Draft Countdown Forums

Go Back   Draft Countdown Forums > Draft Countdown Forums > College Football

College Football Discuss College Football

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-22-2010, 08:51 PM    (permalink
yourfavestoner
#1 Vickscuser
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: LakerLand
Posts: 13,130
Reputation: 628697
yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.yourfavestoner is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Lol, now that I think about it, that 2005 USC team that you have is wrong at almost every position.

Oscar Lua and Dallas Sartz were starters instead of Cushing and Maualuga.

Like I said, Matthews was like a 220 pound linebacker at the time. Frostee Rucker was the starter. Everson Griffin was still in HS.

Taylor Mays was also still in HS.

You, like, overlapped their defense from 2005-2008.
yourfavestoner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2010, 09:25 PM    (permalink
Sniper
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 31,593
Reputation: 494719
Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
The defensive line, outside of Woodley is even I feel.
It is painfully obvious that you didn't watch Alan Branch AT ALL that season. He was absolutely ridiculous. The guy ate double teams for breakfast, allowing for a breakout season from David Harris and an even better season for the eventual Lombardi winner in Woodley. It's an absolute farce that you can legitimately sit there with a straight face and make the asinine statement that you made.
Sniper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2010, 10:59 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Michigan
I'm saying it's too biased towards the 2007-2009 period. Nebraska's 09 defense is definitely not the best they've had since '97, Texas '09 defense is a fringe top 25 at best, and South Florida and Illinois (WHAT!?) should not be on there at all.
Not the best since 97? How? Did you see that offense last year? That defense carried the team, much less the fact they have the best defensive lineman of any of these defensive units in Suh. Could argue they had one of the best if not the best defensive line out of all of these groups if you just look at flat out production and how they changed the game. And sure the defensive backs, their career is not done yet, but I doubt the defensive backs on Nebraska or Texas do not turn out to be fine pros. Five years from now I do not think where I rank them will be too high at all. Especially for Texas if one considers Earl Thomas a Bob Sanders/Polomalu type talent, then yes that defense should be up there despite the talent at linebacker, just look at that great LSU defense, they had few fine linebackers but the great depth at defensive line and defensive back made up for that. Clearly Bo and Will do not mind that type of defense and clearly both have been very successful with it.

As for South Florida and Illinois, well in my opinion it is far harder for those schools to get a great defensive unit because one they are not a famous or well recruited school, second neither are known for defense. So one could argue getting a great defensive unit on a traditional non defensive power is far harder than carrying over players and hopefully getting a good collection at some point in time.




Quote:
ironman4579 I never said a word about last years Illinois team, unless last year was '07. Briinging up Illinois is completely relevant because you have them on a list of the top 25 best defenses of the last decade. And I'm sorry, there's no way they belong on there. Like, at all.

One player got dominated against USC. Morgan Trent. He was the weak point of that defense. If we're playing the "got dominated" game, '07 Illinois gave up 40 to Missouri, 49 to USC.

I would completely disagree with Illinois secondary being that much better.Leon Hall was, at worst, equal with Davis, and likely better because he was actually willing to work hard. Technically he was far superior, though david might have had the edge in pure athleticism. Jamar Adams was underrated. Michigan has a big edge in LB, and I'll take Woodley and Branch over anyone on Illinois defense. Throwing in freshman Brandon Graham makes it a no brainer. If you didn't want to put Michigan on there, fine. I realize it's difficult to rank teams. But there's no way that Illinois team should be on there. I'm not even sure I'd put that '06 Florida on the list over '06 Michigan.
Well I a mistaken, I thought you did. I also just flat out disagree with you clearly on this subject. Leon Hall is no where near the corner V. Davis was, especially when Davis was a freshman and sophomore, he was lights out. Yes later he got lazy, but early on when he still had some fire burning, he was one of the best young corners I have ever seen, his athletic ability make Hall look ridiculously average.

I will have to sleep on it, Michigan had a good defense but again I say, it is far harder for a non traditional defensive power to get a great defensive unit than it is for a traditional power too do so. Certain teams always seem to have a good defense and every now and again have a great one, to have a great one out of no where is extremely difficult and that is exactly what South Florida did.



