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sbh15 07-19-2011 10:03 AM

Fantasy Football Discussion Thread
 
with the lockout (supposedly) ending soon, I figured I'd get this going for this year. I'm also doing this so I can ask...

is Jeremy Maclin for Mike Williams (TB) straight up a good trade? the league is keeper, ppr, and you get 1 pt bonuses for 40+yd td's and 2 pt bonuses for 50+yd td's. I also have Josh Freeman, so I want to get the qb/wr combo.

FlyingElvis 07-19-2011 03:05 PM

I think Hines beat you to the thread, but it's as dead as it gets anyway. lol

I love Maclin at a discount because he's going a bit later than he should for a guy who should produce as well or better than he did last year.

I love Williams, too, and think he can continue his solid play.

I think the trade straight up is fair but believe Maclin is a bit undervalued (too many stars on that roster) so I'd be surprised if the TBMike owner bites. Personally, I'd have a tough time parting with Mike, but I think you're better off going the safe route and NOT having him and Freeman. Double teams, youth, attitude and overachieving are the things I worry about with Mike, whereas my only concern with Maclin is competition for touches.

The two are pretty even, I think, and their ADP shows that to be true.

EDIT: I was the only to respond to the other thread, too. lol

sbh15 07-19-2011 04:04 PM

But shouldn't Winslow's presence help free Mike up? I'm also worried that Vick won't be able to repeat his success from last season and the offense will rely more on Jackson and McCoy, with Maclin falling by the wayside. I guess there are two sides to it... maybe I'll try to get a pick, too, and see if he bites. Also, the format of this league doesn't require you to give up a pick based on the player you keep. The keepers are re-drafted to each team, and then a snake draft starts in reverse order of the last season's standings.

FlyingElvis 07-20-2011 09:22 AM

I think Winslow's role is pretty consistent so there won't be any change there. He's pretty locked in to his career range of 70 catches / 800 yards / 5 TDs.

Both teams have a pretty static group. Same WRs / TEs / QB situations that should be pretty on-pace with last years numbers. I thought Maclin & Vick had better chemistry and he was the number one target, but that's just my eyeball test from the games I saw. Which, considering the dominance of NFC East coverage for me here in the NE, was a decent number of Iggles games.

As far as McCoy . . . best RB in the league to have his talent wasted in an Andy Reid, pass-happy offense. Then Vick steals rushing totals, too. You're right on Vick - I can't see a repeat performance. But to me that means his rushing number may take the hit, but Maclin's may not.

If you like Williams better, go for it. I think they're close enough you should be able to get a deal done and a draft pick going either way in the trade would be fair - round 9-12, maybe? If you have to pay a little to get the guy you think will be better there's no harm in it. Especially if you end up right and Williams blows up. I agree he has the better situation as far as targets and competition on his team, but it may not be as different as you think. Mike had 127 targets vs. Maclin's 115 last year and it seemed like Vick relied on Maclin more while Kolb was looking to DJax & Celek and not Maclin. Again, just eyeball & memory there, both of which can be less than dependable at times. lol

The difference between the two is simply prediction / projection & man-crush.

gpngc 07-20-2011 11:36 AM

Little Mike Williams will have a hard time re-creating that TD production this season. Not to mention, he doesn't play the NFC West this year.

And Maclin does.

FlyingElvis 07-20-2011 02:42 PM

TDs are definitely the wildcard, but I think he'll see a bump in receptions and yards.

75 / 1050

That would give him ~20 points more than last year, which would account for 3 less TDs.

Playing better competition could easily translate to more catches & targets, too.

AntoinCD 07-20-2011 08:41 PM

I like Maclin more in this scenario. The Eagles play the NFC West and have two games against both Dallas and Washington, neither have amazing defensive backfields. I also think Tampa Bay are going to try and commit to more of a running attack this year now they know what they have in Blount

sbh15 07-20-2011 09:16 PM

well the main thing for me is having freeman's #1 target. that way when he throws a td, or even a completion to williams, i'm getting 3+ points, and that's a safe bet to happen quite a bit. it's a 16 team league, and i've found the teams that group their byes do better because it's slim pickings when you need a fill in.

bearfan 07-21-2011 09:11 AM

Who are some of your guy's sleepers this year?
Im having a hard time figuring out who I think will break out and be a steal later in the draft, especially at the RB position. It seems like either there is one RB that will get most the carries, or more truer RBBC this year, which creates no late round steals. Let me know what you guys think cause ive been racking my brain trying to figure it out.

