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Old 06-10-2007, 01:56 AM    (permalink
BigJohn98
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No they shouldn't. They're getting a full ride through school.
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Old 06-10-2007, 02:05 AM    (permalink
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you think the degrees they're getting are really "great" educations? the coaches want them to do as little as possible in the classroom.
You can lead a horse to water....


All the Universities (or society for that matter) is offer the opportunity.
After that, it's up to the individual to determine if it's "worth it".
...and exactly what would the alternantive be if there were no programs
put in place for these kids ? ...I mean there are only so many janitors and
McDonalds employees needed.
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Old 06-10-2007, 02:21 AM    (permalink
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Trust me, what they get paid is not enough for what they do. I roomed with 4 UTEP players this past year, 2 have had knee surgery(one of them twice), and one is well on his way to needing it. Tell me what the violinist has to worry about that will affect his/her life after football? I understand not wanting to give them a salary, but a larger stipend would sure help them out.
Not enough ? If they were injured while playing football, then the players don't even need insurance themselves. The U picks those things up.
If not the U "officially" then the boosters money "somehow" manages to take care of those bills. They recieve educations that cost most students upwards of 50-80 grand a year (multiply by the # of years attending the schools) which only covers tuition and books.
They also recieve food vouchers, rooms, supplies..ect ect.
Furthermore they're "big men" on campuses..constant invites to parties, girls (or guys) constantly throwin 18 year old coochie on them...though this holds no "monitary" value..trust me non of them are turning it down.
I'm curious as to what actual argument you have for this.
I"m assuming you have facts figures and costs for all of this and a better arguement than "the University is getting money for it".


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Like I said they are gone 9am-6pm with very little breaks in between. Having class, then they go eat, then lift, then meetings, then practice, then the linemen had some more meetings. They get a small stipend now, but they need to give them a larger one.
Is this anything more than a statement ? I'm sorry are we supposed to feel bad for these kids ???? Like I've stated before.
1) football isnt neccesary for them. It's a privilage that will benefit them in
more ways than not having it there for them.
2) If you don't like it, perhaps you should organize a protest to hault college athletics until they recieve payment....or better yet stop being a hypocrite by watching them.

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Or how about give all athletes at each division the same amount, regardless of the sport or production. I haven't been an athlete yet(NEXT YEAR!!)
Your basis is that the football players "earn" the Universities money....so why exactly should the Chess team get the same flat rate. This is just so ignorant on so many levels it's not funny.
I do see though..that this is just you trying to dip your hand in the cookie jar. Thanks for the insight on that.

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and I haven't taken more than 12 hours a semester. That is considered a full time student, so the athletes shouldn't have to take any more than that, which, SUPRISE!!! is the rule. Leinhart was an exception, because he had already graduated, so he didn't have other classes to take.
These kids also get individual tutoring while on the road (another expendature they're not required to pay for...hell some have the tutors do their work for them so they can go party) I'd like to know
if the "violin player" should also recieve the same personalized tutor service (free of charge of course) to travel with her/him while she decides to go to the lake for the weekend.
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Old 06-10-2007, 05:27 AM    (permalink
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Not enough ? If they were injured while playing football, then the players don't even need insurance themselves. The U picks those things up.
If not the U "officially" then the boosters money "somehow" manages to take care of those bills. They recieve educations that cost most students upwards of 50-80 grand a year (multiply by the # of years attending the schools) which only covers tuition and books.
They also recieve food vouchers, rooms, supplies..ect ect.
Furthermore they're "big men" on campuses..constant invites to parties, girls (or guys) constantly throwin 18 year old coochie on them...though this holds no "monitary" value..trust me non of them are turning it down.
I'm curious as to what actual argument you have for this.
I"m assuming you have facts figures and costs for all of this and a better arguement than "the University is getting money for it".



Is this anything more than a statement ? I'm sorry are we supposed to feel bad for these kids ???? Like I've stated before.
1) football isnt neccesary for them. It's a privilage that will benefit them in
more ways than not having it there for them.
2) If you don't like it, perhaps you should organize a protest to hault college athletics until they recieve payment....or better yet stop being a hypocrite by watching them.

Your basis is that the football players "earn" the Universities money....so why exactly should the Chess team get the same flat rate. This is just so ignorant on so many levels it's not funny.
I do see though..that this is just you trying to dip your hand in the cookie jar. Thanks for the insight on that.

These kids also get individual tutoring while on the road (another expendature they're not required to pay for...hell some have the tutors do their work for them so they can go party) I'd like to know
if the "violin player" should also recieve the same personalized tutor service (free of charge of course) to travel with her/him while she decides to go to the lake for the weekend.
In case you haven't noticed, I never argued for a salary, just a larger stipend. I am not going to be on scholarship, so none of this would apply to me anyway; even though I think the stipend should apply to non-scholarship people also.

