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Old 04-26-2013, 12:31 AM    (permalink
VAfy-ya
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Originally Posted by dan77733 View Post
Sorry but if Reid doesnt start at FS, then who the hell will? Dahl? Spillman? Robinson? Hmmmm, no. Also, if he doesnt win the starting job, then what was the point in trading up to get him in the first place? Thats stupid. You DONT trade up for a player at a position of need and NOT start him. Seriously, I'll be pissed if that happens and while im not expecting him to be handed the starting FS spot, he should easily win it. Come on. Spillman is a special teamer. Robinson is a special teamer and Dahl was signed to replace Goldson on special teams. None of them are good enough to start because if they were, Baalke/Harbaugh wouldnt have traded up to draft a safety to begin with. Its not that I dont like those other three guys, its that I dont think any of them are good enough to start at FS. Here's what I believe...when you let a player leave and you replace him, that replacement better be as good or ideally better than the guy you let leave because if not, why let the original guy leave?

We didnt trade up for Aldon, he was a surprise pick and no one really knew who the hell he was and we had Brooks and Haralson as proven starters plus we didnt lose a starter at OLB. As for Jenkins, he was a reach plain and simple but like everyone says, it takes three years for a WR to develop so right now, I'll just take a wait and see approach with him.

As for what Baalke has done in the first round, thats true but then again, WR last year wasnt a first round need whatsoever. Crabtree, Williams, we signed Manningham and Moss....WR wasnt a first round need last year. FS this year was and is because we lost an all pro starting FS and sorry, there's NO ONE currently on our roster who plays safety who's half as good let alone better than Goldson so yeah, I will be pissed if Reid isnt the week one starter.
Best case scenario, you dont draft players to start right away. If your are, then your team is obviously pretty bad. You never want to be forced to play a rookie and have have a significant role because ALL rookies make mistakes. A lot can happen between now and September. Whether its Dahl, or Spillman, or McBath or Robinson, I'm going to trust the staff. So if one of them start it must mean that he's the best man for the job.

Being a first round pick doesnt entitle you to anything, other than making the roster. I would never pencil in any rookie to start on a championship caliber team, no matter what holes we have. That's very preamature. FS is one of the hardest positions to come right in and play from day one. You have know not only your job, but everyone else on the defense's job as well. It's much more than being physically able to handle the job. Like I said, he will have to PROVE he should start. We won't give him anything just becuase he's the 18th pick. Did we do that with Aldon? No...he had a role as a rookie, but he didn't earn the right to start. Reid will probably have a role as a rookie, but whether that's as a starter reamins to be seen.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:31 AM    (permalink
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I don't understand why you guys don't like the pick? So it was a little reach but some one could have taken him before us at 31 yes it is a gamble to trade up that but hell we did not give up a whole lot to trade up . It was the right value in trade value IMO. Obviously the staff wanted this guy and wasn't going to let him slip. No way he way he getting pass Ravesn since they drafted Elam as well. What done is done. We move on to day two. I still for will be excited to watch Reid play in our defense as he fits in with big hits and terrific tackling. Not ever draft pick is gonna be perfect coming out. Y'all know that.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:33 AM    (permalink
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Lots of teams loved Reid and had fingers crossed he would slide. Oops.
https://twitter.com/LATimesfarmer/st...06884834095104
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:38 AM    (permalink
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High lights for Reid

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgZoaeyEV0Q
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:44 AM    (permalink
VAfy-ya
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And we drafted a safety that we could have taken at 31 if he was available. Key word is could have but the Cowboys didnt and neither did we.

In the end, I just want Reid to start at FS so we can see how he does. If he ends up as good as Goldson was the last two seasons, I'll be happy even though im obviously hoping he becomes better than what Goldson was the last two seasons.
And I stand by the statement that Reid was on alot teams radar and wouldnt have made it to 31. Draft Rule #1, if you really like a player, go get him and make sure he's yours. I expected him to go before our pick, that why I didn't really spend much time discussing him, same with Vacarro. I always beleived the Cowboys would move up a couple spots and make sure Vacarro was theirs. Maybe the Saints surprised them....who knows? But I never really thought Reid would make it 31. He's physically gifted and his tape wasn't bad enough to drop him all the way to late first, early second. I didn't really see it as a possibility. I was shocked the Cowboys didn't like him. Maybe they had Cyprien ahead of him or they really like another guy like Duke Willimas or Rambo. But sitting at 47, they're talking a gamble someone will be there they like, who is considered a second tier guy. And they also have other needs so there's that too.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:49 AM    (permalink
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Lets begin the obligatory mindless Baalke ass kissing like we did last year with Jenkins. Why think for yourself or have an option? Highly overrated..
The irony of your sig is hilarious
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:50 AM    (permalink
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Its like the Cully pick all over. No one saw it coming so everyone assumed we reached. Then it turns out after the draft, alot lot of teams were very high on him and were ready to pounce later on in that round. People overlook that Baalke really has a good sense of how other teams view prospects and what guys he may need to go get a little earlier, versus guys who are under the radar and can acquire later.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:55 AM    (permalink
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His game tapes aren't quite as exciting as his highlights. I would have been ok picking him at 31 but to trade up for Reid? I just have too many players equal to or better than Reid to be excited about trading up for him. Players I'd rather have than Reid at safety:

Elam
Cyprien

At other positions:

Carradine
Datone Jones
Desmond Trufant
Xavier Rhodes
Patterson
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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya:The lack of ignorance in this thread is alarming.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:59 AM    (permalink
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The irony of your sig is hilarious
Fixed..lol....forgive me for being optomistic
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:00 AM    (permalink
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And I stand by the statement that Reid was on alot teams radar and wouldnt have made it to 31. Draft Rule #1, if you really like a player, go get him and make sure he's yours. I expected him to go before our pick, that why I didn't really spend much time discussing him, same with Vacarro. I always beleived the Cowboys would move up a couple spots and make sure Vacarro was theirs. Maybe the Saints surprised them....who knows? But I never really thought Reid would make it 31. He's physically gifted and his tape wasn't bad enough to drop him all the way to late first, early second. I didn't really see it as a possibility. I was shocked the Cowboys didn't like him. Maybe they had Cyprien ahead of him or they really like another guy like Duke Willimas or Rambo. But sitting at 47, they're talking a gamble someone will be there they like, who is considered a second tier guy. And they also have other needs so there's that too.
I agree with the "if you like a guy, you go and get him" statement. Thats not my problem. My problem is that you dont think Reid will start at FS for us and if he doesnt, then seriously, whats the point in trading up for a guy who you're jumping up for because you need him to replace the guy you lost?

Safety wise, after Vaccaro, I didnt think any team was going to take a safety including the Cowboys as im pretty sure they wanted Vaccaro and because after Vaccaro, no safety was worth a first round pick but at the same time, like you said, if you really want a guy, you go and get him.

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Best case scenario, you dont draft players to start right away. If your are, then your team is obviously pretty bad. You never want to be forced to play a rookie and have have a significant role because ALL rookies make mistakes. A lot can happen between now and September. Whether its Dahl, or Spillman, or McBath or Robinson, I'm going to trust the staff. So if one of them start it must mean that he's the best man for the job.

Being a first round pick doesnt entitle you to anything, other than making the roster. I would never pencil in any rookie to start on a championship caliber team, no matter what holes we have. That's very preamature. FS is one of the hardest positions to come right in and play from day one. You have know not only your job, but everyone else on the defense's job as well. It's much more than being physically able to handle the job. Like I said, he will have to PROVE he should start. We won't give him anything just becuase he's the 18th pick. Did we do that with Aldon? No...he had a role as a rookie, but he didn't earn the right to start. Reid will probably have a role as a rookie, but whether that's as a starter reamins to be seen.
I know all rookies make mistakes but the only way to learn from them is by experiencing them and not making the same mistake twice.

I know FS is a hard position but if Reid isnt up to the task than quite honestly, Baalke should have just said screw it and paid Goldson. None of those guys are better than Goldson period or even half as good. If they were, they would have been starting already or been penciled in as the starter and we wouldnt have traded up to draft Reid who's expected to start at FS.

Huge difference between Aldon and Reid. First, we werent considered a playoff team in 2011 and is there anyone here who thought we were? Second, we didnt lose a starting OLB in FA the year Aldon was drafted and third, he was making the transition from DE in college to OLB in the 3-4 in the NFL so because of those things, not starting Aldon as a rookie makes sense but NONE of that applies to Reid and FS.

We're a ******* SB team, lost our starting FS who we should have kept over Rogers last year (yeah, I said it because its true and the only negative I have against Baalke thus far), dont have ANYONE else on the roster who can start at FS because again, if we did, we wouldnt have just traded up to draft a FS who's expected to start at FS.

I'm not saying, just hand Reid the job but at the same time, if im trading up to draft a player at a position in which I just lost the starter to FA, you can bet your ass that im doing so with the expectation that he'll be my starting FS week one. After all, if he isnt or doesnt, then WTF was the point in trading up to draft him and more importantly, why let Goldson leave when obviously we dont have a player thats as good or better than him?