TheBoyWonder22 07-21-2011 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bearfan (Post 2626989)
Who are some of your guy's sleepers this year?
Im having a hard time figuring out who I think will break out and be a steal later in the draft, especially at the RB position. It seems like either there is one RB that will get most the carries, or more truer RBBC this year, which creates no late round steals. Let me know what you guys think cause ive been racking my brain trying to figure it out.

Roy Helu!
That's all

sbh15 07-21-2011 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bearfan (Post 2626989)
Who are some of your guy's sleepers this year?
Im having a hard time figuring out who I think will break out and be a steal later in the draft, especially at the RB position. It seems like either there is one RB that will get most the carries, or more truer RBBC this year, which creates no late round steals. Let me know what you guys think cause ive been racking my brain trying to figure it out.

not really a sleeper, but i bet you can get really good value on jonathan stewart of carolina. williams is packing his bags most likely, leaving only goodson to split carries with (goodson will make a great handcuff, btw). last year carolina was ****, but their offensive line was wrecked by injuries (gross, otah, and wharton all missed time last year). i think their running game sees a resurgence this year, and i like stewart to hit 1k rushing with 8-10 touchdowns, because there he's the goalline back, too.

TheBoyWonder22 07-21-2011 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbh15 (Post 2627000)
not really a sleeper, but i bet you can get really good value on jonathan stewart of carolina. williams is packing his bags most likely, leaving only goodson to split carries with (goodson will make a great handcuff, btw). last year carolina was ****, but their offensive line was wrecked by injuries. i think their running game sees a resurgence this year, and i like stewart to hit 1k rushing with 8-10 touchdowns, because there he's the goalline back, too.

I just took him in a mock at 25. That's not bad for the amount of tds I see him getting.

LonghornsLegend 07-21-2011 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingElvis (Post 2626463)
As far as McCoy . . . best RB in the league to have his talent wasted in an Andy Reid, pass-happy offense. Then Vick steals rushing totals, too. You're right on Vick - I can't see a repeat performance. But to me that means his rushing number may take the hit, but Maclin's may not.

I'm not sure why some people feel this way, because I've heard it before. Did playing for Andy Reid waste the talent of Brian Westbrook? He was a stud year after year. Everything in his situation makes it one of the most desirable.


He has an offense and a coach that isn't going to run a RBBC, no matter how small the guy. Lesean is a cog in that offense, and very rarely comes off the field. They also pass a ton, and he's involved in every bit of the passing game and receiving game.


They also have Vick. For every downside you can list to Vick vulturing TD's or yards I can give you alot more on the opposite end to show that having a guy like Vick on an offense is going to make the RB's job alot easier and leave a ton of huge lanes wide open, which is dangerous for a guy like McCoy.


Jamaal Charles is a beast. Can you imagine him playing with Michael Vick? If Vick runs to the left, and it's a delayed handoff to the right guess where the defense is going? I love everything about Philly for McCoy. Granted I mostly play in ppr leagues, but I wouldn't hesitate to take him any lower in standard scoring.


McCoy is only getting better, he's on a much faster pace then Westbrook to fast track his career to a pro bowl consistent player and at his age the arrow is pointing up, he hasn't even came close to having his best season as a pro yet IMO.

FlyingElvis 07-21-2011 12:31 PM

Helu is a good one at RB, though Torain is entrenched - which makes him a decent add, too. They're squarely in the RBBC look atm, though so they don't really count as sleepers, per se. Grant / Starks look to be in the same situation.

Guys like DWill / JStew / Addai / Bradshaw are all going at discounts now but their ADP will change once their situations are clear.

Honestly, the more I look at it, the more I think there really aren't any sleepers that are not currently mired in an RBBC. I like Mathews & Hillis to destroy their ADP, but they're not going late enough to be sleepers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornsLegend (Post 2627048)
I'm not sure why some people feel this way, because I've heard it before. Did playing for Andy Reid waste the talent of Brian Westbrook? He was a stud year after year. Everything in his situation makes it one of the most desirable.

He has an offense and a coach that isn't going to run a RBBC, no matter how small the guy. Lesean is a cog in that offense, and very rarely comes off the field. They also pass a ton, and he's involved in every bit of the passing game and receiving game.

