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mightytitan9 06-12-2013 10:50 AM

How many current HOFers are playing
 
Spin off on the QB thread. I'm working on my list. Post your players who you think will have HOF careers (Or have already had and are close to hanging them up)

mightytitan9 06-12-2013 10:58 AM

Offensive Skill:
QB Peyton Manning
QB Tom Brady
QB Aaron Rodgers
QB Drew Brees
QB Ben Roethlisberger
QB Eli Manning
QB Andrew Luch
QB Cam Newton
QB RG3

RB Adrian Peterson
RB Chris Johnson
RB Jamaal Charles

WR Calvin Johnson
WR Andre Johnson
WR Larry Fitzgerald
WR Reggie Wayne
WR Roddy White
WR AJ Green

TE Rob Gronkowski
TE Tony Gonzalez
TE Antonio Gates
TE Jimmy Graham

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mightytitan9 (Post 3385000)
Offensive Skill:
QB Peyton Manning
QB Tom Brady
QB Drew Brees
QB Ben Roethlisberger
QB Eli Manning
QB Andrew Luch
QB Cam Newton
QB RG3

RB Adrian Peterson
RB Chris Johnson
RB Jamaal Charles

WR Calvin Johnson
WR Andre Johnson
WR Larry Fitzgerald
WR Reggie Wayne
WR Roddy White
WR AJ Green

TE Rob Gronkowski
TE Tony Gonzalez
TE Antonio Gates
TE Jimmy Graham



No for Luck, Bob, and Cam. Way too young right now to even consider it. Longevity may be issue for Bob, and Cam has yet to have a winning season. It's just way too early.

AP has a strong chance. Johnson needs to start being productive again, and do this for a long time. So that might be an issue in his career.
Out of the WRs, I think Megatron and Fitz do in their careers. At TE right now, only 1 guy, and that's Tony G.

mightytitan9 06-12-2013 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG (Post 3385005)
No for Luck, Bob, and Cam. Way too young right now to even consider it. Longevity may be issue for Bob, and Cam has yet to have a winning season. It's just way too early.

AP has a strong chance. Johnson needs to start being productive again, and do this for a long time. So that might be an issue in his career.
Out of the WRs, I think Megatron and Fitz do in their careers. At TE right now, only 1 guy, and that's Tony G.

It's projecting people over their career, not just saying who has a hall of fame resume' at the moment

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mightytitan9 (Post 3385011)
It's projecting people over their career, not just saying who has a hall of fame resume' at the moment

Oh well the title threw me off..

Quote:

current HOFers are playing
if this was based off my current QB thread, then I meant as of now, how many current HOF Qbs are playing. Meaning now..

However, to go with what you posted, I still think it will be hard for guys like Bob, and Newton. Longevity may be an issue. Same with Chris Johnson and some of the TEs you put, specifically, Gronk. Gronk is on his 4th or 5th surgery and the last one was on his back.

So I think you need to factor longevity into this. Some of these guys playing styles or past injury history may impact if they are a HOF or not. Stats and Longevity in football get you there. Stats meaning production and Wins, Sbs and so on.

It's not like baseball where you can be a compiler and get into the HOF like that. Due to the nature of this sport, you need to be good and for a long time. That alone in this specific sport is very hard to do.

mightytitan9 06-12-2013 12:32 PM

yeah I tried to change the title after I posted it because I realized it sounded weird, but couldn't change it.

RG3 and Cam are two that I thought long and hard about. I ended up putting them on it because I think they could be two of the leaders in the new era of QB play that actually produce passing numbers as well. I'm more worried about RG3 as he's now had 2 knee problems in what 3-4 years? Cam should be able to play another 8 seasons at the least, probably closer to 10-12 more years.

I don't question Chris Johnsons longevity. He's been one of the most durable backs in the NFL during his NFL career. He should be able to play another 4 seasons, which should account for roughly 5000 more rushing yards. That would put him close to 12000 for a career. Adrian Peterson is a bigger injury risk than CJ at this point.

