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Old 03-07-2011, 02:23 PM    (permalink
Jughead10
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we absolutely do not need him. I also disagree with nicks/MM being inconsistent. MM shined when nicks and smith went down, beating some pro bowl corners week in and week out to boot. I wouldn't even be that upset if we didn't bring smith back, he's a great receiver but we'd be set even without him
Mario Manningham does one thing. But he does it really well. Run in a straight line and go up and get he ball. We need Smith. He's the only real player Eli can trust to be in the right place at the right time. Mario is great to have on the team, but he's a complimentary piece. If we're going to continue to run the same offense, we might want to pay attention to those wonderlic scores a bit more.
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Old 03-07-2011, 02:38 PM    (permalink
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No we need Smith back. End of story.
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Old 03-07-2011, 03:04 PM    (permalink
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Mario Manningham does one thing. But he does it really well. Run in a straight line and go up and get he ball. We need Smith. He's the only real player Eli can trust to be in the right place at the right time. Mario is great to have on the team, but he's a complimentary piece. If we're going to continue to run the same offense, we might want to pay attention to those wonderlic scores a bit more.
have you watched all his games? >.> He's a beast when they give it to him on the screen, and how is he a complimentary piece? He went over 100 yards when nicks & smith were both down, who is he complimenting? Derek hagan XD. His route running really improved from last year to this past year. Wonderlic isn't even relevant.
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Old 03-07-2011, 03:53 PM    (permalink
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have you watched all his games? >.> He's a beast when they give it to him on the screen, and how is he a complimentary piece? He went over 100 yards when nicks & smith were both down, who is he complimenting? Derek hagan XD. His route running really improved from last year to this past year. Wonderlic isn't even relevant.
Mario's route running have improved? From dreadful to awful? I apologize he does two things well. Go routes and screens. He's a great #3 WR. But we cannot count on him to run all the routes that Smith does. Derek Hagan is complimentary as well. Further down the list. But he has value as well because he plays specials too. We should have never let him go to begin with. There is probably room for both of them considering rosters are likely to expand. But bottom line is we need Smith. Mario Manningham is not a suitable replacement for him.
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Old 03-07-2011, 04:00 PM    (permalink
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Mario's route running have improved? From dreadful to awful? I apologize he does two things well. Go routes and screens. He's a great #3 WR. But we cannot count on him to run all the routes that Smith does. Derek Hagan is complimentary as well. Further down the list. But he has value as well because he plays specials too. We should have never let him go to begin with. There is probably room for both of them considering rosters are likely to expand. But bottom line is we need Smith. Mario Manningham is not a suitable replacement for him.
who even said MM would replace smith, smith does work in the slot & on 3rd down. I just meant i'd like to see what nicks and MM can do without smith getting 70-100 catches a year. I don't see how you can downgrade MM so much though, he's a 1k receiver. Bottom line.
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Old 03-08-2011, 12:40 AM    (permalink
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No one is saying Mario isn't a good receiver, he's inconsistent and limited. Those are two valid statements considering he is inconsistent with his route running, his hands, and his blocking. He does have a limited route tree, but this last year i do think that with the added playing time he has become more experienced in that area, he still isn't nearly as effective as he is in screens and flys.

He's a gamebreaker, but he is not a guy i'd like to put out there in a complicated offense especially for receivers and rely on him to do all of the things required for a starting receiver.

Nicks, for a guy who has huge hands and amazing ability, looked like he was thinking too much and dropping easy balls, making moves before he caught the ball, those things aren't helpful to a quarterback. It was his first year, and he did amazing, he is going to be great, he just needs a counterpart.

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How stupid will we look if we dont resign smith?
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Old 03-08-2011, 01:40 AM    (permalink
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Smith will be re-signed, we'll probably overpay him. Is he really worth #1 money? He's had quite a few injury problems since coming into the league, he had a great year in 09, sure. But he failed to even reach 600 yards any of his other years. Not to mention the injury he's coming off of is pretty serious. Hopefully it'll be an incentive-laden contract.
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Old 03-08-2011, 09:29 AM    (permalink
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He won't get #1 money.
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Old 03-08-2011, 12:54 PM    (permalink
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The sad thing is, I think in a simpler offense, like a WCO, Mario would be a stud. He does this well in our complex offense, can you imagine how good he could be if they simplified things for him?

He has potential to be our best WR bc he's the fastest, but realistically that won't happen bc our offense is just too complicated for him.

I can see him thriving elsewhere. For us, he's a solid #3 WR, but you can't rely on him on every snap.
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Old 03-08-2011, 06:24 PM    (permalink
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I agree... Our system puts up stats, but I wish for something else. I think we have the talent to do even better and be MORE consistent.
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Old 03-09-2011, 02:34 AM    (permalink
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The sad thing is, I think in a simpler offense, like a WCO, Mario would be a stud. He does this well in our complex offense, can you imagine how good he could be if they simplified things for him?