Quote:
Sniper Seriously, how can a defense be one of the top 25 defenses of the past "decade" if they ranked in the top 20 in exactly one category? Consider the fact that the one category had nothing to do with points and yardage, and you have zero case for Illinois being one of the top 25 defenses of the past decade. It's a stretch that they'd be one of the top 25 defenses of the Big 10 alone for that stretch.
Anything else to add? Clearly you Michigan boys have a problem with it, that is fine. I would take Ball over Trent any day, Mitchell over Adams any day, Davis over Hall any day. And overall depth of Illinois defensive line I would take over one or two stars on Michigan. Crable was ok but really the only good backer was Harris. Woodley obviously was a star though.



Quote:
critesy auburns 2004 13-0 defense was very well rounded. maybe not top 25 cause im biased but they were very good.

Defensive Coordinator was gene chizik (now hc)
#1 in PPG defense with 11.2
#5 yards/game 269.6
7/13 opponents held at or under 10 points (4 sec games)
1 shutout
28 was the highest someone got on them. (tenn seccg)
it was basically a defense filled with undersized fast players.

de - bret eddins, marquis gunn
dt - jay ratliff, pat sims
dt - tommy jackson
de - stanley mcclover, quentin groves
olb - karibi dede
mlb - travis williams
olb - antarrious williams
cb - carlos rogers, pat lee
fs - will herring
ss - junior rosegreen
cb - david irons
Great point, that was a fine defense, I knew I forgot something. They can easily be included, Williams were great players, both of them, and didn't they have Dansby? Herring I loved as a safety, same with Rosegreen, for sure tomorrow I will include them in the list, amazing defense, that is for sure.



Quote:
yourfavestoner Lol, now that I think about it, that 2005 USC team that you have is wrong at almost every position.

Oscar Lua and Dallas Sartz were starters instead of Cushing and Maualuga.

Like I said, Matthews was like a 220 pound linebacker at the time. Frostee Rucker was the starter. Everson Griffin was still in HS.

Taylor Mays was also still in HS.

You, like, overlapped their defense from 2005-2008.
Ok, my sources were wrong then. Again I swear you guys try to find these rosters up to date on the internet. I dare you, it is not that easy and sorry but keeping them all exact to a T is almost impossible. Thanks for catching that, I will try to correct it.



Quote:
Sniper

It is painfully obvious that you didn't watch Alan Branch AT ALL that season. He was absolutely ridiculous. The guy ate double teams for breakfast, allowing for a breakout season from David Harris and an even better season for the eventual Lombardi winner in Woodley. It's an absolute farce that you can legitimately sit there with a straight face and make the asinine statement that you made.
I did watch Branch, he was a fine player. Sadly his NFL crappiness hurts his reputation a tad I feel though. Agreed he was a great player though in college, never said he wasn't.

But yes you Michigan guys want to harp on that, that is cool. Oddly seem to forget how high I put there actually elite defense with Charles Woodson so not like this list his a Michigan hater list.
__________________

Last edited by Ozzy : 06-22-2010 at 11:30 PM.
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2010, 11:04 PM    (permalink
critesy
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,787
Reputation: 80993
critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

dansby was in the draft that year, so i dont think so? would of been amazing though. dansby was on a lb core with reggie torbor and donatarrious thomas, who all got drafted that year in the 2004 draft i think.
__________________


RIP, Sean Taylor.
critesy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2010, 11:06 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Lol, now that I think about it, that 2005 USC team that you have is wrong at almost every position.

Oscar Lua and Dallas Sartz were starters instead of Cushing and Maualuga.

Like I said, Matthews was like a 220 pound linebacker at the time. Frostee Rucker was the starter. Everson Griffin was still in HS.

Taylor Mays was also still in HS.

