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View Poll Results: Revis or Willis
Revis 62 65.26%
Willis 33 34.74%
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:17 AM    (permalink
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When you can cover TE's and RB's, you can sit your safeties deep and eliminate the deep ball, and not ever have them come up and support the run.

People can't stop the Saints because our backs are awesome at getting open out of the backfield. We're almost always getting positive yards and no sacks, despite mediocre tackles because people flat out can't cover our TE's and RB's one on one.

It cuts both ways.
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Old 08-24-2010, 02:32 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Hurricanes25 View Post
Believe it or not, Revis had a pretty damn good year in 2008 (5 ints) and was solid as a rookie in 2007.
yeah i've been watching Revis since his rookie year, but i've been watching Nnamdi be the best corner in the league since his 8-interception season in '06. unless Asomugha suddenly sucks this season, Revis is going to have to maintain his level of play for at least another season to be considered better than him in my book.




....but yeah i'd take Revis over Willis, although i'd honestly be just as happy with Willis.

nah, i'd take Willis.
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Old 08-24-2010, 12:34 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Shiver View Post
Wrong, Corners help the pass rush. Linebackers do not help the D-Line. (in a 4-3)
Are you honestly going to try and suggest that linebackers benefit from the D-line and Corners dont? Even the best corner ever will get dominated by a middle of the road receiver if the QB has enough time to throw the ball. Make no mistake, corners benefit just as much as linebackers from excellent defensive line play.
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Old 08-24-2010, 12:38 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by A Perfect Score View Post
Are you honestly going to try and suggest that linebackers benefit from the D-line and Corners dont? Even the best corner ever will get dominated by a middle of the road receiver if the QB has enough time to throw the ball. Make no mistake, corners benefit just as much as linebackers from excellent defensive line play.
It's actually a mutual benefit between CBs and linemen. A good CB can help linemen just as much as linemen help a CB.

If a CB can be left on an island, you can send more guys after the qb, which helps your pass rush, and you can load the box with more defenders, which helps your rush defense.

A dominant CB is just as valuable as a dominant pass rusher. Look at where the money goes, the cash doesn't lie. CBs can make just as much as pass rushers.
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Old 08-24-2010, 12:41 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
It's actually a mutual benefit between CBs and linemen. A good CB can help linemen just as much as linemen help a CB.

If a CB can be left on an island, you can send more guys after the qb, which helps your pass rush, and you can load the box with more defenders, which helps your rush defense.

A dominant CB is just as valuable as a dominant pass rusher. Look at where the money goes, the cash doesn't lie. CBs can make just as much as pass rushers.
I wasn't trying to suggest any different. I understand that its a symbiotic relationship between the two...in fact, I said that exact same thing in an earlier post in this thread. Shiver was the one who was suggesting that it wasn't a two way relationship and that Linebackers, not Corners, are the ones who benefit from good defensive line play. But it does go both ways, with both groups of players.
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Old 08-24-2010, 12:43 PM    (permalink
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Revis allowed the Jets to go zero coverage and blitz like crazy. The Jets' front-seven isn't really all that great and they have no elite pass rushers, but Revis afforded them the opportunity to go after the QB with almost reckless abandon. The benefits of having a great corner trickles down and helps the rest of the defense. One could argue that a dominant NT or 4-3 DE/3-4 OLB offer the same benefits, but not MLB.

If an Offensive Line can handle the NT and get a guard to the second level, even Ray Lewis is powerless to stop it. Hence my reference to the '04 Chiefs game against the Ravens. A Guard > any MLB every day.

A Linebackers job is to prevent big plays, make sure tackles, intimidate receivers in the middle of the field and make sure everyone is in the right gap. But they don't impact every other position like a NT, DE, CB do. A very good/great MLB can be on a terrible defense and not make a difference to no fault of his own; see, Jon Beason and Barrett Rudd last year.
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Old 08-24-2010, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by A Perfect Score View Post
I wasn't trying to suggest any different. I understand that its a symbiotic relationship between the two...in fact, I said that exact same thing in an earlier post in this thread. Shiver was the one who was suggesting that it wasn't a two way relationship and that Linebackers, not Corners, are the ones who benefit from good defensive line play. But it does go both ways, with both groups of players.
Yeah, I agree that both benefit.

What I think he was trying to convey however (and I hope I'm not putting words in his mouth), is that a linebacker's relationship with the defensive line is more dependent than that of a CB.

While a CB relies on dline play as well, bc they can counter that dependence with significant help to the dline as well, it kind of balances out.

Whereas with a linebacker, without the dline he's dead in the water, and unlike a CB, he cannot provide as much help back to the dline to make their lives any easier.

A linebacker can technically help the pass rush, but not nearly as much as a CB (4-3 backers and 3-4 ILBs that is), and a great one can help stuff the run sure, but in theory, he's just a tackler who is filling a gap. He doesn't effect the Xs and Os the same way a shutdown CB can.
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Old 08-28-2010, 06:02 PM    (permalink
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That's right.

I said Revis is OVERRATED. Period. People need to stop listening to ******* ESPN and believe every damn thing they say.

And yes, I said that Samuel is the BEST PLAYMAKING CB in the league. I never said he was the best tackler or cover guy. I know he's not but like I said, he's the BEST PLAYMAKING CB in the league. Samuel has 29 INT's in 62 games and after Ed Reed, is the best playmaker in the playoffs.

But hey, like I always say in the 49ers forum, to each his/her own.
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Old 08-28-2010, 06:21 PM    (permalink
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i've been watching Nnamdi be the best corner in the league
So, Charles, tell me, how are things these days?
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Old 08-28-2010, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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That's right.

I said Revis is OVERRATED. Period. People need to stop listening to ******* ESPN and believe every damn thing they say.
Or you know, we can just watch Revis play and see him shut down every WR he played against last year. We don't need ESPN for that.
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Old 08-28-2010, 11:08 PM    (permalink
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So, Charles, tell me, how are things these days?
no clue what you mean there, but i assume you are somehow bitching about my grammar or punctuation?

"i've been watching Nnamdi be the best corner in the league since his 8-interception season in '06."
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Old 08-28-2010, 11:13 PM    (permalink
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Preeeetty sure he's talking about Charles Woodson there.
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Old 08-28-2010, 11:28 PM    (permalink
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Preeeetty sure he's talking about Charles Woodson there.
Smart TitanHope is smart.

Charles Woodson (Praised Be His Name) is such a studmuffin.
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Old 08-29-2010, 03:34 AM    (permalink
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:/ harborside health center is my excuse for my brain fart earlier.
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