Every once in a while a great player comes along and stops producing great numbers but was so great in his early career that they get in. The numbers that Gronk has put up in his first 3 years are these kind of numbers.

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mightytitan9 (Post 3385031)
yeah I tried to change the title after I posted it because I realized it sounded weird, but couldn't change it.

RG3 and Cam are two that I thought long and hard about. I ended up putting them on it because I think they could be two of the leaders in the new era of QB play that actually produce passing numbers as well. I'm more worried about RG3 as he's now had 2 knee problems in what 3-4 years? Cam should be able to play another 8 seasons at the least, probably closer to 10-12 more years.

I don't question Chris Johnsons longevity. He's been one of the most durable backs in the NFL during his NFL career. He should be able to play another 4 seasons, which should account for roughly 5000 more rushing yards. That would put him close to 12000 for a career. Adrian Peterson is a bigger injury risk than CJ at this point.

Every once in a while a great player comes along and stops producing great numbers but was so great in his early career that they get in. The numbers that Gronk has put up in his first 3 years are these kind of numbers.


I would like to see Johnson have more weapons around him so teams don't sit on stopping him. The QB needs to emerge and do some good things as well. I forgot about CJ. After that big season, and hold out, I really don't remember his name as a RB when I think of great Rbs in the league.

Bob in year 1 had a knee issue and 1 concussion. This is all in his rookie year. So HOF could be possible skill wise, but he needs to stay healthy. He can't be a Michael Vick and expect to be a HOFer. Newton I am not a fan of. He needs to get more mature. His antics are a real turn off. If he can be productive for a long time then he has a shot.

Denver Bronco56 06-12-2013 01:33 PM

Newton in now way shape or form should be considered a potential HOF yet... he turns the ball over A TON.. and despite his "sexy" stats he isnt able to produce wins... plain and simple a great QB should be able to muster some wins.. Even players like Dan Marino granted he never won a SB he still made the Dolphins a legitmate playoff team year in an year out with little help around him.


And injuries to RG3 already make him a risky pick because lets say he has 3-4 more good years similar to his rookie year wouldnt matter if he only has a shelf like of 6 years or so...

I mean players like Terrell Davis come to mind, nothing but excellence and accomplishments you could ask for but longevity is what hurts his case. And RG3 is already showing his playing style is not going to last with his build. The one thing Newton has is the ability to run around and take the hits because he is built like a tank.

mightytitan9 06-12-2013 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG (Post 3385041)
I would like to see Johnson have more weapons around him so teams don't sit on stopping him. The QB needs to emerge and do some good things as well. I forgot about CJ. After that big season, and hold out, I really don't remember his name as a RB when I think of great Rbs in the league.

This is somewhat disheartening.

Over the past 3 seasons
Peterson 4365
Foster 4264
Rice 3727
CJ 3654

Of those 4.
Total yards
Foster 5707
Rice 5465
AP 5062
CJ 4549

Statistically, he's still been a top 4 back in the league during that time. This while easily playing on the worst team of the 4, having the worst O-Line of the 4 and having an OC the past two seasons that didn't know what he was doing.

He had the longest run of his career, and 3 tds of 80+ yds in 2012 alone. No other RB has more than 3 in a career. This while averaging 20 less carries than he averaged the first 2 seasons, in fact over the past two he has averaged nearly 70 carries less than he did in what most consider his most productive 2 seasons.

It's more of a poor offensive line, poor playcalling, and not getting him the ball than anything else, and he's still produced top 4 results

Bengals78 06-12-2013 02:28 PM

The qualifications for HOF consideration for offensive players will need to change over time. The game is different now. Every QB, WR and TE is putting up monster numbers it seems....because we keep comparing it to the what most of us grew up with. It just isn't the same.

That is what makes Peyton and Brady amazing. They did it in both.

