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View Poll Results: Who's gonna be the best of these QB's when all is said and done?
Josh Freeman, Bucs 59 15.05%
Matthew Stafford, Lions 126 32.14%
Sam Bradford, Rams 76 19.39%
Mark Sanchez, Jets 19 4.85%
Joe Flacco, Ravens 33 8.42%
Matt Ryan, Falcons 79 20.15%
Voters: 392. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-04-2011, 12:37 PM    (permalink
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Damn that Matt Ryan for playing in a balanced offensive attack! Our offensive is conservative why? Because we don't make mistakes? Or because we don't throw the ball deep 15 times a game?
How is it not conservative? The Falcons 2nd leading receiver is a tight end, the 3rd one is a ******* fullback.

Ryan has one of the lowest YPA in the league. It's not exactly a secret that he checkdowns a LOT.
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:44 PM    (permalink
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Eh, I think people on here vastly overrate the Falcons' offensive talent. Turner is good, but offers nothing in the passing game. Not only that, but he's a guy who does most of his damage late in the game when the defense is worn down. He's not much of an early game back.

Tony Gonzales is terrible these days. He's crafty and knows where to sit against zones, but he offers you nothing other than seven yard in routes.

Their receiving corp consists of Roddy and a bunch of nobodies. I honestly don't think anybody on their receiving corp would start for another NFL team.

I'm interested to see what teams do against them in the playoffs. This is the time of year when defensive coordinators take away your fastball and force you to rely on your other pitches (hate baseball, but the analogy works). Let's see how Ryan responds then.

Remember guys, the real NFL season is just now beginning. We'll have a much better read on Ryan, Flacco, and Sanchez in a month or so.

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Old 01-04-2011, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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His supporting cast is still the best on that list of quarterbacks. Maybe Stafford is better off with Megatron.
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:52 PM    (permalink
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His supporting cast is still the best on that list of quarterbacks. Maybe Stafford is better off with Megatron.
I would argue that Stafford and Sanchez both have a better supporting cast. Freeman has a worse #1 receiver, but other than that his supporting cast is better as well.
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:54 PM    (permalink
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How is it not conservative? The Falcons 2nd leading receiver is a tight end, the 3rd one is a ******* fullback.

Ryan has one of the lowest YPA in the league. It's not exactly a secret that he checkdowns a LOT.

Yeah, that's not indicative of receiving talent at all. And it's been discussed to death now, but the YPA is low because we run the lowest amount of screens in the league, and have to lowest YAC in the league. Your making it sound like he's Kevin Kolb. He certainly isn't a check down quarterback.

And his surrounding talent is better than anyone on the list? Really? We have zero depth behind Roddy.
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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I'm probably being a little too hard on Ryan due to the overhype. I think he's the 2nd best QB on the list, at the moment, with Flacco third.

I don't understand why so many people voted Stafford. Based on what? College?
I guess this is a Canada thing because I don't have ESPN to watch, but I never really hear Matt Ryan as the "Peyton Manning or Tom Brady". Maybe it is worse down there, but he is never really even talked about where I'm from.
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Old 01-04-2011, 12:56 PM    (permalink
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Matt needs a slot WR. Bad.

I love Roddy White though. Sometimes I think you just can't cover that guy.
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Old 01-04-2011, 01:02 PM    (permalink
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Matt needs a slot WR. Bad.

I love Roddy White though. Sometimes I think you just can't cover that guy.

Yup, Harry Douglas was supposed to be that guy this year. He looked horrendous coming back from his knee injury though. Looked really good last week (I know, Carolina) so maybe he can be a spark in the playoffs.


And now that Roddy's more intelligent football wise, he pretty much can't be covered. Has everything you look for in a WR. The only way you can slow him down is by rolling coverage his way all game like the Saints did.
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Old 01-04-2011, 02:13 PM    (permalink
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3700 yards and 28 TDs. You're right, he's so far off from that!



Sorry, if you want to be Peyton Manning, you have to be blowing up passing records. He's not all that young or inexperienced.

If you want to be Tom Brady, get 4 rings.

He's got the stats of Tom Brady early in his career, and the rings of Manning early, lol.
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Old 01-04-2011, 02:37 PM    (permalink
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Eh, I think people on here vastly overrate the Falcons' offensive talent. Turner is good, but offers nothing in the passing game. Not only that, but he's a guy who does most of his damage late in the game when the defense is worn down. He's not much of an early game back.

Tony Gonzales is terrible these days. He's crafty and knows where to sit against zones, but he offers you nothing other than seven yard in routes.

Their receiving corp consists of Roddy and a bunch of nobodies. I honestly don't think anybody on their receiving corp would start for another NFL team.

