New York Giants Discussion

[Giantsfan1080]

Sounds like Nicks, Rivers, Barden should all be back this week. Hopefully Hosley as well. Bennet and Blackburn are added to the injury report also this week. Very excited for this game.

[scottyboy]

we need rivers to help cover Vernon and Hosley playing the slot. the niners are all about the short stuff, so we need them to patrol the middle. I'm terrified of Gore and Co running wild on us though

[bigbluedefense]

Hopefully Chase being hurt makes way for Herzlich to start, and hopefully he never gives up the job after that.

We need to bench Chase.

[scottyboy]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Hopefully Chase being hurt makes way for Herzlich to start, and hopefully he never gives up the job after that.

We need to bench Chase.

the only thing I'll say it this: I trust out coaching staff more than anyone's opinions here. If they are starting Chase over Herz, it's for a reason. A reason I trust in them for.

[bigbluedefense]

That's fair. I won't argue that.

I do know this: Chase hasn't done anything worthy of keeping the job. So if he is in fact our best option, then that tells me we have dogshit at MIKE on our team and we need to address the position in the draft.

[Giantsfan1080]

I'd like to see Herz out there more. I'm not sure why they've been hesitant to make the switch. Chase hasn't been THAT awful though.

[bigbluedefense]

He's been pretty awful. The tackle numbers don't even do him justice, bc when he does make a tackle, 90% of the time it's 6 yards past the LOS.

[Giantsfan1080]

I disagree a little on that. He's been just as good as last year.

[bigbluedefense]

I guess it's more noticeable now bc the front 4 and the guys behind him aren't making as many plays, so his mediocrity is more pronounced.

I could be guilty of looking past the players around him. But still, as the MIKE, there are certain things you should be able to do play in and play out. And he just can't do it.

I love Chase. One of my favorite Giants of all time. But it's time. It's time to give someone else a shot.

[Giantsfan1080]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

I guess it's more noticeable now bc the front 4 and the guys behind him aren't making as many plays, so his mediocrity is more pronounced.

I could be guilty of looking past the players around him. But still, as the MIKE, there are certain things you should be able to do play in and play out. And he just can't do it.

I love Chase. One of my favorite Giants of all time. But it's time. It's time to give someone else a shot.

Yes exactly. We're just realizing for Chase to be good in this D is highly dependent on the DL and Secondary. I'm all for giving Herz a shot at this point. As I said I'm not sure why he hasn't been given an opportunity yet.

[Giantsfan1080]

I'm happy with this because it sounds like a lot of the DNP will be going at least tomorrow or Friday.

@Giants: WR Ramses Barden, CB Jayron Hosley, LB Keith Rivers and Safety Antrel Rolle practiced full today

TE Bennett, DT Bernard, LB Blackburn, RB Brown, WR Nicks, S Phillips & CB Webster did not practice today. Boley & Diehl were limited

[OSUGiants17]

Hopefully we get Nicks and Phillips back. KP would be huge since we need him to take out Davis, he shuts down the deep 3rd and without him there Davis will tear us up. I trust Webster and Prince to limit Manningham and Crabtree and Hosley being back would be nice too, but if we can't at least limit Davis we are screwed. Nicks isn't that key as I trust Cruz to do the same thing he did to Carlos Rogers in the playoffs and dominate him with the option route all game, and I see Randle having another solid outing, but having Nicks back(as long as he is actually healthy and not just a decoy) can only help. We also NEED our front 4 to finally step it up, we can easily keep this game close and make it a winnable game if we put pressure on Smith, but if we give him time to settle in the pocket he will pick our depleted secondary apart. Just my thoughts on Sunday's game

[Giantsfan1080]

No way KP is back this game.

[Forenci]

Originally Posted by scottyboy

the only thing I'll say it this: I trust out coaching staff more than anyone's opinions here. If they are starting Chase over Herz, it's for a reason. A reason I trust in them for.

Maybe. Some coaches are always very reluctant to bench a veteran player for a younger guy. I feel like Coughlin falls in that category.

[Giantsfan1080]

If Diehl gets his job back I'll be pissed.

[Forenci]

Originally Posted by Giantsfan1080

If Diehl gets his job back I'll be pissed.

We've seen it countless times. Guys come back from injury even after getting out performed and they get their job back. Coughlin likes veterans. And I'm not insulting his record on developing rookies, but we ALL know he basically refuses to start a rookie, even if they're the better player.

[Giantsfan1080]

I know but in certain cases it's rubbish. Diehl is one of the more underrated Giants but he doesn't deserve his job back at this point. I did defend him all of last year also so it's not like I've been calling for his head for a long time.

[Forenci]

I agree with you. It bothers me too. My only two gripes I've ever had with Coughlin is his favoritism toward veteran players over young players and his inability to hire great a good coordinator.

