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Old 03-19-2013, 05:25 PM    (permalink
cmarq83
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How does everyone feel about Kyle Long in the 2nd? He reminds me a lot of Nate Solder, and our last 2 picks of raw, long, athletic offensive tackles have paid off immensely. I feel like with Scar as our coach we have a good chance of turning a guy like Long into a Vollmer type. Even if Vollmer resigns we still could use an upgrade at guard currently, and 1-2 years from now we may need to reevaluate the Mankins contract because up to this point his play has not matched his contract. Long could probably play guard for us as well.

Also if Cooper or Warmack fall to the low 20's we should be having serious discussions about trading up to get them.

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Old 03-19-2013, 07:20 PM    (permalink
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i doubt kyle long lasts that long in the second round. i think he will get picked somewhere between 35-50
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Old 03-20-2013, 01:41 PM    (permalink
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I don't think I would trade up in the draft, too many holes and not enough picks to fill them.

Anyway, here's my list so far and possible round. Can't decide if any of the receivers (outside of Allen, should he drop) be taken 1st. I'm assuming we trade out of the first and get a high 2nd round pick for one of those receivers, although the more I read on S.Williams, the better he sounds as a first round choice.

DT
S. Williams (1)
B. Winters (3)
J. Williams (1? I can't decide on J. Williams and his fit for us. I wouldn't be disappointed if we end up taking him though.)

DE
C. Carradine (1?)
M. Hunt (2? If we get an extra pick from somewhere)

WR - Rd 2 except for Allen (no particular order)
K. Allen (1) (He might drop!)
J. Hunter
Q. Patton
D. Hopkins
D. Rogers
K. Stills
M. Wheaton
A. Dobson

CB
Trufant (1)
J Taylor (3)

OLB (Cover LB, situational blitzer)
S.Moore OLB (3)
C.Thomas (3)

OL
Anyone with the Scar seal of approval works for me

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Old 03-20-2013, 05:21 PM    (permalink
cmarq83
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I don't think I would trade up in the draft, too many holes and not enough picks to fill them.
Outside of receiver and possibly RT if Vollmer signs elsewhere I wouldn't classify any spot as having a hole. We have several spots where we can improve upon, but just throwing a draft pick doesn't necessarily solve that problem. The depth isn't as amazing as it's been in year's past, however I still think we have better depth than most teams. There are also still a lot of guys out there, and we should still have a few dollars here and there to throw around.
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Old 03-21-2013, 08:48 AM    (permalink
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Yeah, I can see where 'holes' might be a bit strong, and our record with 3rd round picks hasn't been exactly stellar. If it were me though, I'd probably trade out of the first, then take the extra pick and trade up from our 2nd round pick (so we have a high two, a middle two, and a middle three.) By the time we pick at the bottom of the second I have a feeling all the players I would be looking forward to adding will be gone. :/
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:49 PM    (permalink
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We've worked out Jeff Tuel. I want to believe that we've only done that so we can question him about Marquess Wilson.
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Old 03-22-2013, 03:00 PM    (permalink
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Lol. Was it just me or did Wilson look really good at the combine? Any chance he lasts to 7?
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Old 03-24-2013, 03:35 PM    (permalink
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edit: Took out the trade.

1 (29) C. Carradine DE
2 (59) M. Wheaton WR
3 (91) W. Shields CB

DT might be higher priority but if Carradine is on the boards I think we take him, we don't have many chances at his talent where we pick. CB to back up Talib and play outside when Talib goes out with injury as Arrington on the outside isn't a good idea (and Dowling seems a lost cause.)

Didn't mock the 7th rounders, no idea at that point.

