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Old 12-21-2012, 08:03 PM    (permalink
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The other night on the NFL Network they had one of those 'Top 10' segments, it was something like Top 10 NFL moments - like the Immaculate Reception and the Dallas Clark catch, etc. The #1 moment was Joe Namath running off the field after the Super Bowl win waving one finger - and one of the Total Access commentators says "was that Sanchez?'..hilarious
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:15 PM    (permalink
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It could be worse. They could be Jimmy Clausen. BURN!
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:16 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by I_C_DeadPeople View Post
The other night on the NFL Network they had one of those 'Top 10' segments, it was something like Top 10 NFL moments - like the Immaculate Reception and the Dallas Clark catch, etc. The #1 moment was Joe Namath running off the field after the Super Bowl win waving one finger - and one of the Total Access commentators says "was that Sanchez?'..hilarious
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:25 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by soybean View Post
I think I've watched more Jets games than majority of this board and I find this to be pretty accurate. You can tell he's fueled by rhythm and momentum and performs well when things are going right. And he starts to sink fast when things start when things go bad.

Could Tannenbaum and Rex have done a better job of surrounding him with talent and developing him? of course, but that's true for everyone. But he doesn't have the ability like elite qbs and eli to overcome the pressure.
Yeah talent is an issue, though if he was developed and good, at least he can help raise the level of play OR at worse not give the ball away like Halloween Candy. And in the red zone he makes crucial mistakes that kills his team. He is the opposite of clutch. When you need him to be clutch, you can count on him to turn the ball over.

They tried stripping down the system for him. Then they tried colored cards and a wrist band. Then they took away too much responsibility from him and made it a ground and pound. That all has led to what you see now. There really is no where else to go.

Some guys aren't NY guys, and can't play here. I think he is that type of player. Even when he makes mistakes you see him expressionless as if he knew eventually it would happen. I actually feel bad for the guy.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:31 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Forenci View Post
It could be worse. They could be Jimmy Clausen. BURN!
Lol. No one could be that bad.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:38 PM    (permalink
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Detroit's woes are more an indictment of the teams discipline and execution than Stafford.
Part of Detroits problem is Stafford. I've watched him enough to see how sloppy he's gotten on a lot of plays. He clearly doesn't care about what he's doing enough to produce at a consistent level, which is what is required to be elite.

I know a lot of people are going to question me after I say this, but I really think Sanchez might be pretty good if he gets picked up as a backup for a decent team. Green Bay would be a home run for him. I don't think the Jets could develop sand castle at the beach, let alone an NFL QB. Nor do I think the talent in NY is worth a ****. I'm not saying Sanchez is definitely a good QB, but Tom Brady could be the Jets QB and you wouldn't know he's a Hall of Fame talent.

Seattle and San Francisco are also options. So is New Orleans. Baltimore could be interesting.

Laugh if you want, but at least he's not Jimmy Clausen-esque. He's definitely got the talent. He needs someone to show him how to be a pro and some talent around him to make plays with. His best target can't be Jeremy Kerley or Stephen Hill and succeed.

edit: if we didn't have Ryan Mallett at QB, I wouldn't mind having Sanchez as a backup.
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Old 12-21-2012, 08:38 PM    (permalink
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Is this thread really implying Stafford is a bust? Wow.
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I heard that Sylvester Stallone wrote The Expendables with The Alex in mind. He had to keep it realistic though and split The Alex's abilities into multiple characters. Stallone thought that critics would pan it for being too far-fetched if he just had one character effing everyone up.
The end. Cut to black. Audience goes ****ing ape****.
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Old 12-21-2012, 09:37 PM    (permalink
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Well if David Carr can be a back up QB, I guess so can Sanchez, but he should never be a starter again.
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 12-21-2012, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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At least Pat White makes the class look a little better.
*sigh

I drunk too much of the Kool Aid and I thought he would be a game changer in the Wildcat package. But wow...he was worse then awful.

I remember he "attempted" a throw in his rookie year that was a little 5 yard out and it looked awful. It was way too short and off the mark. I couldnt help but just laugh at how pathetic that throw was.
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Old 12-21-2012, 11:03 PM    (permalink
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I love how people make excuses for Freeman, but the Jets offensive players (outside of Mangold and Brick) are ******* terrible.
People make excuses because he actually can be good. 4 Terrrrrible games. 4 Amazing games. 4 Terrible games. And it goes on. Take his two games this year against the Saints as a great example. The first match is one of his best ever performances, the second is one of his worst.

