New York Giants Discussion

[LTgiants]

Giants signed DT Carlton Powell.
A fifth-round pick by the Broncos back in 2008, Powell will add practice depth with Shaun Rogers, Marvin Austin and Chris Canty sidelined.

[Giantsfan1080]

This is definitely the last year at Albany.

[BamaFalcon59]

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Giants signed DT Carlton Powell.
A fifth-round pick by the Broncos back in 2008, Powell will add practice depth with Shaun Rogers, Marvin Austin and Chris Canty sidelined.

NYG and VT becoming lovers.

[bigbluedefense]

I'm not really worried about our DT situation just yet. We don't really use our DTs all that much to begin with. And the ones we lost, big deal, they weren't going to see the field much if at all anyway, and would probably not even make the team to begin with.

Austin is a concern. But the loss of Rogers just frees up one of the young ponies in the stable to make the team. I'm not losing any sleep over it.

[Giantsfan1080]

I thought Rogers would do well for us but yeah I'm not that upset by it. If another guy goes down then I'll start to panic. Canty probably won't be back on time for the season so we need to make sure everyone else stays healthy between now and then.

[Giantsfan1080]

Good interview with Tuck in the NY Post today. He contemplated retiring last year. Man that would have sucked.

[Giantsfan1080]

The Build a Staff thread got me thinking about Waufle. Why did he leave again? He wasn't promoted to a D-Coordinator job and I don't think he had a falling out with Coughlin. Did Fewell object to having him on the staff? Anyone remember the circumstances?

[bigbluedefense]

The coaching staff felt that he got too close to the players, Osi in particular. He'd give Osi great grades on game performance even when he was playing bad, and that created a rift btw Osi and the coaches. That was the year Osi was demoted to situational pass rusher.

It's a shame, Wauffle is the best DL coach in the league. I wonder how great JPP would be under him.

[Giantsfan1080]

That's a shame. I don't remember that at all for some reason. I wish he were still here.

[bigbluedefense]

Yeah, I loved the guy. The players loved playing for him too. But apparently he stopped criticizing them bc he got so close to them.

He was a master at turning chicken **** into chicken salad at DT. Imagine what he'd do with Joseph.

[Giantsfan1080]

Yea with the talent he and JPP have and the support group in Tuck, Osi, Canty, and Kiwi, and then throw in Waufle as a coach and that would have been amazing. It's not like they haven't developed at a rapid pace though.

[bigbluedefense]

Yeah that's true. Let's not discredit Nunn either. Look at what Nunn is doing with Tracy so far, and Hendricks, JPP, and Joseph.

He's done a terrific job too. We actually have very good positional coaches. Great OL coach, best TE coach in the league, good RB coach, DL coach, Guinta is a great DB coach.

We have a solid coaching staff. And while we constantly kill Gilbride, there's no denying we're married to him now, this is the only offense Eli knows and we have to keep it as long as Eli is under center. Plus I think we're a little unfair with our criticism of Gilbride too. It's not always the OC's fault.

Fewell is still a turd though. He better adjust his scheme this year like he did in the playoffs.

[bigbluedefense]

I know this is gonna sound odd coming from me, but I realized that Xs and Os are somewhat overrated.

Players make plays. That's what it comes down to.

[Giantsfan1080]

The continuity we have with our staff under Coughlin has played a major part in our success.

I agree with you but scheme is still very important. Webster will be the poster child for me in that regard.

[bigbluedefense]

Well what I mean by scheme is overrated is that there isn't a right or wrong scheme per say (other than my disdain for Cover 2), but moreso theres a right or wrong fit btw scheme and players.

Ultimately as a defense, you have to be able to do a little bit of everything. You can't do the same thing over and over again. So you have to blitz, you have to rush 4, you have to play man and zone, you have to be able to do all of those things. The degree of each depends on the schemes and in my opinion, more importantly on what your players do best. You want to do what they do best more often than not, and that's more about coaching adjustments than it is scheme itself.

But even then, even if the fit isn't perfect, it still falls on the players. Youre never gonna get a perfect fit, some pieces will always be a little out of place. It's up to the players to adjust and make plays.