An extra stipend of a couple hundred a month is really too much to ask? Of course I would say just the athletes should get it, but that is a little hypocritical, isn't it? So any person who represents the University should get paid. 10-15k a year is sure a lot of money man...(SARCASM!!!) That is about what it comes out to.

Yes, that violin player should get free tutoring when he/she has to travel for a concert.

You have got to be ******** me about the big man on campus. That has nothing to do with the University, it has everything to do with women wanting the guys other women want. So of course the people who are more known on campus will get more *****.

With the injuries, I am not even talking about insurance. If you are playing sports you are covered by the school's insurance. But those injuries have a lasting affect on your life. One of my roommates has had two knee surgeries in a year, needless to say, he is done playing football. His knee is always going to bother him. The linemen who have to be big, that ***** with their knees too.

Hell, I don't give a damn if I even ever get a scholarship, I just want to play football. But it is unfair that athletes compensation isn't even equal to a somewhat decent internship.

Sounds like sour grapes to me man.
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Old 06-10-2007, 01:10 PM    (permalink
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i say no they shouldnt... a part of what makes college so great to watch is that they are playing for the love of the game and school. i mean they fight for extra yards give that extra effort, sure once the get into a junior and seanior year they may be trying harder to get money.. but the are still playing their best... we dont need anyone coasting because tehy already have money.... cough cough RANDY MOSS cough cough... i mean come on they are getting full rides, what more do you need
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Old 06-11-2007, 12:05 AM    (permalink
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USC's tuition is $30K+/yr. thats over $120K in paid tuition alone. Other public state school 4 yr tuition is easily $30-50K.
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Old 06-11-2007, 12:20 AM    (permalink
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USC's tuition is $30K+/yr. thats over $120K in paid tuition alone. Other public state school 4 yr tuition is easily $30-50K.
That is for out of state, most athletes are from the state they go to.
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Old 06-11-2007, 12:00 PM    (permalink
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My roommate is in Athletic Training. He puts in the same, if not more hours then the football players do. He gets there before they are there and leaves after they do a majority of the time as well as taking 15-18 hours of courses. ALL of the trainers have to do this so while they are paying to go to school and having to do all of this UNPAID why are they not giving money?
He is given experience. It isn't like thee arren't on-campus jobs he could do.
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Old 06-11-2007, 04:24 PM    (permalink
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Going to college is a priveledge, not a right.

