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Old 12-08-2012, 09:38 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by P-L View Post
Johnny Football was really outstanding in 2012, so it's hard to say Te'o got shafted.

Serious question: If Manti Te'o played for an undefeated Texas A&M team and Johnny Football played for a 10-2 Notre Dame, does anyone think Te'o would've been a finalist?
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If Teo was a RS Freshman and Johnny Manziel was a Senior, would the vote have been close? Would Teo have even been in NY?
Lets combine the 2!

Te'o undefeated RS Freshman, Johnny 10-2 Senior....both would still be there.

Johnny 10-2 Freshman for ND, not beating Bama, probably not.

Te'o undefeated AM, beating Bama likely going to NC, yeah he would be there and winning it.
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Old 12-08-2012, 09:48 PM    (permalink
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Glad he won it. Wish the vote was more of a land slide. What are the odds he repeats as a Heisman winner?
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Old 12-08-2012, 09:50 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Bob Sanders Dreadlock View Post
Glad he won it. Wish the vote was more of a land slide. What are the odds he repeats as a Heisman winner?
pretty hard with that Oline leaving.

But if he takes the team to SEC champ game or NC, hard for his name not to be in it.

Beating, Bama, UGA, LSU, UF should take care of it ahha. But that line is going to go downhill fast.
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Old 12-08-2012, 09:55 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by regoob2 View Post
Pretty disappointed by this. Teo was far more deserving imo.

This just brings the trophy down a notch for me.
Far more deserving? Te'o isn't the best player on his own team and Johnny Football was the best player in the country. Te'o shouldn't have even been invited to NY.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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Far more deserving? Te'o isn't the best player on his own team and Johnny Football was the best player in the country. Te'o shouldn't have even been invited to NY.
Teo is the best player on his team. He's the best player and the leader of the best team in the country. Manziel is another guy who had a good year.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:02 PM    (permalink
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Far more deserving? Te'o isn't the best player on his own team and Johnny Football was the best player in the country. Te'o shouldn't have even been invited to NY.
I can see why he was invited. Second in the country for ints, well tied for second. That is pretty damn good for a Lb.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:26 PM    (permalink
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Teo is the best player on his team. He's the best player and the leader of the best team in the country. Manziel is another guy who had a good year.
Teo is the most high profile player on his squad. Their QB is the one I credit most for their undefeated season, and their defense as a unit.

Manziel didn't just have another good year for a college QB.
Usually guys who put up the numbers he did running and passing win the Heisman, which exactly what happened.

Manziel has three years left playing for A&M, so I expect him to improve as a passer.

He's just less than ideal height, but he does remind me a lot of Colt McCoy except way more athletic.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:29 PM    (permalink
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So how does Manziel translate his game to the NFL after next season. Is he RGIII or Russell Wilson.

It appears likely he could be the top pick for 2014.
At least he'll be able to run around and not get killed. That guy is small though. I'm more interested in Geno Smith.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:34 PM    (permalink
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Teo is the most high profile player on his squad. Their QB is the one I credit most for their undefeated season, and their defense as a unit.

Manziel didn't just have another good year for a college QB.
Usually guys who put up the numbers he did running and passing win the Heisman, which exactly what happened.

Manziel has three years left playing for A&M, so I expect him to improve as a passer.

He's just less than ideal height, but he does remind me a lot of Colt McCoy except way more athletic.
Well most QBs are more "important" to there teams success. Manziel was pretty important in there 2 losses. Its just kind of a joke that this kid is going to be mentioned with the other greats who have won the award. If they didnt beat Alabama he wouldnt even be in the conversation. His numbers were similar to Geno Smith.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:35 PM    (permalink
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Florida is only getting better and A&M won't beat them next year.It might be close but won't happen. I see our defensive getting stronger and our offensive as well passing more with Driskel improving much more in the off season.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:45 PM    (permalink
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Well most QBs are more "important" to there teams success. Manziel was pretty important in there 2 losses. Its just kind of a joke that this kid is going to be mentioned with the other greats who have won the award. If they didnt beat Alabama he wouldnt even be in the conversation. His numbers were similar to Geno Smith.
Except Geno Smith didn't give the team that's going to dominate ND in the NCCG it's only loss of the season, and Smith didn't rush for nearly 1200 yards and 19 TDs either.

Beating Alabama in Tuscaloosa IMO trumps a 3 point loss to Florida early in the season and a 5 point loss to LSU.

ND didn't play one team this season on the level of those three opponents.

If Manziel wasn't a freshman, I think fans against him winning would realize how great his 2012 season really was.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:50 PM    (permalink
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Except Geno Smith didn't give the team that's going to dominate ND in the NCCG it's only loss of the season, and Smith didn't rush for nearly 1200 yards and 19 TDs either.

Beating Alabama in Tuscaloosa IMO trumps a 3 point loss to Florida early in the season and a 5 point loss to LSU.

ND didn't play one team this season on the level of those three opponents.

If Manziel wasn't a freshman, I think fans against him winning would realize how great his 2012 season really was.
I bet you knew A&M was going to beat Alabama right? I love how ND has no shot at beating Alabama after lol Texas A&M beat them. Manziel deserves to win the Heisman because he lost to 2 out of the 3 good teams he's faced?
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:54 PM    (permalink
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I bet you knew A&M was going to beat Alabama right? I love how ND has no shot at beating Alabama after lol Texas A&M beat them. Manziel deserves to win the Heisman because he lost to 2 out of the 3 good teams he's faced?
Baylor lost way more last year.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:02 PM    (permalink
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I bet you knew A&M was going to win 10 games this season and beat Alabama with a RS freshman QB in the program's first season in the SEC???

