Aldon Smith or Von Miller?

[Ness]

Originally Posted by Jvig43

Yes we are trolling him.... jesus christ he isnt this poor 9er fan being picked on here. The trolling started when he made this comment

in the ******* Smith/Miller thread. Yes it is no longer Ness perpetuating the issue, when five posts in he leaves a comment like this which he only knows too well is going to get a rise out of every non homer fan on this board.

Yes, after that comment people started trolling him and it is absolutely 100% his fault. I'm sorry to the majority of the 9er fans on here who have to watch this stupid **** happen in any discussion of a 9er player because Ness and a couple other posters make ridiculous outlandish homer comments about every player on your team- but its exactly like the packers a couple years ago at this point. As NJX said, its almost identical to that situation where a few posters acted ridiculous to their teams success causing everyone to want to see that team crash and burn. If we were all just here trolling Ness for no reason you would have a point, but if hes going to continue to make stupid posts like that where he knows the types of responses hes going to get then don't be upset when the rest of us torch his ass for it.

My $0.02 as a Pats fan.

Seriously bro? You think I have an agenda so focused on getting a rise of the people here on this forum? Really? If I hadn't used the exact reference and still said I don't believe Aldon Smith isn't not on the same level of Von Miller, I would be "in the clear" as far as the SWDC clique is concerned? Please. You really need to get over yourself if you actually think I'm trying this bait game you're implying. I was simply referencing another subject. Who gives a **** if it had to do with Gronkowski and Davis. Why does something so mundane and something that wasn't even a personal comment towards someone specific, but used merely for reference bother you so much? Because you believe it's a homer comment? And that ticks you off? Wow.

Oh and it's not like that was the only time that having a different opinion that went against the masses has drawn the ire of obnoxious comments that are uncalled for and have nothing to do with me having a different opinion and rather take issue with the poster instead of the post. Yeah I'm really bringing this on myself. I really forced you to respond to my comment and only focus on the most non-important part of my post which was the Davis/Grownkowski deal you believe was some sort of purposely inserted message board tactic. Oh and I'm definitely the only person here who leaves comments that can be deemed "homerish". Yeah, I really "brought" the argument back up from the other thread in such a conniving manner.

The point was I believe Smith as a player was probably closer to Miller than other people might think. Just because I referenced another thread in which I believe the same logic exists doesn't mean I was also in part trying to start something. If you get ticked off because of some stupid **** like that then it's your own damn fault. No one here is being targeted.

Stop it with this phantom agenda garbage. Here I'll go edit it so no one else's feelings will get hurt.

[cmarq83]

Originally Posted by phlysac

But I digress, because it's obvious that Davis, Gronkowski, Miller, and Smith are all ridiculously good and it's not worth it to get into shouting matches.

I don't disagree. I think the point boils down in each of these cases the use of the term "not even close". For me there are substantial football reasons that differentiate the 2 former players from the 2 latter players. I think Miller and Gronkowski do everything that Smith and Davis do, but have more apparent strengths in substantial areas of the game that make them more versatile and better all around players. In this case there isn't really a reason why I'd rather have Davis or Smith over Gronkowski or Miller so hence the term "it's not even close". When I think of close I'd think of like Trent Cole vs. Mario Williams where each of the guys give you the same things when they're on the field. It's not an indictment on either Smith or Davis, but Miller and Gronk are 2 of the 15 best football players in the league right now. I don't think it's fair to try and hold Davis and Smith to that standard. They may have a game here or there where they stand out, but Gronk and Miller are the best players on the field whenever they step out there.

The 49ers have a ton of talent, but realistically if everyone was as good as certain fans thought they were they'd be a juggernaut instead of just a really good team.

[Ness]

Originally Posted by cmarq83

I don't disagree. I think the point boils down in each of these cases the use of the term "not even close". For me there are substantial football reasons that differentiate the 2 former players from the 2 latter players. I think Miller and Gronkowski do everything that Smith and Davis do, but have more apparent strengths in substantial areas of the game that make them more versatile and better all around players. In this case there isn't really a reason why I'd rather have Davis or Smith over Gronkowski or Miller so hence the term "it's not even close". When I think of close I'd think of like Trent Cole vs. Mario Williams where each of the guys give you the same things when they're on the field. It's not an indictment on either Smith or Davis, but Miller and Gronk are 2 of the 15 best football players in the league right now. I don't think it's fair to try and hold Davis and Smith to that standard. They may have a game here or there where they stand out, but Gronk and Miller are the best players on the field whenever they step out there.

Well the terms are going to be different for everyone of course. And it depends on the player. For me "not even close" means that the player that is supposedly "inferior" could almost never look better on any game day than the "superior player". I don't see that as the case with Miller and Smith. From that times I've seen Miller play I haven't thought he was head and shoulders above Smith. There probably wouldn't be a reason why I'd rather have Sterling Sharpe over Jerry Rice in their prime, but at the same time I wouldn't say "it's not even close" between the two either. But it is what it is. To each their own.