If you just look at his stats, other than completion percentage (which is more to do with scheme than anything), he has had a decent year.

I still believe he can be a long term fix for Tampa, but man is the inconsistency ******* annoying.
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Old 12-21-2012, 11:22 PM    (permalink
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Well if David Carr can be a back up QB, I guess so can Sanchez, but he should never be a starter again.
I don't mean a lifetime backup. I mean a guy you are fairly confident playing.

His problems are not talent related. Maybe they are maturity/work ethic... not sure. But he seems smart enough and yet - he seems not to be developing.

Green Bay just seems to turn guys like him into Hall of Famers... (no offense to Aaron Rodgers)

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People make excuses because he actually can be good. 4 Terrrrrible games. 4 Amazing games. 4 Terrible games. And it goes on. Take his two games this year against the Saints as a great example. The first match is one of his best ever performances, the second is one of his worst.

If you just look at his stats, other than completion percentage (which is more to do with scheme than anything), he has had a decent year.

I still believe he can be a long term fix for Tampa, but man is the inconsistency ******* annoying.
I think my point is that I am going to stop using the term bust until the player is done (unless it's Jimmy Clausen, who 5 minutes of NFL film will tell you he's a bust), because I can see reasons each player isn't succeeding and ways of fixing it.

If Sanchez was throwing to Calvin Johnson, I think a lot of people would have more respect for him.

Everyone loves Stafford because of his 5k+ yard season, but he's also in an offense that throws a lot in a dome, where he can jack it up to Megatron 50 times a game. Having that kind of player hides a lot of deficiencies.

While Stafford has Megatron and Freeman has VJ, Sanchez has Jeremy Kerley. I think I would look better than Sanchez if I had Megatron.

Sanchez has had a few really good games in his career, too. Not just ones where he didn't lose a game, but ones where he actually won it.
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Old 12-22-2012, 02:44 AM    (permalink
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Watching Jets games here in NJ, I would agree that The Sanchize looks shell shocked and mentality out of it. It's almost as if he plays expecting bad things. I noticed after his turnovers, he shows no emotion as he runs back. It's almost as if he expects bad stuff to happen, and when it does, it's expected. Nothing new there. I actually feel bad for the guy. Maybe a good coach can teach the guy, and try to develop him.
Which is why I do think he just needs to get out of the Jets organization and he can maybe find the light again even if he may have to suck it up and be a backup.

It took Rich Gannon a LONG, LONG time to figure it out and while Mark Sanchez will have to be lucky to be Gannon, I do think you need to see what he does with a change of scenery. He's been a huge letdown for the Jets but I think he's just lost it with the team.
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Old 12-22-2012, 02:48 AM    (permalink
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He is the opposite of clutch. When you need him to be clutch, you can count on him to turn the ball over.

They tried stripping down the system for him. Then they tried colored cards and a wrist band. Then they took away too much responsibility from him and made it a ground and pound. That all has led to what you see now. There really is no where else to go.

Some guys aren't NY guys, and can't play here. I think he is that type of player. Even when he makes mistakes you see him expressionless as if he knew eventually it would happen. I actually feel bad for the guy.
He's actually been money in just about all of the playoff games he has been outside of that Colts game in Wildcard round which he was just okay in and was a large part of the team's 4 playoff wins believe it or not.

My problem with Sanchez is he doesn't have a sense of urgency and he continues to have such a carefree attitude when he should not be. Its like he doesn't care what happens anymore, he has his money and fame and that's it for him. He's almost just given up with the Jets organization with the fans, coaches and players hammering him. His press conferences are difficult to watch...its like Sanchez doesn't give a **** what is going on and he was actually smirking/laughing 2-3 times after the loss to the Titans.

He also needs a QB coach....badly. Not to say this will change his career around but how Matt Cavanaugh has kept his job all this time I will never know. Still though, regardless he really needs to make better decisions.

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Old 12-22-2012, 02:52 AM    (permalink
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Oh and people need to stop with the Clausen stuff. Yeah he hasn't done much but his "NFL tape" was him on a GOD AWFUL Panthers squad that had absolutely nothing at O-Line(Much was hurt), Steve Smith who didn't give two shits about the season and a banged up RB duo. I mean that 1-15 season doesn't fall on just the QB.....the team was just awful and the Panthers didn't want to give Clausen a chance with a better core around him so they took Newton.

