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Old 02-20-2013, 01:14 PM    (permalink
Cigaro
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Deja vu..



And this off season is chalk full of solid FA DTs.
How much of our offense have you watched? As little name recognition or credit as they get, Cam Newton has played pretty well with our receivers. Steve Smith is quality(but aging), LaFell is a serviceable number two, and Olsen has greatly helped out as well. What receivers did he have during his amazing rookie year? What receivers did he have during his amazing second half stretch? So far the problem hasn't been so much the receivers, as it is a lack of an offensive line and a running game to assist him. Its not going to matter how much receiving talent we have if we can't give Cam the time to make throws. Further development is going to rely more on keeping him upright and not making him win every single game by himself, which means a return of the running game.

As for the defense, where exactly do you propose we're going to find the money to pay for the defensive tackles?

The Panthers simply have far too many holes to double up at a position that isn't even our primary need.
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Old 02-20-2013, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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I should give them Duke Williams but I'm not ready yet to imagine one of my favorite prospects ending up on the Ravens. We'll see how Wilcox performs at the combine.
Even if Wilcox has a great combine that doesn't mean he's ready to step into a starting role in the NFL. A lot of rookies aren't but he's farther from it than most. That's not what Baltimore needs if Reed isn't with the team.
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Old 02-20-2013, 03:25 PM    (permalink
Brown Leader
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How much of our offense have you watched? As little name recognition or credit as they get, Cam Newton has played pretty well with our receivers. Steve Smith is quality(but aging), LaFell is a serviceable number two, and Olsen has greatly helped out as well. What receivers did he have during his amazing rookie year? What receivers did he have during his amazing second half stretch? So far the problem hasn't been so much the receivers, as it is a lack of an offensive line and a running game to assist him. Its not going to matter how much receiving talent we have if we can't give Cam the time to make throws. Further development is going to rely more on keeping him upright and not making him win every single game by himself, which means a return of the running game.

As for the defense, where exactly do you propose we're going to find the money to pay for the defensive tackles?

The Panthers simply have far too many holes to double up at a position that isn't even our primary need.
What a hole Hurney put them in. Do you think the lack of running game is principally a line issue? (no sarcasm) Coaching? Or are Stewart and Williams declining that fast? It seems like if you're running the WR group that the Panthers are rolling with, besides Smith, you really don't have to worry about anyone else and can gear up for the run.

With the passing trend can they afford to go in the other direction? Newton may have played well but it didn't amount to wins. His release, rocket and mobility lessens the need for elite lineman. And Lafell as a serviceable #2 is a stretch but I guess he's getting better. And I thought Olsen was poised for a massive year but I recognized he's just not as good as I thought.
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Old 02-20-2013, 03:27 PM    (permalink
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Even if Wilcox has a great combine that doesn't mean he's ready to step into a starting role in the NFL. A lot of rookies aren't but he's farther from it than most. That's not what Baltimore needs if Reed isn't with the team.
Yes, but I don't think you sacrifice upside for a guy that's just more ready to play as a rookie.

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Excellent draft for sf. Well done sir! Hit all the key needs especially Kicker!
Oh, and sorry chaps. This was an accident. It was supposed to be the other way around. King to the Ravens and Jenkins to SF-not the other way.

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31. San Francisco 49ers – Brandon Jenkins* /DE-OLB/ FSU:
Highly rated pre injury and could be a steal for whoever takes a chance.

32. Baltimore Ravens - Tavarres King /WR/ Georgia:
Playmaker with a knack for route running showed very well at senior week practices.
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Old 02-20-2013, 09:55 PM    (permalink
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Not a single SF pick that I liked, Boooo
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Old 02-20-2013, 11:11 PM    (permalink
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3. Oakland Raiders – Bjoern Werner* /DE-OLB/ Florida State:
The top DE in this class because he gets off the ball better then anyone else. Versatility is a big plus in Tarver’s new defense and Werner shows the ability to stand up and rush from different spots. NFL comp. Chris Long
Hearing too many questions about his down to down level of effort. That turns me right the hell off. Much rather go a different direction here.


