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-   -   Does Al Harris deserve a Pro-Bowl bid (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1107)

PackerMang 12-17-2006 10:16 PM

Does Al Harris deserve a Pro-Bowl bid
 
He is the packers best DB, even though woodson (who also might make the probowl) has more picks (Tied for 1st in NFL with 6) but Harris has constanlty shut down the #1 receiver of opponents (today, held Roy Wiliams to one catch for 11 yards and out fought him for a interception).
Teams don't pass against Harris or Woodson and we are poor against the pass because of our nickelback, LB and safeties not Harris or Woodson

sweetness34 12-17-2006 10:18 PM

No. From what I've heard and seen he hasn't been that great this season.

4pAc 12-17-2006 10:20 PM

I am going to be a homer and say yes

GB12 12-17-2006 10:28 PM

http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/v...ic.php?t=31018 could have gone in there.

Anyways in reply to sweetness, he started out slow and looked like he lost it big time. after the first couple weeks he has been great though and is probably having one of his best seasons.

Should he go - maybe
Will he go - No, probably an alternate again.

bearsfan_51 12-17-2006 10:44 PM

Considering that the Packers secondary is dogshit this year, and from what every Packers fan has said Charles Woodson has had a better year, I'm going to use my brain here and say no. It doesn't matter whose fault it is, if you're part of a miserable unit, you share the blame.

And again, this goes back to the argument that njx had that nobody could answer. A lot of the passing yards are going to wide recievers, if it's not the cornerbacks fault, who the hell is supposed to be covering these guys? You can't blame it all on the safties.

sodar21 12-17-2006 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
Considering that the Packers secondary is dogshit this year, and from what every Packers fan has said Charles Woodson has had a better year, I'm going to use my brain here and say no. It doesn't matter whose fault it is, if you're part of a miserable unit, you share the blame.

And again, this goes back to the argument that njx had that nobody could answer. A lot of the passing yards are going to wide recievers, if it's not the cornerbacks fault, who the hell is supposed to be covering these guys? You can't blame it all on the safties.

Didn't Denver have one of the worst Pass Ds last season? Doesn't seem to hurt Bailey's rep though.

bearsfan_51 12-17-2006 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sodar21
Quote:

Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
Considering that the Packers secondary is dogshit this year, and from what every Packers fan has said Charles Woodson has had a better year, I'm going to use my brain here and say no. It doesn't matter whose fault it is, if you're part of a miserable unit, you share the blame.

And again, this goes back to the argument that njx had that nobody could answer. A lot of the passing yards are going to wide recievers, if it's not the cornerbacks fault, who the hell is supposed to be covering these guys? You can't blame it all on the safties.

Didn't Denver have one of the worst Pass Ds last season? Doesn't seem to hurt Bailey's rep though.

Teams don't even try to throw on Bailey. You can't say that for Harris.

PackerMang 12-17-2006 11:06 PM

Since I never miss a packer game I can tell you for a fact that Harris completly shuts out the #1 receiver. It was the same story last year.
Tell me the last receiver that got more then 50 yards on him this year. I can't think of any.

The packers snub out the #1 but opponents take shots against our nickelback, Lb or safety. The fact that the packers give up a lot of passing yards doesn't reflect his play. He doesn't get the stats of pass breakups or Int because QB's don't look his way that often. He is a top bump and run, man-to-man cover guy.

bearsfan_51 12-17-2006 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerMang
Since I never miss a packer game I can tell you for a fact that Harris completly shuts out the #1 receiver. It was the same story last year.
Tell me the last receiver that got more then 50 yards on him this year. I can't think of any.

The packers snub out the #1 but opponents take shots against our nickelback, Lb or safety. The fact that the packers give up a lot of passing yards doesn't reflect his play. He doesn't get the stats of pass breakups or Int because QB's don't look his way that often. He is a top bump and run, man-to-man cover guy.

Al Harris covered Moose week 1. Here's his stat-line.

M. Muhammad- 6 catches-102 yards.

That took me about 4 seconds.

sweetness34 12-17-2006 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerMang
Since I never miss a packer game I can tell you for a fact that Harris completly shuts out the #1 receiver. It was the same story last year.
Tell me the last receiver that got more then 50 yards on him this year. I can't think of any.

The packers snub out the #1 but opponents take shots against our nickelback, Lb or safety. The fact that the packers give up a lot of passing yards doesn't reflect his play. He doesn't get the stats of pass breakups or Int because QB's don't look his way that often. He is a top bump and run, man-to-man cover guy.

Bernard Berrian and Moose toasted you guys in the first game, that's at least one dude. :?

Moose had 102 and Berrian had 50, well ok 49 but one yard.

Roy Williams had 138 against you guys in Week 3, should I go on or just stop while I'm ahead?

Pit Bull #53 12-17-2006 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerMang
Since I never miss a packer game I can tell you for a fact that Harris completly shuts out the #1 receiver. It was the same story last year.
Tell me the last receiver that got more then 50 yards on him this year. I can't think of any.

The packers snub out the #1 but opponents take shots against our nickelback, Lb or safety. The fact that the packers give up a lot of passing yards doesn't reflect his play. He doesn't get the stats of pass breakups or Int because QB's don't look his way that often. He is a top bump and run, man-to-man cover guy.

Al Harris covered Moose week 1. Here's his stat-line.

M. Muhammad- 6 catches-102 yards.

That took me about 4 seconds.

That was obviously because of the safeties and nickelback

sweetness34 12-17-2006 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pit Bull #53
Quote:

Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerMang
Since I never miss a packer game I can tell you for a fact that Harris completly shuts out the #1 receiver. It was the same story last year.
Tell me the last receiver that got more then 50 yards on him this year. I can't think of any.

