Browns - Matt Flynn or RG3: It's One or the Other

[Wrathman]

Originally Posted by SRK85

My bad I may have been slightly inebriated. Anyways what I meant was, the Browns lack a number 1 WR, and Hillis is on his way out. Trading away a plethora of draft picks for RG3 will not solve their problems. However, if the Browns were able to sign Bowe and keep Hillis then they would be fine. Greg Little could be a good number 2 WR but we shall see. Needless to say the Browns have a lot of holes.

Bowe was franchised. I think you have some catching up to do after that bender. ;-)

[twiz]

I'm also on board with not signing Flynn. At least until we find out how interested Miami actually is. If they're not interested, steer clear. If they are, there may be some merit to Flynn's ability. But I'd rather have Rg3 anyway.

[prock]

Originally Posted by twiz

I'm also on board with not signing Flynn. At least until we find out how interested Miami actually is. If they're not interested, steer clear. If they are, there may be some merit to Flynn's ability. But I'd rather have Rg3 anyway.

That is the dumbest logic. Why would they depend on another team's scouting department to do scouting for them? If they like him, sign him.

[Brodeur]

Originally Posted by twiz

I'm also on board with not signing Flynn. At least until we find out how interested Miami actually is. If they're not interested, steer clear. If they are, there may be some merit to Flynn's ability. But I'd rather have Rg3 anyway.

Miami is always great with these decisions. Chad Henne turned out great, picking Culpepper over Brees....gotta make sure they're interested.

[FUNBUNCHER]

Matt Flynn and his reps are in for a shock if they believe some team is going to sign him to an insane contract.

If he's offered more than a $40-45 mil deal over 5 years with $10-12 mil guaranteed, I'd be very surprised.

Whoever wants him can get him for a reasonable deal IMO, and if he doesn't work out you get rid of him without the heavy salary cap hit.

No one is going to do a Kolb deal again in the near future,(trading a #2 and DRC, signing Kolb to a five year, $64 mil deal with $21 mil guaranteed).

Flynn will be lucky if he's offered roughly half that deal.

[Clarkw267]

Originally Posted by Brodeur

Miami is always great with these decisions. Chad Henne turned out great, picking Culpepper over Brees....gotta make sure they're interested.

The difference is that Flynn's OC is now the Head Coach of the Dolphins, so if he isn't interested in pursuing Flynn, that would certainly raise a red flag. Although it wouldn't be the end all be all.

[twiz]

Originally Posted by prock

That is the dumbest logic. Why would they depend on another team's scouting department to do scouting for them? If they like him, sign him.

Because Miami's new HC is his old OC?

[twiz]

Originally Posted by Clarkw267

The difference is that Flynn's OC is now the Head Coach of the Dolphins, so if he isn't interested in pursuing Flynn, that would certainly raise a red flag. Although it wouldn't be the end all be all.

Thank you for not just flinging insults.

[FUNBUNCHER]

If the Phins go for Peyton over Flynn isn't really much of a 'tell' whether or not Philbin believes Matt Flynn can actually play.

[Wrathman]

Originally Posted by twiz

I'm also on board with not signing Flynn. At least until we find out how interested Miami actually is. If they're not interested, steer clear. If they are, there may be some merit to Flynn's ability. But I'd rather have Rg3 anyway.

The plan goes out the window if the Phins sign Manning. I see your point, but a team has to live and die with its own ability to recognize talent when it sees it. If a management team can't do that, they are in the wrong business.

[fear the elf]

Originally Posted by keylime_5

I think if the Browns get a great QB then the offensive weapons will magically start to show up. We all know that great QBs make the offense around them so much better. How good would those guys on the Saints that Drew Brees is throwing to be if they played for the Browns with Colt McCoy? Evan Moore, Ben Watson, Josh Cribbs, Greg Little, Peyton Hillis, and MoMass aren't that bad. I think if they had Manning or Brees or Brady throwing to them no one would be complaining that much..........plus you can always build around a QB after you draft one. The hard part is finding a great QB, not finding decent weapons so much.

So, if they get Peyton Manning? It's not like if they draft RG3, he's magically going to be this "great" QB from the start. Chances are, he's going to go through growing pains for a couple of years, if he doesn't flame out completely because he has nobody to help him make plays and develop...

I still don't get this idea that you just find great QB's in the draft. Even the best ones needed a talented supporting cast to get them up and running. Then, once they became great, the supporting cast matters less.

