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Old 06-26-2013, 11:21 AM    (permalink
J-Mike88
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Default Browns rookie charged with attempted murder

Since the Super Bowl, this is the 29th NFL player ARRESTED, according to the Elias Sports Bureau.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/94...tempted-murder

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Cleveland Browns rookie linebacker Ausar Walcott was arrested Tuesday and charged with attempted murder for allegedly punching a man outside a club in Northern New Jersey.

Authorities told The Bergen Record that Walcott punched Derrick Jones in the head just after The Palace Gentlemen's Club closed early Sunday morning.

Police say Jones, who is from New York City, is in critical condition. Walcott, 23, is held on $500,000 bail. The Browns said in a statement that the team is "aware of the situation."

Walcott was signed by the Browns as an undrafted free agent out of Virginia last month. In 45 games for Virginia, he totaled 128 career tackles, 1.5 sacks, four passes defensed and one fumble recovery.

This isn't the first time Walcott has been arrested. In January 2011, he faced charges of assault and battery from a fight while he was at Virginia.
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:25 AM    (permalink
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That seems a little insane. Attempted murder for a punch? I could see assault or something, but that seems a little insane
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:26 AM    (permalink
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That seems a little insane. Attempted murder for a punch? I could see assault or something, but that seems a little insane
I hear that..... so now fists are considered "lethal weapons"? Fights count as do-or-DIE? Death tools?

If fists are treated like that, what's the NHL going to do? They encourage fist fights. On ice.
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:31 AM    (permalink
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Yeah that seems way too aggressive. A punch outside a strip club is not the same thing as attempted murder. Maybe details will come out that he knocked the guy out but kept hammering him or something. One punch is not attempted murder. That's beyond excessive if that's all that happened.
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:34 AM    (permalink
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If he dies it would be manslaughter, at the least.

Noone considers this when they throw fists. "I'll knock you out with one punch!" Well, you'd better hope he doesn't fracture his skull when he hits the ground, because you're going to jail.
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:39 AM    (permalink
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True. When his head hits the ground, or ice. NHL taking notice?
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:43 AM    (permalink
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If he dies it would be manslaughter, at the least.

Noone considers this when they throw fists. "I'll knock you out with one punch!" Well, you'd better hope he doesn't fracture his skull when he hits the ground, because you're going to jail.
What if this rookie was trying to leave but the guy went after him? Did Walcott get punched too? If so, will this other guy get charged with attempted murder too? Or does he get off because he didn't hit hard enough?

Without more details the charge can't be anything but over-the-top. It's not at all consistent with how bar fights are usually handled.
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Old 06-26-2013, 11:47 AM    (permalink
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I knew a guy who did six or seven years for attempted murder after a bar fight. He only used his fists but he left the guy in a wheelchair.
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Old 06-26-2013, 12:12 PM    (permalink
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What if this rookie was trying to leave but the guy went after him? Did Walcott get punched too? If so, will this other guy get charged with attempted murder too? Or does he get off because he didn't hit hard enough?

Without more details the charge can't be anything but over-the-top. It's not at all consistent with how bar fights are usually handled.
Usually? Do bar fights "usually" end with a guy in critical condition?

The end result drastically alters the norm.
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Old 06-26-2013, 12:52 PM    (permalink
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Usually? Do bar fights "usually" end with a guy in critical condition?

The end result drastically alters the norm.
If he hit the guy once during a mutual altercation I don't think the outcome should matter. Of course if he knocked the guy out and kept hitting/kicking the guy that is different.
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Old 06-26-2013, 01:05 PM    (permalink
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From NFL.com article

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Rookie defensive end/linebacker Ausar Walcott was charged with first-degree attempted murder, second-degree aggravated assault and third-degree endangering an injured victim, the Passaic County Sheriff's Office, in Paterson, N.J., confirmed Wednesday to NFL.com.
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Old 06-26-2013, 01:16 PM    (permalink
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If he hit the guy once during a mutual altercation I don't think the outcome should matter. Of course if he knocked the guy out and kept hitting/kicking the guy that is different.
I can't argue your opinion that the outcome shouldn't matter, but in alot of cases it absolutely does.

If he dies, the attempted murder charge will change to a murder charge. If he stood up after the punch, perhaps no charges. The end result could determine all.

And kxs, just so I don't come across to you as argumentative, I'm not saying it's right or wrong, I just know that the ends impact all in this type of situation.
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Old 06-26-2013, 02:20 PM    (permalink
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I can't argue your opinion that the outcome shouldn't matter, but in alot of cases it absolutely does.