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 02:43 PM

Yeah see I would not have seen that or even realized that without looking it up. I think the media coverage of you guys hurts. The guys I would guess would be players like:

AP
Shady
Charles
Rice

And now I am interested to see how Martin and Morris do. If they can be highly productive then add them to the list.

To be fair, I don't really follow MJD either now.

I feel like the media has moved on in the coverage. I am saying this as an outsider who is not a fan of the team. The media like an A.D.D. entity who follow the newest, shiny toy. And I think CJ and MJD need to establish themselves just to bring back the attention to them.

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bengals78 (Post 3385099)
The qualifications for HOF consideration for offensive players will need to change over time. The game is different now. Every QB, WR and TE is putting up monster numbers it seems....because we keep comparing it to the what most of us grew up with. It just isn't the same.

That is what makes Peyton and Brady amazing. They did it in both.

I think it sorts itself out like a homeostasis type control. QBs now that are in the 30s who do well will get in because they are passing the older guys and/or won SBs.

Eventually though, all the newer QBs will rack up yards, and soon they will be fighting among themselves for HOF. Some of those guys will win a SB too. So I think that new standards will always keep the bar raising. At least I hope so.

mightytitan9 06-12-2013 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG (Post 3385112)
Yeah see I would not have seen that or even realized that without looking it up. I think the media coverage of you guys hurts. The guys I would guess would be players like:

AP
Shady
Charles
Rice

And now I am interested to see how Martin and Morris do. If they can be highly productive then add them to the list.

To be fair, I don't really follow MJD either now.

I feel like the media has moved on in the coverage. I am saying this as an outsider who is not a fan of the team. The media like an A.D.D. entity who follow the newest, shiny toy. And I think CJ and MJD need to establish themselves just to bring back the attention to them.

I agree, CJ soared to popularity by being on a team that went 10-0 to start the season, ending at 13-3 and for slashing the Ravens D in the playoff game before they cheaply injured him.

The next season he was on one of the worst teams starting 0-6 and getting blown out 59 to nothing, but he garnished attention (as did the team) after winning 8 of their last 10 games and CJ rushing for over 2000 yards and setting the all-time single season record for yards from scrimmage in a season.

The past few years have been very bleak for my Titans, we aren't in a major market to warrant the same attention Shady gets, and his past 3 seasons have just been steady, but unspectacular due to circumstances.

CJ will likely still play for 4 more seasons, barring injuries and major declines in play (CJ will be 31 after 4 seasons) he should accumulate another 5000 rushing yards. In the end, this would result in nearly 12000 rushing yards. Likely placing him in the all-time top 15.

There are some in that area that aren't likely HOFers, Fred Taylor 11695, Corey Dillon 11241 etc so it's possible he wouldn't get in.

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 03:13 PM

If I think that then how does some of the national media voters think of him. He had amazing seasons here and there, but then faded or went under the radar, or team didn't produce... I feel like Larry F. is the Wr version where he is HOF talent on a team where he can't produce at the highest level year in and year out. I hope that Palmer can hep Fitz put up insane numbers.

I think the voters need to see CJ put up better numbers and thus doing that will get him more attention. Now when I see all the shows it's all about AP, I seen Morris and martin in the picture. Obviously, Ray Rice since his team won, and being in the NFC East, Shady. Charles is the guy when you mention KC and Foster for the Texans.

Like I mentioned, it's sad to say but CJ and MJD you tend to forget about. I know I have. Not on purpose of course, but as a NFL fan you are looking at the other guys and then new rookies and younger players take the next step.

Bengals78 06-12-2013 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG (Post 3385113)
I think it sorts itself out like a homeostasis type control. QBs now that are in the 30s who do well will get in because they are passing the older guys and/or won SBs.

Eventually though, all the newer QBs will rack up yards, and soon they will be fighting among themselves for HOF. Some of those guys will win a SB too. So I think that new standards will always keep the bar raising. At least I hope so.

