Alex Smith is a Chief - Page 49

ViperVisor · 03-02-2013, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmarq83

Smith deserved the lion's share of the blame for the shortcomings of the 49ers though. They were terrible in the redzone in 2011, and a big chunk of that is on Smith. He was the most sacked QB on a per-pressure basis in the entire league in 2011, and he didn't capitalize on nearly enough of the 37 turnovers he was give by his defense. With the overall talent and cushy conditions he played with the offense should have scored more than it did. It looked better with Kaepernick in, and I think it's fairly damning that a guy who was going through his lumps in his first 11 starts looked noticeably better than the guy who had 7 years of experience.

The talent? I have already showed they were dropping passes worse than every team but the Browns. The 2 and 3 WRs were on IR/Cut. Vernon isn't a natural at the position although a freak of nature. We had Crabtree doubts here
http://draftcountdown.com/forum/show...light=Crabtree
http://draftcountdown.com/forum/show...light=Crabtree

Gore and the O-Line last year were failures at tough yardage. 49ers were one of the worst at getting a 1st Down on 3rd and short on the ground. Or punching it in the endzone.

The 2011 rankings page I saw last year is only 2012 now but can still look at Gore splits.
51 rushes in the redzone. 2.1 avg
28 rushes at the 10 or closer 1.3 avg
That is like Michael Turner bad.

In the close range the Line is more about positioning than just brute force. You need to be on point. The O-Line / scheme wasn't working.

2011 needed improvement across the board. Smith, runners, receivers.
It did get better in 2012.

And the offense looking better. You saw an illusion.

In 5 of Smith's 8 games the 49ers were dominate and game was in hand in the 2nd half and the team doesn't practice the Patriots run up the score philosophy.
Smith took 3 sacks up 16+ vs GB and AZ
Kaepernick didn't have 1 all year. Mostly because the team was rarely consistent enough to build a lead in the first half or 3Qs.

FUNBUNCHER · 03-02-2013, 04:09 PM

Crabtree didn't look like a legit NFL WR until Kaepernick took over the starting gig.

The 49ers offense averaged over 35 points per game in the playoffs with CK.
I don't need stats to see that the SF offense was more potent and dynamic after the QB change.

cmarq83 · 03-02-2013, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViperVisor

The talent? I have already showed they were dropping passes worse than every team but the Browns. The 2 and 3 WRs were on IR/Cut. Vernon isn't a natural at the position although a freak of nature. We had Crabtree doubts here
http://draftcountdown.com/forum/show...light=Crabtree
http://draftcountdown.com/forum/show...light=Crabtree

Gore and the O-Line last year were failures at tough yardage. 49ers were one of the worst at getting a 1st Down on 3rd and short on the ground. Or punching it in the endzone.

The 2011 rankings page I saw last year is only 2012 now but can still look at Gore splits.
51 rushes in the redzone. 2.1 avg
28 rushes at the 10 or closer 1.3 avg
That is like Michael Turner bad.

In the close range the Line is more about positioning than just brute force. You need to be on point. The O-Line / scheme wasn't working.

2011 needed improvement across the board. Smith, runners, receivers.
It did get better in 2012.

And the offense looking better. You saw an illusion.

In 5 of Smith's 8 games the 49ers were dominate and game was in hand in the 2nd half and the team doesn't practice the Patriots run up the score philosophy.
Smith took 3 sacks up 16+ vs GB and AZ
Kaepernick didn't have 1 all year. Mostly because the team was rarely consistent enough to build a lead in the first half or 3Qs.

So let me get this straight? A RB's started averaging less per carry in the red zone? How could this happen? Never mind that for example MVP Adrian Peterson's splits were 2.1 and 1.5 in the same category this season, Alex Smith was so hamstrung by his teammates not getting it done.

They had dropped passes sure, but you know what other team dropped 6.4% of their passes this year like the 49ers did last year? The highest scoring one.

The 49ers offense improved in the playoffs, and all the posturing you try doesn't change that. Kaepernick showed up in his biggest tests, and showed the ability to move the ball through the air in ways that Smith never could. I don't care what the stats say, but the 49ers were a better offensive team with Kap than Smith.

