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Old 01-21-2010, 09:28 PM    (permalink
WMD
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What the hell is that supposed to mean?
It means he goes against the grain, man.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:31 PM    (permalink
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I'm gonna brag about seeing Eros now, which is 2/3 foreign... and in three different languages!!!!!! OMG!!! And I liked it!!! Wow!!!
But if there's subtitles, the acting is ruined. How can you like it if you are a fan of acting?
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:33 PM    (permalink
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Battle Royale ftw
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:33 PM    (permalink
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Again, I just want to know how a scene in a different language ruins the acting. You said subtitles ruin the acting. How is it any different than if you say understand what is being said in whatever language it is? Because YOU have to read does not mean the acting sucks. It could be incredible acting, but because you don't understand the words and have to read what's being said makes the acting worse somehow?

I just don't understand how subtitles make the acting worse, when if you understand the language it is in then it would make absolutely no difference.
Now, I see what you're saying. I don't mean the subtitles ruin the acting. That is ********.

You're right, it could be great acting. I'm not gonna know it because I'm reading the script and not paying attention to the actors. THAT MEANS MY ATTENTION IS OFF THE ACTORS/PERFORMANCE, which makes their performance... worthless. It could be anybody up there just going through the motions.

Would you rather read a screenplay or watch it acted out? That's a rhetorical question. We both know that answer.

Now, I'm sure we have 50 different people that read evert screenplay out there.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:34 PM    (permalink
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I'm gonna brag about seeing Eros now, which is 2/3 foreign... and in three different languages!!!!!! OMG!!! And I liked it!!! Wow!!!
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:35 PM    (permalink
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I still fail to comprehend what is so difficult about reading a single line of dialogue while watching the person who is saying it. While I can understand that reading can be strenuous to some, it doesn't really seem all that complicated of a procedure.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:37 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by iowatreat54 View Post
But if there's subtitles, the acting is ruined. How can you like it if you are a fan of acting?
Well, have you seen it?

At least you didn't call me an acting buff or whatever it was you used. Importance (to the film) and attempting to be some acting buff are two different things.


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What the hell is that supposed to mean?
Bro, it's called sarcasm. It was a stupid post and I entertained him by giving him an even dumber response. That's all it was.

Board needs to lighten up. Everyone is so serious around here.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:38 PM    (permalink
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But see, if a movie was in French, and you completely understood French, then you wouldn't need subtitles and could enjoy the acting without reading.

Since you don't understand French, you need to read subtitles to understand what is going on. Thus, in your eyes, you are focused on the words not the acting.

However, I fail to see how that makes anything worse other than you perception. A movie doesn't fluctuate with what you do or do not know. It's not like if you watch a movie but don't understand French, it's bad, but then you learn French, rewatch it and it's good. The acting doesn't change, it's your perception of the acting.

Again, if you feel like you are just reading the script, that isn't the fault of the movie. It's your problem that you don't understand the language it is originally in, not the movie/the acting.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:43 PM    (permalink
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But see, if a movie was in French, and you completely understood French, then you wouldn't need subtitles and could enjoy the acting without reading.

Since you don't understand French, you need to read subtitles to understand what is going on. Thus, in your eyes, you are focused on the words not the acting.
OMG, he gets it. This is why I watch, predominately, American movies even though I've seen just as much non-American movies as the next person on this site.





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However, I fail to see how that makes anything worse other than you perception. A movie doesn't fluctuate with what you do or do not know. It's not like if you watch a movie but don't understand French, it's bad, but then you learn French, rewatch it and it's good. The acting doesn't change, it's your perception of the acting.

Again, if you feel like you are just reading the script, that isn't the fault of the movie. It's your problem that you don't understand the language it is originally in, not the movie/the acting.
BOLD- AGREED!!!!! I have not blamed the movies... and to my first ******* point... IT'S A MATTER OF ******* TASTE!!!!!


Which is why I semi-defended Dreadlock dude.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:50 PM    (permalink
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You specifically said that subtitles ruin the acting. But how is the acting different whether there is subtitles or not? The acting never changes, just your understanding.

I understand it's just a preference, and that having to read subtitles may ruin the experience FOR THE VIEWER. However, it doesn't make the acting worse. The acting is completely independent and cannot be changed. Like I said, it's not like you don't understand French, think the acting is bad, then learn French, rewatch, and the acting has improved.

You should say subtitles ruins the experience for you, not that it ruins the acting, writing, or anything with the production of the movie. The only thing subtitles effect is the viewing experience.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:53 PM    (permalink
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I dont see how reading subtitles prevents you form appreciating the acting.

