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Old 04-19-2013, 08:07 AM    (permalink
Black Bolt
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Default I'm Tired of Daniel Jeremiah's Lies

Yo known, this guy continues to make claims that Sharrif Floyd is a top five player on every team's rankings. He started this nonesense out of the blue BEFORE the Combine, which was suspicious in and off itself. Why start pumping this guy up just before the measurables were in? Since that time, he has mocked Floyd to the Raiders in every one of his mocks. The curious thing is, although the Raiders have been tight lipped, there has been NO buzz about the Raiders being particularly high on Floyd. And although they need D-line help, it's been reported that the Raiders believe that DT is much deeper than DE in this draft and that they will go DE before they go DT. Also, it occurred to me that even when other analysts talk daily about what player will go to what team in the top ten, they almost NEVER reports Floyd as going to any other team beside the Raiders. It's either the Raiders or he's not mentioned in the top ten! If what Jeremiah is saying about his ranking has merit, then why doesn't anyone else link him to any other team?? Putting it all together, this clown is clearly creating his own buzz about the player and passing it off as coming from the NFL IMO. The fact is, he has some nice quickness, but doesn't have sack numbers, he is on the small side and has short arms, he's only done it for one year and perhaps most importantly, he is not scheme versatile. He is a 3 technique only! You tell me, how has Glen Dorsey looked in a 3-4 after Mayock went out of his way to convince the public that he fits perfectly in a 3-4? I really believe that Jeremiah has an agenda, noble or not as the kid has quite a story and appears to be very likeable. Thoughts?
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:22 AM    (permalink
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I like Floyd as a prospect but I honestly don't get this top 5 or top 10 stuff. He has good quickness and can penetrate, and yes, he played out of position a lot at Florida, but I don't think he is this can't miss prospect.

He isn't overly stout at the point of contact and if he doesn't win with his initial burst it's over. I have him as my 17th ranked prospect and think he can be a very good 3 technique who can play a little at end if you want to be scheme versatile, however I would take both Richardson (my #1) and Star over him every day
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:33 AM    (permalink
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I like Floyd as a prospect but I honestly don't get this top 5 or top 10 stuff. He has good quickness and can penetrate, and yes, he played out of position a lot at Florida, but I don't think he is this can't miss prospect.

He isn't overly stout at the point of contact and if he doesn't win with his initial burst it's over. I have him as my 17th ranked prospect and think he can be a very good 3 technique who can play a little at end if you want to be scheme versatile, however I would take both Richardson (my #1) and Star over him every day
I agree with all of this. I don't get the obsession with Floyd in the top 10. He's a guy that was mocked in the late 20's when the first mock drafts started rolling out. He still belongs in that range, in my eyes.

Edit: I shouldn't say that I'd still keep him in the late 20's anymore. He has shown enough to move up from there, at least. Late teens to early 20's. Don't see top 10, though.

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Old 04-19-2013, 08:37 AM    (permalink
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I think he'll be a very good undertackle for a 4-3 team but I don't see him as a top 10 talent in this draft.
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:47 AM    (permalink
Black Bolt
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I like Floyd as a prospect but I honestly don't get this top 5 or top 10 stuff. He has good quickness and can penetrate, and yes, he played out of position a lot at Florida, but I don't think he is this can't miss prospect.

He isn't overly stout at the point of contact and if he doesn't win with his initial burst it's over. I have him as my 17th ranked prospect and think he can be a very good 3 technique who can play a little at end if you want to be scheme versatile, however I would take both Richardson (my #1) and Star over him every day
Also, when you look at Missouri's Sheldon Richardson, they are obviously similar players. Richardson was briefly regarded as the best 3 technique until Floyd mysteriously passed him with Jeremiah's unexpected promotion. Regardless of what you think about either Richardson or Floyd, what happened that all of a sudden caused Floyd to completely leapfrog Richardson and leave him in the dust?? Richardson didn't get hurt, he didn't test positive and he didn't get arrested. Furthermore, he worked out just fine. So what happened? More evidence that Jeremiah is driving this car IMO.
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:48 AM    (permalink
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I agree with all of this. I don't get the obsession with Floyd in the top 10. He's a guy that was mocked in the late 20's when the first mock drafts started rolling out. He still belongs in that range, in my eyes.

