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Old 02-16-2012, 04:47 PM    (permalink
brat316
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Why are people saying best prospect since Manning? Lets remember in terms of prospect and not the NFL player. Ryan Leaf was the better prospect, had errr thing, was tough and had the rocket arm.
Manning didn't have the arm, other stuff
Quote:
In Manning’s case, he may be a solid and productive NFL QB, but he may not have Hall of Fame type skills, but it certainly won’t be for lack of effort..
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/foo...players/4.html

But they are very close replace Manning with Luck
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Manning is probably the most prepared QB to enter the NFL draft in several years.. He has had a storybook college career, and has been in a top level program with excellent coaching, and he has maturity and great intangibles to go along with his natural skills.. He should be able to pick up the mental aspects of the game early on the NFL level, and should play very quickly. He has great overall field vision. He is a fierce competitor, and all of his mechanics are very solid. He has good arm strength, but not necessarily a “gun” that you might expect from a QB at the top of the draft..
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Old 02-16-2012, 04:48 PM    (permalink
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First, it is a quote by somebody besides Mayock himself. I'll wait till I hear Mayock speak on Luck himself before I jump the gun.

I still think Mayock will call him once in a decade prospect when he goes over Luck as a prospect. He's one of the best I have seen in my 55 odd years of following the draft.

Of course we are talking about Luck as a prospect, that carries no guarantee that he will be better than Peyton, Montana or Elway, just that he has that type of ceiling, which means nothing till you actually produce as a pro.

Ceiling doesn't mean you will be better than those you are compared to, just gives a prospect a mark he is capable of.
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Old 02-16-2012, 04:49 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
I put Luck over most prototype QB prospects over the lat ten + years because of his athleticism.
His straight line speed is going to be one of the best for the position in the NFL, after Vick/Newton/Locker/Gabbert/Rodgers/Alex Smith.

In goal line offense, Luck is a guy who can roll out wide and take it into the endzone by himself, easily.
Young, Steve not vince fast?
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Old 02-16-2012, 05:24 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bhaarat316 View Post
Why are people saying best prospect since Manning? Lets remember in terms of prospect and not the NFL player. Ryan Leaf was the better prospect, had errr thing, was tough and had the rocket arm.
Manning didn't have the arm, other stuff

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/foo...players/4.html

But they are very close replace Manning with Luck
I think it is crazy, I has really young and not following the Draft back then but reading that report about Peyton Manning it's like a report about Andrew Luck (Great Mental part/Mature, not a Cannon for an Arm) and the Situation this year is kinda like 1998 in that you have a Guy that has been really good for a few years and is considered the #1 Overall Pick for a year or two when a guy comes out of nowhere and people really like that guy. With Peyton/Andrew you already know what you are getting and that is a Great Player but the Upside is not as great as the other QB that has a better arm and a good player. I am not saying Andrew Luck will be Peyton Manning or Robert Griffin will be Ryan Leaf but the situation is kinda similar.
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Old 02-16-2012, 05:32 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Iamcanadian View Post
First, it is a quote by somebody besides Mayock himself. I'll wait till I hear Mayock speak on Luck himself before I jump the gun.

I still think Mayock will call him once in a decade prospect when he goes over Luck as a prospect. He's one of the best I have seen in my 55 odd years of following the draft.

Of course we are talking about Luck as a prospect, that carries no guarantee that he will be better than Peyton, Montana or Elway, just that he has that type of ceiling, which means nothing till you actually produce as a pro.

Ceiling doesn't mean you will be better than those you are compared to, just gives a prospect a mark he is capable of.
Mayock said it in a conference media call, bro....
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Old 02-16-2012, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by broth223 View Post
Here's the question. Luck or Stafford as a prospect?
I like Stafford better from a physical standpoint but i think Luck has an advantage in the intangible category.
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Old 02-16-2012, 06:43 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Iamcanadian View Post
First, it is a quote by somebody besides Mayock himself. I'll wait till I hear Mayock speak on Luck himself before I jump the gun.

I still think Mayock will call him once in a decade prospect when he goes over Luck as a prospect. He's one of the best I have seen in my 55 odd years of following the draft.Of course we are talking about Luck as a prospect, that carries no guarantee that he will be better than Peyton, Montana or Elway, just that he has that type of ceiling, which means nothing till you actually produce as a pro.