However, despite all of this the fact that Smith a 7 year NFL player doesn't have a discernable statistical difference vs. a guy who is making his first 8 NFL starts coming from a pistol offense tells you all you need to know right there. Smith was the biggest issue with the 49ers, and going forward they are much better off without him.

Even if some of these excuses are valid, if a QB needs perfect conditions to be effective he's not a good QB. A QB will never have a dominant OL, a dominant defense, Good Skill players, his health, and a good system all at the same time. At any given point one of those are going to be weak links, it's up to the QB to pick up that slack, and Smith never proved able to do it.

ViperVisor · 03-02-2013, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmarq83

However, despite all of this the fact that Smith a 7 year NFL player doesn't have a discernable statistical difference vs. a guy who is making his first 8 NFL starts coming from a pistol offense tells you all you need to know right there. Smith was the biggest issue with the 49ers, and going forward they are much better off without him.

Even if some of these excuses are valid, if a QB needs perfect conditions to be effective he's not a good QB. A QB will never have a dominant OL, a dominant defense, Good Skill players, his health, and a good system all at the same time. At any given point one of those are going to be weak links, it's up to the QB to pick up that slack, and Smith never proved able to do it.

Kaepernick was 25yo in his 2nd year after playing 4 years in college.
And does it not cut both ways that Kaepernick couldn't do more than the Alex Smith offense which I guess was unspectacular?

Who is saying perfect?

dominant OL
a dominant defense
Good Skill players
his health
good system

2005-2010 he rarely had any of those around him.

To be fair a problem was also Smith isn't a great QB but only a handful of those guys exist at 1 time. I got over the hope for greatness years ago but still can give him a fair shake.

nepg · 03-02-2013, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monomach

Remember 2008 when some Chiefs fans were saying that Tyler Thigpen was the QB of the future and others were arguing that Brodie Croyle deserved another shot?

God, that was funny.

Oh, I remember. The Chiefs were running a high school-style offense because Thigpen was too stupid to comprehend an NFL playbook. People wanted stickboy Croyle, who was so great in college, was the 86th ranked scoring offense (a lot of their points were defensive and special teams plays) back when there were only 119 teams) Dark days indeed.

49erNation85 · 03-02-2013, 07:11 PM

Damn why isn't this thread locked yet.. seems all pointless crying post in here now.

bucfan12 · 03-02-2013, 07:23 PM

I think the Cheifs made it clear, no QB was even worthy of the 1st pick, heck they didn't even feel comfortable using a 2nd round pick on a young guy.

Cheifs fans may be ticked about this, but in the end, Reid saved them from taking a QB #1, then having the same issue 2-3 years down the road when Geno Smith is being booed out of Arrowhead.

scottyboy · 03-02-2013, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucfan12

I think the Cheifs made it clear, no QB was even worthy of the 1st pick, heck they didn't even feel comfortable using a 2nd round pick on a young guy.

Cheifs fans may be ticked about this, but in the end, Reid saved them from taking a QB #1, then having the same issue 2-3 years down the road when Geno Smith is being booed out of Arrowhead.

so what do they do when Alex Smith leads them to 3-4 years of mediocrity and picking 14-20 every year?

nepg · 03-02-2013, 07:45 PM

This seems more like karma coming back to Reid for snagging a 2nd Rounder for AJ Feeley than like Buffalo getting Drew Bledsoe or the Saints signing Drew Brees.

J-Mike88 · 03-02-2013, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViperVisor

And the offense looking better?
You saw an illusion.

These Smith-haters ain't gonna see that!
Even though it was with the same team, same OL who never missed a start anywhere, same season same coach..... and even though opposing defenses had little film on Kapernick compared to Smith, these stats are...... pretty close?

It can't be... BBD & VidalSassoon say Smith sucked?

vidae · 03-02-2013, 10:15 PM

J-Mike, seriously, just shut up. VidalSassoon? Really? That was supposed to be some kind of insult?