Bottom line...im not expecting him to be handed the starting FS job but I am expecting him to easily win it and will be disappointed and pissed off if he doesnt.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:04 AM    (permalink
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I'm excited to see what Reid can do.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:04 AM    (permalink
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His game tapes aren't quite as exciting as his highlights. I would have been ok picking him at 31 but to trade up for Reid? I just have too many players equal to or better than Reid to be excited about trading up for him. Players I'd rather have than Reid at safety:

Elam
Cyprien

At other positions:

Carradine
Datone Jones
Desmond Trufant
Xavier Rhodes
Patterson
I wouldn't have been happy taking him period, but oh well no sense in bitching time to move on.

I have a feeling the Niners are going to trade out early tomorrow someone will want to move up for one of the quarterbacks.
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I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:06 AM    (permalink
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Anyway...enough about Reid. I dont care about trading up as long as he wins the starting FS job. That happens and I'll be happy.

Moving on...........

I asked earlier and I'll ask again since im sure you guys will know...is next year's CB class projected to be as good, better or worse than this year's CB class?
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:06 AM    (permalink
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I agree with the "if you like a guy, you go and get him" statement. Thats not my problem. My problem is that you dont think Reid will start at FS for us and if he doesnt, then seriously, whats the point in trading up for a guy who you're jumping up for because you need him to replace the guy you lost?

Safety wise, after Vaccaro, I didnt think any team was going to take a safety including the Cowboys as im pretty sure they wanted Vaccaro and because after Vaccaro, no safety was worth a first round pick but at the same time, like you said, if you really want a guy, you go and get him.



I know all rookies make mistakes but the only way to learn from them is by experiencing them and not making the same mistake twice.

I know FS is a hard position but if Reid isnt up to the task than quite honestly, Baalke should have just said screw it and paid Goldson. None of those guys are better than Goldson period or even half as good. If they were, they would have been starting already or been penciled in as the starter and we wouldnt have traded up to draft Reid who's expected to start at FS.

Huge difference between Aldon and Reid. First, we werent considered a playoff team in 2011 and is there anyone here who thought we were? Second, we didnt lose a starting OLB in FA the year Aldon was drafted and third, he was making the transition from DE in college to OLB in the 3-4 in the NFL so because of those things, not starting Aldon as a rookie makes sense but NONE of that applies to Reid and FS.

We're a ******* SB team, lost our starting FS who we should have kept over Rogers last year (yeah, I said it because its true and the only negative I have against Baalke thus far), dont have ANYONE else on the roster who can start at FS because again, if we did, we wouldnt have just traded up to draft a FS who's expected to start at FS.

I'm not saying, just hand Reid the job but at the same time, if im trading up to draft a player at a position in which I just lost the starter to FA, you can bet your ass that im doing so with the expectation that he'll be my starting FS week one. After all, if he isnt or doesnt, then WTF was the point in trading up to draft him and more importantly, why let Goldson leave when obviously we dont have a player thats as good or better than him?

Bottom line...im not expecting him to be handed the starting FS job but I am expecting him to easily win it and will be disappointed and pissed off if he doesnt.
You're taking what VA is saying too literally. Of course there is an expectation he will start at some point that's why they went up and got him. VA is saying that he's not going to start JUST because he is a first round pick. He will have to earn his job and that's how it should be. He will have plenty of opportunities.
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I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:07 AM    (permalink
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I have a feeling the Niners are going to trade out early tomorrow someone will want to move up for one of the quarterbacks.
Trade down for picks this year or possibly a 2014 first rounder? I wouldnt be opposed at all to snatch another team's first rounder next year.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:08 AM    (permalink
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Trade down for picks this year or possibly a 2014 first rounder? I wouldnt be opposed at all to snatch another team's first rounder next year.
With the way next years draft class is looking I would love it if Baalke could snag someone's first next year.
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Originally Posted by 49erNation85 View Post
I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:09 AM    (permalink
dan77733
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Originally Posted by Menardo75 View Post
You're taking what VA is saying too literally. Of course there is an expectation he will start at some point that's why they went up and got him. VA is saying that he's not going to start JUST because he is a first round pick. He will have to earn his job and that's how it should be. He will have plenty of opportunities.
I know that. I dont want Reid to be handed the starting FS spot but I absolutely, positively and definitely want to see Reid win it easily and if he doesnt, I'll be disappointed and pissed off. I'm sure you guys can at the very least agree with me on that.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:11 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Menardo75 View Post
With the way next years draft class is looking I would love it if Baalke could snag someone's first next year.
In general or at CB? Because I can definitely see CB being our main need next year.

