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Old 01-29-2014, 11:10 PM    (permalink
Crickett
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
Gabbert in hindsight should have been a 5th round prospect. I have a much, much higher regard for Carr's overall game.

In hindsight? As I recall, 5/6ths of the forum called him being a bust.

As much as everyone always talks about how professional scouts get paid for their services and our opinions are irrelevant...... we (being the fans, at least on this site) pretty all knew Gabbert was going to fail.

And him getting taken by Jacksonville kind of cemented that.

At least that's how I recall it.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:16 PM    (permalink
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and 5/6ths on the forum can't pat themselves on the back enough for calling him a bust. Good job, guys. Gabbert is probably the most talked about previous Draft QB on this forum.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:24 PM    (permalink
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Gabbert is basically meme-status. It's just a legendary fail by Jacksonville's scouting department and is basically all the validation any of us armchair draftniks need to believe we should be working for an NFL franchise.

Also, let's not forget Gabbert was Halsey's favorite quarterback that year.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:26 PM    (permalink
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Bwah ha ha ha ha!
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:30 PM    (permalink
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Gabbert was an obvious bust in a lot of peoples eyes but it only takes one team and one coach to say "I can work with those tools and turn him into a player." For every hated prospect, it only takes one team out of thirty two to take a chance. Tebow was the same thing. Most eveyone had him later in the draft but one coach wanted to take a chance in the 1st.

One of the nonsense way I judge QBs in college is if it looks easy for them on the field. Certain guys just make it look really hard to get completions. Like they have to earn every completed pass and its a struggle.

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Also, let's not forget Gabbert was Halsey's favorite quarterback that year.
I just assume Halsey likes all QBs. He generally defends any QB in most arguments I've seen.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:32 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Halsey View Post
and 5/6ths on the forum can't pat themselves on the back enough for calling him a bust. Good job, guys. Gabbert is probably the most talked about previous Draft QB on this forum.
Only because he is still in the NFL. Leaf and Russell were much bigger flops than Gabbert.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:38 PM    (permalink
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Gabbert was an obvious bust in a lot of peoples eyes but it only takes one team and one coach to say "I can work with those tools and turn him into a player." For every hated prospect, it only takes one team out of thirty two to take a chance. Tebow was the same thing. Most eveyone had him later in the draft but one coach wanted to take a chance in the 1st.

One of the nonsense way I judge QBs in college is if it looks easy for them on the field. Certain guys just make it look really hard to get completions. Like they have to earn every completed pass and its a struggle.


I just assume Halsey likes all QBs. He generally defends any QB in most arguments I've seen.
I don't think most draftniks predicted him to totally bust, a few maybe but a few say every QB will bust, so they are bound to get one right occasionally. It is amazing how they never bring up all the QB's they were wrong about, just the one they need to make themselves look good.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:47 PM    (permalink
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I don't think most draftniks predicted him to totally bust, a few maybe but a few say every QB will bust, so they are bound to get one right occasionally. It is amazing how they never bring up all the QB's they were wrong about, just the one they need to make themselves look good.
go back and read the threads, bro. like, 4 people didn't watch his tape and thus didn't see him panicking in the pocket when someone breathed in his general direction.

i guess that the nfl.com guys were part of that, so you probably never saw it either.

and this thread didn't even fall off the front page yet. come on.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:57 PM    (permalink
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I don't think most draftniks predicted him to totally bust, a few maybe but a few say every QB will bust, so they are bound to get one right occasionally. It is amazing how they never bring up all the QB's they were wrong about, just the one they need to make themselves look good.
Nevermind, don't care. There are posters here with really good track records. It's easy to search for their posts on certain prospects if you think they're being revisionist about the evaluations they made at the time.

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Old 01-30-2014, 12:01 AM    (permalink
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go back and read the threads, bro. like, 4 people didn't watch his tape and thus didn't see him panicking in the pocket when someone breathed in his general direction.

i guess that the nfl.com guys were part of that, so you probably never saw it either.

and this thread didn't even fall off the front page yet. come on.
It's not like he was a top 5 pick, he went #10 to Jacksonville, QB's drafted that late obviously have some serious warts and the success rate isn't that great once you look at QB's drafted after the top 5. Jacksonville is obviously one of the worst drafting teams of the last decade with a huge propensity for mediocre drafting, so it is hardly a great prediction that they might well be wrong again.
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Old 01-30-2014, 12:03 AM    (permalink
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It's not like he was a top 5 pick, he went #10 to Jacksonville, QB's drafted that late obviously have some serious warts and the success rate isn't that great once you look at QB's drafted after the top 5. Jacksonville is obviously one of the worst drafting teams of the last decade with a huge propensity for mediocre drafting, so it is hardly a great prediction that they might well be wrong again.
whaaaaaaaaat are you talking about?
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Old 01-30-2014, 12:13 AM    (permalink
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It's not like he was a top 5 pick, he went #10 to Jacksonville, QB's drafted that late obviously have some serious warts and the success rate isn't that great once you look at QB's drafted after the top 5. Jacksonville is obviously one of the worst drafting teams of the last decade with a huge propensity for mediocre drafting, so it is hardly a great prediction that they might well be wrong again.
speaking of revisionism... i mean, i don't really care what you think. but the guy was talked about as a number one overall (yes, by the very site you're posting on), and defended as such. the fact is that he shouldn't have gone in the first round at all, and that every bad thing he did and still does was something posters here saw and pointed out early and often. please go back and review the threads.
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Old 01-30-2014, 03:53 PM    (permalink
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Only because he is still in the NFL. Leaf and Russell were much bigger flops than Gabbert.
Easily. Both had higher expectations than Gabbert and were drafted higher because of that. Russell especially, since he was the #1 pick.