Read faster, dudes.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:54 PM    (permalink
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I still fail to comprehend what is so difficult about reading a single line of dialogue while watching the person who is saying it. While I can understand that reading can be strenuous to some, it doesn't really seem all that complicated of a procedure.
Well, I've seen more foreign films than you would think I have, and if you're saying I can't follow along, and if that's what you're interpreting, then you're wrong.

It does, however, impact the acting ON ME (I shouldn't have to add this is in) when I have to constantly divert my attention off of the actors, to the bottom of the screen. It takes away from the performances and the their impact ON ME.

City of God, The Lives of Others, Four Months, 3 Weeks and 2 Days, Let the Right On In, Lust, Caution, In the Mood for Love, Diving Bell and the Butterfly, Pan's Labyrinth, Battle Royal... those are the movies most people who watch a lot of movies (I consider myself one of them) are going to see just from your typical critic praise, and, I've seen them all, and a few more that have come out over the last 10 years. I've also seen Seven Samuri. Look at me... a really old movie that was in Japanese. It was ******* awful, but I wanted to see what the fuss was all about. So I've even gone back into the history books with foreign movies.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:59 PM    (permalink
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BigBanger. Pick your top 5 favorite acting performance of all-time. Are you trying to tell us that anyone who saw those performances who does not speak English will not be able to appreciate the quality of those performances.
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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See, then the subtitles do not effect the acting, they effect you. The acting doesn't change based on whose watching, only how the watcher views it.

So the acting is either good or bad. It can't be changed. Nothing can effect it. Therefore, it's impossible for subtitles to ruin the acting. Subtitles have absolutely no baring on the quality of the acting or the delivery of said lines.

Instead of saying subtitles ruin the acting, you should have said I don't like watching movies with subtitles and it has absolutely nothing to do with the acting, special effects, writing, or otherwise. It's just my preference not to read so that I can appreciate the other aspects and has absolutely no baring on whether the actual performance is good or not.
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:05 PM    (permalink
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BigBanger. Pick your top 5 favorite acting performance of all-time. Are you trying to tell us that anyone who saw those performances who does not speak English will not be able to appreciate the quality of those performances.
1. Channing Tatum in GI Joe
2. Channing Tatum in Stop-Loss
3. Channing Tatum in Dear John (too early? I say no)
4. Channing Tatum in She's the Man
5. Channing Tatum in Fighting
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:06 PM    (permalink
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You specifically said that subtitles ruin the acting. But how is the acting different whether there is subtitles or not? The acting never changes, just your understanding.

I understand it's just a preference, and that having to read subtitles may ruin the experience FOR THE VIEWER. However, it doesn't make the acting worse. The acting is completely independent and cannot be changed. Like I said, it's not like you don't understand French, think the acting is bad, then learn French, rewatch, and the acting has improved.

You should say subtitles ruins the experience for you, not that it ruins the acting, writing, or anything with the production of the movie. The only thing subtitles effect is the viewing experience.
This little debate is and already was over. I didn't say that. My first response:

Quote:
I'm big on acting and I like to watch the nuances of a performance (the whole point of great acting). I don't like reading the lines at the bottom of the screen while missing the delivery of the lines. It makes the acting worthless and greatly detracts from the impact of the characters and the overall importance of the story.
If you can't understand that, I don't know what to tell ya. I was expressing my OWN PERSONAL OPINION on the matter.

I use the word "I" about 15 million times. I have said repeatedly that it's (it being foreign films/subtitles) a matter of taste.

I have not said subtitles ruin acting. That is the second time you have said I said that, and this is the second time I'm telling you, I DID NOT SAY THAT. That is ******** and makes no sense, I would never say something that stupid. Again, that the second time I have said that.

The language barrier is the problem, which we have discussed and both came to a mutual agreement on. Again, matter of taste.
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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1. Channing Tatum in GI Joe
2. Channing Tatum in Stop-Loss
3. Channing Tatum in Dear John (too early? I say no)
4. Channing Tatum in She's the Man
5. Channing Tatum in Fighting
Wow, no Step Up?

For shame Brodeur, for shame...
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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You have to give Tatum credit for A Guide to Recognizing Your Saints
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:13 PM    (permalink
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BigBanger. Pick your top 5 favorite acting performance of all-time. Are you trying to tell us that anyone who saw those performances who does not speak English will not be able to appreciate the quality of those performances.
No.

