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Scotty D 04-26-2012 01:06 AM

Official Draft Discussion Thread
 

Schedule
Round 1 - Thursday, April 26 (8 PM ET)
Rounds 2-3 - Friday, April 27 (7 PM ET)
Rounds 4-7 - Saturday, April 28 (Noon ET)


Current Lions Draft Picks

Round 1, Pick 23 (23)
Round 2, Pick 22 (54)
Round 3, Pick 22 (85)
Round 4, Pick 22 (117)
Round 5, Pick 23 (158)
Round 7, Pick 12 (219) (From Seahawks)
Round 7, Pick 23 (230)

Scotty D 04-26-2012 01:29 AM

What do you guys think is the percentage chance that Avril gets traded on draft day? I'll go with 30%.

Mayock gave us Courtney Upshaw and Kiper gave the Lions Doug Martin. Waiting for Rick Gosselin's and Scott Wright's mocks.

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 05:51 AM

I think it really depends a lot on what the Lions do in round one. They don't have to trade him, but if there's a guy like Chandler Jones, Courtney Upshaw, or Nick Perry on the board, I can see us shopping him around. I'd say it's about 50/50. The Lions haven't been known for moving players on draft day, but the Avril situation is definitely a precarious one. Apparently Avril has already turned down numerous offers that would make him among the highest paid DE's in the League.

Who's 3 guys you'd love to see the Lions pick up this year?

detroit4life 04-26-2012 06:08 AM

I think is Dre or Gilmore are on the board in the late teens Mayhew will do his best to make a jump up and take them.

There is no secret we NEED a CB. It only has gotten more pressing with Marshall joining the division. Oline and LB will help but our exact same oline is in tact from last year and with healthy RBs they can survive the season.

Oline I assume gets addressed round 2 however.

Mayhew has been agressive to get guys he wants, if it takes our 3rd and 5th rounder so be it. Get the young CB we need, we are in a pretty ideal position to do it

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 06:11 AM

I'm not a big fan of Kirkpatrick. I see him being a lot like Amari Spievey in the NFL. If Gilmore is there, yeah, move up 7 picks (no more than that) to get him. Otherwise, this is a really deep CB class. You can still win on a DB in the 2nd round with guys like Josh Robinson, Casey Hayward, Trumaine Johnson, or Brandon Boykin.

detroit4life 04-26-2012 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotty D (Post 2966743)
What do you guys think is the percentage chance that Avril gets traded on draft day? I'll go with 30%.

Mayock gave us Courtney Upshaw and Kiper gave the Lions Doug Martin. Waiting for Rick Gosselin's and Scott Wright's mocks.

I don't see ithappening. For starters we would need him to sign the tender. Also with Osi basically demanding a trade as well and a a fair amount of DEs with early round grades we won't get fair value.

I do think a DT will be traded and my money is on Corey Williams. We have to be comfortable with a DT rotation of Suh, Fairley, Hill. Corey's cap hit is i believe 5 mil and I could see a team like philly or even STL wanting him.

Question is what value do we get for him?

If we do end up taking a DE at 23 i think they'll still stay put. KVB has one more year here tops (I still think we should cut him now). Upshaw may be able to play OLB for us and DE in passing downs this year and we can shift him to DE next year.

detroit4life 04-26-2012 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asteinebach (Post 2966887)
I'm not a big fan of Kirkpatrick. I see him being a lot like Amari Spievey in the NFL. If Gilmore is there, yeah, move up 7 picks (no more than that) to get him. Otherwise, this is a really deep CB class. You can still win on a DB in the 2nd round with guys like Josh Robinson, Casey Hayward, Trumaine Johnson, or Brandon Boykin.

I persoanally like Kirkpatrick a lot. I like his size (would be good for both Jennings and Marshall) and I like that he is a Bama and a Saban product.

Guy has been bred in one of the best defensive systems in the country and did very well there. He seems to be fairly physical as well and can help in run support, something Schwartz definitley likes

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detroit4life (Post 2966888)
a fair amount of DEs with early round grades we won't get fair value.

Value becomes a fluid concept after round 1 when some teams have missed out on the DE they wanted. I still think we could pick up a 2nd for Avril, maybe more. As for Williams, I wouldn't mind seeing him get moved, but we'd probably only get a 5th for him at best.

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detroit4life (Post 2966889)
Guy has been bred in one of the best defensive systems in the country and did very well there. He seems to be fairly physical as well and can help in run support, something Schwartz definitley likes

My only beef with Dre is that I don't think he's fast or smooth enough to keep up with Marshall, Harvin, and Jennings. He's physical, yes, but after the bump he'd be getting burned deep. Then, year two, we'd try to get our value out of him by moving him over to SS. I just don't see it as a great value. We can get the same type of player in round 2 with Trumaine Johnson.

Also, I find it worth adding that I am a fan of the CB's the Lions currently have on roster. Mind you, our worst secondary issues became evident when Louis Delmas got injured. He's the leader of the defense when he's on the field. Without him, the entire secondary suffered. I think the biggest crime our CB's committed was being inexperienced and unsupervised. I like Aaron Berry, Alphonso Smith, Jacob Lacey, and Chris Houston.

detroit4life 04-26-2012 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asteinebach (Post 2966893)
My only beef with Dre is that I don't think he's fast or smooth enough to keep up with Marshall, Harvin, and Jennings. He's physical, yes, but after the bump he'd be getting burned deep. Then, year two, we'd try to get our value out of him by moving him over to SS. I just don't see it as a great value. We can get the same type of player in round 2 with Trumaine Johnson.

