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Old 05-23-2013, 08:14 PM    (permalink
robert pancake gallery
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Is there a link to the details about how they come to their grades? Like what specifically is their defensive back equation?
defensive back value = 1 - name=="earl thomas"
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:16 PM    (permalink
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So Jamaal Charles, who rushed for 1500+ yards a year removed from tearing his ACL, isn't on this list. Their reasoning? He had good blocking.

wat.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:18 PM    (permalink
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Holy crap, everyone besides AcheTen sounds like a stubborn sportswriter stuck up their own ass in this thread. Jesus Christ.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:21 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by vidae View Post
So Jamaal Charles, who rushed for 1500+ yards a year removed from tearing his ACL, isn't on this list. Their reasoning? He had good blocking.

wat.
Their reasoning is that he didn't break any tackles and didn't do much for himself, with most of it being provided by the lanes he was given by his offensive line.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:34 PM    (permalink
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Their reasoning is that he didn't break any tackles and didn't do much for himself, with most of it being provided by the lanes he was given by his offensive line.
Running really fast doesn't count as doing something for himself?
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:44 PM    (permalink
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Their reasoning is that he didn't break any tackles and didn't do much for himself, with most of it being provided by the lanes he was given by his offensive line.
Except our blocking was absolute trash last year. So I'm not sure what film they're watching. And he isn't the kind of back that breaks tackles, he's the kind of back that doesn't get touched.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:47 PM    (permalink
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Graham is closer to a back who ran for 400 yards as a back up and has only started 12 games in 3 years because of injuries. The defensive switch should really be good for him but he just isn't on JPPs level.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:49 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by vidae View Post
Except our blocking was absolute trash last year. So I'm not sure what film they're watching. And he isn't the kind of back that breaks tackles, he's the kind of back that doesn't get touched.
Whatever helps you sleep at night.
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Old 05-23-2013, 08:51 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
that means he's not as good. he should get touched more often.
No! He shouldn't! Not like anyone on the Broncos can tackle anyway! Except Von.

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Whatever helps you sleep at night.
Weird response.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:00 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
you'll just have to learn to live with the fact that charles is terrible. i mean, if pff says it, it must be true. unless they're saying someone is better than brandon graham.
Might as well trade him then. Broncos interested? 2015 5th and we have a deal. I don't want a player on the Chiefs that can't even crack the PFF top 101.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:06 PM    (permalink
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It's a tool, a tool that is useful for analysis. It's not the be all end all, but it's very useful in interpreting the play of guys in the NFL. Stop acting like a douchey Republican njx,
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:09 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
that means he's not as good. he should get touched more often.
We finally have proof for why Brodie sucks so much. He never gets touched.
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Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:10 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
you're like bbd in the android thread. and, apparently, in the nba thread.
No, you are acting like BBD in the NBA thread. It's using a form of analysis, there's nothing wrong with that.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:13 PM    (permalink
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No, you are acting like BBD in the NBA thread. It's using a form of analysis, there's nothing wrong with that.
Except this tool is very limited to its specific purposes, and is often misused by people that use it as anything more than a conversation starter. It's a shot gun in a sport that you need a sniper rifle with all the trimmings to completely talk about.
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Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
Quote:
Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:14 PM    (permalink
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Correct but he uses it as the be all end all.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:17 PM    (permalink
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...

have you like, read any of these? it's using stats (and flawed stats at that) as the SOLE form of analysis, and then further claiming that they tell the whole story. you're literally just backing the guy because everyone else realizes how ridiculous that is.
He's saying it's possible that Graham could be as good a JPP if he got sufficient playing time, which could be true. Trent Cole exploded with proper playing time once.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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He's saying it's possible that Graham could be as good a JPP if he got sufficient playing time, which could be true. Trent Cole exploded with proper playing time once.
No he's saying Graham is better than JPP now and using the PFF metric as proof.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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Just came by to say the "you are acting like BBD in the NBA thread" is possibly the greatest insult ever...please, carry on.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:20 PM    (permalink
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He's saying it's possible that Graham could be as good a JPP if he got sufficient playing time, which could be true. Trent Cole exploded with proper playing time once.
Way too hedge the **** out of what he said snowflake. Why don't you just go get touched?
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Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
Quote:
Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:21 PM    (permalink
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I'm not actually reading his arguments, but I'm just going by what I would say. I'm not reading 4 pages of this ****.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:25 PM    (permalink
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I'm not actually reading his arguments, but I'm just going by what I would say. I'm not reading 4 pages of this ****.
So what you're saying is...snowflakes gotta snowflake?
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Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
Quote:
Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:25 PM    (permalink
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Their reasoning is that he didn't break any tackles and didn't do much for himself, with most of it being provided by the lanes he was given by his offensive line.
Their reasoning doesn't pass the laugh test.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:27 PM    (permalink
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So what you're saying is...snowflakes gotta snowflake?
I don't see why my argument can't work.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:29 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
He's saying it's possible that Graham could be as good a JPP if he got sufficient playing time, which could be true. Trent Cole exploded with proper playing time once.
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Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
I'm not actually reading his arguments, but I'm just going by what I would say. I'm not reading 4 pages of this ****.
so in reality, you have no idea what hes saying? its ok ill fill you in.

Brandon graham was better on a per snap basis than JPP, but JPP was better cumulatively because he played over twice as many snaps.

So AcheTen is saying that Graham IS better because if he had gotten all those snaps and maintained the same pace of output he wouldve outperformed JPP (makes sense on the very very surface).

He fully believes that a smaller sample size is not skewing the data and that Graham would not have a lower average output playing full snaps (larger sample size + wear and tear) rather than part time, despite an everest sized mountain of evidence, and common sense to boot, to the contrary.
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Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:31 PM    (permalink
Caulibflower
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I'm not actually reading his arguments, but I'm just going by what I would say. I'm not reading 4 pages of this ****.
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I don't see why my argument can't work.
Ribbit.
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