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Old 08-09-2013, 04:47 PM    (permalink
Punisher
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As long as Kiffin doesn't have to face Kenjon Barner...
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Old 08-10-2013, 09:36 AM    (permalink
Rosebud
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Originally Posted by cmarq83 View Post
I simply said the Cowboys had a shot at the division. Considering that they're fairly evenly matched with the Giants, and probably have the better overall roster it wasn't a huge stretch.

I just questioned some of the assumptions that you made. You guys missed the playoffs last season, and it's arguable that you got worse defensively. Your back 7 is atrocious. I suspect Eli can continue to produce 25-26 points a game, but it's a stretch to say that the offense is going to evolve into some kind of juggernaut because you have a couple of high round picks maturing. You guys, like the Cowboys have a lot of issues and the division is definitely up for grabs.
Oh cmarq. Just cause they're good enough to stay in the race doesn't mean they're good enough to have a legit shot at pulling it off.

As for the giants ok, care to try and make the argument that our Defense won't be significantly better? JPP and Tuck can't be as banged up as last year, our DT depth is miles better, we added Moore to the young stable of DEs being groomed behind the starters, our LBs are less horrendous as last year, Webster's hand is fixed, Prince has another year of experience to continue beasting. Brown is the only part of the D who's unlikely to be as good as last year while pretty much every single other aspect of the D is unlikely to be as bad as last year, still won't be good by any stretch, but they won't be any worse than they have been the past two years. So seriously bro, go for it, this'll be funnier than your list of QBs who are clearly better than Cutler.

Eli's already lead offensive juggernauts, he's lead top 3 scoring offenses and two years ago Eli lead a passing game that not just carried the giants to the division crown but lead them to the SB. Now he's got even more weapons, with a better OL and running and you don't think he'll be even better? Please try to explain that.

Giants got very complacent last year and ****** it up down the stretch because they were coming off a SB win, do you really think it's more likely that complacency returns rather than the team taking the wake up call the received last year and finishing strong?
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.

Last edited by Rosebud : 08-10-2013 at 09:39 AM.
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Old 08-11-2013, 09:54 AM    (permalink
cmarq83
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Oh cmarq. Just cause they're good enough to stay in the race doesn't mean they're good enough to have a legit shot at pulling it off.

As for the giants ok, care to try and make the argument that our Defense won't be significantly better? JPP and Tuck can't be as banged up as last year, our DT depth is miles better, we added Moore to the young stable of DEs being groomed behind the starters, our LBs are less horrendous as last year, Webster's hand is fixed, Prince has another year of experience to continue beasting. Brown is the only part of the D who's unlikely to be as good as last year while pretty much every single other aspect of the D is unlikely to be as bad as last year, still won't be good by any stretch, but they won't be any worse than they have been the past two years. So seriously bro, go for it, this'll be funnier than your list of QBs who are clearly better than Cutler.

Eli's already lead offensive juggernauts, he's lead top 3 scoring offenses and two years ago Eli lead a passing game that not just carried the giants to the division crown but lead them to the SB. Now he's got even more weapons, with a better OL and running and you don't think he'll be even better? Please try to explain that.

Giants got very complacent last year and ****** it up down the stretch because they were coming off a SB win, do you really think it's more likely that complacency returns rather than the team taking the wake up call the received last year and finishing strong?
I've actually taken part in a conversation on your board before that kind of revolved around the reasons why some of you are being too optimistic about the defense. If you want to go back and reference that go ahead.

You guys added Jenkins, Mundy, Connor, Hankins, and Moore. That's not really a group that is going to fundamentally transform a unit unless Hankins or Moore turn out to be more than what we thought they would be. You also lost Umenyiora, Phillips, Boley, Blackburn, and Canty.

Tuck, Rolle, and Webster are all on the wrong side of 30 and all had poor years by their standards last year. Hell, Tuck is already having back problems this year. But hey, this year everybody is going to be healthy all season, Fewell is going to stop sucking, and all the mid round picks are going to turn into mega-studs because Rosebud said so. Let's just say Terrell Thomas's knees are going to be fine to while we're at it!

Your defense has been poor the last 2 seasons, and added nobody besides Jenkins who is anything besides and average player. Maybe Moore or Hankins can be good, but Coughlin barely plays rookies anyways, so that is hardly a lock.

Listen, I'm not saying this to be mean, but as someone who has tried to parse together a rationale mutiple times as to why the Pats defense would be better because of mid-round draft pick and average veteran acquisitions I know better than to take the leap of faith you're taking. The suck will probably look different this year, but it'll be suck nonetheless.
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Old 08-11-2013, 11:54 AM    (permalink
Eazy Picks
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Originally Posted by cmarq83 View Post
I've actually taken part in a conversation on your board before that kind of revolved around the reasons why some of you are being too optimistic about the defense. If you want to go back and reference that go ahead.

You guys added Jenkins, Mundy, Connor, Hankins, and Moore. That's not really a group that is going to fundamentally transform a unit unless Hankins or Moore turn out to be more than what we thought they would be. You also lost Umenyiora, Phillips, Boley, Blackburn, and Canty.

Tuck, Rolle, and Webster are all on the wrong side of 30 and all had poor years by their standards last year. Hell, Tuck is already having back problems this year. But hey, this year everybody is going to be healthy all season, Fewell is going to stop sucking, and all the mid round picks are going to turn into mega-studs because Rosebud said so. Let's just say Terrell Thomas's knees are going to be fine to while we're at it!

Your defense has been poor the last 2 seasons, and added nobody besides Jenkins who is anything besides and average player. Maybe Moore or Hankins can be good, but Coughlin barely plays rookies anyways, so that is hardly a lock.

Listen, I'm not saying this to be mean, but as someone who has tried to parse together a rationale mutiple times as to why the Pats defense would be better because of mid-round draft pick and average veteran acquisitions I know better than to take the leap of faith you're taking. The suck will probably look different this year, but it'll be suck nonetheless.
I think this is the general point...A lot of the key vets who have had injury concerns in the past are still nursing them this year. Maybe they will be fine in the season, but its silly to not at least consider the strong possibility JPP, Nicks and Tuck are once again not 100% and that maybe guys like Webster and Rolle could be going into decline...And that you cant count on the likes of cullen jenkins and brandon myers to turn everything around...Not saying the Giants cant be good or even regain SB form, but its easy to see how this season could go bad.
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Old 08-11-2013, 01:00 PM    (permalink
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I'm glad we could agree that the giants D is no worse than it was two years ago when they won the superbowl and thus whether it is any good or not doesn't matter, especially with the offense looking better than ever.

And of those guys we "lost" Kenny's knee was an issue last year so his absence isn't new, Osi was a situational pass rusher for us that Kiwi, Tracy and Moore more than make up for, Blackburn was the definition of a JAG, and he wasn't even good at it, Boley's a loss, but with jacquain getting his snaps we should actually be better at the WILL as Jacquain's outperformed Boley in their time here, and the difference between Canty and Jenkins/Patterson/Hankins is non-existent. Our D will suck, at no point did I argue otherwise, but this isn't a new development, fortunately our D has the pieces to give some guys hard times when they step up and decide not to suck, like they did in the playoffs two years ago.
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.

Last edited by Rosebud : 08-11-2013 at 01:05 PM.
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