You, like, overlapped their defense from 2005-2008.
Follow up, I got it exactly correct, just mistaken the date from 05 to 07, my mistake, doing too many things at once I guess. Thus not over lapping the two of them at all. As for Lua and Sartz, well, again it makes sense since it was 07 instead of 05. My mistake however, thanks for the catch.


http://usc.scout.com/a.z?s=15&p=8&c=2&nid=736&yr=2007



Going to add Auburn to the list and yes Michigan as well, even though those defensive backs are extremely suspect. Sadly push off South Florida, but remember that team came out of no where, had two great corners in Jenkins and Williams, Murphy behind them. An amazing college linebacker in Moffitt and a terror edge rusher with Selvie, but the depth of the D-line was not great. Still so very impressive considering they are not a traditional defensive power.
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2010, 11:12 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
dansby was in the draft that year, so i dont think so? would of been amazing though. dansby was on a lb core with reggie torbor and donatarrious thomas, who all got drafted that year in the 2004 draft i think.
**** that team was good, wow, great defense and damn they are the Auburn team with C. Williams, R. Brown and B. Jacobs, holy crap! What a team!


2003 Auburn Tigers
DE J. Ratliff
DT S. Johnson
DT D. McNeil
DE R. Torbor
OLB K. Dansby, A. Williams
ILB D. Thomas
OLB T. Williams
CB C. Rogers,
CB M. Pitts, G. Williams
SS W. Herring
FS Rosegreen
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2010, 11:28 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
ironman4579 I'd put 2006 Michigan at the very least over 2007 Illinois.

'06 Michigan

#15 Scoring D
#1 Rush D
#10 Total D
#4 sacks
#13 tackles for loss

DT-Alan Branch, Terrance Taylor
DE-LaMarr Woodley, Rondell Biggs
DE-Brandon Graham, Tim Jamison
OLB-Shawn Crable, Prescott Burgess
MLB-David Harris
CB-Leon Hall, Morgan Trent
S-Jamar Adams, Willis Barringer
I apologize. Looking through there roster myself, I totally spaced out on how good guys like Taylor were. And especially how good guys like Biggs and Jamison were. That completely changes the depth of their roster and overall look of their team. My mistake, I will give it to you guys, you are both correct they should be ahead of Illinois, they were very deep and talented. Still would take Illinois defensive backs over their group any day, but that defensive line and those linebackers, that is very hard to beat.

So my mistake and my error.
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 01:04 AM    (permalink
critesy
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,787
Reputation: 80993
critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.critesy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

its hard to do something like this without some outside input.
__________________


RIP, Sean Taylor.
critesy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 07:02 AM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
its hard to do something like this without some outside input.
Agree, the Michigan point proved that, and it is hard to remember them all, thank you again for the Auburn reminder, I just loved that defense and loved the talent they had.
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 08:36 AM    (permalink
keylime_5
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,775
Reputation: 303889
keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.keylime_5 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

do what you want ozzy, it's your ******* list ;)
__________________
keylime_5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 08:46 AM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
do what you want ozzy, it's your ******* list ;)
We are all family here ;o)


It is good to have feedback and discussion, if there was none this would be very boring. Also rather have it accurate than me being instantly correct.


Made some changes, included the outstanding 05 Penn State defense which kicks off the Iowa defense sadly. Also listed other defenses I found that I loved but did not make the cut. Might have to expand this list to top 30.


Also included the 08 Ohio State defense as well, extremely deep group. With that changed the order around a little bit too.



That old Virginia defense with Brooks and company was insane, not good defensive backs but all those linebackers was ridiculous. That Wake defense was great too with Abbate and Curry and the ball hawk Alphonso Smith and the sweet safety in Gattis. That Purdue defense was great too but not sure Stuart and Pollard played together or not.
__________________

Last edited by Ozzy : 06-23-2010 at 09:30 AM.
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 12:12 PM    (permalink
iowatreat54
Icon
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Americanzi
Posts: 15,022
Reputation: 1346319
iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Yea, hopefully you don't take offense to a lot of our responses (doesn't seem like you do). I'm sure you knew you'd get some outrage, but I have to give you credit for going through and doing some of these lists. People are always going to complain about something, but it does take a lot to actually sit down and do these, so good work.

And just so you know, I'm not outraged you dropped Iowa out. :) I love our defense usually and normally wouldn't trade it for anything in the world, but I probably wouldn't consider any over the past 13ish years one of the best.
__________________


"You don't need thumbs. My best friend is my brother's dog, he doesn't have any thumbs, he's doin fine."
-Pat Angerer on breaking his thumb.

