Draft Countdown Forums

Draft Countdown Forums (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/index.php)
-   2014 NFL Draft Forum (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=47)
-   -   USC Trojan Breakdown (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53116)

Shane P. Hallam 06-02-2012 03:31 PM

USC Trojan Breakdown
 
Watched some of the Trojans today, here are some thoughts:


Matthew Jones 06-02-2012 03:49 PM

For anyone who's interested, I posted clips of the Trojans' 2011 game against Notre Dame here:

http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/...ad.php?t=53099

USC offense vs. Notre Dame defense:



USC defense vs. Notre Dame offense:


Halsey 06-02-2012 04:09 PM

Good stuff. It seems like everyone who watches Barkley comes away impressed with his accuracy, mechanics, ball placement, anticipation, etc. Those type things really jump out at you with Barkley. His lack of ideal eight and athleticism seem to force him to excel in other areas. It's apparent he works very hard to be a good QB.

Flyboy 06-03-2012 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halsey (Post 3019825)
Good stuff. It seems like everyone who watches Barkley comes away impressed with his accuracy, mechanics, ball placement, anticipation, etc. Those type things really jump out at you with Barkley. His lack of ideal eight and athleticism seem to force him to excel in other areas. It's apparent he works very hard to be a good QB.

He actually reminds me of Matt Ryan except with a higher ceiling.

Razor 06-03-2012 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyboy (Post 3020409)
He actually reminds me of Matt Ryan except with a higher ceiling.

Really? I think Matt Ryan is a pretty accurate description of Barkley, who has little or no upside. He's a safe pick, but I'm pretty damn sure that he won't be the first, second or maybe even third QB selected. Wilson, Thomas and Bray all have lots of upside and very good tools to work with. Given the choice NFL teams will usually pick upside over ability, especially at QB.

Poz51 06-05-2012 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam (Post 3019793)
Watched some of the Trojans today, here are some thoughts:

I like the break down, and agree with pretty much all of it myself, nice job.
I have Woods, Barkley, McDonald and Horton in my (yes I know its early) initial 2013 mock, and was wondering if you wouldnt mind giving me your thoughts on my thoughts/breakdown... If not, no worries, nice break down, and I look forward to the next one.

"Matt Barkley (QB – U.S.C.)
Plenty of draftniks and NFL folk have Barkley as the #1 quarterback heading 2013 NFL draft pre-season, and with good reason. He comes from a pro-style offense, can audible and read defenses, has progressed every year since starting as a freshman, leads his receivers allowing them to YAC with his impressive accuracy and sense of timing, is mechanically sound and gets the best out of his ability, has great pocket presence and feel for the game, and is a great leader with top notch intangibles. Barkley however has his weaknesses. His physical dimensions are less than desired and I worry about him taking a pounding at the NFL level, where he might not have top ten type tackles protecting him and PAC-10/12 defenders coming at him. He can make the throws, but has an average arm and might be limited in terms of offensive style, WCO? Jimmy Clausen’s deep ball, and his “arm talent” is very limited down the field and is not going to win many, if any foot races, although his ability to throw accurately on the move is impressive. I worry about his ability to fit the ball into tight windows at the next level.

Robert Woods (WR – U.S.C.)
Woods has been an extremely productive receiver at the college level, his ability to separate and suddenness in and out of his breaks, along with his very good speed and route running make him a threat to do something special every play. Woods reliance on his athletic ability, as well as his current size limitation concerns me at the next level, and his inability to beat the jam at the next level will throw his timing off. Despite some of the limitations physically, Woods is a dynamic prospect, who has game-breaking qualities. If Woods can add some weight and keep his athleticism, speed and quickness, there is no reason he could not go higher than this.

T.J. McDonald (FS – U.S.C.)
Watching McDonald the first thing that I noticed was his size, 6-2, 6-3, he looks the part. Then his instincts, he reacts well to the play and puts himself in position to make the play. He plays well in run support, has a good feel for the passing game and will pick the ball off. Offensive players must be aware of McDonald as he is not afraid to come up lay the lumber to anyone. Smart, athletic, McDonald can cover tight ends and play the deep end of the field well. If Mark Barron is a top ten pick, McDonald is a top ten candidate.

