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Old 12-25-2011, 06:24 PM    (permalink
49erNation85
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What is your take on Kellen Moore ? How come is he is rated higher then Foles or any of the bottom tier QB? I know he is short , but he still has very good accuracy just not really a deep but can put it up if he needs too. I think he could be competeive in a west coast type system like in SF or Sea maybe sadly I don't think any one drafts him until 4/5th round. No love for the small QB any more.
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Old 12-25-2011, 08:32 PM    (permalink
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What is your take on Kellen Moore ? How come is he is rated higher then Foles or any of the bottom tier QB? I know he is short , but he still has very good accuracy just not really a deep but can put it up if he needs too. I think he could be competeive in a west coast type system like in SF or Sea maybe sadly I don't think any one drafts him until 4/5th round. No love for the small QB any more.
He is under 200 lbs and has limited Mobility.
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Old 12-25-2011, 10:52 PM    (permalink
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Matthew Jones, just curious...where did you play and/or coach ball???
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Old 12-26-2011, 10:36 AM    (permalink
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Big board has been updated!
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Old 12-26-2011, 12:05 PM    (permalink
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Things that are standing out to me most:

-Martin as the #2 OT? I've been extremely unimpressed with him this year. I'd consider taking him with a late first if it was a need for my team, but I can't buy him as the #2 OT.

-I've got Poe/Still as #1 and #2... I personally can't see how someone would have them not only both outside of the top 3, but #5 and 6.
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Old 12-26-2011, 12:42 PM    (permalink
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Things that are standing out to me most:

-Martin as the #2 OT? I've been extremely unimpressed with him this year. I'd consider taking him with a late first if it was a need for my team, but I can't buy him as the #2 OT.

-I've got Poe/Still as #1 and #2... I personally can't see how someone would have them not only both outside of the top 3, but #5 and 6.
Jonathan Martin did have an underwhelming year but during his sophomore campaign he looked like an elite left tackle prospect; Riley Reiff was not able to capitalize on Martin's disappointing junior season.

Dontari Poe never impressed when watching Memphis; not nearly as good of an anchor as he should have due to his poor leverage and balance. Devon Still tore his ACL and MCL in 2007 and broke his ankle in 2008; Still only produced in a "contract" year and needs to significantly improve his anchor and pad level.
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Old 12-26-2011, 01:47 PM    (permalink
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Jonathan Martin did have an underwhelming year but during his sophomore campaign he looked like an elite left tackle prospect; Riley Reiff was not able to capitalize on Martin's disappointing junior season.

Dontari Poe never impressed when watching Memphis; not nearly as good of an anchor as he should have due to his poor leverage and balance. Devon Still tore his ACL and MCL in 2007 and broke his ankle in 2008; Still only produced in a "contract" year and needs to significantly improve his anchor and pad level.
Jason Pierre Paul only produced in his "contract" year and look at him.

Phil Taylor only produced in his "contract" year and was picked in the first round and looks like a future anchor on Cleveland's D-Line.

Devon Still will be the 1st or 2nd DT taken off the board, has first round talent, and will NOT fall farther than pick #20.
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Old 12-26-2011, 04:56 PM    (permalink
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Jason Pierre Paul only produced in his "contract" year and look at him.

Phil Taylor only produced in his "contract" year and was picked in the first round and looks like a future anchor on Cleveland's D-Line.

Devon Still will be the 1st or 2nd DT taken off the board, has first round talent, and will NOT fall farther than pick #20.
Still could be one of the first defensive tackles selected but projected draft position is not factored into these rankings; draft position does not dictate future success in the NFL. Still is nowhere near as physically gifted as either Pierre-Paul or Phil Taylor; Pierre-Paul was a very raw prospect with extremely limited football experience who only started to put it together in his final season whereas Still took years to get healthy and give any semblance of effort on the field. Anecdotal evidence makes for a weak argument.
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Old 12-26-2011, 09:28 PM    (permalink
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Still could be one of the first defensive tackles selected but projected draft position is not factored into these rankings; draft position does not dictate future success in the NFL. Still is nowhere near as physically gifted as either Pierre-Paul or Phil Taylor; Pierre-Paul was a very raw prospect with extremely limited football experience who only started to put it together in his final season whereas Still took years to get healthy and give any semblance of effort on the field. Anecdotal evidence makes for a weak argument.
If you want to talk about production on the field, why don't we talk about the DTs you have ranked above Still?

1. Brandon Thompson, Clemson - He is a solid player, but he is simply not a pass-rushing threat. He will occasionally push the pocket but has little quickness or disruptiveness. He had 45 tackles with 6.5 tackles for a loss, 2.5 sacks and a forced fumble.

2. Alameda Ta'amu, Washington - He was the anchor of one of the worst defenses in college football this year. Teams ran all over the Huskies and passed all over them. The problem was that Taamu and the other defensive linemen were shut down with ease by most of the offensive lines they faced. Taamu presents absolutely zero pass rush threat, and is inconsistent as a run-stopping anchor as well. This season, he had a measly 28 tackles with seven tackles for a loss and 3.5 sacks.

3. Jerel Worthy, Michigan St.* - This big guy is maybe the most inconsistent DT in the country. He'll flash on occasion but disappear for entire games at a time, and is often on the sideline huffing and puffing, as his conditioning is clearly sketchy. This year, he had 3.5 sacks with 25 tackles and 8.5 tackles for a loss.

4. Fletcher Cox, Mississippi St.* - This guy was completely nonexistent for the first five games of the Miss. St. season. Then he exploded for four sacks against South Carolina and Kentucky. He ended the season with 49 tackles with 12.5 tackles for a loss, four sacks and one forced fumble.


So to recap:

Brandon Thompson - 45 tackles, 6.5 TFL, 2.5 sacks.
Alameda Ta'amu - 28 tackles, 7 TFL, 3.5 sacks.
Jerel Worthy - 25 tackles, 8.5 TFL, 3.5 sacks.
Fletcher Cox - 49 tackles, 12.5 TFL, 4 sacks

And compare to:

Devon Still - 55 tackles, 17 TFL, 4.5 sacks

I know you want to harp on the fact that you haven't seen much production from him prior to this year, but I haven't seen any production from the other guys you have ranked ahead of him, even THIS year. If Still is a one-year wonder, he is at least a wonder at all. Thompson, Taamu, and Worthy just don't produce at all, now or in the past. The only DT who should be ranked alongside Still or even be in consideration for the #1 DT ranking is Cox. Still's production blows Ta'amu, Worthy, and Thompson out of the water.

I would understand if you ranked productive DTs above Still, who is a good, but not elite DT prospect, but in this weak DT class, STill is the clearly the best of a mediocre bunch regardless of one-year's worth of production.
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