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Old 10-02-2012, 02:44 AM    (permalink
Borat
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And with a simple touch, Alex Smith transfers all his Alexsmithiness to Christian Ponder.
Ponder: 16-of-26 passes for 111 yards Sunday against the Lions.
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Old 10-02-2012, 03:19 AM    (permalink
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Why aren't you going to get Alex Smith's jersey Borat?
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Old 10-02-2012, 06:36 AM    (permalink
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I don't understand this talk of not being able to win the Super Bowl with Smith's play. If Kyle Williams doesn't let that punt go off of his knee are we even having this conversation?
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Old 10-02-2012, 07:19 AM    (permalink
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I don't understand this talk of not being able to win the Super Bowl with Smith's play. If Kyle Williams doesn't let that punt go off of his knee are we even having this conversation?
I don't know. The way I look at it is that you can't just rely on the defense and special teams being perfect in big games all the time. I could say if the offense could pass the ball to a receiver or convert a third down in the crucial parts of the game are we even having this discussion? Turnovers are going to happen. Good offenses are still able to overcome those blunders as long as it doesn't happen every game throughout the season.

I'm trying to think back...has Alex ever had a game where he was dominant all four quarters? This isn't a bashing attempt. This just popped into my mind. Has he? I really can't remember. I suppose that Tampa Bay game last season, but he didn't really dominate.
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Old 10-02-2012, 07:36 AM    (permalink
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I don't know. The way I look at it is that you can't just rely on the defense and special teams being perfect in big games all the time. I could say if the offense could pass the ball to a receiver or convert a third down in the crucial parts of the game are we even having this discussion? Turnovers are going to happen. Good offenses are still able to overcome those blunders as long as it doesn't happen every game throughout the season.

I'm trying to think back...has Alex ever had a game where he was dominant all four quarters? This isn't a bashing attempt. This just popped into my mind. Has he? I really can't remember. I suppose that Tampa Bay game last season, but he didn't really dominate.
Turnovers are going to happen, true, but when is the last time you saw a punt returner fail to get out of the way of a punt he didn't field and let the ball go off of his knee? The special teams didn't need to be perfect, just fair catch that or get out of the way.

He hasn't really had many of them, true enough, but I mostly think that is because even before Harbaugh the coaching always wanted the offense to play not to lose. Nolan and Singletary played with a lead the same way that Harbaugh does. But Alex has had great games from start to finish. Off of the top of my head the game against St. Louis last year and against the Seahawks in 2010 pop into my mind first. He was also great against the Packers and Lions this year.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:55 AM    (permalink
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Turnovers are going to happen, true, but when is the last time you saw a punt returner fail to get out of the way of a punt he didn't field and let the ball go off of his knee? The special teams didn't need to be perfect, just fair catch that or get out of the way.
Well it doesn't really matter. Turnovers are turnovers and they will screw you over. But that is when you need to have the QB and offense to get you out of those situations. Especially in big games.
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:04 AM    (permalink
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Well it doesn't really matter. Turnovers are turnovers and they will screw you over. But that is when you need to have the QB and offense to get you out of those situations. Especially in big games.
It does matter. Alex did play good enough and put up enough points to win that game. The Giants defense played great in the postseason, no QB was able to put the team on their back and win the game against them. Ryan, Rodgers and Brady all failed and arguably did worse than Smith.

Those other QBs weren't let down by their special teams, though. The Patriots only turnover was a Brady interception, not to mention he gave the Giants two points with that safety. Rodgers did almost nothing. Ryan did nothing. Smith had his team in position to win the game if not for a freak turnover.
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:32 AM    (permalink
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It does matter. Alex did play good enough and put up enough points to win that game. The Giants defense played great in the postseason, no QB was able to put the team on their back and win the game against them. Ryan, Rodgers and Brady all failed and arguably did worse than Smith.

Those other QBs weren't let down by their special teams, though. The Patriots only turnover was a Brady interception, not to mention he gave the Giants two points with that safety. Rodgers did almost nothing. Ryan did nothing. Smith had his team in position to win the game if not for a freak turnover.
Rodgers and Brady have won Super Bowls. So they've already proven themselves and carried their teams on their back.