The packers snub out the #1 but opponents take shots against our nickelback, Lb or safety. The fact that the packers give up a lot of passing yards doesn't reflect his play. He doesn't get the stats of pass breakups or Int because QB's don't look his way that often. He is a top bump and run, man-to-man cover guy.

Al Harris covered Moose week 1. Here's his stat-line.

M. Muhammad- 6 catches-102 yards.

That took me about 4 seconds.

That was obviously because of the safeties and nickelback

Yup. :roll: :lol:

P-L 12-17-2006 11:15 PM

Roy Williams slipped and fell to the ground on that INT, Harris hardly fought him for it. Harris' performance today had more to do with the poor offensive line of the Lions and the pass rush of the Packers. Any time a defense gets 6 sacks and is in the QB's face the whole game, the CB is going to look better. Now I'm not saying Harris had a bad game, but that pass rush combined with awful play by the Lions OL help him out.

sweetness34 12-17-2006 11:19 PM

Here you go PackerMang:

Week One: Moose 102 yards

Week Two: Joe Horn 88 yards

Week Three: Roy Williams 138 yards

Week Four: Reggie Brown 63 yards

Week Nine: Lee Evans 58 yards

I'll stop there.

Komp 12-17-2006 11:20 PM

bleeehhh
 
Considering there is a good chance either him or Deangelo Hall get into the ProBowl I will pick my poison with Harris.

sweetness34 12-17-2006 11:21 PM

Re: bleeehhh
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Komp
Considering there is a good chance either him or Deangelo Hall get into the ProBowl I will pick my poison with Harris.

DeAngelo Hall will not be in the Pro Bowl, and if he is it's a crime.

Shiver 12-18-2006 12:26 AM

Lee Evans beat Al Harris deep three times, but Losman only hit him once.

TitleTown088 12-18-2006 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiver
Lee Evans beat Al Harris deep three times, but Losman only hit him once.

are you sure that wasn't Manuels fault not harris's? Many of the yards roy willliams got in week 3 were when the safties were covering him... nick collins got burned for a long TD in that game, not harris. I dunno if he deserves it, he has been solid. I think woodson deserves it more than harris. The guy is playing injured every week and he still lead the NFL in takeaways at 7. but the thing with either one of these guys making the probowl is that they bolth are playing on one of the worst pass defenses in the NFL. thanks shotty.

remix 6 12-18-2006 05:53 AM

hes not tied for first in picks. before stats updated its 7. and now its 8 with Samuel and Bailey

TitleTown088 12-18-2006 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by remix 6
hes not tied for first in picks. before stats updated its 7. and now its 8 with Samuel and Bailey

yeah well when i was watching the game he was so oh well. Anyways those are bolth AFC guys.

ny10804 12-18-2006 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweetness34
Here you go PackerMang:

Week One: Moose 102 yards

Week Two: Joe Horn 88 yards

Week Three: Roy Williams 138 yards

Week Four: Reggie Brown 63 yards

Week Nine: Lee Evans 58 yards

I'll stop there.

It should be noted that Al Harris only played his side for weeks 1 through 3. From weeks 4 till now, he's been man with who the Packers determined was the team's best WR. Also, Charles Woodson has been on the 2nd WR, and thus his stats are better than Harris'.

bigbluedefense 12-18-2006 12:08 PM

NO!!!!!!!!! ENOUGH OF THIS AL HARRIS IS GOD ******** FROM PACKER FANS, ITS SICKENING, STOP IT ALREADY!!!!!

Newman, Sheppard, Brown, and Ronde Barber are all ahead of him.

someone447 12-18-2006 12:26 PM

I don't think Harris deserves it, he played SO bad the first couple of games that I think it takes him out of consideration. I haven't seen many games since week 4, but the ones I did, he played quite well. It IS the safeties and lbers that have been giving up the big plays. The Packers don't always play man coverage. No team ALWAYS plays man coverage. When they do, the top 2 recievers don't do a whole lot. But then the TE or the number 3 reciever just dominates Dendy and Poppinga.(How many non packer fans have even ever heard of those guys? Hell, how many packer fans have heard of them until the starting getting bent over in the passing game this year?) Then as soon as Woodson or Harris release the receiver to the safeties, well, that is the problem. Collins will occasionally make a play, and Manual, I don't know what the **** he does when a receiver comes in his general direction. He acts like he should be playing for St. Mary's School for the Blind and Deaf. Hell, there have been times when I am sure that I could cover better than he could. At least I am able to follow my responsibility. He always tends to double the short guy with the corner who released the outside man on a fade, and leave the guy going deep to be covered by air.

Guess what Big Blue, Roy Williams and Chad Johnson both have said he is one of the best corners in the league. I will say that I believe he is underrated here, but a lot of that is because there are so many people who overrate and act like he is the best corner of all time. So it kind of turns people off. There is a new Al Harris thread as often as there is a new Mike Vick thread. Both of whom are underrated by the majority of posters on this site, and overrated, by many of the others.

njx9 12-18-2006 12:30 PM

so you're actually saying that almost every single big play given up was by the safeties? are you implying that the packers now play almost exclusive cover 2, or are you just making lame excuses?

someone447 12-18-2006 12:35 PM

Have you watched the games? Just about every big play was given up by the safeties or the nickleback. NOT ALL, but most. Cover 2 isn't the only defense that has safeties deep... Most of the deep passes(in the games I have seen) were either when the packers were in Cover 2 or Cover 3, and many of them were deep posts that the player ran right by either of the safeties. Then when Ahmad Carrol was still on the team he gave up about 430195783214650912340176450726346529086309259230 pass yards. Now Patrick Dendy isn't much of an upgrade. Yes, both Harris and Woodson have given up some plays, BUT SO DOES EVERY CORNERBACK!!!


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