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-   -   Mayock: "Luck is great but not once in a life-time" (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51025)

bucfan12 02-15-2012 05:33 PM

Mayock: "Luck is great but not once in a life-time"
 
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...in-a-lifetime/

Finally someone who makes sense. As much as I like Andrew Luck and think he's worthy of a top 3 pick, he's not this great prospect that so many are hyping him to be. He isn't the next John Elway in terms of physical tools or talent, he doesn't have the upside of Peyton Manning.

I think the comparison to Sam Bradford is kind of harsh. Luck does remind me a bit of a Matt Ryan, but probably a better prospect.

Prowler 02-15-2012 06:04 PM

I think his arm is a little weaker than Aaron Rodgers, but his athleticism reminds me of him more than Matt Ryan. Andrew Luck is the anti-Jamarcus Russell. He's a guy who can still make all the throws, but is lightyears ahead of some NFL QBs(Sanchez, Gabbert) in presnap recognition. Its a game of matchups, and Luck knows where his matchups are on every play. I'm not worried about his arm. I think accuracy clearly trumps strength, as Drew Brees has proven.

Forenci 02-15-2012 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prowler (Post 2860761)
I think his arm is a little weaker than Aaron Rodgers, but his athleticism reminds me of him more than Matt Ryan. Andrew Luck is the anti-Jamarcus Russell. He's a guy who can still make all the throws, but is lightyears ahead of some NFL QBs(Sanchez, Gabbert) in presnap recognition. Its a game of matchups, and Luck knows where his matchups are on every play. I'm not worried about his arm. I think accuracy clearly trumps strength, as Drew Brees has proven.

Pretty much this. We get too enamored with physical tools at the QB position.

No, Luck doesn't have a cannon but he has solid/good arm strength. More than enough to do whatever is needed with the ball. What makes him special is his mechanics, footwork, accuracy and of course what's between the ears.

Peyton Manning didn't have a rocket arm coming out of college either. I would argue Luck has a ton of upside too. No, maybe he won't be Peyton Manning, but then again who really is? Peyton is almost in his own league in terms of what he's done at the position in terms of running an offense.

niel89 02-15-2012 06:24 PM

The 'once in a lifetime' tag is a little much. Manning and Elway are both considered in the same life time and they were better prospects. It's exciting to tag a player as other worldly but it people get sick of talking about it.

That being said I think that Luck is the best combination of physical talent, pro readiness, intangibles, and production since Peyton. I don't actually think that is the biggest statement in the world either once you go back and look at the QBs between then and now.

DraftSavant 02-15-2012 06:39 PM

Such revisionist history with Manning as a draft prospect.

People had this exact same argument with him when he was coming out. Same questions about an elite arm, too.

FUNBUNCHER 02-15-2012 06:39 PM

I think Luck's arm is underrated because he focused so much on throwing with touch and accuracy that you rarely saw him rip the ball even on downfield routes. The few times he did I saw a guy with a stud arm.

It's hard for me to place Luck as a prospect simply because he's been hyped as the next-big-thing for two years.
He's definitely an unusual prospect as in there aren't any easy comparisons for him.

I don't have a problem with people comparing him to Peyton Manning coming out of Tennessee, since most analysts only view Peyton as an all world prospect in hindsight compared to his pro career.

Peyton still came up small in big games as a Vol, and the year after he left nearly the exact same football team with Tee Martin at QB won the NC.

If Luck improves just 20% on the QB his was in college, he's going to be awesome in the NFL.

descendency 02-15-2012 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucfan12 (Post 2860713)
I think the comparison to Sam Bradford is kind of harsh. Luck does remind me a bit of a Matt Ryan, but probably a better prospect.

It's really harsh when the guy you are comparing him to is bottom 3 in QBR the past 2 years. He's in the same class as Jimmy Clausen, Blaine Gabbert, and Colt McCoy.

At least with Matt Ryan, he's an average QB.

SuperPacker 02-15-2012 06:43 PM

When has anyone called him "once in a life time".

All i've heard is "best prospect since Peyton Manning" or "once in a decade". Both of these are true.

descendency 02-15-2012 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER (Post 2860784)
The few times he did I saw a guy with a stud arm.

He tried to gun it every down quite a few times after Phil Simms came out and said his arm was just average.

Babylon 02-15-2012 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DraftSavant (Post 2860783)
Such revisionist history with Manning as a draft prospect.

People had this exact same argument with him when he was coming out. Same questions about an elite arm, too.

Exactly. There was the whole he couldnt win a title, arm issues, even some opting for Ryan Leaf.

As for Mayock or anyone else at NFLN having an opinion on a QB, one it is sure to change and two i'd listen to people in here before anyone at that outfit.

Complex 02-15-2012 06:51 PM

I came he after I saw that article. Glad Mayock agree with me lol.BTW I think RGIII is better.

SuperPacker 02-15-2012 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babylon (Post 2860790)
Exactly. There was the whole he couldnt win a title, arm issues, even some opting for Ryan Leaf.

As for Mayock or anyone else at NFLN having an opinion on a QB, one it is sure to change and two i'd listen to people in here before anyone at that outfit.

In the end how he's seen as a prospect will be decided by how he plays in the pros. People will always find ways to hate on great players like Luck, but if in 10 years he's what every expects him to be people will be saying "he's the best prospect since Andrew Luck" about college quarterbacks of the future.

