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Old 12-12-2011, 06:55 PM    (permalink
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I don't think there is any way the Chiefs consider a quarterback in the early rounds, let alone the first round, as long as Scot Pioli is there. A rookie signal caller would likely mean a bad 2012 season, which would mean Pioli is out of a job. Now if Pioli is fired before this year's draft then all bets are off, but as long as Pioli is there it is going to be Cassel in my humble opinion.
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Old 12-12-2011, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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I don't think there is any way the Chiefs consider a quarterback in the early rounds, let alone the first round, as long as Scot Pioli is there. A rookie signal caller would likely mean a bad 2012 season, which would mean Pioli is out of a job. Now if Pioli is fired before this year's draft then all bets are off, but as long as Pioli is there it is going to be Cassel in my humble opinion.
Then Pioli needs to go too. And he can take this whole "Patriots Way" thing with him.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:02 PM    (permalink
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I don't think there is any way the Chiefs consider a quarterback in the early rounds, let alone the first round, as long as Scot Pioli is there. A rookie signal caller would likely mean a bad 2012 season, which would mean Pioli is out of a job. Now if Pioli is fired before this year's draft then all bets are off, but as long as Pioli is there it is going to be Cassel in my humble opinion.
Miami fired Sparano today too and they may take the final signal caller left if Barkley returns. Kansas City will get a new coach and likely get a quarterback like Tyler Bray or Tyler Wilson in 2013 if Matt Cassel doesn't step up.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:13 PM    (permalink
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I disagree. I think the best thing for the long term future of this club is to move up and take a QB.

The Chiefs haven't drafted a QB in the first round since 1983. They took Todd Blackledge over Jim Kelly and Dan Marino. Ouch. It's about time they took a chance on a guy that can be that franchise signal caller.
So if the big 3 are off the table, who do you want them to take top 10? Tannehill? Jones? That could end up being a Gabbert situation.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:14 PM    (permalink
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So if the big 3 are off the table, who do you want them to take top 10? Tannehill? Jones? That could end up being a Gabbert situation.
Or it could end up being a Jake Locker situation! I'd think hard about taking Tannehill there though. I'm a big fan of his.

And nobody looks as bad in the pocket as Gabbert. I honestly wonder how he even got through college ball.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:17 PM    (permalink
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Or it could end up being a Jake Locker situation! I'd think hard about taking Tannehill there though. I'm a big fan of his.

And nobody looks as bad in the pocket as Gabbert. I honestly wonder how he even got through college ball.
Agree on Tannehill, but not sure Id want him top 10. I think of him just like Locker last year. Love the upside, wouldn't be "pissed" per se if my team took him in the top 10, but would really try to move back to grab him.

And as for Gabbert, yeah, he sucks. No clue how he was a 1st round grade by some. But the funny thing is Alex Smith looked just as bad in the pocket his rookie season. Don't tell that to the Smithers though. Lmao.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:17 PM    (permalink
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I don't think there is any way the Chiefs consider a quarterback in the early rounds, let alone the first round, as long as Scot Pioli is there. A rookie signal caller would likely mean a bad 2012 season, which would mean Pioli is out of a job. Now if Pioli is fired before this year's draft then all bets are off, but as long as Pioli is there it is going to be Cassel in my humble opinion.
Yeah, Pioli tied his shoes to Cassel when he acquired him from the Patriots. Cassel would have to stink big time next year for KC to look elsewhere for the 2013 season.
That is why I think McDaniels will be their new HC. He developed Cassel when he coached him in NE and will give Pioli no trouble for insisting that he remain the starter. Looks like a match made in heaven.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:29 PM    (permalink
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Match made in heaven? Sure, if you're our 2012 opponents.

If you're the Chiefs as a team, and as a fanbase, that is the worst possible scenario to play out. And fyi, Cassel DID stink big time this year before he got hurt. But sure, we should hire a terrible HC to see if he can make our awful QB suck less.

Hint: he won't be able to.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:29 PM    (permalink
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Match made in heaven? Sure, if you're our 2012 opponents.

If you're the Chiefs as a team, and as a fanbase, that is the worst possible scenario to play out. And fyi, Cassel DID stink big time this year before he got hurt. But sure, we should hire a terrible HC to see if he can make our awful QB suck less.

Hint: he won't be able to.
But he went 11-5 with the Patriots in 2008.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:39 PM    (permalink
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But he went 11-5 with the Patriots in 2008.
He also took the Chiefs to the playoffs last year. They aren't going to give up on him for next season especially because Pioli traded for him and is responsible for bringing him to KC. He believed strongly in him then and I seriously doubt his support has lessoned.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:39 PM    (permalink
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But he went 11-5 with the Patriots in 2008.
Oh you're absolutely right. I forgot about that!