This is not saying Clausen will light the world or anything but people overexgerrate with Clausen because of the college he came from.
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Old 12-22-2012, 03:47 AM    (permalink
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Not an excuse but the Lions QB coach is a Linehan lackey from St. Louis who was previously a assistant special teams and defense coach. I've never even seen the guy talking to Stafford on the sidelines. Stafford needs someone hammering mechanics in to his head and to be tough on him. He throws off his back foot way too much because he has the arm to make up for it. I rarely see him step up in the pocket to make the throw. Every time he throws an INT they show him and Linehan sitting on the bench with Stafford looking at sheets of the defensive alignment with Linehan staring forward with a blank expression.
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Old 12-22-2012, 04:59 AM    (permalink
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I just don't see the point of spending time developing Sanchez. He's not a raw guy with massive upside just waiting to be molded. There are plenty of equally crappy QB's with far better physical tools that you could spend that development time on.
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Old 12-22-2012, 12:12 PM    (permalink
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He's actually been money in just about all of the playoff games he has been outside of that Colts game in Wildcard round which he was just okay in and was a large part of the team's 4 playoff wins believe it or not.

My problem with Sanchez is he doesn't have a sense of urgency and he continues to have such a carefree attitude when he should not be. Its like he doesn't care what happens anymore, he has his money and fame and that's it for him. He's almost just given up with the Jets organization with the fans, coaches and players hammering him. His press conferences are difficult to watch...its like Sanchez doesn't give a **** what is going on and he was actually smirking/laughing 2-3 times after the loss to the Titans.

He also needs a QB coach....badly. Not to say this will change his career around but how Matt Cavanaugh has kept his job all this time I will never know. Still though, regardless he really needs to make better decisions.
Yeah but that was his first 2 years. A lot of things changed. Ryan's system was sick those years. I feel like now due to lack of talent AND the scheme being figured out, that his defense isn't as effective as it once was. I think since then Sanchez has gone backwards at a big time rate.

He basically is a broken QB with zero self confidence, expecting the sky to fall every game. They had two systems, going from, Shotty, who was the scape goat, and now Sparano. 2 systems Sanchez has failed in. But I do agree, he hasn't been developed well. Just a terrible job developing him.

The question is can he still be developed with the Jets or is a change of scenery the best possible solution for everyone? And it doesn't help when you see Sanchez doing marketing stuff like GQ and all that. Kris Jenkins called him out recently on worrying about that stuff.

I do agree with the press conferences. I think he is so badly shell shocked and broken, he has nothing to say. He has to be defensive and won't submit and tell the media anything damaging like he has no self confidence is just doesn't get it.

Some people can handle NY, while others can't. This goes for all the sports here. You see it with baseball, hockey, football, and basketball. Sanchez is in a fishbowl here and I think this media attention is a factor as well. The Jets love the media attention too and go out of their way to attract it. That's a volatile recipe for a guy who can't handle it and is playing so poorly.
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Old 12-22-2012, 12:22 PM    (permalink
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stafford is a good QB, one that could really really be great in the next few years
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Old 12-23-2012, 12:18 AM    (permalink
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Still think the Jets should've held their ground and drafted Freeman.
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Old 12-23-2012, 07:48 AM    (permalink
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People make excuses because he actually can be good. 4 Terrrrrible games. 4 Amazing games. 4 Terrible games. And it goes on.
If only he could be facing the Bills Defense for 16 weeks.
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Old 12-23-2012, 08:57 AM    (permalink
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Stafford is crusing on elite arm talent. He does have a good head on his shoulders and is still figuring things out. The Lions have lost games in such stupid ways this season that it has to be wearing him thin. Plus, they have to throw the ball 3 times from 1st and Goal on the 1 most of the time because they lack a decent short yardage package. He's still developing and is not the Lion's problem. He is part of their solution and will keep improving.
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Old 12-23-2012, 09:06 AM    (permalink
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Has anybody else noticed that Stafford is on the verge of another 5000 yard season?
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Old 12-23-2012, 10:12 AM    (permalink
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Stafford does rely on his arm strength a little to much - I think Gruden said it on more than one occassion - he is just like Favre - a gunslinger.

The Lions need a more balanced offense - whether its Linehan's playcalling, personnel or a combination of both. Leshoure has been mediocre and Best is done due to concussions. They need a quality RB back there to give the offense more than one dimension.
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Old 12-23-2012, 10:20 AM    (permalink
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Has anybody else noticed that Stafford is on the verge of another 5000 yard season?
Well I should hope so saying as he's probably going to end up throwing it over 725 times.
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Old 12-23-2012, 06:51 PM    (permalink
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Still think the Jets should've held their ground and drafted Freeman.

I don't get to see a lot of Freeman, but I did today. Wow, he's bad.
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