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Old 05-02-2011, 07:13 PM    (permalink
ChiefMojo
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Default Vontaze Burfict, ILB, Arizona St.

What do you guys think of Vontaze (Arizona State) when it comes to the 2012 NFL Draft? One would expect him to go very early in the 1st round as they guy is a athletic marvel and a physical beast!

With that said, one has to wonder if he is very similar to Lavar Arrington in the fact once he gets into the NFL they will try to reign him in? He seems to go for the kill shot a lot and teams and the NFL in general probably won't be to keen on that. Not only due to safety reasons, but the sake of his own pockets and possibly getting outside the grand scheme of the defense.

Do you guys think this is a legit worry or does his athletic/physical/production talents out weigh the concern?
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:14 PM    (permalink
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A special prospect. His tenacity on the field is unreal, he goes balls to the wall, he actually can diagnose plays, he does not over pursue. I dont know what is wrong with his game, well he is a headcase..but that is a good thing
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:16 PM    (permalink
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Everything you said is true, but the possible headcase aspect probably goes hand and hand with his beastly nature. He plays one way... GO!
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:20 PM    (permalink
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He's an incredible player, but a little ****** in the head.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:25 PM    (permalink
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LOVE him, my #1 guy early on....got a little Ray Ray in him.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:33 PM    (permalink
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Tackle numbers don't show the production I would expect from so highly regarded a prospect, can't really explain that.

But if Burfict tests well and blows up in 2011, he looks like a first round Mike, which is kinda rare nowadays.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:45 PM    (permalink
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Tackle numbers
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:25 PM    (permalink
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I met him once had huge entourage, but he doesn't drink or smoke and is all intensity all the time. His on the field problems are overblown, besides the incident at Washington State(I think) where he head butted a player he really hasn't deserved the penalties he has gotten. Plenty of times it seems like refs are entirely going out of their way to flag him for very legal hits.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:31 PM    (permalink
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Closest thing to Ray Lewis we're ever going to find. Nastiness personified on the field and one of those rare ILB's who you can just build a defense around. Excellent all around athlete with a fantastic build too. True tone setter in every sense of the word with all the devastating blows he's able to deliver on the football field. I'm interested in seeing his ability to play within the context of a scheme, but aside from that this guy is pure money in the bank, even at this point. As roscoesdad said, he's an early candidate to be the top overall prospect next year even though he's only played two years, kind of like Peterson was this year.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:37 PM    (permalink
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Who was the last first round MIKE??? McClain?
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:40 PM    (permalink
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If he plays up to his talent, top 10.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:43 PM    (permalink
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He plays with so much fury and tenacity out there. He just doesn't stop going. He is the most energetic and intense player I have watched at the college level ever. He is considered a head-case because he is all pure raw emotion and acts off that emotion a little too much sometimes. I have never seen a player that can literally jump past an opposing OL to get into the backfield and make the tackle. His ability to rush off the edge, read plays to stop the run, rush up the middle is unreal and his coverage isn't weak either. This kid reminds me a lot of Ray Lewis with his emotion and love for the game and his skills are insane to go with that great emotion and non-stop motor.
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Old 05-02-2011, 07:45 PM    (permalink
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Probably the best LB Prospect since Patrick Willis.
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:12 PM    (permalink
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he is a better prospect than Willis imo. Prob have to go all the back to 2000 with LaVar Arrington to find a better prospect, and idk if he will even be considered better at the end of the day. Remember these last 2 season have been his true Fr. & So. years very rarely do any players make this type of impact let alone middle linebackers.

and as for his tackle stats while it's a irrelevant stat he was getting robbed, myself and boe both believe that he had around 20 tackles in the Arizona game and he credited with only 7

A perfect landing place for him would be Cleveland imo, behind Phil Taylor & Ahtyba Rubin he could put up some stupidly insane numbers
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:41 PM    (permalink
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A perfect landing place for him would be Cleveland imo, behind Phil Taylor & Ahtyba Rubin he could put up some stupidly insane numbers
That would be insane, 2000 ravens baby!!!