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He also took the Chiefs to the playoffs last year. They aren't going to give up on him for next season especially because Pioli traded for him and is responsible for bringing him to KC. He believed strongly in him then and I seriously doubt his support has lessoned.
Against quite possibly the most cupcake schedule ever created by the NFL. And why would you doubt that? Cassel was awful this year before he got hurt. It was 2009 all over again. Except this time he had talent at WR, so you can't blame that.

But you're the guy that all but guaranteed Haley was safe, so if you say Cassel is going to stick around I could probably start celebrating his release right now. :D
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:39 PM    (permalink
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Matt Cassel is never going to be Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees but the Chiefs can win with him. In fact, as long as Kansas City can get healthy and upgrade that offensive line there is no reason why they can't bounce back in a big way next season.

In short, replacing Cassel now would be throwing the baby out with the bath water.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:43 PM    (permalink
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Matt Cassel is never going to be Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees but the Chiefs can win with him. In fact, as long as Kansas City can get healthy and upgrade that offensive line there is no reason why they can't bounce back in a big way next season.

In short, replacing Cassel now would be throwing the baby out with the bath water.
couldn't agree more. Cassel is Pioli's boy and he would have to fail big time in 2012 for the Chiefs to draft a QB. I don't think there is a realistic chance the Chiefs go QB in round 1 in 2012. To be honest I have a bias here -as a Skins fan I want less competition for RGIII, Barkley or Tannehill.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:44 PM    (permalink
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I think probably the best situation for the Chiefs as far as QB is concerned is to trade down (or back up) and land Tannehill. Tannehill absolutely won't be ready to go next year, but Matt Cassel should be good enough to hold the fort until Tannehill is ready.

The Chiefs can certainly bounce back in a big way next year, once all those ACLs heal, but I don't think they're ever going to be a serious superbowl contender until they greatly improve the quarterback position.

Pioli's not going to keep his job long term unless the Chiefs start competing for titles, and that's something he's not going to do if he sticks with Cassel. A greater sin than punting too soon an an average-at-best QB in Cassel, is wasting the pretty talented core of that Chiefs team with an average-at-best QB.

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Old 12-12-2011, 07:45 PM    (permalink
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Matt Cassel is never going to be Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees but the Chiefs can win with him. In fact, as long as Kansas City can get healthy and upgrade that offensive line there is no reason why they can't bounce back in a big way next season.

In short, replacing Cassel now would be throwing the baby out with the bath water.
If we know that he'll never be an elite QB, what is the point? I'd argue that he isn't even a FRANCHISE QB at this point in time.

We know that Cassel can play well against awful defenses, as evidenced by 2010. And we know that Cassel plays horribly against solid to good defenses, as evidenced by 2009 and 2011 pre-injury.

Is it really worth it to go ahead with a QB you know will never be elite, or even top 10 at his position? I submit that it is not and that it is a massive waste of time.

Throwing the baby out with the bathwater? Sign me up for that.

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couldn't agree more. Cassel is Pioli's boy and he would have to fail big time in 2012 for the Chiefs to draft a QB.
He just did that this year. Why wait to draft a QB when we're going to have a top 10 pick?
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:47 PM    (permalink
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He also took the Chiefs to the playoffs last year. They aren't going to give up on him for next season especially because Pioli traded for him and is responsible for bringing him to KC. He believed strongly in him then and I seriously doubt his support has lessoned.
That's right. Cassell is a PROVEN WINNER. Oh wait....He's never won a playoff game. Hasn't Romo won at least one of those?
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Old 12-12-2011, 08:00 PM    (permalink
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Matt Cassel is the next Brody Croyle who was the next Trent Green who was the next Elvin Grbac.....

They've accepted mediocrity at the QB position for too long and it's time that they step up and go after their franchise QB. Cassel isn't good enough to win a championship and probably not a playoff game so how can they move forward with him long term? Hel isn't a 'franchise QB' so the Chiefs need to follow the Golden Rule.
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Old 12-13-2011, 02:38 AM    (permalink
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Matt Cassel is never going to be Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees but the Chiefs can win with him. In fact, as long as Kansas City can get healthy and upgrade that offensive line there is no reason why they can't bounce back in a big way next season.

In short, replacing Cassel now would be throwing the baby out with the bath water.
You severely underestimate how bad Matt Cassel really is.

Regardless, you're right that Pioli won't actively try to replace him.
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Old 12-13-2011, 07:51 AM    (permalink
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Match made in heaven? Sure, if you're our 2012 opponents.