Ceiling doesn't mean you will be better than those you are compared to, just gives a prospect a mark he is capable of.

Did you really agree with Fate Echols going in the top 10 in '62 while Billy Neighbors fell all the way to #43 overall?

Also, what was your scouting report like on Roman Gabriel?
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Old 02-16-2012, 06:45 PM    (permalink
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I've been saying it for 2 years but Luck=Eli but with more mobility. They are very very similar.
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:11 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Babylon View Post
I like Stafford better from a physical standpoint but i think Luck has an advantage in the intangible category.
Luck has the advantage in the physical standpoint as well other than arm strength. Luck is more athletic, is bigger, more accurate, better thrower on the run.
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:12 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by K Train View Post
i wonder who he considers once in a lifetime? i mean guys like calvin and suh were incredible super elite prospects but too say ill never ever see an athlete of that caliber again would be a bold statement.

id say luck is the best QB prospect ive seen in my lifetime so far, once in a lifetime i doubt though
Julius Peppers.
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:20 PM    (permalink
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Julius Peppers.
Until Mario Williams came along a few years later and beat him at just about every combine event, while weighing in heavier.
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:30 PM    (permalink
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Its probably the case where Luck has been around for so long in the stream of conciousness where people will start to put him down a bit.

Luck is a beast, has awesome accuracy, and is a perfectionist. And totally an underrated athlete. All the talent and quick decision making anyone can ask for.

Im hoping the Colts talk themselves out of Luck and the Browns have a crack at him in April. Wishful thinking but whatever...
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:35 PM    (permalink
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Until Mario Williams came along a few years later and beat him at just about every combine event, while weighing in heavier.
I kinda doubt most of his times were better but there's no way to know because Peppers' times aren't listed. Though the urban legend is that he ran a 4.48 at his pro day.
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Old 02-16-2012, 08:44 PM    (permalink
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Would Bronko Nagurski be considered a "once in a lifetime" prospect?
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Old 02-16-2012, 10:00 PM    (permalink
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Here's the question. Luck or Stafford as a prospect?
I'm the guy who would say Stafford. Stafford was an awesome prospect....

Luck is going to be really good. The guy can do whatever he wants to do in life...iw studying mechanical engineering?
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Old 02-16-2012, 10:20 PM    (permalink
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I like Stafford better from a physical standpoint but i think Luck has an advantage in the intangible category.


I like Stafford's intangibles.
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Old 02-16-2012, 10:31 PM    (permalink
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I never thought Stafford was that great of a prospect. I could never get his performance against Alabama's defense as a junior out of my head.

UGA was ranked #3 and had a night game at home against the #8 ranked Crimson Tide in Sanford Stadium (the "Blackout Game")

At halftime, Alabama had a 31-0 lead after Stafford had went 8/14, for 58 yards, no TD's, 1 INT, and an intentional grounding penalty in the first half.

Bama ended up letting Stafford pad his stats in the 2nd half by playing soft coverage due to Saban having called off the dogs at that point.

Stafford had never even completed better than 55% of his passes until A.J. Green came along.

I've never seen anything like that out of Andrew Luck. Then again, Luck has never faced a Nick Saban defense, or anything close to it.
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Old 02-17-2012, 08:24 AM    (permalink
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I think the stat about never completing 55% of his passes before AJ Green, it's the same thing that's happening for him in the NFL. He's got CJ, and that's pretty much all he needs. I think Stafford is pretty much garbage as a QB, he buckles really badly under pressure, chuck and duck. Several of those touchdowns late in the game he threw to Calvin were just floaters into triple coverage that Calvin won. So Luck vs Stafford I'd pick Luck pretty easily, and I'm not overly impressed with him either.
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Old 02-17-2012, 08:24 AM    (permalink
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I never thought Stafford was that great of a prospect. I could never get his performance against Alabama's defense as a junior out of my head.

UGA was ranked #3 and had a night game at home against the #8 ranked Crimson Tide in Sanford Stadium (the "Blackout Game")

At halftime, Alabama had a 31-0 lead after Stafford had went 8/14, for 58 yards, no TD's, 1 INT, and an intentional grounding penalty in the first half.

