The 2012 AP All-Pro Team

[Justone2]

Originally Posted by Babylon

Iupati and Staley made it. Who else did you have in mind.

Think he means it more in the way he hopes they would play on that level.

[Lil Quip]

All Pro's by playoff team:

Denver: 4
New England: 2
Houston: 3
Baltimore: 4

San Fran: 10 (9 really)
Green Bay: 2
Seattle: 4
Atlanta: 1

Hmmm. with 5 out of 7 San Fran's front seven as all-pro's, they should be able to have the best run D in the league out of the NICKEL. Oops, they were third in YPA and fourth in YP/G.

Some of the voting does show that this kind of shortsighted analysis is silly. Plus some injuries affected the overall landscape.

[jth1331]

I just want to know who were the dicks who didn't vote for Megatron and Von Miller.

[Splat]

Originally Posted by jth1331

I just want to know who were the dicks who didn't vote for Megatron and Von Miller.

A former Bear shocking haters gonna hate.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...o-recognition/

Of the 50 voters on the Associated Press panel that chooses the All-Pro team, 49 of them selected Detroit’s Calvin Johnson at wide receiver. The one who did not was Tim Ryan of FOX Sports and SiriusXM NFL Radio.

The AP confirmed to PFT that Ryan, a former NFL defensive tackle who played for the Bears from 1990 to 1994, was the lone voter who left Megatron off his All-Pro ballot.

[LonghornsLegend]

Sean Lee was headed straight for this once again :( i has a sad

[Babylon]

Originally Posted by Justone2

Think he means it more in the way he hopes they would play on that level.

Could be. when you figure what goes on in his brain let us know.

[FUNBUNCHER]

There aren't 4 OTs in the game better than this man. Whatever.
I see you working Silverback.

[The Alex]

Originally Posted by boknows34

Kick returners: Jacoby Jones, Baltimore, 37 ½; Leodis McKelvin, Buffalo, 2 ½

Uh.... what?

[Ness]

EDIT: Nevermind.

[Brodeur]

Originally Posted by The Alex

Uh.... what?

Peter Dinklage and Verne Troyer got votes.

[phlysac]

Originally Posted by Lil Quip

All Pro's by playoff team:
Hmmm. with 5 out of 7 San Fran's front seven as all-pro's, they should be able to have the best run D in the league out of the NICKEL. Oops, they were third in YPA and fourth in YP/G.

Eliminating individual skills (this is an individual award) to make an assumption of a team ability isn't a good way to generalize football.

Do you think that Aldon Smith and Ahmad Brooks are getting most of their looks because of what they do on run defense?

Individual stars does not a team make.


And at the same time, look at the Steelers' defense...

#1 YPG (Total)
#2 YPP (Total)
#2 YPG (Rushing)
#4 YPA (Rushing)
#1 YPG (Passing)
#1 YPA (Passing)

Where are their defensive All-Pros? Not even in the playoffs.

[21ST]

Originally Posted by bucfan12

Hm surprised Morris made 2nd team All Pro over Martin. I mean did you not see josh freeman suck it up or him missing his two all pro guards and still ran 1400 yds

Why am I not surprised you feel this way lol smh.

[Lil Quip]

Originally Posted by phlysac

Eliminating individual skills (this is an individual award) to make an assumption of a team ability isn't a good way to generalize football.

Do you think that Aldon Smith and Ahmad Brooks are getting most of their looks because of what they do on run defense?

Individual stars does not a team make.


And at the same time, look at the Steelers' defense...

#1 YPG (Total)
#2 YPP (Total)
#2 YPG (Rushing)
#4 YPA (Rushing)
#1 YPG (Passing)
#1 YPA (Passing)

Where are their defensive All-Pros? Not even in the playoffs.

Oh I used a bit of hyperbole and you points are completely valid.

Overall I do think the all pro selections are on point in general, but there are things that stand out. Like Mankins.

The one thing that I have seen for a while is the voters really have no idea how to deal with 3-4 DE's. Back in the day, Richard Seymour was in the Watt/Smith position. He was always considered a DT, which makes sense. When Ty Warren made the AP team at the same position, he made it as a DE. Ngata has made the AP team always at DT. It was kind of unique last year to see Smith make both teams, but is he a DE or a DT? Everyone else was considered one or the other, why not him?

[Monomach]

Originally Posted by Brodeur

I wonder how long Maurkice Pouncey will be overrated for.

