.

                    For Tony, a 3 step drop in the pocket inside the 10 means he is throwing toward the sidelines moreso than between the hashes. For Tony to throw between the hashes inside the 10 means an OL must open up throwing lanes for those slants and hook patterns.

                    Getting throwing lans inside the ten is very very hard. DEs typically are lining up in a 5/7. DT are 1/3. LBers are not taking deep drops and frequently blitz to create more pressure. To boot, DL tend to get their hands up lots more b/c they know the passes will have a lower trajectory.

                    **This is the one part of the field having a Carson Palmer is a huge advantage. At the point of release he probably has 6 inches over Tony (Height plus Arm Length plus over the top Release Point). A big differentiator.**

                    So, Tony has a few options with better chances of postive plays -- passes outside the has mark and roll outs........

                    Sidney Rice on a fade pattern is much more attractive than TO or Glenn. Particularly if you line up Rice on the narrow side of the field where lanes are tighter and maybe a TO on the wider side where a slant is still a possiblity.

                    To think Tony is going to zip in slants ala Aikman Irvin inside the 5 is not likely. Fact is Troy had that play taken away from him by 1995/6 when D's learned how to defend it. And Troy was tall with a text book release and great accuracy.

                    So, whatever. I am sure this is all baloney and Madden but figured I would try to explain a nuance of the game and why a Sidney Rice type for this team with a short QB and side arm release would be nice.

                    That alley oop pass in the end zone worked well for Brees in SD and NO .. but he has the horses for the play -- Gates, Jackson, etc


                    saying sidney rice would of been nice for the team is one thing, saying we need help in the redzone is another, which is the phrase you chose to use, and was definately the wrong one...

                    i like sidney rice, would of liked the pick, but seeing as how wr is probably one of our deepest positions this yr it was necessary, but would i of welcomed him yes. would he of made in an impact at some point, probably...but i know your not proclaiming a rookie wr who has yet to play a real game yet the next great thing...and whether or not we took him, he's not the last good wr that will come out of the draft, and you cant get too much better then we were in the redzone...


                    But your term "we need help in the redzone" has nothing to do with your man crush for Rice, i know its fun for you to twist everyone's thoughts around to make you the bad guy like we dont listen to you, but half of the things you say are for reaction





                    Originally posted by Scott Wright
                    I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Rice will be better than doucet and bennet. That is fact.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by LonghornsLegend View Post
                        But your term "we need help in the redzone" has nothing to do with your man crush for Rice, i know its fun for you to twist everyone's thoughts around to make you the bad guy like we dont listen to you, but half of the things you say are for reaction
                        Not sure I wrote those words "need help in the redzone" but maybe ....

                        regardless the bigger point is ..... we could very much use a tall receiver with ball skills for 2007. It is a big help in the red zone, particularly for Tony. Rice could have been a contributor in 2007 and beyond.

                        But let us argue specifics without conceding broader points No comment over the analysis?

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by robert_in_bigd View Post
                          Not sure I wrote those words "need help in the redzone" but maybe ....
                          Post #31

                          it seems as if you're trying to pick fights, and while you do have some good points, whenever I read them its like somebody is yelling at me.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by robert_in_bigd View Post
                            That alley oop pass in the end zone worked well for Brees in SD and NO .. but he has the horses for the play -- Gates, Jackson, etc
                            You kidding, right? Brees didn't have Jackson, Jackson caught 3 passes (and 0 TD's) while Brees was in San Diego. Gates is 6-4 while Witten is 6-5. Brees had McCardell (6-1) and Eric Parker (6-0). I don't know how you get this "Brees had the horses for this play in San Diego".
                            The fact is, last year Romo and our offense were very good in the redzone. The only times Romo made mistakes in the endzone was because he tried to do too much.
                            Last year we scored 425 points (4th in the NFL and behind only San Diego, Chicago and Indianapolis), we scored 26 TD's through the air (5th in the NFL), even with Bledsoe starting the first games of the season.
                            But still you think that Romo's height combined with his realease etc it's a problem in the redzone and we need a Sidney Rice type of receiver.
                            Looking at last year, this is simply not true. Even if your right about Romo, we still did't have problems scoring. We don't need to improve our scoring, we were one of the best team in scoring last year, and Romo was in his first season as a starter.
                            Romo doesn't need that type of receiver, he didn't have that type of receiver last year. Your argument could make sense if he had troubles finding his men in the endzone, or if our team had troubles trying to score. But we were one of the better team in scoring, both through the ground and throug the air.
                            And TO is money in the redzone, he is so physical that is very hard for a DB to not allow him to make a catch in the corner of the endzone. I think this is the play you call "alley oop pass", and TO was very effective for all his career in this type of passes.


                            In Bob We Trust

                            John Madden's wedding video business

                            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ddPHJWkPvU

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                            • #44
                              I would be all for Spears moving to NT, since he has shown nothing since getting drafted.

                              And sorry, bro....

                              Elam is not better at anything football related than Roy Williams.

                              I dont want to get into the middle of anyone's feud...but I can not think of anyone that I would consider football savy that would agree with Elam being better than Roy.

                              Not one.
                              Last edited by HEISMANHERSCHEL; 09-05-2007, 04:28 AM.
                              I published my first book. Available in ebook or paperback! Check it out!!!

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                              • #45
                                By the way, I love the title to this thread. Spears WEARS ME OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                                I published my first book. Available in ebook or paperback! Check it out!!!

                                http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/afte...man/1114044540

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