Bama ended up letting Stafford pad his stats in the 2nd half by playing soft coverage due to Saban having called off the dogs at that point.

Stafford had never even completed better than 55% of his passes until A.J. Green came along.

I've never seen anything like that out of Andrew Luck. Then again, Luck has never faced a Nick Saban defense, or anything close to it.
Yea...its a shame the BCS robbed us of a chance to see Luck go up against Alabama or LSU.He did however perform much better than Griffin against their common opponent Ok. St.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:29 AM    (permalink
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One NFL scout compares Stanford QB Andrew Luck to Matt Ryan as a "really good game manager" who's been overhyped by the media.
"He is a Matt Ryan-type player," said the scout. "He can't carry the team on his shoulders, but he's a really good manager. His arm isn't even close to Aaron Rodgers' and he doesn't have Aaron's feet. He's smart, competitive, tough. His teammates love him. The media has put so much pressure on this kid. It's unbelievable. They've basically anointed him Jesus Christ."
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packe...dium=t witter
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:06 AM    (permalink
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I think the stat about never completing 55% of his passes before AJ Green, it's the same thing that's happening for him in the NFL. He's got CJ, and that's pretty much all he needs. I think Stafford is pretty much garbage as a QB, he buckles really badly under pressure, chuck and duck. Several of those touchdowns late in the game he threw to Calvin were just floaters into triple coverage that Calvin won. So Luck vs Stafford I'd pick Luck pretty easily, and I'm not overly impressed with him either.
Matt Stafford 5,038 yards 41 TDs 16 INTs

Calvin Johnson 1,681 yards 16 TDS

You're right, Stafford is such garbage. Its totally all CJ helping him. You're ******* kidding me right now, right?
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:55 AM    (permalink
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I would agree with Mayock, before the season Luck was once in a life time prospect considering how he played his freshman and sophomore years. But now, this year, he was more average and did not play at his best in the biggest games. Still hard to argue you would not take him over the past few #1 pick QBs....


Since 1998 here are the quarterbacks I would not take over Luck.
2010 Sam Bradford
2009 Matthew Stafford
2007 JaMarcus Russell
2005 Alex Smith
2003 Carson Palmer
2002 David Carr
1999 Tim Couch



These three I would take over Luck when they came out, sure now one would not take Vick seeing how he has done, but coming out of VT hard to not take him back then.

2004 Eli Manning
2001 Michael Vick
1998 Peyton Manning
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Old 02-26-2012, 10:53 AM    (permalink
Leon Sandcastle
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Never thought I'd say this, this time last year but Cam Newton is going to be the better player.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Wide Right View Post
Never thought I'd say this, this time last year but Cam Newton is going to be the better player.
Newton will be way better he can actually throw passes farther than 20 yards unlike Luck.

Luck has the captain check down problem that many young qb's have. Hes similar to trent edwards in the way he plays.

Thats not a knock either because Trent was a middle of the pack QB before his concussions.

Luck will have a similar career in being a middle of the pack QB who can manage a game. Thats not worth a 1st overall selection.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:49 PM    (permalink
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Newton will be way better he can actually throw passes farther than 20 yards unlike Luck.

Luck has the captain check down problem that many young qb's have. Hes similar to trent edwards in the way he plays.

Thats not a knock either because Trent was a middle of the pack QB before his concussions.

Luck will have a similar career in being a middle of the pack QB who can manage a game. Thats not worth a 1st overall selection.
Dude don't underrate Luck's arm because he was trying to 'aim' most of his passes last year. You rarely saw Luck throw the ball last season at his max velocity. He played like a touch passer, but he's much more than that as a quarterback.

His arm is strong, just below elite.

It's hard to imagine you don't see Luck's potential to be a top 10 QB in the pros.

You put him in a real pro vertical system that takes advantage of his entire skill set and he's going to dominate.
Stanford ran a conservative ball control offense out of necessity, not because Luck was a mediocre QB.

Manning's career is on the downside and it's happened to every great QB, eventually the franchise has to make plans for the future.

Teams rarely get a chance to draft a legit franchise QB, Indy knows this more than most. They got a decade and a half out of Peyton AND paid him $26 mil last season to not play a down of football.

Only a Peyton relative would keep Manning over the chance to draft Luck.
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