If you're the Chiefs as a team, and as a fanbase, that is the worst possible scenario to play out. And fyi, Cassel DID stink big time this year before he got hurt. But sure, we should hire a terrible HC to see if he can make our awful QB suck less.

Hint: he won't be able to.
Listen to yourself, now you know what the GM should do and can guarantee that a QB who went to the playoffs the year before doesn't have the ability to do it again.
Who made you the all seeing eye who is infallible when it comes to his team. Sounds just like a homer to me who is way too close to the situation and thinks he knows best, what is needed.
Unfortunately, teams rarely listen to their fans, they have their own plans and attempt to carry them out in their own way.
Whether you like it or not, Pioli is tied at the hip to Cassel, he convinced his owner to open the pocket book and sign him at all costs. Pioli couldn't get his HC in bed with his ideas so he fired him and will most likely bring in somebody who he has had a relationship with and who will support Pioli in insisting that Cassel be the starter.
Pioli has shown a definite affinity for hiring ex NE staff, and McDaniels is sitting right there for him to hire. Seems like a natural progression to me, although Mangini just might sneak in.
Now, I might agree with you about Cassel's potential but I along with you don't make those decisions, the GM does and will no matter how strongly you feel on the matter.
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Old 12-13-2011, 08:07 AM    (permalink
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That's right. Cassell is a PROVEN WINNER. Oh wait....He's never won a playoff game. Hasn't Romo won at least one of those?
The list of QB's in the NFL who have never won a playoff game is significant, many are on teams like KC who are young and inexperienced and need time to learn how to win big games.
How many years was Brees in the league before he won a playoff game. how about Alex Smith or Freeman etc. etc.
Eli was a starter for 4 seasons before he did anything, ditto for Rivers.
It simply isn't as easy as you want to make out.
You only find out after time, if a QB has what it takes. Cassel has had 1 eleven win season and 1 ten game winning season and you simply want to write him off.
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Old 12-13-2011, 12:15 PM    (permalink
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I still don't get why Pioli is tied to the hip of Cassel. Cassel has already earned most of his big money. If we cut him today we'd owe him peanuts.

He isn't tied to anyone for any reason. Period.
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Old 12-13-2011, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by vidae View Post
I still don't get why Pioli is tied to the hip of Cassel. Cassel has already earned most of his big money. If we cut him today we'd owe him peanuts.

He isn't tied to anyone for any reason. Period.
Matt Cassell for 5M 1 year deal is a bargain for a starter and not bad at all as a back up, considering what some of these back-ups are getting paid.

I agree that if Landry Jones is there they will take him and sit him for next year ala Locker or can trade down for Tannenhill or wait till round 2 for Foles.

Cassell will be back as the starter in 2012 but 2013 is completely open, IF someone is there at round 1 or 2 I think they would take said player....but they will not trade up
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Old 12-14-2011, 03:00 AM    (permalink
ChiFan24
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I still don't get why Pioli is tied to the hip of Cassel. Cassel has already earned most of his big money. If we cut him today we'd owe him peanuts.

He isn't tied to anyone for any reason. Period.
He thinks Cassel is good. That's why.

And no, I have no inside knowledge of the situation and I could be totally wrong. But generally, when you draft a QB that probably would have been a UDFA, then trade a second round pick for that QB, then win your division with that QB, odds are that you like the guy and you won't reverse your opinion on him a year later.

And again, this has nothing to do with my personal opinion of Matt Cassel.
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Old 12-14-2011, 03:23 AM    (permalink
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So if the big 3 are off the table, who do you want them to take top 10? Tannehill? Jones? That could end up being a Gabbert situation.
Even if Pioli absolutely hated Cassel, I couldn't see him drafting either Tannehill or Jones. If he was going to go against his own philosophy and take a QB in the first, he'd absolutely would want one he'd feel comfortable that could start Week 1.

Neither fit that description.

As for the likely hood of drafting a QB, I wouldn't keep it off the table. The team ultimately belongs to Clark Hunt and I think he's pissed they don't have a franchise QB.
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Old 12-20-2011, 02:49 AM    (permalink
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Isn't it amazing what a QB who can actually play can do with this offense? And that's without Charles or Moeaki.

I think Orton is the starter next year and Cassel is cut unless he restructures his contract because there's no way he's getting $5.25 million next season. Just isn't happening.

I would love the team to trade up and take Barkley because the guy runs the pro style offense perfectly and would do great with our supporting cast.

Honestly, KC will probably draft an OT or NT in the first round. BPA is very likely.
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