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Old 04-01-2013, 09:20 AM    (permalink
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Margus Hunt... what can you guys tell me about him? His physical skills seem through the roof.
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Old 04-02-2013, 09:46 AM    (permalink
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Margus Hunt... what can you guys tell me about him? His physical skills seem through the roof.
I'm not too big on the guy as he seems like he is a huge project and if you draft him you're drafting him based on potential. His lateral quickness is not great and he is an extremely raw prospect. If you watch him in the Senior Bowl you'll come away unimpressed, he did not look good. I wouldn't use a first on him.
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Old 04-02-2013, 10:07 AM    (permalink
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I was listening to the NFL Draft Tracker podcast and they had Scott Pioli on and he revealed some very interesting things about the Patriots and the way they draft. He talked about how Belichick and the organization as a whole targets players who were captains in college and have a college degree. After looking at the Patriots first round draft picks I realized that under Belichick they have rarely drafted a player with a first round pick who was not a senior. The only players they have used a first round pick on that were not seniors or were not in college for four years are Vince Wilfork, Benjamin Watson, Lawrence Maroney, and Chandler Jones. I don't really count Chandler Jones either because he completed his college degree shortly after declaring for the NFL draft. Pioli emphasized that the organization put a very heavy emphasis on their players having college degrees. Hightower, Solder, McCourty, Mayo, and Meriweather were all team captains. Solder and McCourty were in college for five years. I just thought this was interesting and didn't realize the pattern in types of players the Patriots were using there first round picks on.
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Old 04-02-2013, 10:39 AM    (permalink
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I was listening to the NFL Draft Tracker podcast and they had Scott Pioli on and he revealed some very interesting things about the Patriots and the way they draft. He talked about how Belichick and the organization as a whole targets players who were captains in college and have a college degree. After looking at the Patriots first round draft picks I realized that under Belichick they have rarely drafted a player with a first round pick who was not a senior. The only players they have used a first round pick on that were not seniors or were not in college for four years are Vince Wilfork, Benjamin Watson, Lawrence Maroney, and Chandler Jones. I don't really count Chandler Jones either because he completed his college degree shortly after declaring for the NFL draft. Pioli emphasized that the organization put a very heavy emphasis on their players having college degrees. Hightower, Solder, McCourty, Mayo, and Meriweather were all team captains. Solder and McCourty were in college for five years. I just thought this was interesting and didn't realize the pattern in types of players the Patriots were using there first round picks on.
Yes, BB & Co. have always valued 4 years (preferably in a big-name program) with emphasis on team leaders/captains and increasing production. I don't think he's ever drafted any player that came out as a sophmore and it's only been a few juniors (Meriweather is one you missed).

That philosophy is one of the reasons I really thought we'd draft Hankerson a few years back. Though it's pretty clear at this point he would have been yet another WR slop for us, anyway.
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Old 04-02-2013, 10:49 AM    (permalink
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Yes, BB & Co. have always valued 4 years (preferably in a big-name program) with emphasis on team leaders/captains and increasing production. I don't think he's ever drafted any player that came out as a sophmore and it's only been a few juniors (Meriweather is one you missed).
Meriweather was actually at the University of Miami for 5 years, 2002-2006.
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Old 04-02-2013, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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Right you are. I'm not sure why I always thought he was one of the few exceptions.
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Old 04-02-2013, 06:03 PM    (permalink
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Right you are. I'm not sure why I always thought he was one of the few exceptions.
Probably because his low football IQ is making you assume he never managed to get a degree, which isn't an unfair assumption to be honest.
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Old 04-02-2013, 06:05 PM    (permalink
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Probably because his low IQ is making you assume he never managed to get a degree, which isn't an unfair assumption to be honest.
Fixed for you.
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:13 PM    (permalink
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Based on the Patriots tendency to draft Seniors/Team Captains I thought I would compile a list of players who fit their needs, might be available when they pick in the first, and fit the bill of players with at least four years of college or were captains

Senior AND Captain (Nate Solder)
Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
Manti Te'o, ILB, Notre Dame
Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
Alex Okafor, DE, Texas
Arthur Brown, LB, Kansas State
Bidi Wreh-Wilson, CB, UCONN
Jamar Taylor, CB, Boise State
Jonathan Banks, CB, Mississippi State
Jonathan Cyprien, S, FIU
Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon State
Quinton Patton, WR, Louisiana Tech