I'm saying some kid in China could have a top 5 with a bunch of Chinese made films and Chinese actors delivering lines in a language I can't comprehend. I, ME PERSONALLY, am not going to agree with that list. But, I'm not going to trash his list either. It's his ******* list. Who am I to say he's wrong? His opinion. His taste. Bashing him is for immature people, like APS.

I could show that little Chinese boy a list that includes Patrick Batemen, Dirk Diggler, Jake La Matta, Bill the Butcher and Tony Montana (5 of my favorites just off the top of my head). Will he like it? I don't know. He might. He might not. He might blame the language barrier. He might call them over-the-top. He might call them abrasive. He might be offended by the harsh language. He might not have any clue who they are. He might love some of those performances, maybe all of them. I don't know what the **** this little Chinese boy likes, and I don't really care.

Your question was way too broad. I narrowed it way down.
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:13 PM    (permalink
iowatreat54
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This little debate is and already was over. I didn't say that. My first response:


If you can't understand that, I don't know what to tell ya. I was expressing my OWN PERSONAL OPINION on the matter.

I use the word "I" about 15 million times. I have said repeatedly that it's (it being foreign films/subtitles) a matter of taste.

I have not said subtitles ruin acting. That is the second time you have said I said that, and this is the second time I'm telling you, I DID NOT SAY THAT. That is ******** and makes no sense, I would never say something that stupid. Again, that the second time I have said that.

The language barrier is the problem, which we have discussed and both came to a mutual agreement on. Again, matter of taste.
You are completely missing the point.

It is a personal preference whether or not you care for subtitles, I understand that.

However, the actual acting is completely independent from anything you do or feel. The acting is in absolutely no way effected by the subtitles. If you dislike the acting or the delivery of lines, that's all and good and entirely your opinion to have. However, if you have to read the lines instead of listening to them, that is not the fault of the actually acting and delivery. You having to read does not make the acting any better or worse.

It has nothing to do with tastes in foreign or domestic films. You are either going to like the acting or not, regardless of if you read what they say or listen to it.

If two scenes are delivered in the exact same way, the only exception being the language, would the acting in the English version be better than the acting in the version you have to read subtitles?
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:25 PM    (permalink
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You are completely missing the point.

It is a personal preference whether or not you care for subtitles, I understand that.

However, the actual acting is completely independent from anything you do or feel. The acting is in absolutely no way effected by the subtitles. If you dislike the acting or the delivery of lines, that's all and good and entirely your opinion to have. However, if you have to read the lines instead of listening to them, that is not the fault of the actually acting and delivery. You having to read does not make the acting any better or worse.

It has nothing to do with tastes in foreign or domestic films. You are either going to like the acting or not, regardless of if you read what they say or listen to it.

If two scenes are delivered in the exact same way, the only exception being the language, would the acting in the English version be better than the acting in the version you have to read subtitles?
I'm not bothering with the first two paragraphs.

To the last paragraph. I'll say the English version is better. Example? Infernal Affairs vs. The Departed.

Now, that's pretty much as close as you can get with that horrible hypothetical. The Departed has acting 10.5 million times better, and the results? One of my favorite movies and some of my favorite performances.

Infernal Affairs? Great plot, great story, but I had no connection to the characters. Why? I don't even really know. Was it the subtitles? Could have been. Maybe it was just the performances themselves. I rated that movie a 6/10 (and then 5/10 and 5/10 for the other two).

I do know when I like or don't like an English speaking performance and I know the reasons why I do or don't. With foreign films, I don't always know the reasons, so I blame the subtitles instead of blaming the actors.
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:37 PM    (permalink
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I'm not talking about two separate movies. I'm talking about the same exact movie in two different languages. Not dubbed over, but where the actors actually deliver both languages.

You can say you like English speaking performances better than foreign speaking performances, that's perfectly fine. But the subtitles have absolutely nothing to do with it. Reading has absolutely nothing to do with it.

If the delivery is the same and the acting is the same and the actors are the same and the words are the same, and the only difference is language, I just don't understand how subtitles ruin things that are completely independent from a viewer's comprehension.

I've realized we are at a stand still, and I'll concede that the argument is pointless. I'll just leave with the fact that subtitles have absolutely no effect on the actual movie. The acting and story stay the same whether the subtitles are there or not.
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Old 01-21-2010, 11:26 PM    (permalink
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I like it that the past three pages have been filled with the same arguments stemming from a poor choice of words by BB.
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Old 01-21-2010, 11:49 PM    (permalink
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I finally saw Fargo. Yaaa.
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Old 01-22-2010, 12:13 AM    (permalink
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i dare anyone to watch Inside and Martyrs back to back.
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