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Old 01-17-2012, 12:29 PM    (permalink
BeerBaron
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Default RGIII Trade Rumors Begin Already

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...rumor-emerges/

It's never too early to start speculating.

With the Colts almost certainly taking Luck, the Rams not needing a QB at #2 and such a steep drop from Griffin to the next tier of QBs, it looks like that pick being traded is inevitable.

Cleveland kicks off the rumor mill. They have the most ammunition and Griffin will provide a spark to that very, very dull offense.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:32 PM    (permalink
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Cleveland just makes too much sense. "The time has come," the Walrus said. They moved out of that 5 spot last year to procure the necessary ammo to trade up this year for their franchise QB. If they don't do it, the trade down last year will have largely went to waste.

I think Washington will throw big bucks at Flynn this offseason. Shanny and Snyder won't have the patient to go in and develop a rookie QB - they're going to want to plug somebody in who can come and run that system immediately, and Flynn can do that.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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Colt McCoy sure as hell isn't leading them anywhere. His 5.9 YPA is 2nd worst in the league only behind Gabbert. Even if you adjust for the (lack of) supporting talent, that's horrific.

Griffin at least would bring you the chance to "Cam Newton" his way to a few victories. He'd bring a little bit of dynamism to the offense.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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Hmm. I don't know. I might be tempted to call the Rams bluff if I'm the Browns. No way they would seriously move forward with Griffin with the type of resources they have invested in Bradford. If the price is right, I could see them pulling the trigger to be safe though.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:44 PM    (permalink
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I think I'd rather take my lumps with

McCoy, Trent Richardson, Kendall Wright and Little, OR...
McCoy, Lamar Miller, Justin Blackmon and Little

than RGIII, Hardesty, Little, and Massaquoi. I don't see that as wasting the trade down as Savant suggests.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fear the elf View Post
I think I'd rather take my lumps with

McCoy, Trent Richardson, Kendall Wright and Little, OR...
McCoy, Lamar Miller, Justin Blackmon and Little

than RGIII, Hardesty, Little, and Massaquoi. I don't see that as wasting the trade down as Savant suggests.
Because you're unsold about RG3? Think McCoy can be a decent starter? Or because you'd rather have the "value" of more players?

I dunno, I wouldn't want McCoy starting a game for my team, ever, no matter how much talent is around him. WR and RB are both ridiculously deep and the FA class at WR will be pretty loaded, too.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fear the elf View Post
I think I'd rather take my lumps with

McCoy, Trent Richardson, Kendall Wright and Little, OR...
McCoy, Lamar Miller, Justin Blackmon and Little

than RGIII, Hardesty, Little, and Massaquoi. I don't see that as wasting the trade down as Savant suggests.
Yeah, no. The easiest way to win in the NFL right now is with a great QB. McCoy isn't even adequate. His ceiling and floor are about an inch apart.

You're better served going all in for a chance at someone who may become an elite QB than to doom yourself to mediocrity with one you know isn't.

There's the off chance that in like 7 years with a really, really good rest of the team meticulously built through years of careful drafting that a mediocre QB could become Alex Smith.

But do you really want to wait?

No. Go for the potentially elite QB. McCoy is awful.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:51 PM    (permalink
fear the elf
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Originally Posted by DraftSavant View Post
Because you're unsold about RG3? Think McCoy can be a decent starter? Or because you'd rather have the "value" of more players?
A combination of all of those to be honest.

Ever since guys like Big Ben, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco were sooo amazing in their rookies seasons, apparently nobody wants to give a QB a chance to develop. Add in the fact that all of those teams were exponentially more talented than the Browns and I think it's fair to give McCoy another shot with legitimate, NFL caliber playmakers.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:53 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BeerBaron View Post
Yeah, no. The easiest way to win in the NFL right now is with a great QB. McCoy isn't even adequate. His ceiling and floor are about an inch apart.

You're better served going all in for a chance at someone who may become an elite QB than to doom yourself to mediocrity with one you know isn't.

There's the off chance that in like 7 years with a really, really good rest of the team meticulously built through years of careful drafting that a mediocre QB could become Alex Smith.

But do you really want to wait?

No. Go for the potentially elite QB. McCoy is awful.
If McCoy isn't the answer, that's fine, I know he most likely isn't. However, I would rather trade my 2013 and 2014 first rounders to move up for a QB next year after acquiring talent to help them succeed. That's how I think a team should be built.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:54 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fear the elf View Post
I think I'd rather take my lumps with

McCoy, Trent Richardson, Kendall Wright and Little, OR...
McCoy, Lamar Miller, Justin Blackmon and Little

than RGIII, Hardesty, Little, and Massaquoi. I don't see that as wasting the trade down as Savant suggests.
The best part about this post is what it says about the state of Browns fans.

