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-   -   Who should be Number 2? (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43054)

soybean 10-03-2010 04:24 PM

Who should be Number 2?
 
Oregon or Ohio State and why?

keylime_5 10-03-2010 04:28 PM

we just beat Oregon in the Rose Bowl. benefit of the doubt.

wonderbredd24 10-03-2010 04:31 PM

Hmmm... no love for Boise State, TCU, or Nebraska?

People can say Ohio State was lucky to beat the Illini if they want, but Oregon was lucky to escape that Arizona State game with a win as well.

The difference is people will look at Oregon's crazy amount of points scored and assume they were successful while Ohio State evidently struggled when Ohio State actually plays defense.

SickwithIt1010 10-03-2010 04:33 PM

Oregon shouldnt even be number 3....


....the fact that they jumped Boise State is ******* stupid.

Sniper 10-03-2010 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SickwithIt1010 (Post 2319917)
Oregon shouldnt even be number 3....


....the fact that they jumped Boise State is ******* stupid.

Well, Oregon beat someone with a pulse. Boise hasn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5 (Post 2319907)
we just beat Oregon in the Rose Bowl. benefit of the doubt.

Relevance to this season not found.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wonderbredd24 (Post 2319914)
The difference is people will look at Oregon's crazy amount of points scored and assume they were successful while Ohio State evidently struggled when Ohio State actually plays defense.


How hard can it be to play D against Illinois' two-play playbook?

keylime_5 10-03-2010 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SickwithIt1010 (Post 2319917)
Oregon shouldnt even be number 3....


....the fact that they jumped Boise State is ******* stupid.


that's probably true in terms of fairness, but I can't begrudge voters for putting a team who actually plays a decent schedule ahead of a team who plays only 2 teams all year than are any decent at all.

hawkeye123 10-03-2010 04:37 PM

I'd say Oregon at this point. Mainly because i believe Oregon plays tougher teams. I think just about all the teams on Ohio State's schedule are overrated (Miami, Wisconsin, Penn State). Pac 10 is a tougher conference this year then the Big Ten.

Oregon's offense is just ridiculous, so explosive, it's not a fluke that they're averaging 50+ points a game.

Both teams should be higher then Boise State that's for sure.

keylime_5 10-03-2010 04:39 PM

Pac ten isn't tougher than the big ten. Big Ten has 6 or 7 teams who are top 25 caliber (OSU, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan State, Michigan, Penn State, and Northwestern) plus Indiana who will make a bowl game. Pac Ten has 3 top 25 teams, maybe 4 tops (Oregon, Stanford, Arizona, and maybe Oregon State) and then a bunch of teams who will be lucky to make a bowl.

wonderbredd24 10-03-2010 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawkeye123 (Post 2319931)
Oregon's offense is just ridiculous, so explosive, it's not a fluke that they're averaging 50+ points a game.

How many points did they average per game last year when they were shut down by Ohio State?

keylime_5 10-03-2010 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper (Post 2319929)

Relevance to this season not found.

Oregon was hanging 50 on everyone last year and Ohio State shut them down. Benefit of the doubt if you're gonna compare them both. It's a hell of a lot better thing to compare them with than anything else if they both go undefeated in their conferences.

wonderbredd24 10-03-2010 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper (Post 2319929)
How hard can it be to play D against Illinois' two-play playbook?

No harder than it would be to triple Devier Posey every play and send the other 8 at Pryor, but Oregon couldn't get that job done.

ElectricEye 10-03-2010 04:46 PM

Oregon, not much of a doubt here for me. They're just on a different level than everybody else in terms of offense right now.

Sniper 10-03-2010 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5 (Post 2319947)
Oregon was hanging 50 on everyone last year and Ohio State shut them down. Benefit of the doubt if you're gonna compare them both. It's a hell of a lot better thing to compare them with than anything else if they both go undefeated in their conferences.

Well, considering they're different teams, benefit of the doubt from last year means nothing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wb24
No harder than it would be to triple Devier Posey every play and send the other 8 at Pryor, but Oregon couldn't get that job done.

Good point.

keylime_5 10-03-2010 04:51 PM

we know Chip Kelly's oregon offense isn't unstoppable b/c of last year, even if they are better than before you can't say they're clearly better just b/c they score a **** ton of points again. They certainly didn't win by a **** ton of points last week against Arizona State. OSU has more talent and is more balanced in terms of offense and defensive performance.

