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-   -   Prospect of the Day: Matt Barkley, QB, USC (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=52765)

Mr. Goosemahn 05-02-2012 12:03 AM

Prospect of the Day: Matt Barkley, QB, USC
 
All right, I'm bringing these threads back! Same premise as before, one prospect thread every day. We should be able to cover almost all of the prospects that are drafted in the high-mid rounds.

I'll start off with the top seniors, and then I'll move forward from there. I think Scott is putting out the list of his top seniors on Wednesday, so I'll use that to start off.

Discuss away!

QB Matt Barkley, USC

#7 - 6'2 – 230 lbs. – 21 years old













The front-runner to be the #1 overall pick, I think he's a good QB but is not quite on the "elite" tier as Andrew Luck and Matthew Stafford were. Anybody think Pete Carroll tries to trade up to get him?

-------------------------

Previous Prospects of the Day

QB Matt Barkley, USC

vidae 05-02-2012 12:16 AM

Am I the only person who thinks Barkley is a tad overrated? Maybe it's my hatred for most USC prospects that is blinding me from what makes him so special, and I'm fully willing to admit that is the case, but I just don't see #1 overall material here.

ElectricEye 05-02-2012 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vidae (Post 2982227)
Am I the only person who thinks Barkley is a tad overrated? Maybe it's my hatred for most USC prospects that is blinding me from what makes him so special, and I'm fully willing to admit that is the case, but I just don't see #1 overall material here.

You definitely aren't alone there. There's a fairly well established sentiment that he may not be quite the prospect that the media billing and statistic leads you to believe. The case is somewhat compelling when you look at the track record of USC quarterbacks as well(although you clearly can't use that as the basis of the argument in my opinion). It still early, but I really believe that Bray and Wilson could perhaps challenge Barkley a little bit for the top quarterback spot. Especially Bray, should he come into the season bigger and he puts together the type of season he's shown the capability of having in spurts.

FUNBUNCHER 05-02-2012 12:26 AM

He's a shorter Matt Ryan.
Very good QB with not elite tools.
If you need a starting QB, IMO Matt Barkley will be an upgrade. And IMO he's a 5x better QB than Mark Sanchez.

Safe pick.

Hellisan 05-02-2012 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElectricEye (Post 2982238)
The case is somewhat compelling when you look at the track record of USC quarterbacks as well(although you clearly can't use that as the basis of the argument in my opinion).

I agree, sometimes it's hard not to. In explaining to people why I am not that high on Blackmon, I find it hard not to bring up everybody from Hart-Lee Dykes to Rashaun Woods...

Anyway, on to Barkley. I will say that if it was my pick and Barkley had been in this draft, I would have had a hard time not picking him first. I love Barkley, absolutely love the guy. If I'm in the position to have every one of his tapes and scouts at my disposal who knows what I would come up with...

I watch him play and see a lot of NFL throws. One-on-one fades, hitches, back shoulder throws and plenty of well-placed balls outside the hashes...I have a request... Somebody find me a highlight of Andrew Luck DRIVING a 15-30 yard NFL throw. Like a 12-yard curl or a post route... Seems like everything Stanford runs is play action lobs or quick stuff to the TE or FB. He loves to finesse everything, you can't always do that in the NFL. edit: I will say about Luck that he does have the ability to make a throw look easy but still have good zip sometimes... Clearly has a great arm, but I don't see him producing NFL throws with conviction and ease like Barkley.

My primary concern about Barkley is, what if we learn he's six feet, or six feet and half an inch? Doesn't seem like it to me, but seems like a possibility. I feel confident he will have a great senior season,

I love Barkley, and although I like both Luck and RGIII, I don't think either of their offenses translates as well as Barkley's does. The Colts drafted a couple TE and if they expect to run the same type of plays that Luck built his draft stock around, they will have a tough time. They will need to use them like the Pats do, to stretch the field, and I haven't seen Luck make those types of throws very often.

Check out the throw at 8:34 of the Oregon Ducks video... That is Patriots / NFL type of TE throw. I haven't seen Luck use Fleener in that way. This is a STANDARD throw for Barkley.

SickwithIt1010 05-02-2012 12:55 AM

Bark doesnt have the elite tools like you see from guys like Stafford, but I do think he is on par or better than Luck in most of their physical tools. Luck is a tad more athletic but Bark is no slouch in that regard. He can make all the throws and is very good mechanically.

With that being said he is listed at 6'2" but like many people have mentioned it seems as though that is pretty generous. I've seen him play in person and while he most definitely doesnt look small, I have seen bigger Quarterbacks. Right now as far as being a Quarterback and how they play the position I rank him number 1 right now, no questions asked. His height is the only thing that may hold him back.

