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Old 12-05-2012, 02:10 PM    (permalink
MI_Buckeye
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Originally Posted by CheeseKnuckles View Post
I am just wondering why Ertz is picked ahead of Eiefert? Reasoning?
He has been better this year. Eifert has had some big-time clunkers this season, and I question his ability in the run game.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:11 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by killxswitch View Post
Barkley is not going to drop to the ****ing second round.
It can happen. It really can.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:14 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Trogdor View Post


Universal reaction from Cowboy's fans.


Defensive line has immense depth. We already have young guys forcing more playing time (Lissemore, Brent, Crawford, and Bass) and most likely they will force Coleman and Spears off the roster next season. If we go defensive line it'll be later in the draft on a project.

Second pick. Jason Witten is top 5 in receptions this year and has never relied on elite physical tools to get open and play his role so he isn't slowing down quite yet. We drafted Hannah to develop into the role last year and still have Phillips on the roster as a TE/H-back. No need for a TE at all even though this would be crazy value given that I think he goes round 1.


Our needs are as follows:
RT: Doug Free is getting released and unless Parnell plays out of his mind we'll need one in the first two rounds.

Interior line: We need at least one starter and probably two to change from being one of the worst lines into one of the better lines. Provided we draft a RT high this need can be masked a bit.

Safety: We have a talent void at safety and the injury bug showed everyone how terrible our reserves are. If a playmaker is available it would fill a need on this team that has stretched for years.

SOLB: If Anthony Spencer, currently franchised, isn't resigned we'll have a massive hole at SOLB. Wilber is not ready for the starting role and when Spencer isn't on the field our defense suffers.
Those ends are all average, and if there's a guy of good value at 11, he instantly upgrades your rotation.

All of the other positions you have listed offer little value at 11 overall.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:18 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Pat Sims 90 View Post
1st Round is good for the Bengals. 2nd Round is bad.
I like Montgomery too.

As for Austin and Bell; Austin is so dynamic and versatile I can't see him slipping much further. The Bengals may have bigger needs, but the value brings to the return game and offense would instantly make this team much more explosive.

Bell, IMO, is the best short-yardage back in the draft and would offer an excellent complement to BJGE.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:36 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by MI_Buckeye View Post
I know S is not a position of immediate concern, but I put together this mock under the assumption that Reed plays one more season, as he has hinted he might not be playing much longer. If Reed's situation changes, that obviously diminishes the need for S.

I could have gone with Ogletree or Mosley here, but I am just not sure about either one of them as a first rounder. The other positions you listed don't have a talent like Elam available at your point in the draft, and I know Ozzie never reaches. Under these circumstances, I could see the Ravens getting out of the first round for the second year in a row.
If Reed comes back for only one more season then I could see S as a good pick in the first round but I don't think he re-signs for that short of a deal (he's a free agent after this season) and I don't believe that he won't start as long as he's in a Ravens uniform. Like I said it's a tricky situation and I certainly understand why people have been mocking him and others at the position to the Ravens.

I'm in on Mosley as a pick in the first round. Ogletree not so much, at least for the Ravens. I don't like him at all inside even though what they're really missing there is coverage ability and Ogletree would do a lot in that regard. I think Arthur Brown could translate to that position well though, from what I've seen he has the instincts to play inside despite his size. At WR Justin Hunter would probably be a really nice fit on the team even if Cameron gets fired (hope so but probably not).
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by MI_Buckeye View Post
I was thinking possibly the same thing, but in the end, I think passing on a potential franchise defender for Tyler Wilson would be a big mistake.

In this scenario, they could sign a veteran stopgap, such as Matt Moore, while they have Dysert develop and wait. Think back to the 2011 draft when both the Bengals and Niners needed a QB and passed in the first round, only to get better value in the second. It's working out well for both of them.
That only works if you think Dysert is as quality as Kaep and Dalton.

The Chiefs can't keep ignoring QBs when they're picking high. They've done that for three decades and we haven't been relevant in that time. Those are connected.
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:08 PM    (permalink
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No way the Bears pick that high but Warmack is a perfect fit. In the 2nd we would take Ogletree
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:12 PM    (permalink
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What's with everyone mocking the one position the Jets are guaranteed NOT to draft 1st round next year? Holmes has too much guaranteed money to be let go, he is going to be back next year, and the year after most likely. Kerley is a solid slot receiver and will be in his 3rd year and also not going anywhere for 2 years. Stephen Hill is a work in progress, no one expected him to come out and be a solid #2 WR year one, he is a raw talent, which means he is also going to be given time to progress.