He has potential to be our best WR bc he's the fastest, but realistically that won't happen bc our offense is just too complicated for him.

I can see him thriving elsewhere. For us, he's a solid #3 WR, but you can't rely on him on every snap.
agreed, i've been watching him for 5 years, the only down year he really had was 09 where he had the dropsies. One more solid year and i think you can erase the unreliable tag, he only made one "WTF" play this year.
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Old 03-09-2011, 06:19 AM    (permalink
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agreed, i've been watching him for 5 years, the only down year he really had was 09 where he had the dropsies. One more solid year and i think you can erase the unreliable tag, he only made one "WTF" play this year.
He gets a bad rep for being a dumbass. And let's be honest, he rounds out his cuts a lot, but he's so fast he can get away with it.

He should be our DeSean Jackson, but he's not bc of the system. That's another reason why I was open to a coaching change, I want to see us run a simpler offense.

I know this is revisionist history on my part, but Ron Rivera would've been a great choice. Still a John Fox fan as well.

But anyway, what's done is done. Thankfully we seem to be deep at WR (when healthy) so if we do lose Mario in the future, it won't be that bad for us.
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Old 03-09-2011, 06:42 AM    (permalink
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Also lulz @ Tiki Barber. I love how he's getting thrown under the bus for being the phony fraud that he is.
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:01 AM    (permalink
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He gets a bad rep for being a dumbass. And let's be honest, he rounds out his cuts a lot, but he's so fast he can get away with it.

He should be our DeSean Jackson, but he's not bc of the system. That's another reason why I was open to a coaching change, I want to see us run a simpler offense.

I know this is revisionist history on my part, but Ron Rivera would've been a great choice. Still a John Fox fan as well.

But anyway, what's done is done. Thankfully we seem to be deep at WR (when healthy) so if we do lose Mario in the future, it won't be that bad for us.
I would not have liked Rivera at all. Somethings not right with him. The way he's been totally ignored so many times. And the only team to finally give him a chance is the Panthers, and there main goal in a coach was most likely to pay him as little as possible.
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:07 AM    (permalink
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I would not have liked Rivera at all. Somethings not right with him. The way he's been totally ignored so many times. And the only team to finally give him a chance is the Panthers, and there main goal in a coach was most likely to pay him as little as possible.
He's hispanic. Old rich white owners stuck in the dark ages are skeptical of such madness.

I disliked him bc I thought he was a Cover 2 guy, but he's actually going to run Jim Johnson's 46.

Carolina gets a bad rep for being cheap (which they are), but they're also smart. They believe in defensive head coaches, and they believe in hiring assistants who put in their due. It's the right formula for success. Look at all the successful HCs lately: Mike Smith, John Harbaugh, Mike McCarthy, Steve Spagnuolo, TomTom.

All assistants who put in their due. It's the right formula.

The sexy HC is usually more hype than substance. Look at Shannahan.
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:13 AM    (permalink
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He's hispanic. Old rich white owners stuck in the dark ages are skeptical of such madness.
I don't buy that for a second. I'm sure there are a few owners like that, but enough African American coaches have been hired over the past several years that I don't think this was the issue.
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:24 AM    (permalink
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I don't buy that for a second. I'm sure there are a few owners like that, but enough African American coaches have been hired over the past several years that I don't think this was the issue.
The Rooney Rule is a joke. Look at what Jerry Jones did this year. That was embarassing.

Raheem Morris, Leslie Frazier, Ron Rivera, Lovie Smith, what do they all have in common? They were hired largely bc ownership wanted to save money.

Ultimately though, Ron just needed to build his resume up. Some guys have to work harder for the same thing, that's all. We really haven't seen that many minority coaches until the past 3 or so years, and Ron was a hot item in 06, that was 5 years ago. He had to build up his hype back to that level.

The only reason why I disliked him was bc I thought he'd bring Lovie's Cover 2 to whatever team hired him. But he's not. And he's a tough stern guy, not a player's coach. Which is what I like, I don't like the pat on the back happy go lucky player coaches.

That's one thing I like about Coughlin. He's tough.
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Old 03-09-2011, 09:30 AM    (permalink
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I don't really know who would replace Coughlin at this point. I'm sure there's always up and coming assistants, but I have no idea who they are. I'm still not sold on Cowher.

It's so obvious though that Cowher wants the Giants gig. He might as well just come out and say it at this point.
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Old 03-09-2011, 04:12 PM    (permalink
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A very young coach for the next one... A coach somewhere between players coach and Coughlin. Middle ground..
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Old 03-10-2011, 09:55 AM    (permalink
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The sad thing is, I think in a simpler offense, like a WCO, Mario would be a stud. He does this well in our complex offense, can you imagine how good he could be if they simplified things for him?