No, they shouldn't be paid.
Good post! I agree!
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Old 06-11-2007, 06:05 PM    (permalink
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anyone thats been around big time college football...or has played it..knows those guys arnt left in need of anything...they shouldnt be gettin a paycheck...they are well taken care of
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Old 06-12-2007, 09:37 AM    (permalink
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They definitely should be paid, most are recruited to play sports and the school hardly cares if they ever graduate. They do not get a FREE Education, they have to put in long hours of practice, weight training etc. etc. to stay eligible and play games even at exam time which often involves hours of travel. They risk serious injuries which can have life time consequences.
The schools barely let 60% graduate mostly to satisfy the parents in enticing prospects to come to their school. It used to be more in like 35-40% graduation rates before newspapers started printing the results and embarrassed schools into working harder to pass their student athletes.
The schools make millions off their efforts and continue to increase the # of games they play to maximize their profits while increasing significantly the chances for a very serious injury. They are IN FACT, employees of the University who get peanuts for the amount of money they generate for their schools and have absolutely no recourse. They are in fact saves who get a pittance for their efforts and are terminated if the school sees fit. It may appear on the surface to be a comfortable slavery but it is slavery nevertheless. There is NO other program in a university that asks its students to risk life and serious injury to attend school for a slim chance to graduate in a serious program.
The whole system is totally disgusting and some day it will seriously be tested in the courts for its abuse but until then, those who support it sound a lot like pre Civil War southern sympathizers who argued their slaves were after all, looked after, fed and housed at no cost to them and should be happy with their situation. YES, they definitely need to be paid!!!
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Old 06-12-2007, 11:30 AM    (permalink
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anyone thats been around big time college football...or has played it..knows those guys arnt left in need of anything...they shouldnt be gettin a paycheck...they are well taken care of
Yes, through boosters, which is against the rules. Paying the athletes even the playing field. Honestly, do you think UTEP boosters can/will pay athletes as much as UT boosters? You give the athletes more money(the same amount at each school) and you even the recruiting field somewhat, leading to more parity.
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Old 06-12-2007, 11:32 AM    (permalink
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They definitely should be paid, most are recruited to play sports and the school hardly cares if they ever graduate. They do not get a FREE Education, they have to put in long hours of practice, weight training etc. etc. to stay eligible and play games even at exam time which often involves hours of travel. They risk serious injuries which can have life time consequences.
The schools barely let 60% graduate mostly to satisfy the parents in enticing prospects to come to their school. It used to be more in like 35-40% graduation rates before newspapers started printing the results and embarrassed schools into working harder to pass their student athletes.
The schools make millions off their efforts and continue to increase the # of games they play to maximize their profits while increasing significantly the chances for a very serious injury. They are IN FACT, employees of the University who get peanuts for the amount of money they generate for their schools and have absolutely no recourse. They are in fact saves who get a pittance for their efforts and are terminated if the school sees fit. It may appear on the surface to be a comfortable slavery but it is slavery nevertheless. There is NO other program in a university that asks its students to risk life and serious injury to attend school for a slim chance to graduate in a serious program.
The whole system is totally disgusting and some day it will seriously be tested in the courts for its abuse but until then, those who support it sound a lot like pre Civil War southern sympathizers who argued their slaves were after all, looked after, fed and housed at no cost to them and should be happy with their situation. YES, they definitely need to be paid!!!
Slavery? I wouldn't go that far, it is optional after all. But athletes do deserve to get paid, just for the fact that a single serious knee injury will probably affect the athlete for the rest of their life, likely ending in knee replacement surgery years down the road, something the school won't pay for when you are 60.
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:41 AM    (permalink
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They definitely should be paid, most are recruited to play sports and the school hardly cares if they ever graduate. They do not get a FREE Education, they have to put in long hours of practice, weight training etc. etc. to stay eligible and play games even at exam time which often involves hours of travel. They risk serious injuries which can have life time consequences.
The schools barely let 60% graduate mostly to satisfy the parents in enticing prospects to come to their school. It used to be more in like 35-40% graduation rates before newspapers started printing the results and embarrassed schools into working harder to pass their student athletes.
The schools make millions off their efforts and continue to increase the # of games they play to maximize their profits while increasing significantly the chances for a very serious injury. They are IN FACT, employees of the University who get peanuts for the amount of money they generate for their schools and have absolutely no recourse. They are in fact saves who get a pittance for their efforts and are terminated if the school sees fit. It may appear on the surface to be a comfortable slavery but it is slavery nevertheless. There is NO other program in a university that asks its students to risk life and serious injury to attend school for a slim chance to graduate in a serious program.
The whole system is totally disgusting and some day it will seriously be tested in the courts for its abuse but until then, those who support it sound a lot like pre Civil War southern sympathizers who argued their slaves were after all, looked after, fed and housed at no cost to them and should be happy with their situation. YES, they definitely need to be paid!!!
Hahahahaha, slavery. They don't have to play football. They can hit the books and study and get a desk job if they want! This shouldn't even be brought up, it is ludicrous to even consider athletics anything like slavery - mainly, that sports are fun!

Football provides lots of athletes to the ability to obtain an education that they could not afford. Not everyone is there just for football - there are thousands and thousands of athletes that go pro at something other than sports....

And for the big time athletes that work at it, they can graduate. I know Demeco Ryans graduated in 7 semesters and he was the ROY.

Again, no one is making these kids play football. It is a choice that they make. They are looked up to and praised, hardly the same treatment given to slaves.
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:44 AM    (permalink
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But athletes do deserve to get paid, just for the fact that a single serious knee injury will probably affect the athlete for the rest of their life, likely ending in knee replacement surgery years down the road, something the school won't pay for when you are 60.
What about high school athletes? Can't they get injured too? Should they be paid so in case they suffer knee injuries?
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:54 AM    (permalink
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i havent read anything

but did someone seriously compare collefe athletics to slavery?
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:57 AM    (permalink
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What about high school athletes? Can't they get injured too? Should they be paid so in case they suffer knee injuries?
High school and college football is completely different, and you know that. For one thing, serious injuries in high school football are much less common. For another, they make little to no money for their school. And finally, they can easily have a job, college football players do not have time for a job, and when they can get one, it has to be approved by the NCAA.
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Old 06-13-2007, 02:25 AM    (permalink
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High school and college football is completely different, and you know that. For one thing, serious injuries in high school football are much less common. For another, they make little to no money for their school.
It's still a possibility. However, Football at most schools bring in a lot of their sports budget.

Frankly,

They do get paid, As do smart kids, and minorities.

They get free scholarships. They have to produce and they get free-education.

I can't play sports anymore (Well, My doctor told me they can fix my condition and I could get back to playing shape), and I have to work for an Academic Scholarship... because If I don't, I'll basically have to pay back the cost of an education, that can potentially cost upwards the value of 10-20 Lexus'.


So to say there's nothing to save a student-athlete if they get injured.... most Scholarships, have clauses to protect students if they get injured, by still providing a free education...


My cousin got one, he was a 6'4 324lb DT.. He went to Robert Morris and I think Plays OL.