Other than that, I love him.

[scottyboy]

i think he'll replace Locklear which would be fine. it's not like we've been world beaters without him. The Eagles pressured Eli CONSTANTLY and Bradshaw's 200 yard game was against the browns

[BaLLiN]

Cleveland has a good run D, or at least i thought. I just don't get it, but we randomly play well and i think our team is very driven by being down and way to used to playing to their competition.

That said looking at the 49er's depth is just ridiculous. On offense they have a whole lot of talent, but at WR it just isn't elite so it does not bother me that much. TE's are obviously a big problem if we don't have Rivers and Phillips, but even if we do we need Fewell not to put an obvious mismatch with a LB and vernon davis. Runningbacks are great for them, but Gore isn't as great as he used to be and I fear Hunter moreso. Our defense isn't read IMO, but we'll see.

Regarding their defense, I do not see why we don't go 5 wide. Seriously. Their DB's aren't that great and if we go 4 or 5 wide that means they have to take two of those phenomenal linebackers out of the game (probably Smith and Bowman) which plays in our favor. Goldson is the only DB besides Rodgers and maybe Culliver because of him being on WR3 who would possibly challenge our receivers.

I figure they have to rely on Rodgers with occasional help on Cruz, and then Brown on Nicks with double coverage if he's healthy. That means that we have at least 2 1 on 1's which are likely Randle and Hixon or Barden. And Hixon and Randle have been making consistent plays on 1 on 1 isolation routes. If it were any game to exclusively spread out a team, this is the game.

Cruz- Rodgers
Nicks- Brown and safety
Hixon- Culliver
Barden- Cox
Randle- Spillman/safety depending on personnel

I realize it isn't ideal and that this isn't exactly how they'd match up, but anything to get Aldon Smith and/or Bowman off the field is good for us. Those two are playing way too well to let them play the majority of the snaps.

[D-Unit]

Originally Posted by Forenci

Yeah he's been doing well, it just hasn't resulted in sacks because they essentially just double/triple team him because A) we don't know how to blitz properly and free him up, B) Osi, Tuck, and everyone else along the D-Line has been terrible at getting pressure.

That's essentially been Ware's whole career, so that doesn't cut it for me. Something is up with him. That's a horrendous drop off from last year with the same personnel. I hope he shakes out of it for the sake of my fantasy team, that's for sure. LOL.

[Giantsfan1080]

Sacks comes in bunches. He'll have his numbers by the end of the year.

[Giantsfan1080]

Originally Posted by BaLLiN

Cleveland has a good run D, or at least i thought. I just don't get it, but we randomly play well and i think our team is very driven by being down and way to used to playing to their competition.

That said looking at the 49er's depth is just ridiculous. On offense they have a whole lot of talent, but at WR it just isn't elite so it does not bother me that much. TE's are obviously a big problem if we don't have Rivers and Phillips, but even if we do we need Fewell not to put an obvious mismatch with a LB and vernon davis. Runningbacks are great for them, but Gore isn't as great as he used to be and I fear Hunter moreso. Our defense isn't read IMO, but we'll see.

Regarding their defense, I do not see why we don't go 5 wide. Seriously. Their DB's aren't that great and if we go 4 or 5 wide that means they have to take two of those phenomenal linebackers out of the game (probably Smith and Bowman) which plays in our favor. Goldson is the only DB besides Rodgers and maybe Culliver because of him being on WR3 who would possibly challenge our receivers.

I figure they have to rely on Rodgers with occasional help on Cruz, and then Brown on Nicks with double coverage if he's healthy. That means that we have at least 2 1 on 1's which are likely Randle and Hixon or Barden. And Hixon and Randle have been making consistent plays on 1 on 1 isolation routes. If it were any game to exclusively spread out a team, this is the game.

Cruz- Rodgers
Nicks- Brown and safety
Hixon- Culliver
Barden- Cox
Randle- Spillman/safety depending on personnel

I realize it isn't ideal and that this isn't exactly how they'd match up, but anything to get Aldon Smith and/or Bowman off the field is good for us. Those two are playing way too well to let them play the majority of the snaps.

Very good post and something I'd like to see. The 49'ers are having trouble with their pass rush this year also compared to last year. I'm wondering if it's not just us for whatever reason.

[bigbluedefense]

We won't do that. Their 5 DL vs our 5 OL 1 on 1 is a disaster.

Plus, they won't take Bow and Willis off the field. They run their nickel with zone coverage vs any front because those 2 are so fast they can cover the middle of hte field by themselves.

Look at what they did to the Packers. They'll do the same to our 5 WR set.

[BamaFalcon59]

Yeah, doesn't work as well in practicality when the LBs all run sub-4.7.