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4. Oakland Raiders – John Jenkins /DT/ Georgia:
Bust potential for sure but you can't coach up size + motor. Jenkins gets blown off the ball too often for a guy of his size but massive DTs who can move and hustle are rare commodities-I guess. NFL comp. Shaun Smith
Eh. Maybe.

Tyler Wilson this late sure would be a decent dice roll, though. As would Carradine.


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3. Oakland Raiders – Alvin Bailey* /OG/ Arkansas :
Athletic big man could fit well in the Raiders scheme.
Can't complain, though I think I like Dallas Thomas a little better.
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Old 02-21-2013, 07:18 AM    (permalink
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Solid Raiders draft. I'm not the biggest Werner fan, I believe its going to take him few years to develop into a good player. I'm kind of hoping Raiders draft someone who can come in and make a big impact as a rookie. I'm not sure Werner is that guy. With Lotulelei off the board I would rather see Raiders trade the pick.
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Old 02-21-2013, 08:34 AM    (permalink
Cigaro
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What a hole Hurney put them in. Do you think the lack of running game is principally a line issue? (no sarcasm) Coaching? Or are Stewart and Williams declining that fast? It seems like if you're running the WR group that the Panthers are rolling with, besides Smith, you really don't have to worry about anyone else and can gear up for the run.
Its a combination of poor blocking and bad schemes. DeAngelo Williams 200+ yard rushing game to cap the season shows he's definitely still got it, and Stewart was simply hurt. Our blocking was bad, which eventually made Chud just stop even trying to establish a ground game. And to add to that, he also tried to force the read-option that teams had clearly adjusted to over the offseason.

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With the passing trend can they afford to go in the other direction? Newton may have played well but it didn't amount to wins. His release, rocket and mobility lessens the need for elite lineman. And Lafell as a serviceable #2 is a stretch but I guess he's getting better. And I thought Olsen was poised for a massive year but I recognized he's just not as good as I thought.
As for Newton's playing well not amounting to wins, I completely beg to differ. Anyone who watched us will have noticed a complete difference in Cam Newton's performance in the beginning of the season and his play towards the end. They'll also notice that it correlates directly to how many games we were winning. And I don't know what more you want from Olsen. He may not be Gronk, but he's still pretty damn good. 69 catches for 843 yards and 5 touchdowns. 6th most catches, 4th most yards for his position, those are numbers I'd take from my tight end any season
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Old 02-21-2013, 09:38 AM    (permalink
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[quote=Brown Leader;3277450]
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thanks on the catch of Jackson. Idk, Ace strikes me as having Welker type potential if utilized well in the right offense. I'm not sure how exactly how their cap looks but I was thinking they may want to replace Wilson with a vet since the secondary is full of younger guys.
No worries about Jackson, I was really hoping he would come out, but it is not to be so...
I just started watching Saunders and some other Gamecocks; as for Saunders, I can see the Welker comparison, with his lateral agility, ability to change directions in a heartbeat and "quicker than fast" ability. I actually have him on my potential Patriots list. Another comparison I like for him is Roscoe Parrish, especially with his punt return ability and limited route running experience. Does he fit the Lance Moore/Devery Henderson roll? IDK...
But I do think you right about him needing the right offense.
They have rounghly 20 mill. in cap space from what I understand after releasing Barnett, Wilson and now McGee, hopefully that increases to 25ish with the release of Chris Kelsey. Currently they have enough to franchise Byrd, sign their rookies and maybe bring Levitre ($$$) back, I dont see them being real players in FA, and in regards to SS, I think they look at the mid round depth in the draft to bring in someone. Now, if they release Kelsey, restructure (which I think is likely) Fitzpatrick contract, they should be able to bring Byrd and Levitre back, sign their rookies and maybe bring in a quality FA or 2. Rumor has it that Pettine wants to bring in some of the Jets cuts, and Laron Landry as well, which I think is very likely as long as someone does not overpay him in FA.
So..., currently SS is a draft solution, and given the right circumstances SS could be filled in FA, which ideally is the way I think they want to go, but maybe forced to look to the draft. The Levitre situation and potential cuts will have alot to say about that.
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Old 02-21-2013, 12:43 PM    (permalink
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Detroit has 2 first round picks playing DT, I highly doubt they draft another.