Are the Jets converting to some air raid offense next season where they need 4+ stud WRs? I just don't get it. Put some thought into your mocks, please.
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:36 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by MI_Buckeye View Post
I like Montgomery too.

As for Austin and Bell; Austin is so dynamic and versatile I can't see him slipping much further. The Bengals may have bigger needs, but the value brings to the return game and offense would instantly make this team much more explosive.

Bell, IMO, is the best short-yardage back in the draft and would offer an excellent complement to BJGE.
The Bengals already have a short slot receiver in Andrew Hawkins and they just draft Sanu and Jones last year and it is not worth taking a ST Player in the 2nd round.

The Bengals don't need a short yardage back that what BJGE is. They need a explosive back that actually run to the outside.
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:38 PM    (permalink
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not gonna get too into prospect rankings, but I like the TE pick in the first. Not a huge fan of the OG pick with Konz and Blalock there, but I never argue against bringing in talented offensive linemen.
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Old 12-05-2012, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Robcards View Post
What's with everyone mocking the one position the Jets are guaranteed NOT to draft 1st round next year? Holmes has too much guaranteed money to be let go, he is going to be back next year, and the year after most likely. Kerley is a solid slot receiver and will be in his 3rd year and also not going anywhere for 2 years. Stephen Hill is a work in progress, no one expected him to come out and be a solid #2 WR year one, he is a raw talent, which means he is also going to be given time to progress.

Are the Jets converting to some air raid offense next season where they need 4+ stud WRs? I just don't get it. Put some thought into your mocks, please.
How long do you really think Holmes is going to be around?

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Old 12-05-2012, 04:24 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by scar988 View Post
not gonna get too into prospect rankings, but I like the TE pick in the first. Not a huge fan of the OG pick with Konz and Blalock there, but I never argue against bringing in talented offensive linemen.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Konz drafted to replace McClure at C when he retires?
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Old 12-05-2012, 04:32 PM    (permalink
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He has been better this year. Eifert has had some big-time clunkers this season, and I question his ability in the run game.
this just flat out isnt true
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Old 12-05-2012, 04:42 PM    (permalink
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this just flat out isnt true
Look at both of their numbers this year. Ertz has been far more productive, and Eifert has disappeared against the best defenses ND has played.
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Old 12-05-2012, 05:01 PM    (permalink
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Look at both of their numbers this year. Ertz has been far more productive, and Eifert has disappeared against the best defenses ND has played.
the offense changed, he did a lot more inline blocking this year but about every time ND needed a big play he was the #1 guy and that way became the leading receiver, ertz was playing a virtual wideout by comparison.

eifert had a waaaaaaaay better season this year than last year
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Old 12-05-2012, 05:26 PM    (permalink
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How long do you really think Holmes is going to be around?
At least 2 years due to his contract. I already said as much. They could maybe cut ties with him before the roster bonus in Spring 2014 kicks in, but if they do then they'll draft a WR in the 1st round in 2014, not 2013.

And just to be clear, because of the large amount of money Holmes is guaranteed and how backloaded the contract is, it is such that if the Jets cut him in 2013 the penalty against the cap would be larger than keeping him on the team. At least that was the case this year, I'm pretty sure even if it isn't next year the penalty is still substantial enough to where they can't reasonably cut him.

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Old 12-05-2012, 05:55 PM    (permalink
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I would hate to see the Vikings not come out of the first two rounds without a WR unless they did something big in FA, which is highly unlikely. The Jenkins/Simpson combo outside has been pathetic, aided by the terrible play of Ponder. With it seemingly going to be Ponder under center again next year, Harvin and AP need help, and there would be guys available at either pick in this scenario that could fit the bill, especially when we are taking a luxury/BPA type pick of a DE in round 1.
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Old 12-05-2012, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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At least 2 years due to his contract. I already said as much. They could maybe cut ties with him before the roster bonus in Spring 2014 kicks in, but if they do then they'll draft a WR in the 1st round in 2014, not 2013.

And just to be clear, because of the large amount of money Holmes is guaranteed and how backloaded the contract is, it is such that if the Jets cut him in 2013 the penalty against the cap would be larger than keeping him on the team. At least that was the case this year, I'm pretty sure even if it isn't next year the penalty is still substantial enough to where they can't reasonably cut him.
The Jets would have lost $11 million if they cut him this season. They'd save $1.25 million if they cut him next season, and $8.25 million if they cut him in 2014. So Robcards is right, he'll probably be around for at least one more season after this one.