I'm interested to see what teams do against them in the playoffs. This is the time of year when defensive coordinators take away your fastball and force you to rely on your other pitches (hate baseball, but the analogy works). Let's see how Ryan responds then.

Remember guys, the real NFL season is just now beginning. We'll have a much better read on Ryan, Flacco, and Sanchez in a month or so.


That's what I've been trying to say. I mean we can't act like he's playing on a ****** offense but it's not like he has guys all over the place who are making plays in the passing game for him. Should he throw deep just to say that he can and get more INT's? I don't see the point in that. He's winning games, and being smart with the football, there is no reason to just chunk the ball deep.



The Falcons do have some talent, but I don't understand how you can complain about Ryan's YPA, that's just nit picking. Ryan won a ton of games with his arm by going deep in the passing game when he needed to.
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Old 01-04-2011, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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The Falcons do have some talent, but I don't understand how you can complain about Ryan's YPA, that's just nit picking. Ryan won a ton of games with his arm by going deep in the passing game when he needed to.
Nitpicking? YPA and interception % are the two most important stats for a quarterback.
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Old 01-04-2011, 05:21 PM    (permalink
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Nitpicking? YPA and interception % are the two most important stats for a quarterback.
I would say TD % and 3rd down completion % are more important than YPA, and the passer rating is more important than the sole YPA category.

The passer rating may be flawed, but it's more accurate as a whole than just the YPA average. Some guy may hit a lot of deep balls to raise that average, but misfire a lot and not convert often on 3rd downs.

Now, Matt Ryan is still great and he is the guy I voted for in this original poll way back.
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Old 01-04-2011, 05:24 PM    (permalink
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Eh, I think people on here vastly overrate the Falcons' offensive talent. Turner is good, but offers nothing in the passing game. Not only that, but he's a guy who does most of his damage late in the game when the defense is worn down. He's not much of an early game back.

Tony Gonzales is terrible these days. He's crafty and knows where to sit against zones, but he offers you nothing other than seven yard in routes.

Their receiving corp consists of Roddy and a bunch of nobodies.
Well, the Packers shut down Roddy, but Turner burned us for over 100, and Gonzalez beat us with a TD and an athletic (controversial) 4th down conversion.

Still, we held them to 20 in their place and that should have been good enough to beat them.
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:28 PM    (permalink
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I would argue that Stafford and Sanchez both have a better supporting cast. Freeman has a worse #1 receiver, but other than that his supporting cast is better as well.
People tend to forget that although Freeman has Winslow, who never practices due to injury history of his knee, has worked with a bunch of rookies. Mike Williams is very talented and should become a star in this league, but he had his fair share of rookie drops this year as well. Benn didn't come on until the middle of the season and was a rookie as well. Then you have guys like Stovall and Spurlock, who did nothing there whole entire careers, showed up and made plays suddenly when Freeman was behind center? How about Preston Parker and Dez Briscoe? Both rookies and made plays. Stroughter is another guy who makes clutch plays when needed, but he missed like 8 or 9 games this year.

Freeman would consistently hit 6 or more different WRs a game this year. He spreads the ball out and has excellent vision. He's made has beens like Stovall and Spurlock look better than they actually are. Blount has really helped the offense as well. Also, Freeman has worked with 7 different O-line lineups this season as well. He is 22 years old and the sky is the limit for this kid. He could be top 5 some day.
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:40 PM    (permalink
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People tend to forget that although Freeman has Winslow, who never practices due to injury history of his knee, has worked with a bunch of rookies.

I literally don't think that's possible. Bucs fans will never let you forget.
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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Its awesome because in one thread, Williams and Blount are the best players around and amazing and sexual and whatever other adjective Bucs fans use to describe them, and in this thread they are untalented rookies who Freeman carried all season. I enjoy the duality.
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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Its awesome because in one thread, Williams and Blount are the best players around and amazing and sexual and whatever other adjective Bucs fans use to describe them, and in this thread they are untalented rookies who Freeman carried all season. I enjoy the duality.
Since when have you seen a team, led by a 22 year old qb that had 12 rookies start this season, and the youngest team in the nfl was even a threat to win 10 games? Honestly, you don't have that much success in those situations.
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Old 01-05-2011, 01:12 PM    (permalink
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Since when have you seen a team, led by a 22 year old qb that had 12 rookies start this season, and the youngest team in the nfl was even a threat to win 10 games? Honestly, you don't have that much success in those situations.
You beat exactly 1 team with a winning record, and that was in Week 17 in a meaningless game. Dont get too up on yourself yet. The future looks bright for sure, but those 10 wins came against the NFL's bottom feeders.
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Old 01-05-2011, 01:23 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by A Perfect Score View Post
Its awesome because in one thread, Williams and Blount are the best players around and amazing and sexual and whatever other adjective Bucs fans use to describe them, and in this thread they are untalented rookies who Freeman carried all season. I enjoy the duality.