DJK = Mr. Fun-Haver
Kirk Ferentz = Coach Killjoy
iowatreat54 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 12:33 PM    (permalink
ironman4579
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: "lulz"
Posts: 5,779
Reputation: 36867
ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ironman4579 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

No hard feelings Ozzy, I'm glad you decided to include that '06 defense. I'm also really glad that Auburn D was brought up. I completely forgot about that one, but they were a great group.
__________________



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakey View Post
WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!
ironman4579 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 01:01 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
iowatreat54
Yea, hopefully you don't take offense to a lot of our responses (doesn't seem like you do). I'm sure you knew you'd get some outrage, but I have to give you credit for going through and doing some of these lists. People are always going to complain about something, but it does take a lot to actually sit down and do these, so good work.

And just so you know, I'm not outraged you dropped Iowa out. :) I love our defense usually and normally wouldn't trade it for anything in the world, but I probably wouldn't consider any over the past 13ish years one of the best.
Might have found one for Iowa, Bob Sanders is the key because he is their best defensive back in that era, and all of these guys played I believe. Too bad Colin Cole was the year before but still this unit might crack the top 25.

Iowa 2003
DE M. Roth, Iwebema
DT Clauss
DT J. Babineaux
DE H. Hodges, Mattision
OLB E. Miles, Humpal
ILB A. Hodge, Klinkenborg
OLB C. Greenway
CB J. Johnson
CB A. Allen
SS B. Sanders, S. Considine
FS Paschal, Merrick


Overall Iowa is great at defense but have yet to put together a deep and stellar class of defensive backs, because their front 7 are always good, defensive backs, not so much.
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 01:07 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Yeah they are top 25 I think, unless some of these players were not on the roster. And no it is not to get a Iowa team on there...haha It is more the fact I really liked Greenway and Hodge as college backers, two of the best plus Bob Sanders was just flat out great. So I feel that group deserves to be on there and is better than that other group, but since they over lap I will delete that past one.

Roth and Bob Sanders were easily the tipping point when comparing those two Iowa defenses.
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 01:26 PM    (permalink
iowatreat54
Icon
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Americanzi
Posts: 15,022
Reputation: 1346319
iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.iowatreat54 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
Might have found one for Iowa, Bob Sanders is the key because he is their best defensive back in that era, and all of these guys played I believe. Too bad Colin Cole was the year before but still this unit might crack the top 25.

Iowa 2003
DE M. Roth, Iwebema
DT Clauss
DT J. Babineaux
DE H. Hodges, Mattision
OLB E. Miles, Humpal
ILB A. Hodge, Klinkenborg
OLB C. Greenway
CB J. Johnson
CB A. Allen
SS B. Sanders, S. Considine
FS Paschal, Merrick


Overall Iowa is great at defense but have yet to put together a deep and stellar class of defensive backs, because their front 7 are always good, defensive backs, not so much.
Yea, that's the problem (is it really a problem lol) with Iowa. We always have a solid D, but only because it's so well coached and works so well together as one unit. There may be a one or two standouts, but overall it's usually always lacking a top talent. And like you said, the strength of the front 7, and mainly the LBs in coverage, are what run Iowa's defense. The LBs ability to play coverage is huge, and you rarely see Iowa LBs that can't play into coverage and usually always will have one LB that can adequately play with TEs or in Greenway's and Edds's cases, some slot WRs.

But yea, I forgot about some of the defenses before 05 (when I started following Iowa). He may be lost in the NFL, but Matt Roth was ridiculous in college, especially his Senior year in 04 I think. Plus in addition to Roth and Sanders, you had Babs who was just ridiculous. Many are comparing Ballard this year to him because of the move he made from DE to DT, especially with his athletic ability. (I think Babs moved from the outside).
__________________


"You don't need thumbs. My best friend is my brother's dog, he doesn't have any thumbs, he's doin fine."
-Pat Angerer on breaking his thumb.