It's just shocking to me that people think Teo had a Heisman worthy season, for a one-way DEFENSIVE player. A middle linebacker who never really did anything jaw dropping on Saturdays.

The Heisman is the ultimate 'flash' award in college football; big plays, big wins, highlight reel moments all season long. You don't win the Heisman in most cases without style points, which Teo simply did not have.

You don't win the Heisman because you were a solid MIKE in college.
Manziel had much more to do with A&M going 10-2 in the SEC than Teo had to do with ND's undefeated record.

Also it's not a requirement that a player's team be undefeated to win the Heisman.

Teo had only 46(!!) solo tackles in 2012. The rest were assisted.
Kuechly averaged over 90 solo tackles a season at BC.

Anywhere else but ND, and this isn't even a discussion.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:43 PM    (permalink
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Te'o had the most boring Heisman highlight reel ever.
He made a few key tackles but they were never "big plays" they weren't "Heisman Moments."
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:45 PM    (permalink
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A defensive player can win it IMO but they're going to need a bigger season statistically than Teo had.
Suppose Manti also had 15 sacks, 20-30 TFL and oh, 6-10 defensive TDs by himself this year, then I would have been more open to him winning.

His 2012 season just wasn't spectacular enough to overtake your standard Heisman QB candidate.
Lol... 15 sacks... 6-10 defensive TDs... you want Manti's 7 INTs too?

That is near impossible my friend. That's GOAT NCAA season defensive stats.

I thought if there was ever a time for a defensive player to win it it was this year. Guess not. I do think Manziel had a rightful claim to it. But Teo was the best player on the best tea, overcame deaths to people close to him and was tied for the NCAA lead in INTs. Meh.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:48 PM    (permalink
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Luke Keuchly was a better LB than Teo last year, Jarvis Jones was a better LB than Teo this season - neither of them were invited to the Heisman ceremony. Teo is a good player on a good defense but he shouldn't have even come in second place. The ND bias was evident with him even being involved in the Heisman. Braxton Miller and Marquise Lee should of been there ahead of him.

Really happy Johnny Football won though.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:51 PM    (permalink
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Lol... 15 sacks... 6-10 defensive TDs... you want Manti's 7 INTs too?

That is near impossible my friend. That's GOAT NCAA season defensive stats.

I thought if there was ever a time for a defensive player to win it it was this year. Guess not. I do think Manziel had a rightful claim to it. But Teo was the best player on the best tea, overcame deaths to people close to him and was tied for the NCAA lead in INTs. Meh.
I didn't realize that was a qualification...How many deaths did Cam overcome?
His INT's will show to be an anomaly more than skill. He has played what, since he was a freshman? 7 ints in 2012 is impressive, but for a guy who had 0 before, sorry if I doubt the skill in those picks.
2 forced fumbles. For his career.
Only 50 or so solo tackles.

Sorry but the whole being an awesome dude and all is 2nd to being the best football player.
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:24 AM    (permalink
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Johnny Football was the right choice. If Te'o didn't have that story on his side then he probably doesn't get as many votes as he does. I think him winning like 6 other awards equals a Heisman in his book.
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:51 AM    (permalink
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I didn't realize that was a qualification...How many deaths did Cam overcome?
His INT's will show to be an anomaly more than skill. He has played what, since he was a freshman? 7 ints in 2012 is impressive, but for a guy who had 0 before, sorry if I doubt the skill in those picks.
2 forced fumbles. For his career.
Only 50 or so solo tackles.

Sorry but the whole being an awesome dude and all is 2nd to being the best football player.
The game is part mental. Having 2 people close to your die in one week can break you down. It's more than him just being an awesome dude.

And BTW, I wouldn't have voted him #1 (Nor would it have gone to JM either).

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Old 12-09-2012, 01:40 AM    (permalink
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He's probably going to win the Butkus too.
I wouldn't feel too bad for Teo.

He's going to end up the most decorated college linebacker in recent memory.
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Old 12-09-2012, 01:57 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vidae View Post
Far more deserving? Te'o isn't the best player on his own team and Johnny Football was the best player in the country. Te'o shouldn't have even been invited to NY.
manziel is the third best player on his own team, youre talking out of your ass if you call him the best player in the country
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Old 12-09-2012, 02:40 AM    (permalink
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A great Oline can't turn a crap QB into an All American.
Manziel by far is the best player on A&M's roster.

If you put in Joeckel and Matthews' backups I don't Manziel's production would fall off that much.

Why do you think he was running around so much if his Olineman was dominant??
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Old 12-09-2012, 02:48 AM    (permalink
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first of all i was talking about joeckel and moore, not matthews. Secondly he starts running around before anything even happens half the time and because Joeckel (and to a lesser extend matthews) are so good he can actually scramble sideways and move upfield when he wants instead of having to go back because the edge is set by the defender.

and regards the crap qb to aa argument --> AJ McCarron

Im not sure about you but im just not ready to give a guy the heisman for playing a really good first half against alabama and feasting on soft teams
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Old 12-09-2012, 02:48 AM    (permalink
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they would have screwed it up if they had given it to Te'o. Good Job Johnny
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