He has potential to be our best WR bc he's the fastest, but realistically that won't happen bc our offense is just too complicated for him.

I can see him thriving elsewhere. For us, he's a solid #3 WR, but you can't rely on him on every snap.
Good Morning,

You hit it right on the head! Any above average OC would have this offense rolling regardless of injuries. Look how Beckhum was or wasn't utilized during the last quarter of the season? You give Beckhum to S. Payton or N. Turner he would be consistently be matched up with LBs and causing chaos...Are the Saints or Chargers offensive personnel better than ours? NO! Its all about the Coordinators....

I don't argue with people about our OC no more, they seem to be stuck on stats instead of understanding that playing to the strengths of your personnel seems to be something foreign to the offensive coaching staff which will lead to creating consistent offense for 4 quarters not one half or one quarter.

Mannigham in any other offense with his respective deficiencies would 70 catch 1200 yds guy. He would get the ball in space in so many different ways. SMFH

This is one of the reasons, I care so much about fielding an elite defense and solid special teams with a good return game; My dream for 2011 and beyond....

What you think BBD?

Mannigham

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Old 03-18-2011, 10:46 PM    (permalink
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Tuck plans to talk to Asomugha about joining Giants: report

March 18 New York Post

"While the lockout prevents teams from talking to players, it won't stop Justin Tuck from doing some recruiting.

The Giants defensive end said Tuesday night that he plans on talking to Raiders cornerback Nnamdi Asomugha about coming to New York.

"New York City is the place to be and that draws on its own, and plus we are a team that hasn't gotten over the [hump] and a player like him would definitely help do so," Tuck told ESPN.com.

The Jets could also be interested in Asomugha; him and Darrelle Revis are friends and have spoken in the past about joining forces. But they have a slew of free agents that they may look to re-sign, including another cornerback Antonio Cromartie, before Asomugha becomes an issue. Asomugha's Raiders contract was voided when he failed to reach certain incentives."
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Old 03-18-2011, 10:58 PM    (permalink
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I'm sure a player from every team is talking to Asomugha.
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Old 03-19-2011, 07:21 AM    (permalink
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He's not coming here. We can't afford him anyway.

Cornerback is not the issue, we need a linebacker. I'd be willing to trade our 1st and a player for Lawrence Timmons if the Steelers were willing to listen.

But that's never going to happen bc we'd never think to do it, plus the Steelers wouldn't trade him even if they can't afford to resign him after this year.
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Old 03-19-2011, 02:38 PM    (permalink
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Not saying I want him or we will get him just simply posting an article. If we got him then TT would be pushed to Nickle or traded which I am against. Tuck should be talking to LBs out there not players that we don't truly need or have the money for
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Old 03-19-2011, 11:13 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMINATEtheline View Post
Good Morning,

You hit it right on the head! Any above average OC would have this offense rolling regardless of injuries. Look how Beckhum was or wasn't utilized during the last quarter of the season? You give Beckhum to S. Payton or N. Turner he would be consistently be matched up with LBs and causing chaos...Are the Saints or Chargers offensive personnel better than ours? NO! Its all about the Coordinators....

I don't argue with people about our OC no more, they seem to be stuck on stats instead of understanding that playing to the strengths of your personnel seems to be something foreign to the offensive coaching staff which will lead to creating consistent offense for 4 quarters not one half or one quarter.

Mannigham in any other offense with his respective deficiencies would 70 catch 1200 yds guy. He would get the ball in space in so many different ways. SMFH

This is one of the reasons, I care so much about fielding an elite defense and solid special teams with a good return game; My dream for 2011 and beyond....

What you think BBD?

Mannigham
While I love to ***** about Killdrive I can't agree with the idea that his problem wasn't utilizing Mario Manningham, the kid's extremely explosive, but he's also still so raw as a route runner and we just couldn't trust him with this offense any more than we had to. Now I also disagree with killdrive's need for an excessively complex passing system with as many young receivers as we have, but that's a mistake made in the offseason. One thing, if we keep Killdrive and Steve Smith can stay healthy he could put up HOF numbers catching passes from Eli. SS is probably the perfect receiver for this system out of any young receiver out there simply because of how well he reads the field and how well he and eli can stay on the same page in this stupidly confusing offense. I think Nicks has the instincts to become great in it to, he still clearly has some room to grow.

I guess there's no point to that textual ejaculation other than, the offense is a cool idea that we just were in no position to run given what was happening with our personnel and that is absolutely on Killdrive, which is what infuriates me. If we had a team full of Steve Smith's and strong OL I'd be for it, even though I do agree that Killdrive does a **** job of utilizing some guys, but we don't we had young inexperienced Hakeem Nicks, young inexperienced and possibly ******** Mario Manningham and a young completely inexperienced Ramses Barden to go with our one steve Smith. That's just bad management and planning.
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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