I think you see Wilson's productivity fall this year without his receivers and without Petrino runnin the show. Bray I feel will give him a run for his money, though.

kalbears13 05-02-2012 01:01 AM

Oregon at ~2:05.

His play action boot and throws on the run are so money.

JHL6719 05-02-2012 01:07 AM

I've made it a point to study Matt Barkley's height in any instance and every angle/avenue possible for a long time. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that if he isn't 6'2", it's so close that it won't matter.

FUNBUNCHER 05-02-2012 01:37 AM

As a recruit Barkley was listed as 6'3, so I'm confident Barkley is almost exactly 6 feet two inches.

USC's official heights have been for the most part very accurate.

Dangermouse 05-02-2012 01:51 AM

I have this guy tabbed as the number 1 and unless he regresses he will keep that. I don't concur with the view he has a weak arm.

359 days till the draft, so we can cover that many prospects.

tjsunstein 05-02-2012 12:20 PM

Watching the Oregon highlight posted up there, I don't see how he isn't the #1 QB coming out. I also don't see how anyone can not take notice of Marqise Lee (WR, #9), true freshmen in that reel.

kwilk103 05-02-2012 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vidae (Post 2982227)
Am I the only person who thinks Barkley is a tad overrated? Maybe it's my hatred for most USC prospects that is blinding me from what makes him so special, and I'm fully willing to admit that is the case, but I just don't see #1 overall material here.

could also be that hes been hyped up as the next big qb since his junior year of high school, so you've been hearing about him for 5-6 years

D-Unit 05-02-2012 12:45 PM

Top 3 pick, but I don't think he'll go #1 overall despite USC winning the National Championship.

Saints-Tigers 05-02-2012 12:48 PM

I don't see anything "special" when I watch Barkley. Closer to Mark Sanchez than he is to someone like Stafford.

jrdrylie 05-02-2012 12:52 PM

Watching USC play Stanford last year, I was actually more impressed with Barkley than I was with Luck. I'm not saying Barkley is better than Luck, but in that game I thought he was. I love his accuracy and I think his arm is just as strong as Luck's.

killxswitch 05-02-2012 01:00 PM

As a prospect I'd put him somewhere between Sam Bradford and Andrew Luck.

I also think it's funny when people don't like a well-known QB, they say "He's a <insert slightly unique characteristic> Matt Ryan".

Iamcanadian 05-02-2012 01:01 PM

I'd rate Barkley as a top 5 talent but no where near the prospect that Luck and RG111 were. These 2 were the best in at least a decade and Barkley just isn't rated anywhere near as high.
When a QB is rated as a top 5 talent, there is an excellent chance he goes #1 overall considering how important QB's are in the NFL, even if he isn't quite a Luck or a RG111.

Babylon 05-02-2012 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iamcanadian (Post 2982646)
I'd rate Barkley as a top 5 talent but no where near the prospect that Luck and RG111 were. These 2 were the best in at least a decade and Barkley just isn't rated anywhere near as high.
When a QB is rated as a top 5 talent, there is an excellent chance he goes #1 overall considering how important QB's are in the NFL, even if he isn't quite a Luck or a RG111.

Griffin one of two best in the decade?, that's news to me.

Barkley to me is somewhere between Carson Palmer and Matthew Stafford. His arm is much stronger than most people in here give him credit for.

Iamcanadian 05-02-2012 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babylon (Post 2982668)
Griffin one of two best in the decade?, that's news to me.

Barkley to me is somewhere between Carson Palmer and Matthew Stafford. His arm is much stronger than most people in here give him credit for.

Matter of opinion I guess on RG111, time will tell.

As for Barkley, I don't see the Palmer/Stafford ranking. They are taller and while I like Barkley's arm, it just isn't in their league, of course, few are.

Hellisan 05-02-2012 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iamcanadian (Post 2982701)
Matter of opinion I guess on RG111, time will tell.

As for Barkley, I don't see the Palmer/Stafford ranking. They are taller and while I like Barkley's arm, it just isn't in their league, of course, few are.

I find Luck and RGIII to be such an interesting couple of QB's. I am not sold on either one but I would use a rating system similar to how Baseball HQ rates prospects... First the ceiling in a numerical fashion, and then a letter grade (A being the highest)

RGIII is a 10D - Hall of Fame Potential and about a 25% chance or so in my book of reaching it. Due to injuries, the differences from his offense to the NFL style game, and the fact that let's face it despite his speed he is not an instinctive runner hurt him... however if he pans out I can see him leading the league in passing yards and TDs etc. if he stays healthy, being a multiple MVP.

Luck is an 8A for me. Potential Pro Bowler that can win titles with a strong D. I can't see him ever being anywhere near the top of the league in passing or winning an MVP. However he will be the ultimate game manager type QB that inspires his team, keeps the chains moving with strong runs when need be, and has the ability to make a big pass when necessary. Not much chance of him completely flaming out.