Forever. When he was drafted by the Stillers, people decided that he's going to the hall of fame. That's where this is headed. It's like a runaway train; we can't stop it, no matter how much we tell them the truth. Dude was the twelfth-best center this year. Once he retires, it isn't going to be "how the eff did that averagish guy make all those pro bowls?" It's going to be "MAURKICE POUNCEY MADE EIGHT PRO BOWLS. HE WAS ONE OF THE GREATEST CENTERS OF ALL TIME."

Ugh.

[BigBanger]

Originally Posted by Lil Quip

Oh I used a bit of hyperbole and you points are completely valid.

Overall I do think the all pro selections are on point in general, but there are things that stand out. Like Mankins.

The one thing that I have seen for a while is the voters really have no idea how to deal with 3-4 DE's. Back in the day, Richard Seymour was in the Watt/Smith position. He was always considered a DT, which makes sense. When Ty Warren made the AP team at the same position, he made it as a DE. Ngata has made the AP team always at DT. It was kind of unique last year to see Smith make both teams, but is he a DE or a DT? Everyone else was considered one or the other, why not him?

Not even making the All Pro team twice makes up for the fact that he missed first team. If you want to call him a DE or DT, I don't care, he pretty much does both, but he should be a first teamer. I don't think there's five defensive players in the NFL better than him, and Aldon Smith will probably become one of the three or four of the highest paid OLBs in the NFL because of him. There is not a more dominant player along the defensive line than Smith, well, until Watt set the bar at a whole new standard. The difference between Watt and Smith is that Watt beats linemen and then makes the play himself. Smith beats multiple linemen and creates space for other defenders to make plays.

Justin Smith has been one of the best defensive linemen in the NFL in each of the last four seasons. This year was no different. JJ Watt, Richard Sherman and Clay Matthews. Those are the only defensive players that I think were better than Justin Smith last year, and Matthews missed more time due to injury.

Haloti Ngata doesn't seem to get any flack. He was shockingly bad this year. I know he was playing hurt, but that doesn't rule out the fact that he was still playing like just another guy. He's probably the most undeserving player on this list. I've never seen the interior linemen of the Cowboys push anyone off the line and then pacake them three or four yards down field consistently. They did that to Ngata all day long. He had games this year where he spent more time on his back or so far away the play that he wasn't even worth blocking. It seems like people are bashing Mankins, who had a much better season than Ngata, and saying he only made it based on his reputation. The same thing happened to Ngata this year.

I also think Dez Bryant was a huge oversight, or the writers hold some personal bias against him for personal / off the field issues. He was a bad dude this year, and scoring as much as he did in the second half of games... Something is up if you don't get one single vote for putting up 92 catches, 1,382 yards and 12 TDs. Those are All-Pro numbers.

Ryan Clark. That's all I'm going to say. Ryan Clark. Unreal.


And Doug Martin is significantly more deserving than Alfred Morris.

Doug Martin:

319 Attempts / 1,454 rushing yards (4.6 Avg) / 11 TDs (1 FUM / 1 LOST)
49 Receptions / 472 yards (9.6 Avg) / 1 TD
368 Touches / 1,926 total yards / 12 TDs

Alfred Morris:

335 Attempts / 1,613 rushing yards (4.8 Avg) / 13 TDs (4 FUM / 3 LOST)
11 Receptions / 77 yards (7.0 Avg)
346 Touches / 1,690 total yards / 13 TDs

Martin was in an offense with much less talent around him, and an offensive line that simply doesn't compare to Morris. And when you consider the fact that RG III made Morris more difficult to defend, then Griffin's impact becomes more important to Morris' success. Morris is deserving of votes, but he should have been a third team type All-Pro, and behind Martin. Martin carried his offense more than Morris did to his. And he was more productive when Morris was in an ideal situation with great talent around him. Bot had great seasons, but Martin had less talent around him and was more productive.

[Brodeur]

You forgot Geno Atkins.

[Lil Quip]

Originally Posted by BigBanger

Not even making the All Pro team twice makes up for the fact that he missed first team. If you want to call him a DE or DT, I don't care, he pretty much does both, but he should be a first teamer. I don't think there's five defensive players in the NFL better than him, and Aldon Smith will probably become one of the three or four of the highest paid OLBs in the NFL because of him. There is not a more dominant player along the defensive line than Smith, well, until Watt set the bar at a whole new standard. The difference between Watt and Smith is that Watt beats linemen and then makes the play himself. Smith beats multiple linemen and creates space for other defenders to make plays.

Justin Smith has been one of the best defensive linemen in the NFL in each of the last four seasons. This year was no different. JJ Watt, Richard Sherman and Clay Matthews. Those are the only defensive players that I think were better than Justin Smith last year, and Matthews missed more time due to injury.