If it is anything like MLB it won't
(Look up the Adam Dunn HOF arguments based off of his HR numbers)

Denver Bronco56 06-12-2013 03:20 PM

I think alot of people overlook the impact of National Media...

Being a Broncos fan I have seen first hand the impact that the media plays into HOF consideration. So smaller market teams I feel are at a disadvantage in terms of recognition and media attention than a large market team and that in turn affects HOF consideration.

NY+Giants=NYG 06-12-2013 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bengals78 (Post 3385136)
If it is anything like MLB it won't
(Look up the Adam Dunn HOF arguments based off of his HR numbers)

I think that's the different between sports. The longevity of baseball players helps. You can have something called stat compilers where good players play for a 100 years and compile stats that make them look much better than they were. But because they played so long their numbers are HOF numbers.

In football, ironically, that's a good thing because it's hard to play a long time in this league, in this sport. So if a player can last and produce that's a very special thing. In baseball, you have a lot of guys that can stretch out their careers and play until their old.

The difference between the sports I think will make it so that football standards within the sport will or should differ than baseball.

stlouisfan37 06-25-2013 08:52 PM

I really don't see Chris Johnson making the Hall of Fame. While he was one of a handfull of backs to gain 2000 yards, he has a lot going against him. For starters, he has gained over 1000 yards every season, but he really only had that one monster year. Pretty much every modern era back in the Hall of Fame, save for Marshall Faulk, had multiple seasons with 1500+ yards. Additionally, he has a long way to go in the touchdown department. At the rate he is going, in another 3 seasons he will have 10,000 yards and 70 touchdowns, and he will be 30 and worn out. There is the magical Jim Brown line of 12,312 yards that pretty much writes your ticket to Canton...AP is on pace to make it, but no other backs in today's game are.

Don't get me wrong...CJ could have a strong late career and get there, but I really don't see him compiling the numbers necessary. I think the future is going to be really weak for RBs in the Hall of Fame until the game evolves back into a running game with a workhorse back.

mightytitan9 06-25-2013 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stlouisfan37 (Post 3392447)
I really don't see Chris Johnson making the Hall of Fame. While he was one of a handfull of backs to gain 2000 yards, he has a lot going against him. For starters, he has gained over 1000 yards every season, but he really only had that one monster year. Pretty much every modern era back in the Hall of Fame, save for Marshall Faulk, had multiple seasons with 1500+ yards. Additionally, he has a long way to go in the touchdown department. At the rate he is going, in another 3 seasons he will have 10,000 yards and 70 touchdowns, and he will be 30 and worn out. There is the magical Jim Brown line of 12,312 yards that pretty much writes your ticket to Canton...AP is on pace to make it, but no other backs in today's game are.

Don't get me wrong...CJ could have a strong late career and get there, but I really don't see him compiling the numbers necessary. I think the future is going to be really weak for RBs in the Hall of Fame until the game evolves back into a running game with a workhorse back.

I think your Chris Johnson numbers are a little low. First off, he should be able to play 4 seasons. Projecting his career average (excluding the 2000yd season) that's 4882 more yards. Projecting with his 2000yd season it's 6888. Even if he slips at the age of 30 (which is now closer to 31-32 for RBs than 30 like it had been in the past) he should still get somewhere around 5000 more yards to finish his career. That would put him at 11,888 career yards over 9 seasons. Given the tds he should finish around 80 rushing, and 8 receiving.

With all the records CJ has set, including yards from scrimmage in a season (2509), if he keeps up the pace it's hard for me to see him not get in. AP ran for 2097 but composed 2314 yards from scrimmage. You mentioned Marshall Faulk, but CJ has the record for yards from scrimmage. The greatest benefit to CJs HOF resume' would be if the Titans improved and he was on an offense that put up big numbers where he could ink out 8 easy tds a season.