I've heard rumors that there is very little separation between the top 25 picks and if true I doubt there will be many trades especially as round 2 and 3 picks will be worth their weight in gold in such a deep draft. Teams will be very reluctant to give up picks to move up for equal value in talent.
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Old 02-21-2013, 09:30 PM    (permalink
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Didn't make it past Eifert? Are you serious dude? Never gonna happen. Book it. TE's don't go that high unless they are absolute freaks like Vernon Davis and Kellen Winslow. Eifert is no where near the prospect Gronk, Finley, Hernandez and Graham were, and those guys all went 2nd round and later.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:14 AM    (permalink
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Didn't make it past Eifert? Are you serious dude? Never gonna happen. Book it. TE's don't go that high unless they are absolute freaks like Vernon Davis and Kellen Winslow. Eifert is no where near the prospect Gronk, Finley, Hernandez and Graham were, and those guys all went 2nd round and later.
That's fair, he's high, although the passing trend should push blue chip TE's up. I think he's a better prospect then any of the recent high rated guys like Fleener, Allen, Rudolph, Kendricks. I think Eifert's the best prospect since Gresham, who went #21, but would have gone higher if not for the injury question-same as Gronk.

A lot of mixed feeling on Eifert. D.Jeremiah, for one, loves him as a vertical threat. We'll see how he tests tomorrow but early word from combine suggests he's already getting a few marks ahead of Ertz -arm length and expected speed.

Shockey and Bubba Franks went mid first over a decade ago. Davis and Winslow went a lot higher-nearly top 5 picks-over 7 yrs ago. Pettigrew went #20th not to long ago, then Gresham.

Dolphins are expected to add WR in FA. RB is out of the picture mid first. There aren't really any worthy CBs. Do you think they'd consider Lane Johnson at #12? Or one of the OGs DE?

A top notch TE just looks like a perfect fit. Maby they'll throw money at one of the top FA TEs. Finley should become available. Fred Davis-D.Walker-M.Bennett-D.Keller. I think it's their top skill position to upgrade.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:20 AM    (permalink
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Detroit has 2 first round picks playing DT, I highly doubt they draft another.

I've heard rumors that there is very little separation between the top 25 picks and if true I doubt there will be many trades especially as round 2 and 3 picks will be worth their weight in gold in such a deep draft. Teams will be very reluctant to give up picks to move up for equal value in talent.
Richardson's listed as a DT but he doesn't play like one. A few things out there point to Ziggy Ansah, who I had in there last mock but that seems too obvious.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:25 AM    (permalink
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I see what you're saying. It's a nice luxury pick, but we have too many needs to take a TE at #12. Yes, TE is a need, but the value just isn't there at #12. There are a lot of IFs coming into this draft. If we don't re-sign Sean Smith, then Xavier Rhodes could be the top target. If we don't re-sign Jake Long, then yes, Lane Johnson is a realistic target at 12. If we don't re-sign Randy Starks, then we probably kick Odrick inside and DE is the top need then. So lots of variables to consider here. But for my money, even if we do sign Jennings or Wallace, adding a BEAST like Cordarrelle at #12 would be too good to pass up, talent and value-wise.
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Old 02-22-2013, 11:34 AM    (permalink
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As for Newton's playing well not amounting to wins, I completely beg to differ. Anyone who watched us will have noticed a complete difference in Cam Newton's performance in the beginning of the season and his play towards the end. They'll also notice that it correlates directly to how many games we were winning. And I don't know what more you want from Olsen. He may not be Gronk, but he's still pretty damn good. 69 catches for 843 yards and 5 touchdowns. 6th most catches, 4th most yards for his position, those are numbers I'd take from my tight end any season
Cam's play was steady then improved but that 2nd half season schedule helped. sans ATL. Idk, Olsen's numbers look fine but in the parts of games I watched, he didn't step up like I thought he should.
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Old 02-23-2013, 01:34 PM    (permalink
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Philly says NO.
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Old 02-23-2013, 02:47 PM    (permalink
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Love the Logan Ryan pick in the 3rd round. Didn't care for the rest of the Chiefs picks though.
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:36 PM    (permalink
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I really don't think there is any way the Lions go Richardson at 5. You mention playing him at end but they are a wide 9 team, and just hired Washburn so I don't see them going away from that. They are young at DT with Fairley and Suh. They need a corner in the worst way and whilte Milliner is a reach at 5, he is likely the best pick IMO.
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Originally Posted by 49erNation85 View Post
I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:37 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by eliasrapp98 View Post
Philly says NO.
They say yes, if Star is off the board Joeckel needs to be the pick.
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 02-23-2013, 04:23 PM    (permalink
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This is a very nice Niner mock.
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I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:07 PM    (permalink
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Updated with wholesale changes and added a 5th round.
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Pre-Draft 2014 Mock *FULL DRAFT*
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:46 PM    (permalink
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3. Oakland Raiders – Sheldon Richardson* /DE/ Missouri:
Richardson is like a LB trapped in a DT’s body. Huge motor, surprising power, along with his mobility, could make him a top 5 pick. Raiders could put him at DE in a 43 or 34. NFL Comp. Justin Smith
I like him better than Floyd, but I'm not sure I'd take him 3rd overall.

