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-   -   How is Mark Sanchez So Bad? (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56607)

Swoll_Cat 04-29-2013 12:19 AM

How is Mark Sanchez So Bad?
 
I just don't get it. yes, i understand he's regressed. yes, i understand that you're suppose to be a better football player (stronger, smarter, more experienced) in your fourth year than in your first year. But really,

How is Mark Sanchez so bad? He's been in HUGE games before, most notably colt, steeler, and patriot playoff games. He's beaten the best with his arm, made good plays, and has plently, i mean plenty of championship caliber experience.

How do you lose your balls (confidence) and play as bad as he did last year?

Do the jets have some god-awful training staff? Does the team just give him the off-season off and say hey, do as you may as long as youre here in june? this guy is terrible and i really dont think a change of scenery as many predict, will be what gets him over the hump. I can already see him throwing a pick 6 or getting sacked from behind while scrambling as a member of another team. he may not be athletic, but trends dictate much more competence out of a player whose been in a familiar setting for 4 years at such a prime age.

I want to see your thought process as far as why you think he keeps getting worse year after year after year after year...

Ness 04-29-2013 12:28 AM

Those playoff teams he was on focused on running the football and playing good defense. Sanchez was never the focal point of those teams. Now that the team has gotten worse, so has he. He just isn't that good of a quarterback. It has happened and will happen again to a lot of highly touted guys coming out of college. That is just the way it is. The coaching staff is partly to blame in New York, but at the same time Sanchez is also responsible for some of his own failures.

nepg 04-29-2013 12:36 AM

I think they did kind of just leave him to his own devices. He needed someone to teach him how to be a QB year-round rather than just when you're obligated to do it. He regressed because defenses figured him out, and he never adjusted or got better. I liked Sanchez coming out. More than Stafford. He's still had more success than Stafford.

He just has that Matt Leinart in him where he just doesn't really want to put the work in that it takes to be really good. He'll either be good by osmosis, or whatever.

Saints-Tigers 04-29-2013 02:12 AM

Mark Sanchez's team has been further in the playoffs than Stafford's. I count that as more success about as much as I would say "T-Mac's Spurs team just eliminated Kobe's Lakers."

SuperPacker 04-29-2013 06:51 AM

Alex Smith is Mark Sanchez. Sanchez got them to two AFC Championship games and now he's one of the worst starting QB's in the league. The only reason he was average in his first two years was because he was a game manager and he had an elite defense. Sound like anyone else? Alex Smith is gonna fail so badly once he's actually made to throw the ball and is playing with an average defense.

FUNBUNCHER 04-29-2013 06:59 AM

WHen he's playing at his best I think Sanchez is at least an average NFL, maybe better than that.

He just lost his confidence as he became more afraid of making mistakes, which led to even more idiotic decisions from the pocket.

I think Sanchez is the type of guy who started to believe he didn't have any weapons to catch the ball and played down to that level, instead of trying to find a way to manufacture drives and points.

Finally I think Sanchez in his heart believes he's a better QB than he's shown, which is a mistake. He's not an established pro bowl QB who had a bad stretch of games last year. Sanchez is a guy who many believe was the byproduct of a great defense and still hasn't proven himself.

I'm not a huge fan of his, but I still think if he'd had two competent WRs, a reliable run game and more protection from his oline, there's no way the Jets would have drafted Geno SMith with the 39the pick.

jrdrylie 04-29-2013 07:27 AM

Two reasons. Lack of mental toughness and coaching. He looked like he had a bright future after his first year. But he didn't get any better. How is that possible? A good QB coach could have gotten more out of him. But Sanchez also seems to lack mental toughness. When he makes mistakes, he doesn't forget and move on. He just gets worse. When the team brought in Tebow, yeah it sucked, but a real QB would have stepped up and shown that without a doubt it was still his team.

I still think he has a chance. Getting cut would be great for him. Maybe go to New England, Houston, New Orleans, or Arizona. Sit for two years and actually get coached up. If he does that, he will be 28 and ready to contribute.

Brent 04-29-2013 07:43 AM

I don't think he's worse than when he came into the league. He's always been a bad QB; there has been no progress, rather than any regression.

AcheTen (Thumper) 04-29-2013 08:06 AM

He was never "good" to start.

In 2009 and 2010, he was winning games because he was on a team with the best defense in football. You can put almost anybody behind center on that kind of team and they'll win games.

He was wretched in 2009 and 2010 even when he was winning. The Jets almost missed the playoffs in 2009 because of his ineptitude. A team with the 2009 Jets defense, but with a real franchise QB instead of Sanchez, would be a 14-2 lock for the Super Bowl.