That said, the GM that drafted Gabbert still doesn't have a job in the NFL. Even though he wasn't the draft guru that a lot of fans thought he was, he knew he would be judged heavily on whether or not Gabbert succeeded or not.
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Old 01-30-2014, 04:41 PM    (permalink
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It's not like he was a top 5 pick, he went #10 to Jacksonville, QB's drafted that late obviously have some serious warts and the success rate isn't that great once you look at QB's drafted after the top 5. Jacksonville is obviously one of the worst drafting teams of the last decade with a huge propensity for mediocre drafting, so it is hardly a great prediction that they might well be wrong again.
Are you serious..?
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:53 PM    (permalink
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Are you serious..?
Of course he's serious. He says stupid stuff a lot.

He claims that he was seriously scouting college football when he was still in middle school
...in the 60s
...when it was basically impossible to watch more than one game a week
...and you could only watch that game once because there weren't VCRs yet
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Old 02-03-2014, 04:31 PM    (permalink
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Of course he's serious. He says stupid stuff a lot.

He claims that he was seriously scouting college football when he was still in middle school
...in the 60s
...when it was basically impossible to watch more than one game a week
...and you could only watch that game once because there weren't VCRs yet
And now everything you need to know is all on one website - nfl.com! new technology is amazing.
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Old 02-07-2014, 09:24 PM    (permalink
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Former Scouts take on Carr....

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"Derek Carr, he looks pretty," Shonka says. "When you put him in shorts and a T-shirt and (in pass skeleton), he's going to carve you a new one. But when you've got Chris Long and (Robert) Quinn chasing his a**, it's a whole different story. He will hit the dirt and look for a foxhole. But some teams are going to fall in love with him because fundamentally he's awfully good. ... Somebody may take him in the late first or trade up to get him, but to me he's a second-round guy."
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Old 02-07-2014, 09:39 PM    (permalink
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A personal favorite. Notice the wide-open receiver in the flat.


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Old 02-07-2014, 11:52 PM    (permalink
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Shonka must think he's got a chance to be good if he rates him as a second rounder. Should a team that needs a QB be scared off from taking a QB in the late first just because they only have him rated as a second rounder?

"We need a QB, but Carr is a second round guy! Let's draft a guard in the first round instead!"
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Old 02-08-2014, 12:07 AM    (permalink
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Teams don't group prospects in 7 non-overlapping tiers.
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Old 02-08-2014, 12:22 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Monomach View Post
Of course he's serious. He says stupid stuff a lot.

He claims that he was seriously scouting college football when he was still in middle school
...in the 60s
...when it was basically impossible to watch more than one game a week
...and you could only watch that game once because there weren't VCRs yet

In the 60's I was in university my friend and while you couldn't watch a lot of games, you learned to take each game seriously and developed an eye for talent that you will never comprehend.

We had to work hard at this hobby, it wasn't all given to us on a platter like it is today.

And what I said about QB's wasn't stupid, if you did your homework instead of spitting out junk, you'd know the %'s of finding a QB's drafted after the top 5 in the NFL is quite low. Sure, Brees and Wilson are exceptions but they had a height problem to overcome which caused them to fall and Tom Brady/Aaron Rodgers, I think we can all agree were complete flukes. Any QB drafted after the top 5 picks has between a 3 to 20% chance at success depending on what round you are talking about, which is why teams quickly draft any QB with even a half ass chance of success early in practically every draft year. Few GM's want to risk their careers on a 3-20% chance of finding a franchise QB after the top 5 picks. Jacksonville tried it with Gabbert, Cleveland tried it with Weedon/Quinn, Washington tried it with Campbell, Minny tried it with Ponder, Denver tried it with Tebow, Tampa Bay tried it with Freeman, then there were Leftwich, Grossman, Boller, J.P. Losman, Leinart, and possibly Manuel with Buffalo. Locker is still up for who knows what and the jury is also still out on Tannehill.

Gabbert who was drafted with the 10th pick, fell into that category and it should come with little shock that he struggled as a pro, he obviously had serious warts to have fallen to the 10th pick, so no one had to be a genius to suggest he might be a flop. The odds were stacked 80% against him. If you go into round 2 the odds fall somewhere between 6-10% chance for success, after round 2, the odds are incredibly low.
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Old 02-08-2014, 12:32 AM    (permalink
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Tom Brady/Aaron Rodgers, I think we can all agree were complete flukes.

I suppose that depends how you define the word 'fluke'. But I don't know any definition that would include Aaron Rodgers.


But I suppose I should ask a hypothetical. Byron Leftwich was drafted 7th overall in 2003. If the Cowboys had drafted him 5th, do you think he would have succeeded?

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Old 02-09-2014, 03:26 AM    (permalink
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I suppose that depends how you define the word 'fluke'. But I don't know any definition that would include Aaron Rodgers.


But I suppose I should ask a hypothetical. Byron Leftwich was drafted 7th overall in 2003. If the Cowboys had drafted him 5th, do you think he would have succeeded?
There are flops in the top 5 drafted QB's as well, it is just a much lower %. So, no I don't think he would have succeeded.
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