Wes Horton (DE – U.S.C.)
Horton is already a physical, run stopping defensive end who can hold down the point of attack, set the edge and do what needs to be done in the run game, I expect his pass rushing ability to improve significantly this season and become part of the first round chatter heading into the 2013 draft."

HakeemtheMachine 06-05-2012 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poz51 (Post 3023264)
I like the break down, and agree with pretty much all of it myself, nice job.
I have Woods, Barkley, McDonald and Horton in my (yes I know its early) initial 2013 mock, and was wondering if you wouldnt mind giving me your thoughts on my thoughts/breakdown... If not, no worries, nice break down, and I look forward to the next one.

"Matt Barkley (QB – U.S.C.)
Plenty of draftniks and NFL folk have Barkley as the #1 quarterback heading 2013 NFL draft pre-season, and with good reason. He comes from a pro-style offense, can audible and read defenses, has progressed every year since starting as a freshman, leads his receivers allowing them to YAC with his impressive accuracy and sense of timing, is mechanically sound and gets the best out of his ability, has great pocket presence and feel for the game, and is a great leader with top notch intangibles. Barkley however has his weaknesses. His physical dimensions are less than desired and I worry about him taking a pounding at the NFL level, where he might not have top ten type tackles protecting him and PAC-10/12 defenders coming at him. He can make the throws, but has an average arm and might be limited in terms of offensive style, WCO? Jimmy Clausen’s deep ball, and his “arm talent” is very limited down the field and is not going to win many, if any foot races, although his ability to throw accurately on the move is impressive. I worry about his ability to fit the ball into tight windows at the next level.

Robert Woods (WR – U.S.C.)
Woods has been an extremely productive receiver at the college level, his ability to separate and suddenness in and out of his breaks, along with his very good speed and route running make him a threat to do something special every play. Woods reliance on his athletic ability, as well as his current size limitation concerns me at the next level, and his inability to beat the jam at the next level will throw his timing off. Despite some of the limitations physically, Woods is a dynamic prospect, who has game-breaking qualities. If Woods can add some weight and keep his athleticism, speed and quickness, there is no reason he could not go higher than this.

T.J. McDonald (FS – U.S.C.)
Watching McDonald the first thing that I noticed was his size, 6-2, 6-3, he looks the part. Then his instincts, he reacts well to the play and puts himself in position to make the play. He plays well in run support, has a good feel for the passing game and will pick the ball off. Offensive players must be aware of McDonald as he is not afraid to come up lay the lumber to anyone. Smart, athletic, McDonald can cover tight ends and play the deep end of the field well. If Mark Barron is a top ten pick, McDonald is a top ten candidate.

Wes Horton (DE – U.S.C.)
Horton is already a physical, run stopping defensive end who can hold down the point of attack, set the edge and do what needs to be done in the run game, I expect his pass rushing ability to improve significantly this season and become part of the first round chatter heading into the 2013 draft."

I think Hayes Pullard could be a candidate to leave early.He is a RS Soph this year but he already has the look of an NFL LB. I think he is going to have a huge year

SolidGold 06-05-2012 02:26 PM

I am a huge Barkley fan, I think he will be this year's target of unwarranted scrutiny. As long as he measures in a 6'2" he should be one of the top QBs taken.

keylime_5 06-05-2012 06:18 PM

Barkley's lack of ideal size and athleticism is a worry. His arm is only a little above average, not great, but that is not a problem to me considering his top notch intelligence, accuracy, polish and other intangeables. We know that his numbers aren't inflated by a gimmicky system either like all of those spread QBs' have been.

I love Woods. Really would like to see him on the Browns. Not a true elite WR prospect, but he compares favorably to Reggie Wayne and should be a #1 receiver. What both Woods and Barkley have going against them though is upside. There will be some more physically gifted players coming along, maybe Justin Hunter at WR and someone like Tyler Wilson at QB.