Senior But Not Captain
Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC
Datone Jones, DE, UCLA
Margus Hunt, DE, SMU
DJ Hayden, CB, Houston

At Least 4 Years of College AND Captain (Jerod Mayo)
Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia

At Least 4 Years of College (Chandler Jones)
Xavier Rhodes, CB, FSU
Kevin Minter, ILB, LSU
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Old 04-10-2013, 06:45 PM    (permalink
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Based on the Patriots tendency to draft Seniors/Team Captains I thought I would compile a list of players who fit their needs, might be available when they pick in the first, and fit the bill of players with at least four years of college or were captains

Senior AND Captain (Nate Solder)
Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
Manti Te'o, ILB, Notre Dame
Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
Alex Okafor, DE, Texas
Arthur Brown, LB, Kansas State

Senior But Not Captain
Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC

At Least 4 Years of College AND Captain (Jerod Mayo)
Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia

At Least 4 Years of College (Chandler Jones)
Xavier Rhodes, CB, FSU
Kevin Minter, ILB, LSU
As previously mentioned I will punt kittens off of a bridge if we take another slow linebacker who can't cover with a high pick. I could talk myself into any other spot on the field, but taking a guy like Te'o makes absolutely no sense even with Spikes's impending free agency next season.
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Old 04-10-2013, 07:25 PM    (permalink
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I'm not advocating taking him. I just listed the players that fit the mold of who the type of player that Pats have drafted in recent years with their first round pick.
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:35 AM    (permalink
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Based on the Patriots tendency to draft Seniors/Team Captains I thought I would compile a list of players who fit their needs, might be available when they pick in the first, and fit the bill of players with at least four years of college or were captains

Senior AND Captain (Nate Solder)
Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
Manti Te'o, ILB, Notre Dame
Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
Alex Okafor, DE, Texas
Arthur Brown, LB, Kansas State

Senior But Not Captain
Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC

At Least 4 Years of College AND Captain (Jerod Mayo)
Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia

At Least 4 Years of College (Chandler Jones)
Xavier Rhodes, CB, FSU
Kevin Minter, ILB, LSU
Thanks for compliling that list, saves me some leg work :)

Of those players listed, I can see us taking only Trufant, but like many of the other players listed I think he'll be gone. I can't see us taking a LB in the first, although I'd personally not be opposed to Brown. If Williams were there I don't know if we would take him, but everything I've read is that Williams has inside rush potential, and those guys don't tend to last long anyway.

It certainly looks like we'll be trying really hard to trade out of the first. The Sander's offer sheet tells me that after the numerous WRs we've looked at through the draft visits, they don't see any that can come in and start right away, which also leads me to believe we won't be taking a WR with our first pick, but rather a developmental guy with our second one. If we stay at the end of the second I have to wonder who will be left. Maybe Wheaton, Stills or Swope? Rogers will still be there, but I don't know if we take that gamble. Been reading there are question marks on Hunter's football IQ, so I'd be surprised if we take him. (I think there's even a decent chance we won't take any WR.)

If it were me and assuming the DE's are gone (Werner or Carradine) I'd go with Allen, Woods or maybe Hopkins with the first pick. However, I think the most likely first pick will end up being corner, one of B. Wilson, J. Taylor or possibly Banks (any of which gives me a sad )

Oh, and I really can't see us taking Te'o so hopefully kittens everywhere will be safe from Cmarq's wrath.

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Old 04-11-2013, 11:35 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackluck View Post
If it were me and assuming the DE's are gone (Werner or Carradine) I'd go with Allen, Woods or maybe Hopkins with the first pick. However, I think the most likely first pick will end up being corner, one of B. Wilson, J. Taylor or possibly Banks (any of which gives me a sad )
I forgot to look up Wilson, Taylor and Banks. Thanks for mentioning those guys. All three were captains and seniors so I've added them to the list. I also wouldn't be surprised if they pass on WR in the first round. Based on the players that are on the list I made and your comment about the Sanders offer being a sign of their thoughts of the WRs in the draft, I think they will take one of the senior CB's available. Trufant, if he falls, and Wreh-Wilson seem like the types of guys that Belichick would want, followed by Banks.