It might not be fair to have something like the polls be left up to human judgement, but they do use the previous bowl game in the rankings, and I don't think OSU has done anything to be dropped just b/c they won a league road game against a poor team by 11. Oregon did the exact same thing a week before.

hawkeye123 10-03-2010 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5 (Post 2319988)
we know Chip Kelly's oregon offense isn't unstoppable b/c of last year, even if they are better than before you can't say they're clearly better just b/c they score a **** ton of points again. They certainly didn't score a **** ton of points last week against Arizona State. OSU has more talent and is more balanced in terms of offense and defensive performance.

It might not be fair to have something like the polls be left up to human judgement, but they do use the previous bowl game in the rankings, and I don't think OSU has done anything to be dropped just b/c they won a league road game against a poor team by 11. Oregon did the exact same thing a week before.

They scored 42 points against ASU at Arizona in the 100 degree heat, that's still impressive. Arizona State has a very solid defense.

Ohio State only scored 24 against Illinois.

keylime_5 10-03-2010 04:57 PM

no one could pass in the wind and Pryor got hurt. We only score 24, but at the same time we only gave up 13, and the one touchdown was on the opening drive. We ran the ball almost every single play in the 2nd half, maybe threw 2 or 3 passes. Both were ugly wins on the road against bad teams.

wonderbredd24 10-03-2010 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawkeye123 (Post 2320001)
They scored 42 points against ASU at Arizona in the 100 degree heat, that's still impressive. Arizona State has a very solid defense.

Ohio State only scored 24 against Illinois.

You're an Iowa fan and you're making this argument?

So offense is more impressive than defense. Got it.

Sniper 10-03-2010 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wonderbredd24 (Post 2320012)
You're an Iowa fan and you're making this argument?

So offense is more impressive than defense. Got it.

Let's not pretend like Illinois and Stanford have similar offenses.

hawkeye123 10-03-2010 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wonderbredd24 (Post 2320012)
You're an Iowa fan and you're making this argument?

So offense is more impressive than defense. Got it.

I'm actually not an Iowa Fan, I was watching a Iowa football game highlight last year when this site asked for a username.

But yeah i'm pretty biased to Pac-10 teams.

wonderbredd24 10-03-2010 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper (Post 2320016)
Let's not pretend like Illinois and Stanford have similar offenses.

as long as you don't pretend Oregon has a defense.

This year is vintage Pac-10 Football where no one can stop anyone and the last team who has the ball typically wins

keylime_5 10-03-2010 05:04 PM

I don't care if it's a different season, that doesn't matter. Most of the players on both teams are the same and the Buckeyes beat the Ducks last year, shutting their offense down. If they both go undefeated with the schedules they have, OSU should get in the title game before Oregon. If Oregon won that game to end last season they it would be the other way around, it's only fair. It's not like Ohio State's remaining schedule isn't much stronger than Oregon's either, b/c it is. Michigan, Iowa, Penn State, and Wisconsin all potential/probable ranked teams while Oregon plays one more ranked team (arizona) with the exception of maybe Oregon state or USC getting ranked. Their OOC schedule features a win over Tennessee who won't go to a bowl while Ohio State beat the potential ACC Champ.

Sniper 10-03-2010 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5 (Post 2320031)
I don't care if it's a different season, that doesn't matter.

Michigan should be ranked No. 1 because they won the national title in 1997. Sure, it's a different season, but you don't care.

keylime_5 10-03-2010 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper (Post 2320039)
Michigan should be ranked No. 1 because they won the national title in 1997. Sure, it's a different season, but you don't care.

you're not following logic sniper. it's a different season but it's mostly the same players on both sides and it is the same coaches and similar scheduling. If they both go undefeated then the only tiebreaker you can use is human judgement, and those voters saw an Ohio State team with most of the same players decisively shut down an Oregon team with most of the same players on a neutral field. It's not like it was the first game of last season, it was this in January of this same year.

soybean 10-03-2010 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5 (Post 2320050)
you're not following logic sniper. it's a different season but it's mostly the same players on both sides and it is the same coaches and similar scheduling. If they both go undefeated then the only tiebreaker you can use is human judgement, and those voters saw an Ohio State team with most of the same players decisively shut down an Oregon team with most of the same players on a neutral field. It's not like it was the first game of last season, it was this in January of this same year.

well in contrast, Stanford whooped on Oregon last season as well.

hawkeye123 10-03-2010 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soybean (Post 2320055)
well in contrast, Stanford whooped on Oregon last season as well.

This is what i was going to say.

Stanford is much better this year then they were this year, especially on defense.


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