Edit: I shouldn't say that I'd still keep him in the late 20's anymore. He has shown enough to move up from there, at least. Late teens to early 20's. Don't see top 10, though.
Actually, he was a 2nd rounder early on.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:13 AM    (permalink
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It's not just Daniel Jeremiah, it's a bunch of people. Pioli and Tannenbaum had Floyd in their top 10. Back in January, Pioli listed Floyd as his 3rd best underclassman. Matt Williamson said Floyd won't get out of the top 3. Greg Cosell said Floyd is his favorite player. Mike Mayock said Floyd was a top 5 pick before the combine. All this buzz must be coming from the NFL, especially when you have former GMs saying the player belongs in the top 10. I don't agree with them, I don't see a special player, but it is what it is.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:16 AM    (permalink
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So this is all whining because you don't want your favorite team to take Floyd? Got it.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:20 AM    (permalink
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I've assumed (and maybe wrongly) that the reason for Richardson not being the #1 DT was the character/medical red flags - would you trust him as a top 10 pick? Only teams will know for sure, but I'm sure DJ and Mayock get a bunch of info for rankings from GM's/scouts.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:28 AM    (permalink
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I've read rumors about some teams having Sylvester Williams ranked higher than Floyd, with Lotulelei and Williams atop the DT rankings. We'll soon find out.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:36 AM    (permalink
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agree that he's not scheme diverse with 31 inch arms not really a 3-4 DE measurements. Compres to Sedrick Ellis or Broderick Bunkley type of player, which is fine but not a fit for the 3-4.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:41 AM    (permalink
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Yo known, this guy continues to make claims that Sharrif Floyd is a top five player on every team's rankings. He started this nonesense out of the blue BEFORE the Combine, which was suspicious in and off itself. Why start pumping this guy up just before the measurables were in? Since that time, he has mocked Floyd to the Raiders in every one of his mocks. The curious thing is, although the Raiders have been tight lipped, there has been NO buzz about the Raiders being particularly high on Floyd. And although they need D-line help, it's been reported that the Raiders believe that DT is much deeper than DE in this draft and that they will go DE before they go DT. Also, it occurred to me that even when other analysts talk daily about what player will go to what team in the top ten, they almost NEVER reports Floyd as going to any other team beside the Raiders. It's either the Raiders or he's not mentioned in the top ten! If what Jeremiah is saying about his ranking has merit, then why doesn't anyone else link him to any other team?? Putting it all together, this clown is clearly creating his own buzz about the player and passing it off as coming from the NFL IMO. The fact is, he has some nice quickness, but doesn't have sack numbers, he is on the small side and has short arms, he's only done it for one year and perhaps most importantly, he is not scheme versatile. He is a 3 technique only! You tell me, how has Glen Dorsey looked in a 3-4 after Mayock went out of his way to convince the public that he fits perfectly in a 3-4? I really believe that Jeremiah has an agenda, noble or not as the kid has quite a story and appears to be very likeable. Thoughts?
1. Jeremiah pumped Floyd up there after he watched him, which was after the declaration and before the Combine, thus his ranking

2. He is plugged in, that is evident, and we can start to see his track record post draft but at this point signs point to him being very trustworthy. Even if I don't have Floyd that high, I can trust the evaluation.

3. He hates doing mock drafts. He has been on record on his weekly radio spot here in Pittsburgh that he is forced by employment to do it but wouldn't if given the choice.