[keylime_5]

well the thing is, if you draft a rookie QB, you have time to build a team around him.....and even with Griffin I think the Browns offensive playmaker would still improve their production a little. If a QB is good, then the talent on offense won't hold him back much - even early in his career.

[Iamcanadian]

He would already have the best LT in football to protect him and great QB's make their WR's look far better than they actually are, look at Deon Branch and Wes Welker in NE.

Sure it will take 3 years to become a contender which gives you plenty of time to add some solid help through the draft but if you don't get that franchise QB, you can be waiting 2 decades for any sign of success.

There are plenty of scouts and GM's who think RG111 will be a better pro than Luck, that kind of QB comes once in a generation and you had better pay the price to get him or you'll end up settling for a Locker, Gabbert or Ponder, QB's who may all end up being NFL staters but hardly franchise super stars.

[twiz]

Originally Posted by Wrathman

The plan goes out the window if the Phins sign Manning. I see your point, but a team has to live and die with its own ability to recognize talent when it sees it. If a management team can't do that, they are in the wrong business.

Of course you do, but I feel it would be rather telling if Flynn's old coach has no interest in signing him, too.

[Iamcanadian]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

Matt Flynn and his reps are in for a shock if they believe some team is going to sign him to an insane contract.

If he's offered more than a $40-45 mil deal over 5 years with $10-12 mil guaranteed, I'd be very surprised.

Whoever wants him can get him for a reasonable deal IMO, and if he doesn't work out you get rid of him without the heavy salary cap hit.

No one is going to do a Kolb deal again in the near future,(trading a #2 and DRC, signing Kolb to a five year, $64 mil deal with $21 mil guaranteed).

Flynn will be lucky if he's offered roughly half that deal.

Sorry, but the Kolb deal is the minimum you will have to pay for Flynn. This is a QB hungrey league and he isn't going to get less than Kolb, not in a million years. He might even get more.

[Iamcanadian]

Originally Posted by twiz

Of course you do, but I feel it would be rather telling if Flynn's old coach has no interest in signing him, too.

Of course, you are right on, if Philbin isn't interested, it would speak volumes to me about Flynn's potential.

[FUNBUNCHER]

THe Cards were bidding against themselves for Kolb's services. Not a chance Flynn comes close to that contract after starting two games.

Just isn't going to happen and no one is going to offer FLynn a $64 mil deal.

[Shane P. Hallam]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

THe Cards were bidding against themselves for Kolb's services. Not a chance Flynn comes close to that contract after starting two games.

Just isn't going to happen and no one is going to offer FLynn a $64 mil deal.

Per year, Flynn will get as much if not more IMO.

[Iamcanadian]

Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam

Per year, Flynn will get as much if not more IMO.

I totally agree.

[descendency]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

Matt Flynn and his reps are in for a shock if they believe some team is going to sign him to an insane contract.

If he's offered more than a $40-45 mil deal over 5 years with $10-12 mil guaranteed, I'd be very surprised.

Whoever wants him can get him for a reasonable deal IMO, and if he doesn't work out you get rid of him without the heavy salary cap hit.

No one is going to do a Kolb deal again in the near future,(trading a #2 and DRC, signing Kolb to a five year, $64 mil deal with $21 mil guaranteed).

Matt Cassell was given 5 years 63 million, 28 guaranteed.

Flynn will get 5 years 6x million with 20+ guaranteed.

[Clarkw267]

I keep seeing people say that the Browns shouldn't give up #4 and #22 to get Griffin because they aren't just a QB away from winning.

What you are forgetting is that the QB is the hardest piece of the puzzle to get. So when you have the opportunity to get one that you feel is a franchise guy , you have to do it. There is always FA, and the 2nd-7th round of the draft to go out and fill those secondary needs, but you have to get the QB when you can, because who knows if you'll have the chance to do so next year.

[FUNBUNCHER]

How many teams are looking at FLynn as a possible starter in 2012??
I know the SKins won't give him a $60+ mil contract, $20 mil guaranteed.

So how many other teams look at Flynn as an upgrade over their incumbent starter??
I just don't see the market being that hot for Flynn.
Seahawks?? Broncos?? Phins?? SKins?? Maybe the Browns??

I'll believe it when I see it, but something tells me he gets offered significantly less money than either Cassel or Kolb.

Kolb's failure in Arizona is partly why I think teams will be more sober in how they approach Matt Flynn.