They also have Vick. For every downside you can list to Vick vulturing TD's or yards I can give you alot more on the opposite end to show that having a guy like Vick on an offense is going to make the RB's job alot easier and leave a ton of huge lanes wide open, which is dangerous for a guy like McCoy.

Jamaal Charles is a beast. Can you imagine him playing with Michael Vick? If Vick runs to the left, and it's a delayed handoff to the right guess where the defense is going? I love everything about Philly for McCoy. Granted I mostly play in ppr leagues, but I wouldn't hesitate to take him any lower in standard scoring.

McCoy is only getting better, he's on a much faster pace then Westbrook to fast track his career to a pro bowl consistent player and at his age the arrow is pointing up, he hasn't even came close to having his best season as a pro yet IMO.

McCoy is a stud and is the leader of my tier 2 RBs, tbh. My comment wasn't meant to be as negative as you took it. I just think McCoy would be even better if he had more consistent carries, which doesn't happen in Reid's offense. If he were used as a true feature back in an offense like SDs he would be in the #1 spot on my draft board.

sbh15 07-21-2011 03:27 PM

well the guy declined my offer, so i guess i'm "stuck" with maclin. what irks me is that he didn't give a reason for declining the trade, so i don't even know if he was intrigued or not.

FlyingElvis 07-21-2011 03:48 PM

Yeah, I hate that. At lease decline with a note like "not intersted in moving him" or "not enough."

LonghornsLegend 07-21-2011 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbh15 (Post 2627127)
well the guy declined my offer, so i guess i'm "stuck" with maclin. what irks me is that he didn't give a reason for declining the trade, so i don't even know if he was intrigued or not.

Those probably aren't future trading partners. I love flea flicker dynasty leagues and the set up, but every trade I decline I let a guy know if he was close, or if a guy was off limits, or send a counter. At least some thoughts. When I get a decline comment I know if I can counter, or how to.


When I get cold declines I usually just move on to another guy and figure I won't get anthing from those types of guys unless I prod him for a response or make him an offer he can't refuse.

gpngc 07-21-2011 09:29 PM

I'm about to give you all the best advice you'll get. The AFC North and NFC East play the NFC West this year. You're all welcome.

The_Dude 07-22-2011 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingElvis (Post 2627059)
Helu is a good one at RB, though Torain is entrenched - which makes him a decent add, too. They're squarely in the RBBC look atm, though so they don't really count as sleepers, per se. Grant / Starks look to be in the same situation.

Guys like DWill / JStew / Addai / Bradshaw are all going at discounts now but their ADP will change once their situations are clear.

Honestly, the more I look at it, the more I think there really aren't any sleepers that are not currently mired in an RBBC. I like Mathews & Hillis to destroy their ADP, but they're not going late enough to be sleepers.

Add in the fact that Shannahan is a complete dick when it comes to FF running backs, i won't be taking Helu in any of my dynasty drafts.

FlyingElvis 07-22-2011 12:28 PM

Yeah, Shanny sucks b/c it's impossible to guage who will play. I'll take Helu / Torain only in my deep roster leagues. It doesn't help any that Washington is just terrible to begin with.

sbh15 07-28-2011 12:29 PM

i just trade donovan mcnabb for jon beason in my idp keeper league. wasn't gonna keep mcnabb, so i feel like it's good value. i also offered a guy short on keepers dwill+jstew for jamaal charles since i only have one spot left for an offensive keeper. anyone have thoughts?

also, i'm starting to like bush for a big year on the dolphins, especially if they get orton. bush and bess are two guys who could break out because that offense would be pretty pass happy. almost spread-like, imo

FlyingElvis 07-28-2011 12:45 PM

Who does Miami have as OC this year? That makes all the difference.


Charles faces a brutal schedule this year. 12-16 it's Pitt / Chi / Jets / Pack / Raiders. Ouch.

I won't say I'd rather have DWill / JStew than Charles, but I definitely would consider shopping for someone else if you can.

Splat 08-01-2011 10:26 AM

Just started a 10 team league on Yahoo if anyone is interested playing let me know.

DiG 08-01-2011 02:23 PM

will bradshaw get close to last years numbers now that we know he re-signed in NY? his adp right now seems pretty good at 4.03 for a 10 team league.

sbh15 08-02-2011 04:04 PM

how concerned should i be about gates being on the PUP list? i got offered a trade involving him for maclin+a pick. is the trade worth doing? same league i described earlier


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