What happens if Floyd does go to the Raiders? How will you respond in this thread then? I wouldn't go near libeling someone before the draft even happens.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:42 AM    (permalink
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He's a top 10 talent but I'm not sure if he fits with a 3-4 team, I guess we'll know on draft day. Terrific upside and should be a solid pro. When players are asked to switch schemes, there is always a degree of doubt for every player put in that position.
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Old 04-19-2013, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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I have honestly been more inclined to listen to DJ's opinions this year than Mike Mayock's. Mayock used to be my boy, but he just seems way out there and going way too much for the shock and wow factors than ever this year. It seems like every guy he mentions could slip into the first or second round. He says that for everyone, not sure he realizes there are only 62 picks this year.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:18 AM    (permalink
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So this is all whining because you don't want your favorite team to take Floyd? Got it.
Wow, why be a complete a-hole? You've done nothing but whine about everything you team has has done this entire off season and I didn't attack you, did I? Maybe you all will pick him to replace Dorsey and continue to suck.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:24 AM    (permalink
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1. Jeremiah pumped Floyd up there after he watched him, which was after the declaration and before the Combine, thus his ranking

2. He is plugged in, that is evident, and we can start to see his track record post draft but at this point signs point to him being very trustworthy. Even if I don't have Floyd that high, I can trust the evaluation.

3. He hates doing mock drafts. He has been on record on his weekly radio spot here in Pittsburgh that he is forced by employment to do it but wouldn't if given the choice.

What happens if Floyd does go to the Raiders? How will you respond in this thread then? I wouldn't go near libeling someone before the draft even happens.
Even if he does come to us, that doesn't prove he is a top 5 prospect as ranked by supposedly the entire NFL. I'll ask again, if he is a top ten prospect, then how come he isn't linked to any other team in the top 5? Eagles? Nope. Chiefs? Nope. Jacksonville, Lions? Nope and Nope. Anyone in the top ten? Nope. Maybe he means to say he knows or thinks he knows that the Raiders are going to pick him.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:28 AM    (permalink
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I have honestly been more inclined to listen to DJ's opinions this year than Mike Mayock's. Mayock used to be my boy, but he just seems way out there and going way too much for the shock and wow factors than ever this year. It seems like every guy he mentions could slip into the first or second round. He says that for everyone, not sure he realizes there are only 62 picks this year.
I think we are too hard on the guys hired to be scouts for NFL.com or even the ex GM's. Pro teams use a # of scouts to give feedback on prospects and it is never just one guys opinion that decides who a team will draft. Each scout in an organization builds up credibility over years with his GM and then most GM's go over the film as well and attend most of the post season events.

We see Mayock, DJ, Davis etc. all give their opinions and question each, but on a real team their opinions alone would decide a team's draft board and on draft day, each scout would be asked to sell the GM on why that team should pick player 'A' vs player 'B', then the GM decides which point of view he will follow.

Finally, we haven't a clue to what directions these guys get from their bosses at NFL.com, after all, it is a TV program they both work for. Initially Mayock may have had a lot more freedom in earlier days to state his opinions on prospects before the network was really aware of what it was doing, Mayock also wasn't encumbered by having another job as a TV announcer.

For all we know today, NFL.com may instruct Mayock to do a Kiper and change his rankings to keep up interest in the program so they can attract viewers and therefore sell more advertising, after all, it is a business which equals money which equals doing what you are told.

I think we all know that draft boards are pretty well set at this stage and if the NFL wanted, they could give a ranking that would really affect draft day decisions, but that would effect their TV ratings and cost them money, so we just have to put up with the crap they are trying to sell now. All I know is that just before the draft day, they will put out their final grades which will reflect their true grades but until then, all bets are off.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:33 AM    (permalink
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He's a top 10 talent but I'm not sure if he fits with a 3-4 team, I guess we'll know on draft day. Terrific upside and should be a solid pro. When players are asked to switch schemes, there is always a degree of doubt for every player put in that position.
I don't think he is a top ten talent.
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:50 AM    (permalink
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I have honestly been more inclined to listen to DJ's opinions this year than Mike Mayock's. Mayock used to be my boy, but he just seems way out there and going way too much for the shock and wow factors than ever this year. It seems like every guy he mentions could slip into the first or second round. He says that for everyone, not sure he realizes there are only 62 picks this year.
You have to realize. Mayock used to be a drafnik. Now he's a fairly big-time announcer probably with aspirations to crack "real" primetime/networks rather than just ND and TNF.