DJK = Mr. Fun-Haver
Kirk Ferentz = Coach Killjoy

Last edited by iowatreat54 : 06-23-2010 at 01:28 PM.
iowatreat54 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 04:13 PM    (permalink
Sniper
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 31,593
Reputation: 494719
Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Well I a mistaken, I thought you did. I also just flat out disagree with you clearly on this subject. Leon Hall is no where near the corner V. Davis was, especially when Davis was a freshman and sophomore, he was lights out. Yes later he got lazy, but early on when he still had some fire burning, he was one of the best young corners I have ever seen, his athletic ability make Hall look ridiculously average.
Just so we're on the same page, we're talking about the same Leon Hall that was a finalist for the Nagurski, semi-finalist for the Thorpe, quarter-finalist for the Lott, and first-team All-American? Yeah, "nowhere near Vontae Davis", my ass. Makes you wonder how he got drafted 18th overall if he was nowhere near Davis' level. Both secondaries were well-below average, but Hall's career was significantly superior to Davis'.
Sniper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 06:03 PM    (permalink
P-L
Head Moderator
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: South Florida
Posts: 30,577
Reputation: 1108093
P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.P-L is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Sorry, but I'm not sure focusing mostly on the players rather than the results is the best way to go about this. That '07 Illinois team was 4th in it's conference in points allowed, 7th in total yards against, and 9th in passing yards against. I know they had a few good players, but overall they were a middle-of-the-pack Big Ten defense.
P-L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 06:27 PM    (permalink
RealityCheck
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: The land of three rings and a half
Posts: 5,617
Reputation: 28718
RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.RealityCheck is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

You know you'll have to redo this next year.
RealityCheck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 09:41 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Just so we're on the same page, we're talking about the same Leon Hall that was a finalist for the Nagurski, semi-finalist for the Thorpe, quarter-finalist for the Lott, and first-team All-American? Yeah, "nowhere near Vontae Davis", my ass. Makes you wonder how he got drafted 18th overall if he was nowhere near Davis' level. Both secondaries were well-below average, but Hall's career was significantly superior to Davis'.
Yes we all know Sniper every Michigan player is the best player in the world ever, simple as that right? Yes Hall has a better work ethic than Davis, sadly Davis is so superior athletically between the two they are about equal, regardless of the superior technique Hall has or the superior work ethic, Davis's athletic ability can trump that in many cases.

Keeping with Michigan, I would rather talk about how kick butt Charles Woodson is and was than freaking Leon Hall right? ;o)


Or talk about some other teams besides Michigan once in awhile. Any opinions on that sweet Tennessee defense or that old school Va Tech defense from 1999?

One can only talk so much Michigan football right, expanding of ones horizons. ;o)
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 09:42 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
You know you'll have to redo this next year.
Possible, UNC does have the talent to make it interesting but need to achieve and reach that potential and not choke it up like they did last year. They need to dominate, especially considering they have a lack luster quarterback leading the way on offense.

However overall, doubt any defense this years can get too high on lists like these. Have some good defenses but nothing great, will have to wait and see who develops and what kind of talent comes in.
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 09:52 PM    (permalink
Sniper
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 31,593
Reputation: 494719
Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Sniper is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
Yes we all know Sniper every Michigan player is the best player in the world ever, simple as that right?
Not sure where I said that. If you truly believe that, you don't read half of my Michigan-related posts.

Quote:
Yes Hall has a better work ethic than Davis, sadly Davis is so superior athletically between the two they are about equal, regardless of the superior technique Hall has or the superior work ethic, Davis's athletic ability can trump that in many cases.
Great. Davis is also more athletic than 99 percent of the corners in the NFL. Should we anoint him the best CB, too? I'd rather have a guy who can, you know, actually cover than a guy who's athletic and not that good in coverage. Vontae's a better athlete, whoopdie-*******-do. Hall was and is a better football player.

Quote:
Or talk about some other teams besides Michigan once in awhile. Any opinions on that sweet Tennessee defense or that old school Va Tech defense from 1999?
Maybe if you'd write factually accurate information once in a blue moon, I wouldn't correct you on it. However, the fact that you legitimately believed that the '07 Illinois defense, a defense that was middle-of-the-pack in the Big 10 and below average nationally was better than the '06 Michigan defense, just because you like a player better because he jumps farther and runs faster, is laughable.

Also, I talk about other teams all the time. Stop ******* stereotyping me for a minute and look around. ZOMGZ SNIPER LIKES MICHIGAN SO HE ONLY TALKS ABOUT THEM LOLZZZZZZ. No, look around, then talk.