In the end I think it largely depends on how long we can see AP and CJ play. Because as I am projecting, he could get hurt tomorrow and never be the same. The longevity is a bigger issue for AP than CJ. CJ has never missed a game and never had an injury besides the precautionary one where he wasn't allowed back into a game.

If CJ can finish his NFL career with 10000yds and 70tds as you mentioned, I have a hard time seeing him not get in. We're talking about a 2000yd rusher, yards from scrimmage in a season leader, and the owner of multiple other NFL records.

You can measure them against Jim Browns number all you want, but the fact is that 23 RBs have less career yards than Jim Brown and still managed to get in the HOF.

It will largely depend on the voters, and there will also be players with more yards that didn't get it. But it's all too early too tell. We can pick this conversation up in 5 years and see what we think then

boknows34 06-26-2013 02:31 PM

Turn the clock back 20 years ago.

Future HOFers from the 1992 season.

QB:
Joe Montana
John Elway
Dan Marino
Steve Young
Jim Kelly
Warren Moon
Troy Aikman
(Brett Favre 2016 lock)

RB:
Barry Sanders
Emmitt Smith
Eric Dickerson
Marcus Allen
Thurman Thomas
(Jerome Bettis? - drafted in 1993)

WR/TE:
Jerry Rice
Michael Irvin
Cris Carter
James Lofton
Art Monk
Shannon Sharpe
(Andre Reed? Tim Brown?)

OL:
Anthony Munoz (retired 1992)
Bruce Matthews
Dermontti Dawson
Randall McDaniel
Mike Munchak
Jackie Slater
Gary Zimmerman
(HOF Willie Roaf, Will Shields? drafted in 1993; HOF Larry Allen in 1994).

DL:
Reggie White
Bruce Smith
Howie Long
Cortez Kennedy
John Randle
Chris Doleman
(Charles Haley? Michael Strahan? drafted 1993)

LB:
Lawrence Taylor
Mike Singletary (retired 1992)
Derrick Thomas
Andre Tippett
Rickey Jackson
(Junior Seau lock 2015; Kevin Greene?)

DB:
Ronnie Lott
Deion Sanders
Rod Woodson
Darrell Green
(Steve Atwater? Aeneas Williams?)

Coach:
Don Shula
Bill Parcells
Joe Gibbs
Marv Levy

25 HOFers on offense
15 HOFers on defense
4 HOF head coaches

40 HOF players in 1992 (potentially another 6-8 from that year: Favre, Seau, Haley, Reed etc).
Singletary and Munoz retired following the 1992 season.
Roaf (HOF) and potential HOFers (Strahan, Shields, Bettis) were drafted in April 1993.

jth1331 06-26-2013 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bengals78 (Post 3385136)
If it is anything like MLB it won't
(Look up the Adam Dunn HOF arguments based off of his HR numbers)

Well, baseball has been played for so long, we are just now starting to see a change in what are more "normal" career numbers, mainly homeruns.

Football, every stat is getting skewed, well almost every stat it seems.
I mean, football is weird in their elections. Cris Carter took several years to get into the HOF, Tim Brown still not in, what will happen with Ward, Bruce, Wayne, etc?

niel89 06-26-2013 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jth1331 (Post 3392978)
Football, every stat is getting skewed, well almost every stat it seems.
I mean, football is weird in their elections. Cris Carter took several years to get into the HOF, Tim Brown still not in, what will happen with Ward, Bruce, Wayne, etc?

If Hines Ward ever gets in that will be ridiculous. He was a tough WR who made plays and could block his ass off, but he is not an all time great in any sense. He is a all time great Steeler, but he isn't even close to HoF worthy.

WCH 06-26-2013 05:18 PM

Do you know what I have in common with Hines Ward, Isaac Bruce, Reggie Wayne, and Donald Driver?