It's probably tough to be both a full-time draftnik and big-time broadcaster. Think about if Mel Kiper or McShay asked for a shot to color commentate on MNF. ESPN would laugh at them.

DJ is more in it for the football. Mayock has slowly crossed over to the "dark side" and has to keep in mind who he's affecting with every word he says.

As for Floyd... I see it. I see why he's going to go high. His strengths have been well documented everywhere. But there's two things that are completely overlooked by those who keep saying "I don't see it."

1) Stamina. It is a HUGE advantage for a man that size to be able to give consistent motor, and + potential (vs. run and pass) on all three downs - especially with all the fast-paced no huddle going on.

2) Character/work ethic. Everybody loves this kid and he loves football. That makes a HUGE difference at the top. Teams believe there is very little bust risk. If you get a kid with pre-req size, big-time talent, and he's going to be an asset to your program in terms of work ethic AND off-the-field. That's hitting the jackpot.

Here's Cosell about everyone complaining about his fit in a "3-4".

Quote:
Are there still 3-4 fronts that utilize ď2-gapĒ concepts? The Patriots at times, and the Steelers in their base front, are 2 teams that come to mind. But in a passing league that places a defensive premium on pressuring the quarterback, the reality is, you have far greater pass rush flexibility and versatility out of 4-3 principles, but with 3-4 personnel. You want more athletic defenders, and you want them aligned in gaps so that they can penetrate more effectively. Thatís the key. Itís a tactical combination of personnel and concept.
I've said this a million times. Even if he's 2-gapping on 1st and 2nd, he's playing 3-tech on the most important down in football. You can play 3-4 that is similar to a 4-3 under in that there is a penetrating 3-technique. Philly and Jacksonville will play that style.

I understand that his best position is as an every-down penetrator from 3-technique. But it's not so cut-and-dry. He's more powerful than Dorsey was too.

The name of the article: Cosellís Take: 3-4 and 4-3 concepts more about personnel than defensive fronts

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-sh...8715--nfl.html

So if you see a "3-4" team take him, they'll have a plan for him. Jay Ratliff played NT. J.J. Watt got more than half of his sacks from the 3-technique.

I'm rationalizing him going high. He's gonna go high (I guess No. 2 and I'd be shocked if he fell past No. 4). But I have reservations too - I'm not here questioning the collective instincts of you (really, us) skeptics. But I also understand the appeal and it's really not that difficult to see if you look at it from a coach's perspective.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:06 PM    (permalink
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Even if he does come to us, that doesn't prove he is a top 5 prospect as ranked by supposedly the entire NFL. I'll ask again, if he is a top ten prospect, then how come he isn't linked to any other team in the top 5? Eagles? Nope. Chiefs? Nope. Jacksonville, Lions? Nope and Nope. Anyone in the top ten? Nope. Maybe he means to say he knows or thinks he knows that the Raiders are going to pick him.
I kind of want links to what you are saying. I dobut Jeremiah said the entire NFL ranks Floyd as a top 5 prospect. He likely said some or many teams did, which is probably true. The Jaguars and Eagles have worked out Floyd (per Schefter and nj.com). No offense, but it does sound like you are just hating on a guy because he thinks the Raiders will take a prospect you dislike.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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Floyd was linked to the Chiefs in the past.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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I kind of want links to what you are saying. I dobut Jeremiah said the entire NFL ranks Floyd as a top 5 prospect. He likely said some or many teams did, which is probably true. The Jaguars and Eagles have worked out Floyd (per Schefter and nj.com). No offense, but it does sound like you are just hating on a guy because he thinks the Raiders will take a prospect you dislike.
Oh, so everything else I said is invalid because I don't want the Raiders to pick him? That's quite an accusation. I could easily say it sounds to me that you are looking out for your fellow draft media guy.

No, I believe he is exaggerating teams interest in/ranking when it comes to Floyd and using the Raiders to increase Floyd's value. Funny, don't the Jags run a similar scheme? Yet he only has him coming to the Raiders. Furthermore, if he knows the Raiders are interested, then why not just say it? Finally, if the Raider do actually like him, why would I be mad at Jeremiah and not the Raiders?