Again, turnovers happen. You have to have an offense that is still able to score late in the game to overcome those mistakes. The 49ers offense has much to blame as the special teams for not being able to move the ball. Doesn't matter what defense they were playing against. That is when an offense is supposed to rise up regardless of the challenge. That is the difference between legend and non-legend.
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:34 AM    (permalink
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So, what you are saying that even though Smith played as well and scored as many points as unquestionably great quarterbacks he should have done more? I think maybe your expectations are too high. Smith isn't Joe Montana or Steve Young. He might not even be Jeff Garcia. He isn't a great QB. He is a good QB who can, and did, do enough to get his team to the Super Bowl if someone else on the team doesn't make a terrible mistake
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:16 PM    (permalink
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So, what you are saying that even though Smith played as well and scored as many points as unquestionably great quarterbacks he should have done more? I think maybe your expectations are too high. Smith isn't Joe Montana or Steve Young. He might not even be Jeff Garcia. He isn't a great QB. He is a good QB who can, and did, do enough to get his team to the Super Bowl if someone else on the team doesn't make a terrible mistake
Well this is what I was saying earlier about Smith have maybe already reached his ceiling. If that's the case it's going to be hard to win the Super Bowl. Usually the top quarterbacks, the guys that don't need an elite defense to help them out on offense, are the ones lifting the Lombardi up in February. Who was the last "meh" quarterback to win a championship? I think it was Brad Johnson riding that 2002 Buccaneers defense. Even he had a good season that year though.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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No, I did see Brees win a Super Bowl in 2010 though.

Brees has Graham. Alex has Vernon who can take short passes and turn them into long gains. What is your point? God-forbid good quarterbacks having playmakers. Brees has also been productive before Graham was around and after he had left the Chargers with Gates there.

Let's not forget that due to the Saints and their garbage defense, Brees is having to play catch up in every game now. Not surprising that he is committing more turnovers than usual trying to carry his team.

And no, the Saints don't have the same offensive philosophy as we do. The Saints are also a much better offense than San Francisco because of their philosophy.
Did that better offense win when it mattered though? As recall, we outplayed the 'better' offense when it was all said and done. We don't win games the same way the Saints do. I'm not trying to be the Saints offensively. And if your waiting for Jimbaugh to turn into Sean Peyton, don't hold your breath. We will never be a pass-first, spread-type of offense as long as Jimbaugh is coaching the Niners. All those visions of a high-powered passing offense you and others have in your head for this team will never happened. Might as well kill that dream now.

Jimbaugh has stated NUMEROUS times his perfect offense is 50/50, pass/run. That what he envisions, that's what he's trying to build. I refer to it as Steelers West. The same way the Steelers built those teams that had them in 3 Super Bowls in a 5 year span a couple of years back, that's what Jimbaugh and Baalke are trying to establish. Dominant run game. Dominant defense. Good passing attack. Except we're still working on the good passing attack aspect. My beef with the offense is not that I want us to pass downfield more. It's that I want us to execute better when we do pass. Giving up pressure, conservative play calling in some instances, dropped balls, overthrows to open WRs, all of those are why the passing game is struggling. It has nothing to do with not taking enough shots downfield or utilizing Moss enough. If we tighten up those areas I mentioned, no one is talking about us not throwing the ball downfield enough because the offense is converting 3rd downs, moving the chains and capitalizing on big gains through the air when the opportunities present themselves.

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Old 10-02-2012, 02:09 PM    (permalink
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Well this is what I was saying earlier about Smith have maybe already reached his ceiling. If that's the case it's going to be hard to win the Super Bowl. Usually the top quarterbacks, the guys that don't need an elite defense to help them out on offense, are the ones lifting the Lombardi up in February. Who was the last "meh" quarterback to win a championship? I think it was Brad Johnson riding that 2002 Buccaneers defense. Even he had a good season that year though.
I don't think Smith is only "meh," though. He is a borderline top 10 QB right now and I think he can improve even more. He is never going to be a top 3-5 QB but a top eight QB is not out of the question, and that is more than we need to win a Super Bowl
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Old 10-02-2012, 03:40 PM    (permalink
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Anthony Davis has looked very good so far. I am happy to see this.
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Old 10-02-2012, 03:56 PM    (permalink
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I am very surprised at how good the right side has looked in general. Boone is really impressing me
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Old 10-02-2012, 06:03 PM    (permalink
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I think everyone needs to calm down about the Offense. Alex is all we got, and even if the O is going to improve it's going to take some time. First two games, A+, last two C-. I'm hoping the first two games are more indicative of where it's gonna be at.
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:24 PM    (permalink
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If we had a passing offense, those two fumbles by Kyle Williams wouldnt have mattered because we would have blown out the Giants.

I agree with Ness because Harbaugh and company cant keep depending on the running game, defense and special teams. We're eventually going to need a passing attack (hell, we needed it last week in MIN) in order to win some games and without that, there will be games that we wont win even though we should (see Vikings game).

The passing game is the ONLY major flaw we have on our team. Just imagine if we could actually have a passing game thats a threat to opposing defenses?