If he dies, the attempted murder charge will change to a murder charge. If he stood up after the punch, perhaps no charges. The end result could determine all.

And kxs, just so I don't come across to you as argumentative, I'm not saying it's right or wrong, I just know that the ends impact all in this type of situation.
Oh hey I'm not offended or anything. Just talking. The "endangering an injured victim" portion makes it sound like he kept going after the guy was down, so if that's the case then murder or some degree of manslaughter would make more sense.

I believe you that cases end up the way you're saying. Seems wide open for prejudice and subjective rulings but I guess expecting otherwise is naive.
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Old 06-26-2013, 02:29 PM    (permalink
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If he dies it would be manslaughter, at the least.

Noone considers this when they throw fists. "I'll knock you out with one punch!" Well, you'd better hope he doesn't fracture his skull when he hits the ground, because you're going to jail.
Yeah, it doesn't happen like it does in the movies. Sadly.
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:16 PM    (permalink
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Don't have a problem with the attempted murder/murder charge for it but I have no time for morons who feel the need to throw punches at or outside clubs. It's a serious problem that just shouldn't happen and I have no problem with the book being thrown at this moron to set an example and try and actually stem it.

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Old 06-27-2013, 06:42 AM    (permalink
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I think context is everything here. If you're a 6'4, 240 lbs. linebacker and you punch someone who is, let's say 5'8 130 lbs., that might be attempted murder. (I don't know how big the other guy is, I was just using a hypothetical size)

Or maybe he punched the guy multiple times, or the guy fell and hit his head on a curb or some other variable we're unaware of right now.

I think if the guy needed medical attention to survive the punch, then it certainly warrants legal ramifications.
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Old 06-27-2013, 09:18 AM    (permalink
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I remember a news story a few years ago of a man who simply punched a guy and it ended up killing him. It's a jungle out there!
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Old 06-27-2013, 03:27 PM    (permalink
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If he hit the guy once during a mutual altercation I don't think the outcome should matter.
Tell that to the judge.
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:17 PM    (permalink
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There was a story I recently read where a teenage boy in Utah punched a soccer referee during a game over a disagreement and iirc the referee later died and the boy was charged with homicide.
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:19 PM    (permalink
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Attempted murder? So the guy set out trying to kill this man? In most fights, you're not trying to kill anyone (unless you are truly fighting for your life). It will be interesting to hear more. I can't imagine this charge ever sticking though unless he knocked him out, screamed I'm going to kill you and curb stomped him, or kept hammering him after he was unconcious and caused some near death type scenario. Seems awfully weird for a typical bar fight though.
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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Attempted murder? So the guy set out trying to kill this man? In most fights, you're not trying to kill anyone (unless you are truly fighting for your life). It will be interesting to hear more. I can't imagine this charge ever sticking though unless he knocked him out, screamed I'm going to kill you and curb stomped him, or kept hammering him after he was unconcious and caused some near death type scenario. Seems awfully weird for a typical bar fight though.
Perhaps he simply uttered the often overused and rarely literal tough-man sentence, "I'll f**king kill you, **********ker!"

People underestimate the seriousness of their actions when displaying bravado.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:05 PM    (permalink
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Perhaps he simply uttered the often overused and rarely literal tough-man sentence, "I'll f**king kill you, **********ker!"

People underestimate the seriousness of their actions when displaying bravado.
Or they watch too much NHL hockey. Tough guys.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:31 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Guru View Post
Attempted murder? So the guy set out trying to kill this man? In most fights, you're not trying to kill anyone (unless you are truly fighting for your life). It will be interesting to hear more. I can't imagine this charge ever sticking though unless he knocked him out, screamed I'm going to kill you and curb stomped him, or kept hammering him after he was unconcious and caused some near death type scenario. Seems awfully weird for a typical bar fight though.
These types of cases occur all the time.
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:47 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51 View Post
These types of cases occur all the time.
Maybe I'm just out of the loop on them. Attempted murder is a heckuva charge for a fight from my view but I live in small town USA so could be different elsewhere.
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Old 06-29-2013, 07:29 PM    (permalink
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Have you ever watched an MMA fight and seen the official have to step in and stop a professional fighter from bashing the other persons skull in when he's clearly unconscious? Now take away the cameras, the official, and the "sport" aspect.

tl;dr: don't get into street fights.
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