Poz51 06-06-2012 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HakeemtheMachine (Post 3023438)
I think Hayes Pullard could be a candidate to leave early.He is a RS Soph this year but he already has the look of an NFL LB. I think he is going to have a huge year

I did not notice him much in the games I watched, except Oregon, in which he looked like a top ten talent. IMO at his height he needs to to bulk up and keep his athleticism to be able to have an Oregon type impact in the NFL. I would think at this point he is better served to stay in school at least one more year after this one myself, but a huge year might persuade him otherwise, for better or worse.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolidGold (Post 3023496)
I am a huge Barkley fan, I think he will be this year's target of unwarranted scrutiny. As long as he measures in a 6'2" he should be one of the top QBs taken.

I am sure he will get torn up pretty well this year as well. Personally I think he has reached his ceiling in terms of ability, which I see as a good thing, in that you know what you are going to get, and if I run a WCO (Seattle...) I would love to have him, although I am not so hot on him if I run a more vertical type system. In my mock I have him going 10th (3rd QB taken overall) to Seattle, having #1 overall potential because he does so much so well. Some take that as a slight, but I think he will be one of the top QB's taken as well, and is a great prospect overall. He to me is similar to Drew Brees, and although physically I worry about guys taking a NFL pounding at 6'2" and 220 lbs or less, he would still be bigger than Brees, who has managed to do quite well for himself at 6', 209. The USC offensive style certainly helps.

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5 (Post 3023801)
I love Woods. Really would like to see him on the Browns. Not a true elite WR prospect, but he compares favorably to Reggie Wayne and should be a #1receiver. What both Woods and Barkley have going against them though is upside. There will be some more physically gifted players coming along, maybe Justin Hunter at WR and someone like Tyler Wilson at QB.

I am basically with you on Barkley, although I dont like pigeon holing players, a spade is a spade and to me Barkley screams WCO. Although I agree with you on his limited upside, I dont think in a WCO it is a problem because IMO he comes into a WCO and already has all the qualities you would want, not alot of development needed, and upside is not so much of a concern, vs. his fit in a more vertical style. As for Woods this thought is starting to turn my evaluation of him into a more negative one. I am not sure his ceiling gets much higher unless he becomes a pre-snap movement guy, or maybe a slot type. Could he add bulk and still be as athletic, or even athletic enough to be a #!? I dont know. 180 lbs concerns me, although I do think with the way that NFL teams are starting to spread things out, it might not be as big of an issue as it has been in the past, I actually see him more along the lines of a bigger Desean Jackson type myslef, although the Wayne comaprison is interesting, maybe a love child of the two?? If Hunter returns to form, I think he could push the top of the board, and think that you have a great point about Wilson and Hunter being more physically gifted.

keylime_5 06-07-2012 04:41 PM

I think Woods is bigger than 180. He's more like 6 feet or 6 feet 1 and 190ish lbs. He'll play in that 190-200 lb. range in the NFL just like Wayne. Jackson is like 5'10"/160 with 4.3 speed. Woods is more of a 4.45 guy. Like I said his measurables are almost exactly like Wayne's, and his game is comparable too.

I like Hunter a lot. He has a game similar to AJ Green and was putting up sick numbers before he go hurt. His upside is fantastic. I definitely think the cream of the crop will rise to the top and that is usually physically gifted guys with great upside who have great seasons. This probably will be at the expense of the USC stars.

cmd34 06-07-2012 06:45 PM

some other players you guys should check out are:
Devon Kennard DE - He has started or played significant downs at SOLB, MLB, LDE, and RDE for the Trojans. He is going to be a fulltime starter at LDE this year. I think he will be appealing to 3-4 teams.
Dion Bailey OLB - I can't believe someone brought up Hayes Pullard but did not mention Bailey. Bailey was the most impressive player on the field most games. He will be a redshirt sophomore this next season. Personally, I believe his NFL future is at Safety (he's 6'0" and 205 lbs)
Gerald Bowman S - The nation's top JuCo safety was as impressive a JuCo player as I've seen. He should quickly work his way into the starting line-up and team with TJ McDonald to form one of the top safety tandems in the nation. Great speed, instincts, and very willing hitter.