Smith is a top 15 QB but not top 10 let alone top 8 and here's why - if he was that good, Harbaugh would actually let him pass more instead of playing power run ball. Sorry but watching that and the play-calling sometimes feels like Nolan and Singletary are still here.

Every game is the same - run, get a lead, play good defense and special teams but dont go for the dagger and just try to hold on for the win. What if we didnt get any turnovers? We scored 10 points off four turnovers in the win over the Jets. Eventually, the defense isnt going to get any turnovers and thus, wont score any points off of them.

Then what? Our passing offense will need to win games for us. Eventually, like the NFCCG, thats what its going to come down too and we wont win because our passing attack is pretty much non-existent.

Cant keep depending on our running game, defense and special teams. The passing game has to do its fair share and score some damn points. And no, 10 isnt exactly what I had in mind.
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:37 PM    (permalink
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Man CK deep to Randy Moss looked pretty good into triple coverage. I say start him in Buffalo and see what he can do throwing deep. He has a better arm then Smith as well as better legs. Could be the next Steve Young....

I was shocked to see Kap get more playing time this game even with game more of a blow out.I thought it was cool and interesting to watch.I would like to see him start towards the end of season if had the NFC west locked down. I was still disappointing that Smith didn't bomb is down field instead of CK . So it tells me that JH doesn't trust his deep ball passing .. Why would that be ?
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:45 PM    (permalink
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Man CK deep to Randy Moss looked pretty good into triple coverage. I say start him in Buffalo and see what he can do throwing deep. He has a better arm then Smith as well as better legs. Could be the next Steve Young....
what? the fluck?
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:48 PM    (permalink
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Yeah im a bit confused as well haha
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:54 PM    (permalink
49erNation85
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I'm just saying Colin Kap had a better deep ball then Smith. And like we should start him one game this season . Too hard to ask for ?
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:05 PM    (permalink
VAfy-ya
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Originally Posted by 49erNation85 View Post
I'm just saying Colin Kap had a better deep ball then Smith. And like we should start him one game this season . Too hard to ask for ?
Are you high? That was one of the worst throws I've ever seen from him. You want to start him one game based off of that?
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:22 PM    (permalink
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CK underthrew a triple covered Moss. We should definitely start him. On a more serious note,

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If we had a passing offense, those two fumbles by Kyle Williams wouldnt have mattered because we would have blown out the Giants.
Did you not watch the Giants defense during their last six games last year? Smith outplayed most of the quarterbacks they went up against. With his receivers being Michael Crabtree, Kyle Williams and Brett Swain Alex put up 17 points.

Romo was throwing to Miles Austin, Dez Bryant and Laurent Robinson--the Cowboys scored 14 points. Ryan was throwing to Roddy White and Julio Jones--the Falcons scored zero points. Rodgers was throwing to Jordy Nelson, Greg Jennings, Donald Driver, James Jones and Randall Cobb--the Packers scored 20 points, seven of those being a garbage time touchdown. Brady was throwing to Wes Welker and Deion Branch--the Patriots scored 17 points.

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Smith is a top 15 QB but not top 10 let alone top 8 and here's why - if he was that good, Harbaugh would actually let him pass more instead of playing power run ball. Sorry but watching that and the play-calling sometimes feels like Nolan and Singletary are still here.
Not necessarily true. Harbaugh had Andrew Luck at Stanford and they still ran the ball over 55% of the time. That was actually higher than the percentage the 49ers ran the ball last year.

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Every game is the same - run, get a lead, play good defense and special teams but dont go for the dagger and just try to hold on for the win. What if we didnt get any turnovers? We scored 10 points off four turnovers in the win over the Jets. Eventually, the defense isnt going to get any turnovers and thus, wont score any points off of them.
We had no problem dominating the Packers and Lions without forcing turnovers this year. The defense forced no turnovers against the Giants in the NFCCG and we still would have won if not for Williams' knee.

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Old 10-02-2012, 10:54 PM    (permalink
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Holy jeebus. I guess I should get started on the next gameday thread asap. This last page has been fairly embarrassing.
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Old 10-03-2012, 12:02 AM    (permalink
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Holy jeebus. I guess I should get started on the next gameday thread asap. This last page has been fairly embarrassing.
Yes please.
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Old 10-03-2012, 06:57 AM    (permalink
abaddon41_80
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Holy jeebus. I guess I should get started on the next gameday thread asap. This last page has been fairly embarrassing.
Make sure you put something about Kaep being the starter because he threw a deep ball to a triple-covered Moss that wasn't even completed
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