They could use help all over the place, so there's no real need to reach for a WR. I could see the argument that Hill's not ready right now so roll with Holmes - Allen - Kerley - Hill for next year, cut Holmes, and hopefully in Hill's third year he's ready and you can go Allen - Hill - Kerley, but that really only applies if Allen's clear BPA.

Whoever's running the draft at that point should easily be able to find a OLB who's good value plus there's needs all over the place - RT, QB, RB, TE, G, and S all are weak and/or have starters heading into free agency.

Also I could care less about draft order, but the remainder of the Jets' schedule is pretty soft so I'd be surprised if they end up picking that high. Would be better for the team long-term, I just don't see it happening.
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:49 PM    (permalink
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As for Alex Boone, I'm glad for him that he is doing so well, though I never saw it coming. He was an uberprospect coming out of high school, but was an absolute mess off the field and a stiff on it. While I'm glad he's doing well now, I still wonder how much you can trust him going forward.
To be fair there's a big difference between...

Ohio State - Overweight, out of shape, alcoholic playing Left Tackle.
SF 49ers - In amazing shape (diet/fitness), no longer drinks, playing Right Guard.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:54 PM    (permalink
scar988
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Originally Posted by MI_Buckeye View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Konz drafted to replace McClure at C when he retires?
no. he wasn't. Joe Hawley was drafted for that.
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Old 12-06-2012, 01:55 AM    (permalink
Robcards
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The Jets would have lost $11 million if they cut him this season. They'd save $1.25 million if they cut him next season, and $8.25 million if they cut him in 2014. So Robcards is right, he'll probably be around for at least one more season after this one.

They could use help all over the place, so there's no real need to reach for a WR. I could see the argument that Hill's not ready right now so roll with Holmes - Allen - Kerley - Hill for next year, cut Holmes, and hopefully in Hill's third year he's ready and you can go Allen - Hill - Kerley, but that really only applies if Allen's clear BPA.

Whoever's running the draft at that point should easily be able to find a OLB who's good value plus there's needs all over the place - RT, QB, RB, TE, G, and S all are weak and/or have starters heading into free agency.

Also I could care less about draft order, but the remainder of the Jets' schedule is pretty soft so I'd be surprised if they end up picking that high. Would be better for the team long-term, I just don't see it happening.
Couldn't have said it better myself. Jets have so many needs due to Tannenbaum trading away or selecting busts with draft picks over the years, I'm seriously going to have a party when he gets fired.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:28 AM    (permalink
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I like Montgomery too.

As for Austin and Bell; Austin is so dynamic and versatile I can't see him slipping much further. The Bengals may have bigger needs, but the value brings to the return game and offense would instantly make this team much more explosive.

Bell, IMO, is the best short-yardage back in the draft and would offer an excellent complement to BJGE.
We don't need them [Austin and Bell] at all. Like it is in the negatives. Bell is a BJGE type back. BJGE excels at short-yardage situations. Why would we take him off the field for an overgrown FB? He is not the type of RB we need. Complete opposite actually. He is the antithesis of what we need.

Austin is also the EXACT opposite of what we would need. We have a dwarf for WR already in Andrew Hawkins. We have Mo Sanu to run gadget plays. We still would need a DE, S, RB, LB way before a luxury pick in Austin.

Overall they are just really poor fits.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:45 AM    (permalink
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Your analysis on tampas Gerald McCoy couldn't be more wrong. He needs help along the line and he's missing Clayborn a ton. Bennett is overrated. He's solid in run defense but is more of a rotational player than full time starter. McCoy s presence has led the bucs going from 32nd in the league in 2011 to 1 in 2012. He needs some help with a pure pass rusher on the outside. He pushes the middle of the pocket but no one collapses on the outside.
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Old 12-06-2012, 03:12 PM    (permalink
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Very good Bears picks. I think we would have to take a MLB in round 2 though since Urlacher is likely done.
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Old 12-06-2012, 04:24 PM    (permalink
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I really like this Chiefs draft. I would love the Teo pick. I don't see us moving to a 4-3 with this pick, however. Hali and Houston are perfect for the 3-4, and Johnson has been a stud in this defense as well. While Hali could move back to a 4-3 with ease, I think Houston would be lost in the shuffle.

Not sure how the Chiefs would be able to pass on Barkley in the 2nd round there, however.
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