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Old 01-04-2013, 07:24 PM    (permalink
Cigaro
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51 View Post
Ok, what coach are you talking about exactly then? Bellichick had 4 losing seasons out of 5 in Cleveland, and both guys had records around a 40% winning %. That's certainly not good.

Edit: See you mentioned Josh McDaniels. He was 11-17 with Denver. Mike Shanahan was 8-12 with the Raiders. That's essentially the same.
Overall W/L, yes, similar. But its not as simple as that. Mike Shanahan didn't trade away his most talented players for no reason, nor did he draft an equivalent of Tim Tebow in the first round. Belichick and Shanahan didn't do well, you're correct, they were fired for a reason, but they didn't attempt to dismantle their team either. McDaniels got off to hot start his first year, but after that, his team quickly descended into one of the worst in the league, and his personnel moves did nothing to help.

And if you do want to make the "they learned from their mistakes" argument, you still have to recognize the difference in scenarios for the two. If McDaniels were to be hired this offseason, that'd be only two seasons after he got fired. Your cited Shanahan waited five years for his next gig, and Belichick four, both at least twice as long of a "learning" period.
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:26 PM    (permalink
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What success did Shanahan have in Oakland?
7-9, and then getting fired after 1-3 isn't good, but its not horrible.
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:31 PM    (permalink
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I hope Chip at least interviews with Philly before making a decision.
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:34 PM    (permalink
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I think Weeden could work for Kelly...he already knows he is going to have to adapt his offense to the pro level. Perhaps they'll run something similar to the Patriots spread ?

Personally I am more interested in what his staff will look like.
Oh he will have to adapt for sure but I don't think its going to be like the Pats. The tempo is the one similarity. The Pats offense is in all reality a conventional pro style system with some window dressing. Shifts and different formations are what the Pats live and die by but it is still a conventional drop back passing attack. In the running game the Pats stay relatively conventional again using common staples such as stretch plays, ISO, wham blocks etc.

The one difference in Kellys offense is, while he also uses these, he adds in read plays. The running game is a numbers game. When the offense can't block all the defenders they will read one instead. We have seen Kaepernick, RG3 etc do this as well so I don't think Chip will abandon this concept. With Weeden this becomes defunct as he won't warrant any attention from defenders. From this comes the possibility of adding read play action and gives more one read pass options. All these things are in McCoys favour
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:52 PM    (permalink
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While at Oregon defenses have had to respect 3 things off play action (QB keep, dive, and pass) which makes their offense that much harder to stop. Don't really have to respect Weeden keeping the ball so that hurts the offense a little bit but Kelly will make it work. Can replace the "keep" part of the game with bubble screens, dig screens, quick slants etc.

Or he can go with McCoy and see what he's got.
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:05 PM    (permalink
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Seems like the trend was to stray away from college coaches after Petrino and Saban but now it seems like college coaches are the hot commodity.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:14 PM    (permalink
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They relate well to how the game and the players are these days. Football is such a copy cat league and the NFL seems like its copying the College game more than the other way around.
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:25 PM    (permalink
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While at Oregon defenses have had to respect 3 things off play action (QB keep, dive, and pass) which makes their offense that much harder to stop. Don't really have to respect Weeden keeping the ball so that hurts the offense a little bit but Kelly will make it work. Can replace the "keep" part of the game with bubble screens, dig screens, quick slants etc.

Or he can go with McCoy and see what he's got.
They're quite the tradeoff. With McCoy you can forget about pushing the ball downfield. With weed as you said forget about runs.

I say **** um both and just draft Boyd.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:27 PM    (permalink
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They're quite the tradeoff. With McCoy you can forget about pushing the ball downfield. With weed as you said forget about runs.

I say **** um both and just draft Boyd.
NO! Thats what the Eagles are supposed to do! Kelly+Boyd=Philly! damn it
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:35 PM    (permalink
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Overall W/L, yes, similar. But its not as simple as that. Mike Shanahan didn't trade away his most talented players for no reason
Eh....that's debatable. I'm a Bears fan, and I wouldn't have a problem with us trading Cutler (I'm probably the minority, but I don't think we'll ever win anything substantial with him as our QB).