If you want other critiques on your article, Ohio State could easily field three or four defenses on this. You underrated '09 Nebraska and overrated '06 Florida.
Sniper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2010, 10:32 PM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Maybe if you'd write factually accurate information once in a blue moon, I wouldn't correct you on it. However, the fact that you legitimately believed that the '07 Illinois defense, a defense that was middle-of-the-pack in the Big 10 and below average nationally was better than the '06 Michigan defense, just because you like a player better because he jumps farther and runs faster, is laughable.

Also, I talk about other teams all the time. Stop ******* stereotyping me for a minute and look around. ZOMGZ SNIPER LIKES MICHIGAN SO HE ONLY TALKS ABOUT THEM LOLZZZZZZ. No, look around, then talk.

If you want other critiques on your article, Ohio State could easily field three or four defenses on this. You underrated '09 Nebraska and overrated '06 Florida.
I cleared up the Illinois issue rather clearly I believe. The V. Davis issue is totally different entirely.

But yes if you want to pretend I did not correct myself on that Illinois defensive issue, that is fine.


As for Nebraska and Florida, Nebraska I actually overrated and moved them down a little, I had them quite high originally. Still like them but the depth at linebacker is an issue and it is yet to be seen how great those defensive backs will become. Florida overrated? How, the fact that the defensive line was absolutely sick you did not like? Or the fact they had very fine linebacker play, or the fact they had Reggie Nelson who absolutely dominated at safety, much less got great performances out of corner Ryan Smith intercepting passes. That defensive line was outstanding though and one of the best and deepest I have seen. One could argue they are the best in this group, at least their ends are better than Nebraska's last year with Moss, Harvey and company.

Explanation with statements is lovely and quite wonderful.


Still waiting on the Va Tech and Tennessee defensive roster conversation, or any non standard defense conversation. I know some have watched other defenses outside of the obvious ones. Top to bottom conversation on all rosters is ideal but pick and choose conversation is a must I guess considering.....
__________________
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2010, 08:59 AM    (permalink
Ozzy
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,141
Reputation: 249968
Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ozzy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Blessed Big Ten Network, help filling the boring days of summer. Had a great game on last night between Alabama and Michigan. Two fine defenses.


I am probably going to include this unit, amazing defense, I LOVED Rasheed at linebacker, loved his speed and quickness. Clearly having Griffin, a wonderful tackle ahead of him helped him big time keep blockers off of him and keep him free, because later in his career he was no where close to being as good as he was as a freshman. Merritt was a fast linebacker as well and that defensive line was very solid, especially with Moorhead, Griffin and King. That defensive backfield was the only weakness, Dixon was ok but played out of position, Spencer was a tough guy though but Lewis got beat a lot. They said that unit was ranked #2 nationally in run defense, again those are nice to see and hear but ultimately again I feel it comes down to players, so what if they were #2 nationally in rush defense, they get killed in the passing game then just like the Minnesota Vikings ;o) Need complete defense...

1999 Alabama
DE King
DT C. Griffin
DT R. Grimes K. Smith
DE Moorhead
OLB M. Merritt
ILB S. Rasheed
OLB D. Gilbert
CB T. Dixon
CB M. Lewis
SS Spencer
FS R. Myles




Odd thing is, they might be deeper than the 07, they have a lot of the same players on the roster though. But the likes of Woodson clearly switches it to that old Michigan defense, how can it not. And Sword was a great linebacker and surprisingly I believe Gold and Jones played a lot even as young players on that older defense. Renes sure was a beast though, great player for them for a very long time. Hendricks was a fun player to watch as well, and Cato June and him were a great par. Oddly this defense got totally racked by Alexander the Great in that game, what a special running back he was!

1999 Michigan
DE Hall
DT Renes
DT J. Williams
DE Frysinger, Rumishek
OLB Gold, S. Orr
ILB D. Jones, L. Foote
OLB V. Hobson
CB T. Howard
CB Whitley
SS T. Hendricks
FS C. June
__________________

Last edited by Ozzy : 06-24-2010 at 09:02 AM.
Ozzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2010, 02:04 PM    (permalink
Brent
TomTom Out
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 25,840
Reputation: 4767621
Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Brent is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GB12 View Post
Yeah, he said it was a little more than a decade...
I'm just being obnoxious
__________________

Pick the Winners Champion 2008 | 2011
Brent is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.