Regardless of which group of players they'll roll with, fear the elf is automatically assuming that he's going to have to take his lumps... lol

He didn't say "I think we'd be better off with..." or "we have a better chance to win with..." No. He already knows the team is going to suck so he's just choosing guys based on who he wants to see suffer.

I'm sorry, Cleveland.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BeerBaron View Post
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...rumor-emerges/

It's never too early to start speculating.

With the Colts almost certainly taking Luck, the Rams not needing a QB at #2 and such a steep drop from Griffin to the next tier of QBs, it looks like that pick being traded is inevitable.

Cleveland kicks off the rumor mill. They have the most ammunition and Griffin will provide a spark to that very, very dull offense.
Cleveland also makes the most sense from the Rams perspective.

-The Rams could sit at 4 and while Kalil is most likely gone, can choose between Claiborne and Blackmon (trading with Washington, Miami or further down would likely take them out of contention for both of those players), and allow them to get the top prospect at a critical position of need for them.

The 2nd pick could be WR/CB or OL (or perhaps even another area of need) as there should be good talent still available at those spots when the pick comes up. they would also have 3 new players to try and plug in to the lineup from the top 40.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fear the elf View Post
I think I'd rather take my lumps with

McCoy, Trent Richardson, Kendall Wright and Little, OR...
McCoy, Lamar Miller, Justin Blackmon and Little

than RGIII, Hardesty, Little, and Massaquoi. I don't see that as wasting the trade down as Savant suggests.
There is this amazing thing called free agency and a ton of good players in it this year.

I also doubt we would have to give up the ATL first round pick to move up two spots, probably only our second rounder and maybe a future third.

RG3 + Wright + (insert random free agent receiver out of the million that will be there) + (insert Hillis or one of the random free agent running backs out of the million that will be there) > McCoy + anything
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:31 PM    (permalink
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Colt McCoy sure as hell isn't leading them anywhere. His 5.9 YPA is 2nd worst in the league only behind Gabbert. Even if you adjust for the (lack of) supporting talent, that's horrific.

Griffin at least would bring you the chance to "Cam Newton" his way to a few victories. He'd bring a little bit of dynamism to the offense.
Not sure i see the weapons there on offense to "Cam Newton" anyone. Besides Griffin has a long way to go to be in Cam's class but that's probably just me.

On the other hand the Browns defense kept them in near every game so i guess any improvement at the QB position would result in more wins going forward.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:39 PM    (permalink
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There is this amazing thing called free agency and a ton of good players in it this year.

I also doubt we would have to give up the ATL first round pick to move up two spots, probably only our second rounder and maybe a future third.

RG3 + Wright + (insert random free agent receiver out of the million that will be there) + (insert Hillis or one of the random free agent running backs out of the million that will be there) > McCoy + anything
Condescension is not going to help convince me. I'm aware of the existence of free agency, thanks though, WB.

Assuming we are active in free agency, I would still rather roll with McCoy this year and move up (if needed) in the 2013 draft for a QB if needed.

I prefer not to bring a rookie QB into the worst offense since the team came back in '99. Get some pieces at other positions this year, go after Tyler Wilson next year.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:39 PM    (permalink
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The Browns have two firsts and a early second so if they trade #5 and #37 to the Rams they would still be able to get weapons for Griffin if they got him. They could even trade up again and get Richardson if he falls to about #10. If not they can get Kendall Wright (which would be best case scenario) or Michael Floyd, Sanu or Jeffery. Plus there are some top WR free agents so they could get Richardson by trading a 2013 1st round pick and get a Vincent Jackson in free agency.

Now an offense of:

Griffin - Richardson - V.Jackson - Little

The Browns offense would be explosive then! And this is a very possible situation as well.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:42 PM    (permalink
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The best part about this post is what it says about the state of Browns fans.

Regardless of which group of players they'll roll with, fear the elf is automatically assuming that he's going to have to take his lumps... lol

He didn't say "I think we'd be better off with..." or "we have a better chance to win with..." No. He already knows the team is going to suck so he's just choosing guys based on who he wants to see suffer.