Look at CWeb. He adjusted. He can play zone just fine now. His issue was more confidence than scheme.

I have issues with scheme when they are blatantly misusing the talent on the field, and when the coaches overcomplicate things and confuse the players.

[Jughead10]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

I know this is gonna sound odd coming from me, but I realized that Xs and Os are somewhat overrated.

Players make plays. That's what it comes down to.

It really depends on the player. Someone like JPP is going to make plays in any scheme. He's a freak. But someone like Victor Cruz, could very well be a system player. He's a perfect fit for us.

[bigbluedefense]

Originally Posted by Jughead10

It really depends on the player. Someone like JPP is going to make plays in any scheme. He's a freak. But someone like Victor Cruz, could very well be a system player. He's a perfect fit for us.

This is true as well.

[Giantsfan1080]

Webster was nearly the same player when Sheridan was playing his zone that year.

[bigbluedefense]

The year Sheridan was our DC, Webster had a good year. The only time he got owned was when he played vs VJax.

Think about it, Fewell runs a ton of zone, why is Webster good under him? Web can play both. He's at his best when he's in man, yes, but he can play both.

[Giantsfan1080]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

The year Sheridan was our DC, Webster had a good year. The only time he got owned was when he played vs VJax.

Think about it, Fewell runs a ton of zone, why is Webster good under him? Web can play both. He's at his best when he's in man, yes, but he can play both.

He does play better in it now but he's not nearly the same player. Webster gets torched a lot more in the zone.

We signed another DT. Oren Wilson.

[bigbluedefense]

I honestly cant remember the last time Webster got burned.

[Giantsfan1080]

Lately never. Even that year isn't bad he's just not close to the same player as he is in man.

[BigBlueNorwegian]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Plus I think we're a little unfair with our criticism of Gilbride too. It's not always the OC's fault.

This. I am going to go out on a limb, and say that it's much easier for fans like me, relatively "dumb" guys when it comes to X's and O's, to appreciate Gilbride. To me, he looks like one of the best Offensive Coordinators in the league.

Sure, he has his obvious flaws, and you guys are very good at pointing them out. But when I read on the general forums, it seems like every team that doesn't have an offensive minded HC complains a lot about their OC. Gilbride surely has certain things he both can and need to improve on. But all in all, he's one of the best OC's in the league who isn't in immediate danger of jumping ship to become a HC soon. And that's more than satisfying enough for me.

[NY+Giants=NYG]

Originally Posted by BigBlueNorwegian

This. I am going to go out on a limb, and say that it's much easier for fans like me, relatively "dumb" guys when it comes to X's and O's, to appreciate Gilbride. To me, he looks like one of the best Offensive Coordinators in the league.

Sure, he has his obvious flaws, and you guys are very good at pointing them out. But when I read on the general forums, it seems like every team that doesn't have an offensive minded HC complains a lot about their OC. Gilbride surely has certain things he both can and need to improve on. But all in all, he's one of the best OC's in the league who isn't in immediate danger of jumping ship to become a HC soon. And that's more than satisfying enough for me.

Yeah his WR rules are based on the Run and Shoot philosophy. The over all system is a high risk/high reward system. This means that when the system, is executed perfect, we can move the ball on anyone and score a lot. However, if even one person makes a mistake, the system becomes problematic. We see this one in a while when Eli throws one way and the WR is going another, or doing god knows what else. That's when you see Eli stare, maybe even put his hands up, as if to say, hey dude, what are you doing?

I am actually a big fan of the Run and Shoot, Air C. and Air Raid, but this system does bother me at times. Sometimes I wish if Eli was in another system, he would be a lot better, in terms of stats he puts up.

But I agree, I been impressed with Gilbride and his decades of experience he brings with him. He is a BIG upgrade over Hufangel who I loathed. That had to be the worst hire TC made! A OC who had zero OC experience to call plays and work with a QB who was a rookie. It was a god awful mess! Not to mention going from Jim Fassel/ Sean Payton's offense to this offense.

I respect Gilbride a lot and his tenure here as increased my respect for him.

[Giantsfan1080]

Cablevision is getting NFL Network and Red Zone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!