I certainly wouldn't hire McDaniels if I had an opening, but I wouldn't rake him over the coals either for essentially one personel move that really wasn't even that bad.
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:24 PM    (permalink
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Eh....that's debatable. I'm a Bears fan, and I wouldn't have a problem with us trading Cutler (I'm probably the minority, but I don't think we'll ever win anything substantial with him as our QB).

I certainly wouldn't hire McDaniels if I had an opening, but I wouldn't rake him over the coals either for essentially one personel move that really wasn't even that bad.
Cutler
Marshall
Scheffler
Hillis

were all good pieces that worked well together. He jettisoned all of them. Those are all bad moves, not just the Cutler one. ...and then what he drafted with most of the picks? Yuck.
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:31 PM    (permalink
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Eh....that's debatable. I'm a Bears fan, and I wouldn't have a problem with us trading Cutler (I'm probably the minority, but I don't think we'll ever win anything substantial with him as our QB).

I certainly wouldn't hire McDaniels if I had an opening, but I wouldn't rake him over the coals either for essentially one personel move that really wasn't even that bad.
When he traded away Cutler, he was considered one of the best young quarterbacks in the game, yet before even coaching his first practice or game with Cutler, he wanted to get rid of him for Matt Cassel. Admittedly Cassel's stock was a lot higher at the time as well, but I don't think even then many would have taken Cassel before Cutler, and certainly no one now would do so. And of course his later solution to quarterback is Tim Tebow. Anyone who tries to trade away Cutler for Cassel, fails and thus settles for Orton, and then decides that Tebow is the solution clearly has no idea what they are doing.
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:47 PM    (permalink
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They're quite the tradeoff. With McCoy you can forget about pushing the ball downfield. With weed as you said forget about runs.

I say **** um both and just draft Boyd.
Boyd...isn't all that much better than McCoy
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:13 PM    (permalink
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Cutler
Marshall
Scheffler
Hillis

were all good pieces that worked well together. He jettisoned all of them. Those are all bad moves, not just the Cutler one. ...and then what he drafted with most of the picks? Yuck.
He traded Marshall for a 2nd round pick to the Dolphins, who then two years later traded him for two 3rds. You can disagree with the Dolphins decision as well, but he got market value and wasn't the first person to decide that Marshall wasn't worth the headache.

Hilis was also basically let walk for nothing by Cleveland, who decided he was a diva not worth an investment.

If anything, over time, all of McDaniels' decisions look better than they did at the time.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:00 AM    (permalink
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I hope Chip at least interviews with Philly before making a decision.
He interviewed with the Bills last night so I'm guessing the Eagles get an audience with him but I'm thinking he's made up his mind weeks ago.

The Joe Banner/David Dunn connection worked dividends for Cleveland.
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:39 AM    (permalink
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I am ok with Reid in KC, more intrigued by the staff he builds.
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:59 AM    (permalink
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I am ok with Reid in KC, more intrigued by the staff he builds.
There's talk of Childress as his OC

http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/...-action/17950/

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Old 01-05-2013, 01:43 PM    (permalink
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Doug Marrone interviewing with Eagles.
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Old 01-05-2013, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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There's talk of Childress as his OC

http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/...-action/17950/
They have also mentioned Shurmur.
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 01-05-2013, 03:07 PM    (permalink
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They have also mentioned Shurmur.
I'm not too shurmur thats a good idea.
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Old 01-05-2013, 05:36 PM    (permalink
Cigaro
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Ron Rivera will stay in Carolina.
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:09 PM    (permalink
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I guess a deal between Chip Kelley and Cleveland is almost done . Reporting from NFL . com site. Should be interesting to see if changes his offense at all. I know he has too.
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:58 PM    (permalink
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So now chip Kelly is close to a deal with the eagles? Great.
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Old 01-05-2013, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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So now chip Kelly is close to a deal with the eagles? Great.
The Browns not the Eagles, or did ti change again?
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Old 01-05-2013, 10:34 PM    (permalink
BuckeyeDan17
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The Browns not the Eagles, or did ti change again?
He was supposed to meet with Banner and Haslam again tonight along with lawyers and he hasn't. Supposedly, he was with the Eagles for like 5 hours or something.

Either way, the fact that a contract didn't get locked up yesterday/last night after we met with last night says enough, imo. I really don't think we end up with him after all is said and done.

To be blunt, I probably put way too much stock into all of the stupid little sources that were surfacing and jumped the gun with excitement.
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