K Train 02-15-2012 07:12 PM

i wonder who he considers once in a lifetime? i mean guys like calvin and suh were incredible super elite prospects but too say ill never ever see an athlete of that caliber again would be a bold statement.

id say luck is the best QB prospect ive seen in my lifetime so far, once in a lifetime i doubt though

dannyz 02-15-2012 07:21 PM

I like Mayock because he knows what he's talking about. I think everyone else on NFLN is just caught in the RGIII Hype because he is the new thing and that everyone has been talking about Andrew Luck for Two years now. I was watching NFLN yesterday and they made a point about always calling RGIII the Running QB because Andrew Luck has the ability to run and I think that gets overlooked because they is not a runner like Robert Griffin or Mike Vick but he has the ability to Run like Aaron Rodgers where at most he might run for 15 Yards.

PossibleCabbage 02-15-2012 08:04 PM

The thing about Luck is "coming out, he's the best prospect anybody has seen in some time (at least since Carson Palmer)." Nobody's saying he's going to be this all time fantastic player (I mean, Carson Palmer didn't turn out that way), since a QB's success in the NFL hinges on a lot more than how good a prospect they were coming out, and there's certainly some luck involved (no pun intended.)

So while I'll say that I like Luck as a prospect better than a good number of other quarterbacks, I don't honestly expect him to be as good of an NFL player as someone like Aaron Rodgers. Rodgers was a weaker prospect coming out, but he fell into an ideal situation that was probably previously unmatched and it's hard to see it recurring for anybody else (definitely not Luck, at least.)

bitonti 02-16-2012 10:10 AM

if Luck went to Boston College instead of Stanford, Mayock would say he's the best QB prospect ever.

DeathbyStat 02-16-2012 10:16 AM

If I have to choose between Luck and RG3 Im taking Luck every time.

But I won't be shocked if Griffin is proven to be the better QB in 5 years.

Luck is the best prospect since Manning, not the best prospect since Elway

Shane P. Hallam 02-16-2012 10:17 AM

I think people are saying he is more "once a decade" which he is.

dolphinfan2k5 02-16-2012 11:02 AM

Mike Vick is probably the only once in a lifetime guy that immediately comes to mind.

the_dark_knight 02-16-2012 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam (Post 2861362)
I think people are saying he is more "once a decade" which he is.

I guess I just don't see that either. I mean look at some of the QBs from the last decade, he doesn't show anything to me that indicates he will be more special than someone like Matt Ryan, Matt Schaub, or even Mark Sanchez. I just don't see anything in Luck that makes me go *wow* Sort of how I was with Matt Ryan though, who has turned into a very good QB. Not saying he's elite or anything cause he's not yet, but his tools have improved and fit the pro game better than they did at BC.

Maybe Luck will do the same thing, I just think when someone peaks so highly it makes me skeptical, so I'm leery of him. RGIII to me seems like he's not reached his potential yet, and maybe I just can't see it in Luck and I'm looking for it in RGIII.

Brothgar 02-16-2012 11:48 AM

Here's the question. Luck or Stafford as a prospect?

SolidGold 02-16-2012 12:04 PM

Like others have said I do not think anyone ever said Luck was a once in a life-time prospect but that many regard him as the best prospect since Peyton Manning. I would argue that he may be the best prospect since Carson Palmer - I remember Palmer was getting a lot of hype as the perfect prototype QB leading up to the 2003 draft as well.

I would take Luck over Griffin any day of the week. People do not really appreciate the mental aspect of the game Luck has mastered - he has been coached up in a pro-style offense for his whole college career. If Luck plays in the Big 12 running the same wide open spread offense with the assistance of probably first round talent at WR (Kendall Wright) he would of put up better numbers than Griffin.

People get caught up in 40 times so they label Griffin more exciting because he will run a fast 40. For whatever reason all the "expert draftniks" seem to think Griffin will have a Newton like influence on the team that drafts him when the fact of the matter is when you peel back the layers a little Newton and Griffin are different types of players physically - its lazy journalism/analysis.

Prowler 02-16-2012 12:07 PM

Stafford's potential was way higher, but he was touted as more of a project. Stafford was sporadic with his short throws and really only started to become good his Junior year. He had flashed his enormous potential, but he was still only a 55% passer until then.

Luck has back to back years of going over 70% and did it while showing that he could adapt to a 3 TE offense devoid of real deep threats. I would say that Stafford was the kid born with all the gifts in the world, while Luck is the prodigy that completely understands how to be successful.

I think its a matter of taste between the two. Top talent vs top skill. It just depends on how much people consider skill to be talent when evaluating them. If I'm Oakland or Jacksonville, then I'm taking Luck because I can't develop talent, but if I'm New England then I'm taking Stafford.

FUNBUNCHER 02-16-2012 12:29 PM

I put Luck over most prototype QB prospects over the lat ten + years because of his athleticism.
His straight line speed is going to be one of the best for the position in the NFL, after Vick/Newton/Locker/Gabbert/Rodgers/Alex Smith.

In goal line offense, Luck is a guy who can roll out wide and take it into the endzone by himself, easily.

BuddyCHRIST 02-16-2012 04:22 PM

He reminds me of a more athletic Eli Manning (when Eli Manning is playing well ie this year). Great pre snap, can make every throw (any Luck arm strength concerns are way over blown), very accurate and very cool, calm and collected. The way Luck interviews reminds me alot of Eli.


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