Barkley in Comparison is a 9A for me. All Pro caliber. I see him eventually being in the top 10 in passing year after year, and depending upon the quality of his weapons can be a championship-level signal caller.

SenorGato 05-02-2012 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER (Post 2982243)
He's a shorter Matt Ryan.
Very good QB with not elite tools.
If you need a starting QB, IMO Matt Barkley will be an upgrade. And IMO he's a 5x better QB than Mark Sanchez.

Safe pick.

Sanchez is a better athlete but the difference is college experience. Barkley has way more game experience going into the draft.

I'd say he's safe as QBs go...Good prospect.

Iamcanadian 05-02-2012 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellisan (Post 2982883)
I find Luck and RGIII to be such an interesting couple of QB's. I am not sold on either one but I would use a rating system similar to how Baseball HQ rates prospects... First the ceiling in a numerical fashion, and then a letter grade (A being the highest)

RGIII is a 10D - Hall of Fame Potential and about a 25% chance or so in my book of reaching it. Due to injuries, the differences from his offense to the NFL style game, and the fact that let's face it despite his speed he is not an instinctive runner hurt him... however if he pans out I can see him leading the league in passing yards and TDs etc. if he stays healthy, being a multiple MVP.

Luck is an 8A for me. Potential Pro Bowler that can win titles with a strong D. I can't see him ever being anywhere near the top of the league in passing or winning an MVP. However he will be the ultimate game manager type QB that inspires his team, keeps the chains moving with strong runs when need be, and has the ability to make a big pass when necessary. Not much chance of him completely flaming out.

Barkley in Comparison is a 9A for me. All Pro caliber. I see him eventually being in the top 10 in passing year after year, and depending upon the quality of his weapons can be a championship-level signal caller.

I have to disagree, if Barkley comes out this year, he is the #3 QB in the draft and returning to school isn't going to change that.
Luck, IMO, is a 10A all the way and once Indy gets up to snuff, he will be a sure fire HoF QB quite capable of leading the NFL in passing. Everything about him shouts out Peyton with maybe a true winner thrown in.

RG111 has it all, a great arm, a perfect temperament, no fear, high football IQ and quick feet even if they aren't Vick like. Of course, there are no guarantees but outside of injuries, he should do quite well.

Barkley has some limitations, not a perfect height, solid but not a great arm, comes from a school where he had 2 future All Pro OT's defending him and has superior talent at WR. It is far more difficult to judge how good he will be when he gets to the pros and hasn't all that superior talent around After all, even with all that talent, Oregon has dominated the Pac 12.

tjsunstein 05-02-2012 07:18 PM

Throw around HOF again when discussing a prospect and I'll double sack whack you.

Raiderz4Life 05-02-2012 07:34 PM

You know its IIIs not 111s for RGIII?? I will join tj too.

I know its a total pipe dream but I sometimes wish everything would fall into place and Barkley falls and lands on the Raiders haha

I really do think he'll establish himself as #1 this season.

SickwithIt1010 05-02-2012 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iamcanadian (Post 2983172)
I have to disagree, if Barkley comes out this year, he is the #3 QB in the draft and returning to school isn't going to change that.
Luck, IMO, is a 10A all the way and once Indy gets up to snuff, he will be a sure fire HoF QB quite capable of leading the NFL in passing. Everything about him shouts out Peyton with maybe a true winner thrown in.

RG111 has it all, a great arm, a perfect temperament, no fear, high football IQ and quick feet even if they aren't Vick like. Of course, there are no guarantees but outside of injuries, he should do quite well.

Barkley has some limitations, not a perfect height, solid but not a great arm, comes from a school where he had 2 future All Pro OT's defending him and has superior talent at WR. It is far more difficult to judge how good he will be when he gets to the pros and hasn't all that superior talent around After all, even with all that talent, Oregon has dominated the Pac 12.

Oregon had more talent his freshman and sophomore year, plain and simple. Thats why they won. USC didnt have the type of teams that youve seen USC field his 1st 2 years there. Ive watched every game that he has played while hes been there and he is what makes that offense go. With your comments you make it seem as though when he came out guys like Aaron Corp and Mitch Mustain (who were both 5* recruits) shouldnt have skipped a beat.

Bark is the real deal. He has a better arm than Luck so for people to keep saying that it is on par and what not need to get rid of that. His accuracy isnt as good, but the arm is better. Luck is a better athlete and completes a ton of passes on the run while Bark stays in the pocket a little bit more. With the whole offense being a year older this year his numbers SHOULD improve, or so I hope.

Many do fail to realize that he is doing the same thing guys like Luck and Peyton did in college and he is starting to be the general of that offense and Kiffen is letting him call plays at the line. Hes not missing much, other than that other inch people want.


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