Of the WRs I can't see them taking Hopkins. Not only because he was only in college for three years and not a captain, but also because I heard him say that this past season was the first year that he really concentrated on football and worked on it year round. I can't see Belichick drafting that type of guy. If I could see him taking a WR with only three years under his belt, and it's between Woods and Allen, I would have to go with Woods. I feel he is the most polished and complete WR in this class and could see Belichick taking a chance on him if he really wants a WR.
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Old 04-12-2013, 08:45 AM    (permalink
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I like Woods, and we really need a long term solution there. I'm guessing he's an early 2nd round pick, so we'd have to take him with our first pick. With BB you never know, but I doubt we end up doing that.

Speaking of never knowing, we've had D.Jordan, T. Austin and now E. Ansah in for private workouts. It's one thing to do due diligence (in case they drop) or even for scouting potential AFC East rival picks, but it seems a little odd. Something brewing here with the Pats moving up (way up)? I really can't see Cleveland swapping their pick for Mallet and 29, but really that's the only way we can get those players
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Old 04-14-2013, 11:40 PM    (permalink
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I really want them to trade out to get extra picks but you can only have 53 players. We all are hoping for a WR and/or CB and we can never predicting BB. I really want a WR in round 1, what's going for me is he hasn't dont it yet. Starting to put together my board of who I think will be on their short list, see if I nab one...
(Austin will require a trade up)

Pick 29
WR
-Keenan Allen - His knee might knock him down more than people expect maybe into round 2. He snatches the ball out of the air and doesn't body catch(like Patterson)
-DeAndre Hopkins - you watch him play how can you not like him, he goes hard and is competetive for every ball.
-Justin Hunter - He is a risky pick but is the only true deep threat in the draft plus he is a good kid with good work ethic.
CB
-Jamar Taylor - I think BB would love him and I wouldn't be suprised if he ended up being a top 20 pick
-Blidi Wreh-WIlson - Just sounds like a Patriot, another Captain like Taylor good size and can play all 4 downs which BB likes.
-DJ Hayden - Don't be shocked they have inside info at Houston and Hayden if healthy would easy be a top 15 pick
DL
-DT-Sylvester Williams - A big three tech is hard to find, I will bet he will be a top 15 pick though.
-DE-Datone Jones - can play DE in multi formations and DT in a 4 man front
-DE-Tank Williams - Take away the injury and he is a top 15 pick, better than Werner
-DE-Marqus Hunt - I'm not a fan but he can play all 4 downs and in hybrid formations, someone he can mold.
S
-Jonathan Cypien - Can play close to the line and center field, hits a ton and runs sideline to sideline. I think Wilson will play the nickel S role on our D.
-Eric Reid - Excellent 2011 tape, has the size and speed they like and can play all 4 downs.
-Matt Elam - He likes Florida players, if Elam was 6' 215 he would be a top 20 pick.

Trade Down - Low 2nd round
To come tomorrow
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Old 04-15-2013, 10:05 AM    (permalink
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Good list.
I would add Woods, he appears to be the most accomplished route runner.
Hunter scares me. I would be surprised if we take the risk.

While I personally think we can use a safety upgrade, I'd also be surprised if we take one. Everything I've read indicates NE is happy with T. Wilson' progress, and they probably give him another year to develop.

Lastly I would add DE - if Carradine, Werner, or maybe D. Jones (scheme diverse) are sitting there I think we take them.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:40 PM    (permalink
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The Pats have been looking hard at all pass rushers and wide receivers. I think if Werner or Carradine somehow fall to 29 they take him. If not, then if Keenan Allen or possibly Trufant are available they take him. If none of those are there then they trade back. I would also like Hopkins a lot at 29 but I'd like him a lot more at 39 than 29.

Finally I'm a big fan of both Woods and Hunter but I don't think either are going in the first round.
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