Prospects with Character Red Flags

[WhiteBread]

I just find it funny that people see a little belly and assume he has a poor work ethic or is lazy.

[Iamcanadian]

[quote=WhiteBread;2834670]Fact? You have proof of this? Link? Anything other than a opinion that has no credibility?

Or again, is this just from a picture on the freaking internet?

Jeffery has always been big. He's even on record saying he never worked out in high school and couldn't even bench 150 pounds. He's up to 250 or so now.

I'll take you opinion as stated above this, "He's even on record saying he never worked out in high school and couldn't even bench 150 pounds. He's up to 250 or so now." What more is to be said?

[CDCB14]

Guys like Burfict really won't be a problem, because all you have to do is put fines for personal fouls in his contract. He's a grown man who wants money just like everyone else. Put it in his contract that every deliberate personal foul or any type of out of control conduct is like a $50,000 fine and he'll be a scared straight little school boy real quick.

I don't get why people are acting like the personal fouls are the real problem. The real question is will he be able to develop as a player and realize his Ray Lewis type potential, because he basically just got by on athleticism and size at ASU.

[Lil Quip]

I am surprised no one mentioned Crick. He was a well lauded prospect, but it seems like his health issues are a big red flag.

[WhiteBread]

Originally Posted by Iamcanadian

I'll take you opinion as stated above this, "He's even on record saying he never worked out in high school and couldn't even bench 150 pounds. He's up to 250 or so now." What more is to be said?

That he's not lazy and has actually been working his tail off?

[Lil Quip]

For Jeffrey, his only job right now is to make himself the best prospect possible.

Also, when in the NFL, his only job is to be a NFL receiver.

If he has a half a brain, I think he should spend some time with a nutritionist and a speed coach. I think he has plenty of time to lose the weight, keep the strength or get stronger. He can improve his speed just by shedding that excess weight.

He needs to look at a guy like Bryant as showing luck rather than he can get away it. He isn't the prospect Bryant was.

If he shows up at the combine fat and slow, I could see a big drop on draft day. Some team will take a flyer on him later, thinking they can do the things I stated above, however he should be doing that stuff already.

[WhiteBread]

He said strength coach Craig Fitzgerald has given him a program he has been committed to, and he can see the difference on the field. “I’m faster and stronger,” Jeffery said. “It pays off for everybody. We are out here running and lifting weights all summer.

http://www.muscleprodigy.com/alshon-...arcl-1815.html

[GaMeTiMe]

I think for Jeffery, his do or die moment here will be Scott's bodily description of him from the combine.

[FuzzyGopher]

Originally Posted by GaMeTiMe

I think for Jeffery, his do or die moment here will be Scott's bodily description of him from the combine.

Very long arms with poor definition and little muscle and large hands, midsection similar to Snooky.

[DeepThreat]

Originally Posted by Iamcanadian

They showed initiative in trying to get paid for what they do for their colleges. GM's aren't stupid, they know a lot of college players get paid under the table so it is no big deal to them if a college player wants to get paid and goes out and secures some income. Remember, a lot of these kids come from dirt poor families that have nothing. Their families can give them nothing so it would hardly surprise a GM that they tried to make some money when their colleges are taking in millions in revenue and giving them peanuts.
I'd bet that a lot of GM's would give them a plus for their initiative.

There is no initiative. It's not like these players are scheming on how to make money. They are being offered it and accepting it. There is no creativity or brilliance.

[J-Mike88]

Originally Posted by WhiteBread

Jeffery has always been big. He's even on record saying he never worked out in high school and couldn't even bench 150 pounds. He's up to 250 or so now.

Would you like a credible link for that?

Sounds an awful lot like the former USC Mike Williams. That scared away a lot of teams, but the Lions bit.

[WhiteBread]

Originally Posted by J-Mike88

Sounds an awful lot like the former USC Mike Williams. That scared away a lot of teams, but the Lions bit.

Mike Williams was what, 2 years removed from college football (he and Clarrett tryed to declare as Soph. and got revoked) and a football environment at all before he entered the NFL and played for the Lions?

His last season at USC was in 2003, his first season in Detroit was in 2005.

Bad example IMO.

[keylime_5]

Mike is still always out of shape and still has a bad work ethic. He's had plenty of years in the NFL to improve it and he still hasn't. He had a little better year in 2010 playing with Hasselbeck for Pete Carroll, but still a total bust. If Jeffery isn't more proactive about staying in shape than he was at Carolina then he is destined for the same fate.

[Menardo75]

I've seen every one of Billy Winn's games and I have never seen a problem with his motor.

[keylime_5]

it seems like we've gotten away from "character" issues and are delving into any red flags of any sorts. Work ethic and health have nothing to do with character. Character red flags are about attitude, personality, and getting into trouble on and/or off the field.

[descendency]

Originally Posted by WhiteBread

His last season at USC was in 2003, his first season in Detroit was in 2005.

Bad example IMO.

A player who really wants to be in the NFL won't accrue rust, 2 years removed or not.

I'd agree that it's not a perfect example, but fat with low motivation to be otherwise is a huge red flag. There are plenty of examples of players that were useless because of low desire and they almost universally bust.

[raynman]

Originally Posted by keylime_5

it seems like we've gotten away from "character" issues and are delving into any red flags of any sorts. Work ethic and health have nothing to do with character. Character red flags are about attitude, personality, and getting into trouble on and/or off the field.

i would consider bad work ethic and laziness to be a character issue. sure, it won't get you in jail, but it can be just as detrimental to a team.

[keylime_5]

you don't have to have a great work ethic to have top notch character. they are separate issues in my opinion. They might often come hand-in-hand, but you can't assume a guy who doesn't work as hard as the best has character problems. Vernon Gholston - great guy, all smiles, never gets into trouble, great team mate - didn't put in the effort to be the best football player. That kind of thing happens. Not everyone is dedicated or driven to be the best. That's more of having a competitive nature than anything.

[WhiteBread]

Originally Posted by descendency

A player who really wants to be in the NFL won't accrue rust, 2 years removed or not. I'd agree that it's not a perfect example, but fat with low motivation to be otherwise is a huge red flag. There are plenty of examples of players that were useless because of low desire and they almost universally bust.

Agreed on all accounts. Mike Williams was out of shape due to his long lay off out of football and not applying himself. He's a bonafide 1st round bust. Matt Millen was an idiot.

[raynman]

Originally Posted by keylime_5

you don't have to have a great work ethic to have top notch character. they are separate issues in my opinion. They might often come hand-in-hand, but you can't assume a guy who doesn't work as hard as the best has character problems. Vernon Gholston - great guy, all smiles, never gets into trouble, great team mate - didn't put in the effort to be the best football player. That kind of thing happens. Not everyone is dedicated or driven to be the best. That's more of having a competitive nature than anything.

it's a character trait.

laziness is a character flaw. it's a red flag. and it can be a costly one.

it doesn't mean you're a bad guy. but it also doesn't take away from it being a negative character trait. it doesn't contribute to winning. it hurts team morale. it sets a bad example. it drags down a team. it makes that player a liability.

it's a red flag.

[keylime_5]

i never said it wasn't a red flag. I just think there is a distinction between not having a great work ethic and what we call character concerns.

[raynman]

when you are trying to build a team with players you can count on....ehhh...there's not much a a distinction. they will both be high maintenance players that usually aren't worth the bother.

actually i'd rather take someone who has gotten busted for pot possession and gets in trouble once in a while off field but busts his butt in practice and on the field than someone who is a good guy but lazy player that you have to work hard to keep motivated. neither are particularly good for the organization but you'll probably get more production from the bad seed than the lazy one.