But that would pale in comparison to if he somehow went to the ravens to play with ray....how sick would that be?
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Old 05-03-2011, 02:13 AM    (permalink
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College tackle stats may never be the 'end all-be all' for grading college Mikes, but IMO Kuechly is more instinctive, more productive and it shows up in his numbers.

Burfict is a 'wow' type prospect, meaning at least a couple times a game he's going to make you catch your breath in your throat. Hyper-physical player.

Keuchly IMO locates the ball better and seems like the more instinctive ILB.

Keuchly's numbers reflect his evaluation, and had more than twice the solo tackles that Burfict had in 2010.

Yeah tackle numbers can be subjective, but that discrepancy IMO between the two players isn't.

IMO those two are in direct competition in 2011, although I'm not sure Kuechly leaves BC after his junior season.

I'd almost bet that it's 90% certain Burfict is gone after his junior year.
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Old 05-03-2011, 02:44 AM    (permalink
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College tackle stats may never be the 'end all-be all' for grading college Mikes, but IMO Kuechly is more instinctive, more productive and it shows up in his numbers.

Burfict is a 'wow' type prospect, meaning at least a couple times a game he's going to make you catch your breath in your throat. Hyper-physical player.

Keuchly IMO locates the ball better and seems like the more instinctive ILB.

Keuchly's numbers reflect his evaluation, and had more than twice the solo tackles that Burfict had in 2010.

Yeah tackle numbers can be subjective, but that discrepancy IMO between the two players isn't.

IMO those two are in direct competition in 2011, although I'm not sure Kuechly leaves BC after his junior season.

I'd almost bet that it's 90% certain Burfict is gone after his junior year.

Guarantee you if someone actually took the time to count each tackle Burfict had would be ahead of Kurecky as i said before against Zona he was only credited for 7 and he had about 20, I'd estimate he is in on at least 12 tackles a game


not all the plays but there is def more than 7 tackles on there
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Old 05-04-2011, 02:04 AM    (permalink
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Guarantee you if someone actually took the time to count each tackle Burfict had would be ahead of Kurecky as i said before against Zona he was only credited for 7 and he had about 20, I'd estimate he is in on at least 12 tackles a game


not all the plays but there is def more than 7 tackles on there
Yes sir. I counted I think 11 on there in that video alone with one real questionable one. Definitely more than 7 but not quite 20.
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Old 05-02-2011, 11:55 PM    (permalink
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A perfect landing place for him would be Detroit imo, behind Ndamukong Suh & Nick Fairley he could put up some stupidly insane numbers
It'll happen one way or another.
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Old 05-03-2011, 01:08 AM    (permalink
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Burfict wont be a first round pick, and if he is, it'll be based all on potential. I have no idea what is going on in this thread. The kid from BC is far superior. #40, someone mentioned him but I'm too lazy to look it up and it's hard to pronounce, but he has much better instincts, a much better motor and plays sideline-to-sideline. Also much smarter with better instincts and technique. Lacks the size, strength and physicality of Burfict though and struggles at times disengaging from blockers. Not as much upside or potential.

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and as for his tackle stats while it's a irrelevant stat he was getting robbed, myself and boe both believe that he had around 20 tackles in the Arizona game and he credited with only 7
I took notes on this game. Foles was getting a ton of hype and Burfict flashed as a freshman. I credited him with 9 tackles in the game, but not anywhere close 20.

Quote:
Negatives:

- Looks lazy on the field and plays slow
- Really bad motor, quits on plays away from him
- Missed numerous tackles (5) and plays put of control
- Very wild, drops his head and doesn't keep his eyes up
- Doesn't wrap up and a lot of times wont take ball carrier to the ground
- Plays upright
- Looks mediocre in space
- Straight line player, all downhill
- Would come out of zone coverage and rush towards the QB when QB scrambled, creating voids: undisciplined
- Blew coverage on game tying TD (see previous negative)
- Did not show much instincts in coverage
- Showed no feeling (or awareness) of receivers behind him
- Tap dancer who didn't trust his eyes
- Didn't disengage from blockers, lacks technique
- Most of the tackles he made were when he was free and unblocked
- Chippy play after the whistle
- Incredibly raw
- Looks like he's playing his own game and not within the defense
- Was in the backfield three times all game
- Virtually no impact (blew up 1 WR screen where he was held and 2 run stuffs: 3rd and short)
- Didn't make 1st tackle until the very end (44 seconds) of the 1st QT
- All but 3 tackles made (9 tackles total) were 4 to 8 yards down field
- Was taken off the field on quite a few passing downs
He's probably one of the worst tacklers I've seen in the past two years. Not that bad, but he's so out of control, he's pretty frustrating to watch. If you wanna see a MLB jog around the field all day long, watch ASU and then watch #7. That'll be him jogging.

A lot of those negatives can go hand in hand with each other, but I try to be as descriptive as possible. And it's from just the one game.

He's made some highlight reel plays that have gotten him a lot of recognition. He's a 5 star recruit with ridiculous size, and I'd venture to guess some pretty good straight line speed. He does act like a complete bonehead and would rather get into shoving matches with linemen after the play is dead instead of actually disengaging and making a tackle. He has a reputation for letting his emotions get the best of him. Probably just immature.

He looks like Rey Maualuga all over again. A two down player that has no technique, is big, makes some huge hits, but misses a lot of tackles because he's always looking for the knockout blow. He's just undisciplined and does his own thing out there.

I made this post because of the insane overhype he's receiving in this thread. I like the kid and he's got a lot of potential, but he's really raw and didn't make much improvements from his freshman year. If he was in this draft I would have given him a third round grade.


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Well below those two. I've heard some early buzz from scouts that Hightower is fairly overrated.
Yeah, I would say the same. I don't know what happened to him. I really liked him and thought he was just as good as McClain a couple years ago. After the injury he appeared about 40 pounds fatter, much slower and was looking like a DE. There were games last year where he simply looked terrible. I mean terrible.
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Old 05-03-2011, 02:21 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fenikz View Post
he is a better prospect than Willis imo. Prob have to go all the back to 2000 with LaVar Arrington to find a better prospect, and idk if he will even be considered better at the end of the day. Remember these last 2 season have been his true Fr. & So. years very rarely do any players make this type of impact let alone middle linebackers.

and as for his tackle stats while it's a irrelevant stat he was getting robbed, myself and boe both believe that he had around 20 tackles in the Arizona game and he credited with only 7

A perfect landing place for him would be Cleveland imo, behind Phil Taylor & Ahtyba Rubin he could put up some stupidly insane numbers
Not quite, the perfectly landing spot for him would be the Giants after a Falcons for Julio Jones type trade with Cleveland.
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:18 PM    (permalink
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fenikz hit the nail on the head, he is a special talent at a young age and a position where it is rare to find that ability. Because he plays with so much emotion though he has "character concerns" and may never be seen as the better prospect. He also doesn't have the stats, but the skill and intensity is still there. Simply put, he is a man among boys in college football and is only in his true Jr. year. He could go pro now if you ask me. The kid can flat out play. He is a real difference maker that you must account for on defense which is rare for a MIKE.
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:24 PM    (permalink
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:26 PM    (permalink
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There's very few linebackers you can put as the center piece of the defense and build around like a quarterback. Ray Lewis and Patrick Willis are two prominent ones. Brian Urlacher has played up to that level at times as well at different points in his career. Burfict is that kind of guy in my opinion and that's absolutely special like you guys said. He can legitimately effect a game with his presence.
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Old 05-02-2011, 08:30 PM    (permalink
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There's very few linebackers you can put as the center piece of the defense and build around like a quarterback. Ray Lewis and Patrick Willis are two prominent ones. Brian Urlacher has played up to that level at times as well at different points in his career. Burfict is that kind of guy in my opinion and that's absolutely special like you guys said. He can legitimately effect a game with his presence.
I feel like Luke Kuechly is the same way, but he won't be nearly as talked about because of Burfict. Kuechly is a tackling machine and is similar to Urlacher and could be the leader of a defense that you build around.
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