HakeemtheMachine 06-08-2012 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmd34 (Post 3026900)
some other players you guys should check out are:
Devon Kennard DE - He has started or played significant downs at SOLB, MLB, LDE, and RDE for the Trojans. He is going to be a fulltime starter at LDE this year. I think he will be appealing to 3-4 teams.
Dion Bailey OLB - I can't believe someone brought up Hayes Pullard but did not mention Bailey. Bailey was the most impressive player on the field most games. He will be a redshirt sophomore this next season. Personally, I believe his NFL future is at Safety (he's 6'0" and 205 lbs)
Gerald Bowman S - The nation's top JuCo safety was as impressive a JuCo player as I've seen. He should quickly work his way into the starting line-up and team with TJ McDonald to form one of the top safety tandems in the nation. Great speed, instincts, and very willing hitter.

Didnt bring up Bailey because although Pullard is an undersized LB, Bailey is extremely undersized and needs more time.I cant see him coming out

Poz51 06-08-2012 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmd34 (Post 3026900)
some other players you guys should check out are:
Devon Kennard DE - He has started or played significant downs at SOLB, MLB, LDE, and RDE for the Trojans. He is going to be a fulltime starter at LDE this year. I think he will be appealing to 3-4 teams.
Dion Bailey OLB - I can't believe someone brought up Hayes Pullard but did not mention Bailey. Bailey was the most impressive player on the field most games. He will be a redshirt sophomore this next season. Personally, I believe his NFL future is at Safety (he's 6'0" and 205 lbs)
Gerald Bowman S - The nation's top JuCo safety was as impressive a JuCo player as I've seen. He should quickly work his way into the starting line-up and team with TJ McDonald to form one of the top safety tandems in the nation. Great speed, instincts, and very willing hitter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HakeemtheMachine (Post 3027209)
Didnt bring up Bailey because although Pullard is an undersized LB, Bailey is extremely undersized and needs more time.I cant see him coming out

Im with Hakeem on Bailey, who similarly to Pullard, might be better served moving to safety, and I dont see either really coming out at this point. Dennard is interesting in that he can really boost his stock this season, he certainly has showed flexability, especially in moving from DE, to ILB, and now back again to DE for this year, for me he hasnt really wowed me, but his versatility certainly makes him a late round posibility for me at this point. I havent seen anything of Bowman at this point, so I cant comment on him, but will keep an eye on him this year.

cmd34 06-08-2012 01:16 PM

Bailey is really a safety at heart. Monte Kiffin moved him to linebacker to help neutralize the speed of some Pac-12's offenses. I see him making the transition back to safety in the NFL like so many Pac-10 players have done before (Darren Woodson, Carnell Lake, Sammy Knight, etc). He plays the SOLB position like a strong safety who gets to creep up to the los anyway. He's an exceptional talent.

HakeemtheMachine 06-10-2012 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmd34 (Post 3027589)
Bailey is really a safety at heart. Monte Kiffin moved him to linebacker to help neutralize the speed of some Pac-12's offenses. I see him making the transition back to safety in the NFL like so many Pac-10 players have done before (Darren Woodson, Carnell Lake, Sammy Knight, etc). He plays the SOLB position like a strong safety who gets to creep up to the los anyway. He's an exceptional talent.

Even then is he good enough in coverage to handle playing safety.A Box safety isnt in much of demand these days in the NFL.I do admit he is talented just a little in limbo on a perfect fit

cmd34 06-10-2012 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HakeemtheMachine (Post 3028860)
Even then is he good enough in coverage to handle playing safety.A Box safety isnt in much of demand these days in the NFL.I do admit he is talented just a little in limbo on a perfect fit

I don't know, Mark Barron, who IMO is a strong safety only, just went pretty high. I'm willing to bet Bailey is faster or at least as fast as Barron.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:34 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.