And please remove that Goldson video.....its an awesome video but it saddens and depresses me. :(
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:21 AM    (permalink
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I know that. I dont want Reid to be handed the starting FS spot but I absolutely, positively and definitely want to see Reid win it easily and if he doesnt, I'll be disappointed and pissed off. I'm sure you guys can at the very least agree with me on that.
We agree on that.

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In general or at CB? Because I can definitely see CB being our main need next year.

And please remove that Goldson video.....its an awesome video but it saddens and depresses me. :(
In general I haven't looked into the corners yet. I would change it but the fact that the hit is on Early Douchette I just can't love it. Something about watching that little douchebag get blown up gets me wet every time.
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Originally Posted by 49erNation85 View Post
I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:24 AM    (permalink
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So @ 34 I'm thinking DL, WR, or Ertz.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:34 AM    (permalink
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I don't understand why you guys don't like the pick? So it was a little reach but some one could have taken him before us at 31 yes it is a gamble to trade up that but hell we did not give up a whole lot to trade up . It was the right value in trade value IMO. Obviously the staff wanted this guy and wasn't going to let him slip. No way he way he getting pass Ravesn since they drafted Elam as well. What done is done. We move on to day two. I still for will be excited to watch Reid play in our defense as he fits in with big hits and terrific tackling. Not ever draft pick is gonna be perfect coming out. Y'all know that.
You're assuming the Ravens had Reid ranked over Elam. I'm not sure how likely that is.
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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya:The lack of ignorance in this thread is alarming.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:35 AM    (permalink
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Anyway...enough about Reid. I dont care about trading up as long as he wins the starting FS job. That happens and I'll be happy.
Why is his career defined by having to start as a rookie? Did Dashon start as rookie? No. And before you tell me 'well he was a 5th round pick', the point is you draft players on potential. Not for what they are now, but what you envison they will be down the road. Your priorities about first rounders are misguided. Basically your saying, if you get drafted top 20, you should be a starter immediately. That asinine. It depends on the talent on the team he's going to, how quickly the player develops, and how the team plans on using him. Your too hung up on the fact we traded up for him. That's irrelevant becuase we didn't lose anything of susbstance to make that move. We gave up a 3rd round draft pick and still have another one. We gave up two draft picks to draft Kilgore. He's not starting so why aren't you complaing about that? Bottom line, just because he doesn't start as a rookie doesn't mean anything. Neither CK, Brooks, Aldon, Bowman, or Ray Mac started as rookie. They turned out to be pretty good players, all things considered. Just becuase you start doesn't mean your playing good enough to start. I rather see long term potential as a rookie than worrying about whether or not a guy is good enough to start, right away. I rather ease a young into a starting role than looking at him for immediate impact.

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Old 04-26-2013, 01:40 AM    (permalink
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1) Carradine
2) Hunter
3) Trade down
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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya:The lack of ignorance in this thread is alarming.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:42 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya View Post
Why is his career defined by having to start as a rookie? Did Dashon start as rookie? No. And before you tell 'well he was a 5th round pick', the point is you draft players on potential. Not for what they are now, but what you envison they will be down the road. Your priorities about first rounders are misguided. Basically your saying, if you get drafted top 20, you should be a starter immediately. That asinine. It depends on the talent on the team he's going to, how quickly the player develops, and how the team plans on using him. Your too hung up on the fact we traded up for him. That's irrelevant becuase we didn't lose anything of susbstance to make that move. We gave up a 3rd round draft pick and still have another one. We gave up two draft picks to draft Kilgore. He's not starting so why aren't you complaing about that? Bottom line, just because he doesn't as a rookie doesn't mean anything. Neither CK, Brooks, Aldon, Bowman, or Ray Mac started as rookie. They turned out to be pretty good players, all things considered. Just becuase you start doesn't mean your playing good enough to start. I rather see long term potential as a rookie than worrying about whether or not a guy is good enough to start, right away. I rather ease a young into a starting role than looking at him for immediate impact.
You trade up 13 spots in the 1st round for a safety, ****** better start!
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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya:The lack of ignorance in this thread is alarming.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:47 AM    (permalink
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You trade up 13 spots in the 1st round for a safety, ****** better start!
We traded up to 18 not 8, get a gripe. If your drafting top ten, you should expect to land a starter. Anything after that, your hoping a guy is good enough to start but your looking for talent first and foremost, with the potential to start as a rookie.
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