Ugh, go. Just go.

mqtirishfan · 03-02-2013, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vidae

J-Mike, seriously, just shut up. VidalSassoon? Really? That was supposed to be some kind of insult?

Actually, considering VidalSassoon is a beauty product, I think he was hitting on you...

Ness · 03-02-2013, 11:30 PM

I thought I'd just leave this here. Remember way back when?

Malaka · 03-03-2013, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

I thought I'd just leave this here. Remember way back when?

This is my lasting memory of him.

49ersfan_87 · 03-03-2013, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

I thought I'd just leave this here. Remember way back when?

2003-2005 TV graphics- current ones.

CBS's score box on the top used to be GOAT.

niel89 · 03-03-2013, 01:40 AM

Can we get an updated version of that graphic including what Kaep did in the playoffs? This is the only place I could find snap count totals so that old graphic is off.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/snapcounts

49ersfan_87 · 03-03-2013, 02:04 AM

Any stat projections for Alex in 2013?

Assuming 16 starts i'll say 19 TD, 11 INT, 3250 Yards

Shupp · 03-03-2013, 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49ersfan_87

Any stat projections for Alex in 2013?

Assuming 16 starts i'll say 19 TD, 11 INT, 3250 Yards

3250 seems a little high, as do the 19 INT's.

20 TD, 8 INT, 2900 yds 7-9 record

Prime Time · 03-03-2013, 02:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malaka

This is my lasting memory of him.

Wow dude who was that scumbag trying to talk sh*t after Trent was knocked out?? I get it Trent tried to go low but damn that was pretty classless...

cmarq83 · 03-03-2013, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViperVisor

Kaepernick was 25yo in his 2nd year after playing 4 years in college.
And does it not cut both ways that Kaepernick couldn't do more than the Alex Smith offense which I guess was unspectacular?

Well in 3 years if Kaepernick is playing like he did in those first 8 games I'm sure fans will be calling for his head too. However, there is a different set of expectations for a guy just getting his feet wet to the NFL game vs. a guy who is making his 75th start in the NFL. It really doesn't cut both ways in this case.

Also, Kap showed up in his biggest games. I think there is fairly a point to be made when somebody has their best games in prime time against the Patriots and Bears, and in the playoffs vs. a guy who has his best games against Buffalo and Arizona.

J-Mike88 · 03-03-2013, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mqtirishfan

Actually, considering VidalSassoon is a beauty product, I think he was hitting on you...

Exactly.

V just needs to get over the "wo is me" mentality here.
Have faith in your man.
He had a nice program for a long time there in the city of Brotherly love.
Sure it went ill at the end, but that happens over time.

Alex Smith is a huge upgrade for the Chefs, was a former #1 overall pick for a reason (picked ahead of Mr Rodgers of course), and his play has steadily improved each of the past 3 seasons.

Most 2nd round picks don't improve a team.
Adding this QB will improve this team.

I used to like the Chiefs, and want to root for Smith.
But this crybaby mentality from some Chief fans almost has me rooting for Oakland and San Diego in that division.

Man-up and have some faith in Andy Reid.

scottyboy · 03-03-2013, 08:34 AM

Well, nobody addressed my point and jmike just said most 2nd round picks don't improve a team, so yeah folks, that's where we're at.

vidae · 03-03-2013, 08:51 AM

I could give two shits whether or not you root for the Raiders or Chargers. Go ahead. You're still being a dunce.

And sorry, but no coach or GM gets blind trust from me anymore. If the first thing you do when you come to KC is trade a ******* 2nd and future 3rd for Alex Smith, you've just killed all good will you had.

Monomach · 03-03-2013, 08:56 AM

Still super srsly wondering why they didn't just sign Matt Moore and keep their damn picks.

vidae · 03-03-2013, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monomach

Still super srsly wondering why they didn't just sign Matt Moore and keep their damn picks.

Or wait for Alex Smith to be released and sign him as a FA. Yeah I'm wondering that too.

Alex Smith as a FA? Awesome, sign me up. Hell, Alex Smith for a 4th? I'm in. But christ.