Jordan would be pretty exciting.

Ansah I go back and forth on. I don't like him as a traditional rush LB. But, if he can play as a standup DE/OLB on some downs and as a rush end on others, he could turn out to be a good pick.

Fisher or Lane Johnson would be pretty exciting as well. I love the idea of a rebuilding franchise having terrific bookend tackles.

And, yeah. I'd be okay "reaching" for Warmack.


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4. Oakland Raiders – Jonathan Hankins* /DT/ Ohio State:
First round talent but questionable motor and poor game tape plus the quality defensive line depth in this draft should have his stock dropping. NFL Comp. Shaun Rogers
Back to back DTs. Sounds like something I'd jihad for in a different set of circumstances. For me, though, this is too high for Hankins. You can't coach up a motor. Dude's just lazy and lazy fat asses don't suddenly become motivated when they're getting paid a 6 figure salary.

Jenkins is a better pick there. His problems are coachable, imo.

Barret Jones could be an even better pick. Kick him outside to guard and give us a versatile lineman that could seamlessly fill in at C should Wiz 2.0 ever got dinged.


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3. Oakland Raiders – Leon McFadden /CB/ San Diego State:
Impressed senior week but must run well to maintain a lofty draft stock. NFL Comp. Leonard Johnson
Good pick here, but with Dallas Thomas available...

When in doubt, fatties over skinnies.


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5. Oakland Raiders – Kevin Reddick /ILB/ North Carolina:
Solid but unspectacular inside LB does a little bit of everything.
Would be a great choice there, but Seattle owns this pick.
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No offense, but your Raiders draft sucks.
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Old 02-28-2013, 01:30 AM    (permalink
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For Saints, the picks should be as follow:

1. Barkevious Mingo (Werner is a better fit at 4-3 end)

3. Blidi-Wreh Wilson, Daniel Gratz, or Tyrann Mathieu

4. Darius Slay

5. Christine Michael
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:02 AM    (permalink
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Double-Dipping WR's for the Vikings was definitely interesting, and I probably would have made some different picks, but overall honestly awesome draft with a lot of great values. Nice job!
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Old 02-28-2013, 07:13 AM    (permalink
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I think that is a dreadful Miami draft.

Tavon Austin in the 1st at 12 is a reach, maybe in the early 20's he would be ok, but not that early. if Werner, Mingo or Ansah were there at 12, either in that order would be my 1st pick.

Jamar Taylor in the 2nd round - not over Banks, Ertz, Amerson or Armstead.

Pugh with our 2nd pick - it probably fills a need but I think Barrett Jones is a better all round lineman.

McDonald in the 3rd - not over Wreh Wilson, Ryan Swope or Margus Hunt.
Winters in the 3rd is avarage, hodges in the 4th I like, & Williams in the 5th is ok.

Werner
Banks/Ertz
Jones
Swope
Hunt
Hodges
Williams
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