2009:
53.8% 2444 yards 12 TDs 20 INTs 6.7 Y/A 63.0 QB rating
2010:
54.8% 3291 yards 17 TDs 13 INTs 6.5 Y/A 75.3 QB rating
2011:
56.7% 3474 yards 26 TDs 18 INTs 6.4 Y/A 78.2 QB rating
2012:
54.3% 2883 yards 13 TDs 18 INTs 6.4 Y/A 66.9 QB rating


As you can see, he's been consistently mediocre across four years of his career thus far in the NFL.

THe only thing that has changed is the dominance of the Jets defense. In 2009 and 2010 they were literally the best in the game. In 2011 and 2012, good but not great.

princefielder28 04-29-2013 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperPacker (Post 3351360)
Alex Smith is Mark Sanchez. Sanchez got them to two AFC Championship games and now he's one of the worst starting QB's in the league. The only reason he was average in his first two years was because he was a game manager and he had an elite defense. Sound like anyone else? Alex Smith is gonna fail so badly once he's actually made to throw the ball and is playing with an average defense.

Weak comparison. Smith is far more competent than Sanchez. I will not deny that Smith's best fit is as a game manager but he also has the ability, whether it's with his feet or arm, to make the necessary play if the time calls for it. The performance Smith had against the Saints in the 2012 Divisional round was extraordinary and more than anything Sanchez can point to throughout his career. Smith has also proven to be more mentally strong than Sanchez.

SuperPacker 04-29-2013 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by princefielder28 (Post 3351396)
Weak comparison. Smith is far more competent than Sanchez. I will not deny that Smith's best fit is as a game manager but he also has the ability, whether it's with his feet or arm, to make the necessary play if the time calls for it. The performance Smith had against the Saints in the 2012 Divisional round was extraordinary and more than anything Sanchez can point to throughout his career. Smith has also proven to be more mentally strong than Sanchez.

Why is Smith more competent than Sanchez? Smith had a MUCH better situation than Sanchez; he had what Sanchez had him 09 and 10, but better. If you put Alex Smith on the Jets last season and Sanchez on the 49ers, i'd guess that Sanchez would be seen as the better QB. Either way, both of them suck.

Jvig43 04-29-2013 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent (Post 3351382)
I don't think he's worse than when he came into the league. He's always been a bad QB; there has been no progress, rather than any regression.

Seriously this. No, Mark Sanchez didn't just all of sudden become bad because he lost his confidence and mental toughness. Mark Sanchez has always been a mediocre to below average quarterback who happened to play for an amazingly talented and stacked team for his first two seasons. Once the talent level in NY declined, Sanchez was obviously going down with the ship. Franchise QBs are able to keep their teams ship afloat in these scenarios, Sanchez was NEVER going to be that QB.

Also this thread makes me soooooo happy (The title specifically, but also because guys like Iamcanadian and Complex defended this guy at every chance they got even including last season).

Also, a Jets fan on here once told me the only reason i thought Mark Sanchez was bad was because he plowed my mom and I was a Patriots homer.

Don Vito 04-29-2013 08:29 AM

Shhhhh, Iamcanadian and all the Sanchez apologists are all right. Whatever keeps Sanchez starting for the Jets I am all for it.

In all seriousness though, he is awful. This shouldn't be news. I hope they keep him forever.




Jvig43 04-29-2013 08:36 AM

The Sanchez, Geno, Tebow Wildcat trifecta would have been without doubt the most incredible thing I have ever seen. Damn new management trying to right this ship.

Basileus777 04-29-2013 08:52 AM

He was never any good. Regressed? This is a quarterback that couldn't throw to his left early in his career.

VAfy-ya 04-29-2013 09:58 AM

Its fairly simple. He hasn't progressed. There is absoultely ZERO development there. And that's why I hate when teams pick franchise QBs high who lacked the intangibles(moxy, pocket awareness, self-motivation, arm talent, poise under pressure) and put them on teams with defensive minded HC who have no clue about how to develop them. Sanchez never exhibited any of those traits in college, from my perspective. People liked his physical intangibles to a degree and his ceiling. But the bust factor was too high to go to a Rex Ryan-led team. Certain guys exhibit those intangibles and no matter what kind of coach they play for, those traits are going to come through and shine. Matt Ryan, Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck off the top of my head...they went to defensive-minded regimes but they were such great QB prospects who oozed those intangibles, it didn't matter.

He isn't really a self-motivated guy, at least not from what's been reported about his work ethic. Sanchez needed a offensive-minded HC that was going to push him and challenge him everyday, during the season and the off-season to get better and work at his craft. Challange him in the film room, harp on his bad footwork and sloppy mechanics, day in and day out. Piss him off and make him work harder until he became better. Most defensive coaches don't understand that because....well, their too busy fixing their defense. There are some instances where defensive coaches have great offensive coaching, who will take the reigns and develop a QB(Gilbride in NY). But most times a young QB needs great offensive mentor. I saw it first hand with Nolan and Alex Smith. Sanchez was a carbon-copy of Alex....he needed to be nurtured by a offensive father-figure because he was NOT ready coming into the league and lacked those certain intangibles it takes to succeed, long-term.