We're all 6'0" tall and none of us are getting into the HOF.

stlouisfan37 06-26-2013 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mightytitan9 (Post 3392469)
I think your Chris Johnson numbers are a little low. First off, he should be able to play 4 seasons. Projecting his career average (excluding the 2000yd season) that's 4882 more yards. Projecting with his 2000yd season it's 6888. Even if he slips at the age of 30 (which is now closer to 31-32 for RBs than 30 like it had been in the past) he should still get somewhere around 5000 more yards to finish his career. That would put him at 11,888 career yards over 9 seasons. Given the tds he should finish around 80 rushing, and 8 receiving.

With all the records CJ has set, including yards from scrimmage in a season (2509), if he keeps up the pace it's hard for me to see him not get in. AP ran for 2097 but composed 2314 yards from scrimmage. You mentioned Marshall Faulk, but CJ has the record for yards from scrimmage. The greatest benefit to CJs HOF resume' would be if the Titans improved and he was on an offense that put up big numbers where he could ink out 8 easy tds a season.

In the end I think it largely depends on how long we can see AP and CJ play. Because as I am projecting, he could get hurt tomorrow and never be the same. The longevity is a bigger issue for AP than CJ. CJ has never missed a game and never had an injury besides the precautionary one where he wasn't allowed back into a game.

If CJ can finish his NFL career with 10000yds and 70tds as you mentioned, I have a hard time seeing him not get in. We're talking about a 2000yd rusher, yards from scrimmage in a season leader, and the owner of multiple other NFL records.

You can measure them against Jim Browns number all you want, but the fact is that 23 RBs have less career yards than Jim Brown and still managed to get in the HOF.

It will largely depend on the voters, and there will also be players with more yards that didn't get it. But it's all too early too tell. We can pick this conversation up in 5 years and see what we think then

First off, let me say that I don't dislike Chris Johnson. I am a fan of his, not a huge fan, but a fan nonetheless. I follow a lot of small school football and I always pull for the unknown guy coming into the league.

I really don't see him playing at his current level beyond 30. He doesn't play like a guy his size. He plays like a bigger back and takes a lot of big hits. The fact that he has had so much success and stayed healthy playing this style says a lot about his toughness. That being said, I don't see him being the RB who plays into his 30's.

I also think that there are few people out there who will remember him as the best at his position, aside from the one big year. The reason I mentioned Marshall Faulk is that, while he never had the huge rushing season, he had 4 seasons in a row where he topped 2000 yards from scrimmage, including the 1999 season when he was only the 2nd back ever to have 1000 yards rushing and receiving.

Your mention of the 23 backs with less yardage than Jim Brown being in the Hall of Fame is somewhat unfair in this argument, in my opinion. A lot of those backs played way back in the day when 500 or 1000 yards was a huge accomplishment. Others were clearly dominant in a shortened career, such as Earl Campbell and Gale Sayers. Some of them were also inducted later as senior inductees, which is basically an effort by the Hall to not forget about the history of the game. If CJ were to get in, in my opinion, it would likely be in this fashion.

Lastly, I very much disagree with your suggestion that 10,000 yards and 70 TDs would be enough to get him in. Steven Jackson is sitting at 10,000 and 56 right now, along with 400 receptions, and I don't think he gets in either. I think they both fall into a similar category; really good players, but just not elite.

mightytitan9 06-26-2013 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stlouisfan37 (Post 3393121)
Lastly, I very much disagree with your suggestion that 10,000 yards and 70 TDs would be enough to get him in. Steven Jackson is sitting at 10,000 and 56 right now, along with 400 receptions, and I don't think he gets in either. I think they both fall into a similar category; really good players, but just not elite.

I don't mean for it to be the deciding factor, i'm saying that to me, that would solidify him as a HOFer. Not in the minds of the actual voters, just mine. Sorry for the confusion.

The Jackson comparison is a good one, but the stats are not the deciding factor. If CJ plays 3 more seasons, he should be at 10000 yards. Jackson took 9 seasons to get there with alot of average years. Obviously I am projecting CJ forward, and there's no way to tell for sure.


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