He got injured his Senior year in school.. and when he signed his scholarship RMU showed the Clause in his scholarship that as long as he has a certain GPA (2.5 or 2.75 I believe), he would then be transferred over to an academic scholarship.


So they get paid, they have the luxury of a great education that most normal people have to pay back for 20-30 years..
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Old 06-13-2007, 04:06 AM    (permalink
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It's still a possibility. However, Football at most schools bring in a lot of their sports budget.

Frankly,

They do get paid, As do smart kids, and minorities.

They get free scholarships. They have to produce and they get free-education.

I can't play sports anymore (Well, My doctor told me they can fix my condition and I could get back to playing shape), and I have to work for an Academic Scholarship... because If I don't, I'll basically have to pay back the cost of an education, that can potentially cost upwards the value of 10-20 Lexus'.


So to say there's nothing to save a student-athlete if they get injured.... most Scholarships, have clauses to protect students if they get injured, by still providing a free education...


My cousin got one, he was a 6'4 324lb DT.. He went to Robert Morris and I think Plays OL.

He got injured his Senior year in school.. and when he signed his scholarship RMU showed the Clause in his scholarship that as long as he has a certain GPA (2.5 or 2.75 I believe), he would then be transferred over to an academic scholarship.


So they get paid, they have the luxury of a great education that most normal people have to pay back for 20-30 years..
I'm not even talking about not being able to play if they get injured. I am talking about the doctor bills from knee or hip replacement surgeries when they are older that they have to get due to the wear and tear of college football.
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Old 06-13-2007, 08:40 AM    (permalink
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Going to all these D1 Universities provides one with GREAT opportunities.

That, in itself, is a worthy reward.
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Old 06-13-2007, 09:38 AM    (permalink
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There is a huge difference between choosing to play high school football and playing college football. In high school you aren't required to pay to attend and you aren't on scholarship in order to afford to go. In university I'd guess that most of the student athletes especially in football and basketball couldn't afford to attend if they didn't play their sport. The NFL also requires that they play college football until their junior year. So the vast majority of college players are forced to accept scholarships and follow the rules.
It is very much like slavery. It may appear to be a comfortable slavery but when a person is denied wages for making a university millions of dollars, it begins to look like a type of slavery when the HC can force a kid to practice, train and play in order to stay in school with only a 60% chance they will ever graduate and that # probably diminishes if you only look only at football and basketball student athletes. Football in particular carries an astounding 10% chance of a serious injury which can effect a person their whole life never mind the back and hip injuries which may not show up for another 20 years as the bones degenerate slowly over time.
What is really disgusting is how the universities have taken advantage of their football and basketball student athletes by increasing the # of games they MUST play to maximize their profits even though they know very well that more games equals a lot more serious injuries. The more tired a player becomes as a season progresses, the more susceptible he becomes to injuries. Longer seasons also mean that student athletes have a far harder time to graduate as they are required to give up even more of their study time for their sport.
The NCAA limits severely how much a student athlete can make in the off season. How many students on scholarship who aren't athletes are told how much they can make in the summer. The restrictions on these kids is unbelievable and demands complete servitude while attending university and that my friend smells a lot like a type of slavery to me.
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:01 PM    (permalink
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Paying college players would be terrible for college football. One reason I enjoy college more than the nfl, is because you dont see players only caring about themselves and how much they are getting paid. College players work their butts off and play hard every game so one day they can get paid to play football in the nfl. Most college players have full scholarships and most big name colleges for one semester you have to pay between 30 and 50 thousand just to attend that school. so if a player goes to college for 4 years thats 200,000. also they get put in nice dorms and have much more benefits than your average student has. So when you think about it, they are getting paid, with a free college education, place to live and eat. instead of a pay check.
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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Due to some equal rights law that Nixon passed while in office, if you want to pay John David Booty a certain amount of money, you have to pay every athlete in the entire school the exact same amount of money.
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Old 06-13-2007, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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High school and college football is completely different, and you know that. For one thing, serious injuries in high school football are much less common. For another, they make little to no money for their school. And finally, they can easily have a job, college football players do not have time for a job, and when they can get one, it has to be approved by the NCAA.
I for a fact know a guy that broke his ankle - foot really badly playing high school football. He has no more cartilage and will walk in pain the rest of his life. I know a guy who tore his meniscus 3 times. I saw 2 ACL tears happen in the same season. Not to mention all the broken arms, hands, fingers, and collar bones. Concussions are also quite common. Don't act like just because it is high-school and not college that bad injuries can't happen.

Of course high school football makes little or no money for their school. They don't have thousands and thousands of alumni that are willing to come and watch them every friday night. They do however generate more revenue than let's say....the girls track team.

College football players can have a job during the entire offseason - same with highschool. Anyways if they are on scholarship - why do they need a job? It isn't like they have to pay their way through school.
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Old 06-13-2007, 02:07 PM    (permalink
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