Early in his career the offennse wasn't focused around him, it focused on the running game. His reads were simplified and the running game carried the offense. The defense was awsome and that's how they won game. But being in the same division with the Pats, you have to keep up. So Ryan wanted more from the passing game so they put more on his plate. But the progression from him as a QB didn't warrant the leap of faith. The running game got worst and worst, as his flaws were being exposed. The defense got older and injuries started to mount, and their play started to dip, which put even more pressure for him to step up, which never happened.

Now of course, going to a offensive-minded HC doesnt guaranteed success either. But in general, OC-driven teams understand the importance of development and growth at the position and make it a focal point, not an afterthought. But more importantly, they understand the ramifications when they DON'T see that improvement or growth, and act swiftly and accordingly, in most instances.

NY+Giants=NYG 04-29-2013 11:39 AM

My cousin is a Jets fan, and I thank the football gods that I was able to share the amazing butt fumble with him. By far the best thing ever! The look on his face when it happened was priceless! I couldn't stop laughing for like 10 minutes. In all my days of following football, I never see a play so funny.

Jvig43 04-29-2013 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG (Post 3351546)
My cousin is a Jets fan, and I thank the football gods that I was able to share the amazing butt fumble with him. By far the best thing ever! The look on his face when it happened was priceless! I couldn't stop laughing for like 10 minutes. In all my days of following football, I never see a play so funny.

As a Patriots fan, you have no idea the pleasure I still take in watching that play transpire.

NY+Giants=NYG 04-29-2013 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jvig43 (Post 3351567)
As a Patriots fan, you have no idea the pleasure I still take in watching that play transpire.

It was clearly amazing. I remember sitting on the couch, my cousin was next to me, and the jets were struggling. Then the play occurs! I was shocked seeing it, and look over at my cousin to see if he reacted, and he closed his eyes like, god what a mess, and the replay showed it again, and I couldn't stop laughing.

It was truly amazing! That play is Mark Sanchez!

bigbluedefense 04-29-2013 12:45 PM

He can't read defenses, he has poor work ethic, and he has a limited arm.

/thread.

gsorace 04-29-2013 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent (Post 3351382)
I don't think he's worse than when he came into the league. He's always been a bad QB; there has been no progress, rather than any regression.

This. Everyone kept saying how he regressed in 2011 from his 2010 season, but that's only because the Jets went deep into the playoffs in 2010, statistically 2011 was his best season by far and he was still terrible.

Mark Sanchez today is the same QB he was when he left USC, he only looks as good as the team around him.

descendency 04-29-2013 01:33 PM

Sanchez is bad because the talent around him is bad and the coaching staff is incompetent.

When Geno Smith (who is a much rawer product than people realize) gets into the system, if they don't get serious about their young QB's development - then he will be a "bust" in by his rookie contract's end too.

FlyingElvis 04-29-2013 01:38 PM

lmfao . . .

Set to Benny Hill theme song (I <3 you, interwebz)





On nfl.com w/the live call - Collinsworth: "Oh. My. God. I've never seen this before in my life."
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...mble-return-TD



He just wasn't ready coming out of USC and most people saw it that way. Another few years and maybe he would have matured enough to handle the pressure involved with an NFL gig.

The release of Tebow makes me sad. :crybaby:

Hurricanes25 04-29-2013 01:42 PM

It's time for the Jets to completely move on from Sanchez. They released Tebow today and Sanchez should be next.

A change of scenery won't do anything for him. He'll never win a starting QB job in camp/preseason. His mental makeup in too fragile and it's gotten worse over time.

As for the 2013 QB situation for the Jets, I'm hoping we give the job to Garrard to start the season. Geno isn't ready and the supporting cast is lackluster. Let Garrard take all the bumps. What's everyone thoughts on that?

FlyingElvis 04-29-2013 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hurricanes25 (Post 3351684)
It's time for the Jets to completely move on from Sanchez. They released Tebow today and Sanchez should be next.

A change of scenery won't do anything for him. He'll never win a starting QB job in camp/preseason. His mental makeup in too fragile and it's gotten worse over time.

As for the 2013 QB situation for the Jets, I'm hoping we give the job to Garrard to start the season. Geno isn't ready and the supporting cast is lackluster. Let Garrard take all the bumps. What's everyone thoughts on that?

Sanchez gives you a better change of a high pick. Garrard gives you a better chance of winning games. Honestly, as a Pats fan, I hope Garrard gets the nod.


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