[jth1331]

Originally Posted by Ness

Well the terms are going to be different for everyone of course. And it depends on the player. For me "not even close" means that the player that is supposedly "inferior" could almost never look better on any game day than the "superior player". I don't see that as the case with Miller and Smith. From that times I've seen Miller play I haven't thought he was head and shoulders above Smith. There probably wouldn't be a reason why I'd rather have Sterling Sharpe over Jerry Rice in their prime, but at the same time I wouldn't say "it's not even close" between the two either. But it is what it is. To each their own.

You're a 49ers fan, of course you have the viewpoint Smith is on par with Miller.
Watching Miller is a thing of beauty. Like ******* poetry out there on the football field. Oh how sweet it is, like he should be forced to play with a 10 pound bowling ball on his back because he is so good.

[fenikz]

are there really 11 49ers fans on this board?

[FUNBUNCHER]

Both these guys have HOF upside.
I don't think fans of either team feel sorry for themselves because they don't have either Aldon Smith/Von Miller.

[D-Unit]

Does 5 sacks against Gabe Carimi to get to the stiff that is Jason Campbell even count as sacks?

[njx9]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

Both these guys have HOF upside.
I don't think fans of either team feel sorry for themselves because they don't have either Aldon Smith/Von Miller.

not even a little bit. though i don't think aldon smith would've been this successful in denver. our defense needs von to help stop the run.

[phlysac]

Originally Posted by D-Unit

Does 5 sacks against Gabe Carimi to get to the stiff that is Jason Campbell even count as sacks?

Probably not. His 10 other sacks this season shouldn't really count, either.

How many sacks did favored NFL DPOY J.J. Watt get against the same guys, just last week?

[Ness]

Originally Posted by jth1331

You're a 49ers fan, of course you have the viewpoint Smith is on par with Miller.

Of course. Everyone who watches a player on their team can't be objective at all...right?

You should have seen all of my cheering for the likes of Kentwan Balmer or Kevan Barlow back in the day. I mean they were 49ers too.

[J-Mike88]

Why's everyone so mad in this thread? Chill.

I came here to throw up a poll that axed:

If we were starting new franchises and you had a chance to start your defense with either of these 5 guys (and had yet to determine what D scheme you'd run, 3-4, 4-3, or who your DC would be), how would your draft board look #1-5 among these guys:

• Aldon Smith
• Von Miller
• Jason Pierre-Paul
• JJ Watt
• Ndamukong Suh

[J-Mike88]

I got it:

1. Watt
2. Pierre-Paul
3. V Miller
4. Suh
5. A Smith

[vidae]

1. JJ Watt
2. Von Miller
3. Aldon Smith
4. Jason Pierre-Paul
5. Ndamakong Suh

[njx9]

1. clay matthews

102. von miller
103. jj watt
104. aldon smith
105. whatever

[scottyboy]

Originally Posted by njx9

1. clay matthews

102. von miller
103. jj watt
104. aldon smith
105. whatever

you forgot Juice Williams. HE'D KNOW WHAT THE QUARTERBACK WOULD BE THINKING. Like a god damn mind reader

[njx9]

is juice williams even still a person?

[scottyboy]

Originally Posted by njx9

is juice williams even still a person?

was he ever?

[cmarq83]

My choice:

1) Miller
2) Watt
3) JPP
4) Suh
5) Smith

I think Smith is a better player than Suh now, but I still think if you put Suh in a read and react scheme like he played at Nebraska he'd be a beast again.

[Rosebud]

Miller
Watt
JPP
Smith


Suh - Cause he's the worst of the group by a large margin.

[TACKLE]

lol suh over ngata. silly j-mike.

[The Great Jonathan Vilma]

I don't get the pleasure of watching either of these two enough, so i'm not going to act like i've seen every game of their seasons, but based on my viewing i would prefer to take Von at this point in time. Don't get me wrong, i'd kill for the Jets to have either player (or a OLB with half their talent), but putting them in a bubble and choosing between the two I have to go with Von. He always seems to grab my attention. Watching the 49ers I find myself noticing Bowman or Justin Smith or X other guys constantly. I can only figure that with all the talent around him that offenses must have a harder time focusing on Smith than they do when playing Von and the Broncos...and he still consistently gets it done.

[YAYareaRB]

i love um both.. **** the poll (waaaait uhhhh)

[elway=goat]

I hated the Von Miller pick initially.. boy was I wrong. You can make the argument, that not only is he the most complete linebacker in football. But the best defensive player as well. I have gotten to watch a good amout of both teams and players. Smith appears to me, to be a pure pass rusher. Miller can rush the passer just as well, but is much more dominate in the run game as well.

[phlysac]

I'm not disagreeing that Miller has shown to be more impactful in the run game. My question, since I've only seen 3-ish Broncos games this season, is what makes Miller "dominant" against the run, while Smith is just a "pass rusher."?

Remembering that the "additional talent" argument often used to discredit Smith, can also be theorized to benefit Miller, at times. It's a give-and-take.

[Ness]

Since Aldon has been given the chance in his extended role this season as a full time starter, he's been pretty good against the run. Teams are necessarily attacking him assuming he's a liability in that department.