I'm sorry, Cleveland.
It is sad, but 2 winning seasons since 1999 coupled with one of the worst offenses in that time will do that. I think without a huge influx of talent at the skill positions and an upgrade at RT this team will have to rely on the defense to win every game, which it just isn't equipped to do yet.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:45 PM    (permalink
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I think Cleveland goes after Matt Flynn, especially since Holmgren isn't afraid to take on QB's to be starters(Hasselbeck part 2?). Holmgren then could go Richardson/Blackmon at 4 then go Miller/Jeffery at 21
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:55 PM    (permalink
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We will see where Matt Flynn goes in free agency.Free agency starts in March, the browns have plenty of cap room well they should. It's not like they have a lot of high paid players.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:01 PM    (permalink
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Condescension is not going to help convince me. I'm aware of the existence of free agency, thanks though, WB.

Assuming we are active in free agency, I would still rather roll with McCoy this year and move up (if needed) in the 2013 draft for a QB if needed.

I prefer not to bring a rookie QB into the worst offense since the team came back in '99. Get some pieces at other positions this year, go after Tyler Wilson next year.
I just see no benefit in sticking with McCoy. He has no deep ball, poor accuracy and a small frame. I like him as a person and hes tough as hell but he isn't any good.

This team could be an 8 win team next year if we are active in free agency as Heckertt said we would be and get a good quarterback whether it be Matt Flynn or RG3.

I would love to see this team grow a sack and do something to get some playmakers. Flynn Blackmon Stevie Johnson and Little would be 10x better than what we have right now. Get over the whole Hillis bull **** and bring him back then go out and get a right tackle and RDE and we would be light years ahead of where we are.

Lots to do, but we have a ridiculously large amount of cap space and there really is no reason not to go wild in this free agent class.
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"If something happens, and it's the Cleveland Browns, I'm going to pour my heart out for the Dawg Pound and try to win a Super Bowl for Cleveland," he said. "I don't care if they've had 20 starting quarterbacks since 1999. I'm going to be the 21st and the guy that brought them the Super Bowl." - JFF

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Old 01-17-2012, 02:03 PM    (permalink
SolidGold
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The Matt Flynn sweepstakes will clear up some of the QB questions. Compelling cases can be made for both Cleveland and Washington to go after Flynn.

Cleveland - the GB Holmgren connection/same type of offense. They can sign Flynn as a young veteran QB and draft some offensive playmakers/o-line.

Washington - the probably short leash Shanahan will be on this year may not allow him to develop a rookie QB so he will need a veteran. The Redskins are a huge wildcard at this point (it's very early in the process...I realize this): They can sign Peyton if he is cleared to play and released by Indy, Sign Flynn, Trade up for Luck or Griffin, stay at 6 and get Tannehill (or possibly trade down).

I don't think Griffin compares to Newton though, I would label Griffin a Vick like prospect with less athleticism but a better command of the passing game.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:21 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fear the elf View Post
I think I'd rather take my lumps with

McCoy, Trent Richardson, Kendall Wright and Little, OR...
McCoy, Lamar Miller, Justin Blackmon and Little

than RGIII, Hardesty, Little, and Massaquoi. I don't see that as wasting the trade down as Savant suggests.

And the second you see RG3 roll out, out run T Suggs or Woodley for a 22 yard gain you'll be in love.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:23 PM    (permalink
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Cmon Oakland make it happen....give up a 1st and a 2nd for him

Oh wait...
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that's because we're the only animal capable of getting it from other animals. the day a goat can milk cows, it will.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:32 PM    (permalink
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Cmon Oakland make it happen....give up a 1st and a 2nd for him

Oh wait...
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha,
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:49 PM    (permalink
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Cmon Oakland make it happen....give up a 1st and a 2nd for him

Oh wait...
Now there's the rumor out there that, with Hue out, Palmer could play the "trade me or I retire" card again.

You could have just traded a 1st and 2nd round pick for half a season of a guy throwing more INTs than TDs.

Think about that. Trading for Carson Palmer may very well turn out to be the worst trade in the history of the NFL, with Herschel Walker being the only other one I can think of.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:55 PM    (permalink
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When you have to rebuild, you rebuild. Staying in limbo is the worst possible move

Look at Carolina last year. We had an aging Steve Smith coming off a bad season and no one else going into the offseason for a QB to throw to. By far the worst offense in the NFL. But we took Cam anyway and added two TEs along with the 4th and 6th string WRs from the Chargers

Worked out pretty well.

RGIII could bust. So could Tyler Wilson or whoever you eventually pick. But the sooner you figure that out the better. McCoy has had 2 seasons, that's long enough for a guy of his pedigree and physical limitations
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