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Originally Posted by ATLDirtyBirds View Post

And I don't get this with Bucs fans. (Not necessarily you, just in general) Either Blount, Williams, K2, Penn are as great as you guys say they are or they are rookies and nothings that Freeman carried to greatness.
I don't get it either.
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Old 01-05-2011, 01:54 PM    (permalink
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I don't understand this contradiction you guys are asserting. Young and talented don't have to be mutually exclusive of each other. Are they talented young guys? Absolutely. Is it easy to win with talent that young? Absolutely not.

Why is Tom Brady winning the MVP this year? For winning with young talent.
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Old 01-05-2011, 02:00 PM    (permalink
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I don't understand this contradiction you guys are asserting. Young and talented don't have to be mutually exclusive of each other. Are they talented young guys? Absolutely. Is it easy to win with talent that young? Absolutely not.

Why is Tom Brady winning the MVP this year? For winning with young talent.
Well Id venture to say Brady is going to win it because his team went 14-2, he went an absurd number of passes without throwing a TD and had one of the most statistically impressive seasons we've seen in recent memory. He would win it whether his supporting cast was all 25 or all 45, I dont see where you're coming from on that one.

The binary that exists is that in one thread, Mike Williams and Blount and Benn are whoever else are these untalented players who Freeman consistently puts on his back and carries. They use the age excuse repeatedly when it suits their argument and come back in a different thread and talk those same players up to be stalwarts. It isnt all Bucs fans, just the same new posters over and over. They came out of the woodwork this season, now they are everywhere.
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Old 01-05-2011, 02:20 PM    (permalink
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Eh, I think people on here vastly overrate the Falcons' offensive talent. Turner is good, but offers nothing in the passing game. Not only that, but he's a guy who does most of his damage late in the game when the defense is worn down. He's not much of an early game back.

Tony Gonzales is terrible these days. He's crafty and knows where to sit against zones, but he offers you nothing other than seven yard in routes.

Their receiving corp consists of Roddy and a bunch of nobodies. I honestly don't think anybody on their receiving corp would start for another NFL team.

I'm interested to see what teams do against them in the playoffs. This is the time of year when defensive coordinators take away your fastball and force you to rely on your other pitches (hate baseball, but the analogy works). Let's see how Ryan responds then.

Remember guys, the real NFL season is just now beginning. We'll have a much better read on Ryan, Flacco, and Sanchez in a month or so.

We really do not have the talent in place, nor the desire really, to have an air it out aggressive passing attack. There is zero "yards after catch" in the Falcons offense so no wonder Ryan's YPA was very low. Hopefully the team adds a slot receiver, a dual-threat RB, an athletic TE or some combination of all of the above this off-season. Also when Mike Mularkey leaves for a HC position we can hire this man, who has a good working relationship with Thomas Dimitroff:



But there is no reason to think that Ryan's 3,700 28/9 season in just his third year is his plateau.
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Old 01-05-2011, 02:43 PM    (permalink
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I don't understand this contradiction you guys are asserting. Young and talented don't have to be mutually exclusive of each other. Are they talented young guys? Absolutely. Is it easy to win with talent that young? Absolutely not.

Why is Tom Brady winning the MVP this year? For winning with young talent.
I'm just using this for Bucs fans because I see them do it constantly, but I'm sure many others do it. It's rather simple.

In any thread about Freeman, it's about how he's led a group of collective nothings to greatness.

In any Bucs related thread it's, "OMG MIKE WILLIAMS, BLOUNT, K2!, BENN! HAVE YOU SEEN HOW GOOD PENN'S BEEN THIS YEAR?!?!?"

It would be like me in one thread saying "Oh man, Gonzo is still so great, he's a stud!" then coming in here and complaining about how he's rapidly declined and isn't nearly the weapon he once was.

You can be young and very good, but you can't be very good and something that's just a Freeman by-product.
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Old 01-05-2011, 03:59 PM    (permalink
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Just saying, but how many games do the Bucs win without Josh Freeman this year? I say 2, both against Carolina and thats it.
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Old 01-05-2011, 04:07 PM    (permalink
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Just saying, but how many games do the Bucs win without Josh Freeman this year? I say 2, both against Carolina and thats it.
Take a good QB off any team and see how that teams does. I'm not sure what you are arguing here.
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