As you can see, there are plenty fans of other teams that don't understand and don't agree with his WTF meteoric rise. Since you are here, do you have any insight as to why you nor anyone else was talking about him so glowingly until Jeremiah started pumping him up?

Finally, you are being too literal. He's obviously talking about most teams rankings, or at least that's what he is selling. And he is selling it HARD- and you don't ask why? Who else is he pimping like Floyd?
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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Floyd was linked to the Chiefs in the past.
What, for about 5 seconds? Please, you all have been linked to Joeckel (not Geno) from the start.
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Old 04-19-2013, 01:01 PM    (permalink
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You have to realize. Mayock used to be a drafnik. Now he's a fairly big-time announcer probably with aspirations to crack "real" primetime/networks rather than just ND and TNF.

It's probably tough to be both a full-time draftnik and big-time broadcaster. Think about if Mel Kiper or McShay asked for a shot to color commentate on MNF. ESPN would laugh at them.

DJ is more in it for the football. Mayock has slowly crossed over to the "dark side" and has to keep in mind who he's affecting with every word he says.

As for Floyd... I see it. I see why he's going to go high. His strengths have been well documented everywhere. But there's two things that are completely overlooked by those who keep saying "I don't see it."

1) Stamina. It is a HUGE advantage for a man that size to be able to give consistent motor, and + potential (vs. run and pass) on all three downs - especially with all the fast-paced no huddle going on.

2) Character/work ethic. Everybody loves this kid and he loves football. That makes a HUGE difference at the top. Teams believe there is very little bust risk. If you get a kid with pre-req size, big-time talent, and he's going to be an asset to your program in terms of work ethic AND off-the-field. That's hitting the jackpot.

Here's Cosell about everyone complaining about his fit in a "3-4".



I've said this a million times. Even if he's 2-gapping on 1st and 2nd, he's playing 3-tech on the most important down in football. You can play 3-4 that is similar to a 4-3 under in that there is a penetrating 3-technique. Philly and Jacksonville will play that style.

I understand that his best position is as an every-down penetrator from 3-technique. But it's not so cut-and-dry. He's more powerful than Dorsey was too.

The name of the article: Cosell’s Take: 3-4 and 4-3 concepts more about personnel than defensive fronts

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-sh...8715--nfl.html

So if you see a "3-4" team take him, they'll have a plan for him. Jay Ratliff played NT. J.J. Watt got more than half of his sacks from the 3-technique.

I'm rationalizing him going high. He's gonna go high (I guess No. 2 and I'd be shocked if he fell past No. 4). But I have reservations too - I'm not here questioning the collective instincts of you (really, us) skeptics. But I also understand the appeal and it's really not that difficult to see if you look at it from a coach's perspective.
I am not buying the scheme fit part. Glenn Dorsey and Ziggy Hood helped me with that. I said neither would fit and I didn't know why each team was trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. I do buy the character and stamina part about Floyd. Overall, I don't buy the arbitrary "top five" label.

As far as the comparison to Watt, the players could not be more different. Watt is bigger, longer, stronger, more explosive and he played DE in college and provide he could turn the corner. As a matter of fact, Watt should have been labelled a top five player.

Now let me say this about Mayock. Yeah, he's gone Hollywood for sure, BUT, even though he has had his low moments, I NEVER got the sense that Mayock had an agenda. I remember him siding with Earl Thomas over Eric Berry as the best S in the draft, and I could tell he truly meant it. He didn't go on and one about where other teams had Thomas rated. My problem with Jeremiah is he doesn't even appear to be submitting much of his own analysis on Floyd, rather he is basing it on what he supposedly heard. He's acting like an agent as much as he is a draft analyst.
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Old 04-19-2013, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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Come on you know I didn't compare Watt to Floyd. My point was that positions for NFL players aren't limited to where they line up in their base defense.

I also don't think the top-5 label is arbitrary. He's going in the top 5...
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