Haloti Ngata doesn't seem to get any flack. He was shockingly bad this year. I know he was playing hurt, but that doesn't rule out the fact that he was still playing like just another guy. He's probably the most undeserving player on this list. I've never seen the interior linemen of the Cowboys push anyone off the line and then pacake them three or four yards down field consistently. They did that to Ngata all day long. He had games this year where he spent more time on his back or so far away the play that he wasn't even worth blocking. It seems like people are bashing Mankins, who had a much better season than Ngata, and saying he only made it based on his reputation. The same thing happened to Ngata this year.

I also think Dez Bryant was a huge oversight, or the writers hold some personal bias against him for personal / off the field issues. He was a bad dude this year, and scoring as much as he did in the second half of games... Something is up if you don't get one single vote for putting up 92 catches, 1,382 yards and 12 TDs. Those are All-Pro numbers.

Ryan Clark. That's all I'm going to say. Ryan Clark. Unreal.


And Doug Martin is significantly more deserving than Alfred Morris.

Doug Martin:

319 Attempts / 1,454 rushing yards (4.6 Avg) / 11 TDs (1 FUM / 1 LOST)
49 Receptions / 472 yards (9.6 Avg) / 1 TD
368 Touches / 1,926 total yards / 12 TDs

Alfred Morris:

335 Attempts / 1,613 rushing yards (4.8 Avg) / 13 TDs (4 FUM / 3 LOST)
11 Receptions / 77 yards (7.0 Avg)
346 Touches / 1,690 total yards / 13 TDs

Martin was in an offense with much less talent around him, and an offensive line that simply doesn't compare to Morris. And when you consider the fact that RG III made Morris more difficult to defend, then Griffin's impact becomes more important to Morris' success. Morris is deserving of votes, but he should have been a third team type All-Pro, and behind Martin. Martin carried his offense more than Morris did to his. And he was more productive when Morris was in an ideal situation with great talent around him. Bot had great seasons, but Martin had less talent around him and was more productive.

I definitely won't argue his candidacy for the team in general. The correlation between his physical absence and Aldon's absence of production cannot be ignored. I will admit I do not know enough of the 49ers scheme to put him at either DT or DE in a more holistic sense, but I imagine he skews one direction.

I will argue that the 49er's , Pats and Bengals are happiest with their DT respectively.

[SuperPacker]

I agree that Doug Martin should've got in ahead of Morris.

[phlysac]

Originally Posted by Lil Quip

I will admit I do not know enough of the 49ers scheme to put him at either DT or DE in a more holistic sense, but I imagine he skews one direction.

He is a 3-4 DE in the team's base set, but the majority of snaps the defense is in nickle. In the 49ers even nickle front Smith lines up at DT over 90% of the time. Occasionally, J. Smith will line up in a 3pt at DE while Aldon Smith will line up in a 2pt inside him at DT.

[AntoinCD]

Originally Posted by phlysac

He is a 3-4 DE in the team's base set, but the majority of snaps the defense is in nickle. In the 49ers even nickle front Smith lines up at DT over 90% of the time. Occasionally, J. Smith will line up in a 3pt at DE while Aldon Smith will line up in a 2pt inside him at DT.

Yeah the vast majority of the time Smith will line up either head up on the OG or shading him with Aldon to his outside. Then it's a simple case of holding the OG while Aldon loops around for 19.5 easy sacks

[P-L]

Originally Posted by Wide Right

Does Mike Pouncey hate his brother?

I probably would if I was twice as good as my brother and he still got all the recognition.

[WCH]

I just went to look up their contract details, and Mike Pouncey apparently doesn't even get to have his picture on his rotoworld profile.

[killxswitch]

The All-Pro team is still a popularity contest. The voters are just a little more informed.

[jsagan77]

Originally Posted by SuperPacker

I agree that Doug Martin should've got in ahead of Morris.

Maybe, but keep in mind Morris had the single greatest season rushing in Redskins history, and considering some of the RB's we've had and OL's in years past it's very impressive.

[FUNBUNCHER]

If the Bucs had made the playoffs maybe Martin would have gotten more run for the All Pro team. These teams are heavily skewed towards winning teams, so I think the SKins finishing 10-6 had something to do with it.

BTW I think both Morris and Martin played with roughly similar talent on offense, the difference IMO is scheme.

I don't think there's really a case that Doug Martin was 'more' deserving. Maybe deserving to an extent, but Morris was the NFL's 2nd leading rusher and ran for the 2nd most TDs.

I don't know how you can say Doug Martin carried the Bucs when Josh Freeman threw for over 4K and 27 TDs.

It's really hard for a voter to ignore 1600+ yards rushing and choose a 1400+yard RB a slot above him.