Also, I find it worth adding that I am a fan of the CB's the Lions currently have on roster. Mind you, our worst secondary issues became evident when Louis Delmas got injured. He's the leader of the defense when he's on the field. Without him, the entire secondary suffered. I think the biggest crime our CB's committed was being inexperienced and unsupervised. I like Aaron Berry, Alphonso Smith, Jacob Lacey, and Chris Houston.

I agree with you actually that his speed is an issue (although Marshall is not a speed reciever and he should be able to stay with him). My belief however, is that any of those recievers are bound to be doubled anyway. And if you look at the tape a lot of the times we get burned is because our CBs can't bump or play at the line.

Our defense gets to the QB, everyone knows that. Thats why a CB that can take away the short pass could fit perfectly in our system.

Our CB squad is average at best, but they are also all very similar, poor in run support and they all have to play off the line. Think about the Oakland game last year, our CBs were playing 10 yards off the reciever and we got torched as they threw short passes all the way down the field.

detroit4life 04-26-2012 06:45 AM

With that said, what is everyones feelings on Jenkins? Huge talent, huge character issues. if he is there second rounds do you take the gamble?

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detroit4life (Post 2966905)
With that said, what is everyones feelings on Jenkins? Huge talent, huge character issues. if he is there second rounds do you take the gamble?

I wouldn't. I won't go as far to say the Lions' as an organization feel the same way, but as a fan, I'd hate to have him. Just because we've had so many off the field issues from our rookies last year. Adding him in with that bunch would not provide a good environment for him.

detroit4life 04-26-2012 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asteinebach (Post 2966906)
I wouldn't. I won't go as far to say the Lions' as an organization feel the same way, but as a fan, I'd hate to have him. Just because we've had so many off the field issues from our rookies last year. Adding him in with that bunch would not provide a good environment for him.

I agree. I just had to ask because I was reading the mlive boards and they were all so pro Jenkins (in round 1).

It is tempting knowing how talented this guy is, but with the youth in our lockerroom and all the drug incidents this offseason Mayhew is walking a fine line between having an uncontrolable lockerroom

cotts1 04-26-2012 11:01 AM

I disagree about Jenkins. The kid smokes pot, he isn't a thug like Pac-man Jones. I don't see marijuana as a big problem. Just immaturity issues that almost every kid goes through at some point. Jenkins will grow up. I would bet at least 50% of the players in the NFL smoke pot regularly. These kind of problems are very correctable.

Maybe This Year Mayhew 04-26-2012 11:56 AM

Happy draft day.

No way Avril traded without signing his tender. Plus Lo Jack is a free agent next year, KVB is old and his salary in 2013 is not worth his ability and Willie Young is a restricted free agent. And Avril isn't signed long term yet so right now only 2 under contract in 2013(1 very old). Lions getting a DE wouldn't be a bad option if the Gilmore/Dre/Barron/Glenn arent' there and they don't want to take a risk on Jenkins/Mike Adams. I really don't like Martin. Falling like a rock, Scott has us taking him in Round 2.

Going to be interesting to see if anyone falls or if Mayhew makes a trade up or down.

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 12:00 PM

I've been hearing the Lions are in play to move up for Mark Barron. They'd have to go higher to get him than I'd be willing to do. Looks like Barron could be gone as soon as 9 or 10, so we'd have to give up a King's ransom.

I agree with you about Jon Martin, but if we get him in round two, that's decent value.

Maybe This Year Mayhew 04-26-2012 01:00 PM

Yeah giving up a bunch of picks for a safety is kind of crazy especially considering our future needs on Oline and impending free agents(Houston,Delmas,Lo Jack,Durant,Gosder,Levy,Lee-Hill, maybe Avril). Barron and Delmas would be quite the combo though. Back end better be locked down for years to come. And both Spievey and Delmas struggled in run D last year. Barron would help improve that too.

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 01:10 PM

Yeah, John Clayton sounded off on ESPN a few minutes ago saying that the Lions have contacted the Chiefs, Seahawks, and Cardinals. Looks like Barron, maybe even Gilmore. Neither is worth moving up that high. They'd better make it a lean deal.

Scotty D 04-26-2012 01:18 PM

So its becoming clear Mayhew loves to trade up.

Maybe This Year Mayhew 04-26-2012 01:19 PM

Yeah well they tried to trade up last year for Patrick Peterson. Didn't want to give up 2nd and 3rd to Zona. Not that suprising.

Lions will have to give up some picks though as they can't swap picks because they have the later draft positions in this draft. Hopefully not a future 1st though. That isn't worth it if it does happen.

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 01:24 PM

If we keep all of our picks this year, I'd give up a 1st and a 2013 1st to grab a chance at Barron/Gilmore. Those guys would be very solid additions to our defense.

We just can't be nearsighted with the 1st round. We need to add depth along the offensive and defensive fronts.

Scotty D 04-26-2012 01:28 PM

Well, at least they would be trading the 32nd overall pick.

Asteinebach 04-26-2012 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotty D (Post 2967398)
Well, at least they would be trading the 32nd overall pick.

Mwuahahahahahaha. Yes.

Scotty D 04-26-2012 01:38 PM

Scott Wright's mock

Round 1 - Dre Kirkpatrick, CB - Bama
Round 2 - Jon Martin, OT - Stanford
Round 3 - Tyrone Crawford, DE -Boise St

detroit4life 04-26-2012 03:11 PM

If we got Dre and Martin i would be one happy happy man.

I honestly don't think it could go better for us.


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