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Old 03-25-2008, 02:19 PM    (permalink
DawgBone
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Yahoo.com made there 32 team NFL offseason-power rankings. Browns are pretty high on the list.....

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_yl...yhoo&type=lgns
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Old 03-26-2008, 05:54 PM    (permalink
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Nice work.
i agree, nice post.

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Ive heard very solid rumors that Minnesota offered their RD1 #17 for DA allready but Savage wasnt so quick to pull the trigger. Shortly after, we resigned DA, to a very tradeable contract that doesnt see a pay out until late April.

This sets up a trade for around draft time.

Phil is a smart guy and has looked at every scenario his cards can be played. If he made a trade for the #17 right now, the player he wants (there might only be one or two) might not last until pick 17. If and when a trade happens it wont be until the #17 pick comes up on draft day IMO so Phil can weight the options.

Back to the rumor......It was said that the Viks offered the #17, but Phil is sticking to his demand of an early to mid RD1 and RD3. The Viks werent willing to give their RD3 as of now.

It has also been said that numerous teams have offered their later RD1 picks for DA, but Phil doesnt think a later RD1 will get the player he wants and other teams would then use the pick to trade even higher in the draft (possibly giving DA to Baltimore).

I think with the evidence we have, Phil hasnt got what he wants but clearly wants something. Until all the pro days and personal workouts for the top rated QB's are through the teams interested in DA will not be clear on where they stand at the QB position. Phil also understood this and thats why he made DA's contract payout start late April. Phil is clearly willing to go into the 08 season with stability at the QB position for us Browns, but it should seem clear hes willing to take another risk after all the others he has taken in the last 2 years.

At the same time if a trade never happens DA will be the starter in 2008 and that is why Phil is saying such things in recent interviews. Even if he wants to attempt a trade, the worste thing he could do is make it look like there is a QB controversy. That would hurt DA's value.
i think that this is the best interpretation of what we can see.

phil's probably got a top 10 players list and if one of them is available at 17 *and* assuming we can pry a 3rd rd pick away from the vikings DA is probably gone.

groves would be nice, but that CB from tennessee state rogers-cromartie is 6-1 and runs a 4.3, probably a top 15 pick at this point.

the good thing is that there are a lot defensive players that are legit top 15 picks, and we could use just about any of them.
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Old 03-28-2008, 02:27 PM    (permalink
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we resigned seth mcKinney today. its a 1 year deal. thats all i know so far
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Old 03-29-2008, 04:48 PM    (permalink
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savage: "At this point, we feel we have seven starters competing for five positions,"

*now*, can you do the math?
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Old 03-31-2008, 11:02 AM    (permalink
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Thomas, Steinbach, Fraley, Tucker, Shaffer, Hadnot, McKinney. 1 2 3, 4 5 6, 7. 7. (to take a page out of sesame street). Don't forget Friedman who might not be a starting caliber OG/C, but he's a great backup guy. We are loaded at O-Line, which is weird considering that just over 1 year ago before we drafted Joe and signed Eric we were thin and weak there.
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Old 03-31-2008, 08:04 PM    (permalink
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Thomas, Steinbach, Fraley, Tucker, Shaffer, Hadnot, McKinney. 1 2 3, 4 5 6, 7. 7. (to take a page out of sesame street). Don't forget Friedman who might not be a starting caliber OG/C, but he's a great backup guy. We are loaded at O-Line, which is weird considering that just over 1 year ago before we drafted Joe and signed Eric we were thin and weak there.
I wonder if Phil has thought about drafting Count Von Count as a Nickelback...
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Old 04-01-2008, 02:40 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by keylime_5 View Post
Thomas, Steinbach, Fraley, Tucker, Shaffer, Hadnot, McKinney. 1 2 3, 4 5 6, 7. 7. (to take a page out of sesame street). Don't forget Friedman who might not be a starting caliber OG/C, but he's a great backup guy. We are loaded at O-Line, which is weird considering that just over 1 year ago before we drafted Joe and signed Eric we were thin and weak there.
and what might be most amazing is that bentley is not in the mix in terms of overall depth. this doesn't seem to bode well for sowells either. how many OLs do we normally carry during the regular season?
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Old 04-01-2008, 07:57 AM    (permalink
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and what might be most amazing is that bentley is not in the mix in terms of overall depth. this doesn't seem to bode well for sowells either. how many OLs do we normally carry during the regular season?
My guess is that Bentley is done as a player and isn't in the team's thinking.
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Old 04-01-2008, 11:59 AM    (permalink
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here the new list of players that have and/or are rumored to come in for a visit for the Browns.


RB Cory Boyd, South Carolina- visit
FB Owen Schmitt, West Virginia- visit
WR Mario Urrutia, Louisville- visit
TE Brad Cottam, Tennessee- workout
OT Thaddeus Coleman, Mississippi Valley State
OL Mike Galassi, Walsh- workout & visit
OL Brandon Keith, Northern Iowa- visit
OL James Lee, South Carolina State- workout & visit
OT Eddie Pingis, Liberty- workout
OL Mike Schepp, Akron- workout
OG Donald Thomas, Connecticut- visit

OLB Quentin Groves, Auburn- visit
OLB Curtis Johnson, Clark-Atlanta- workout
ILB Beau Bell UNLV- visit
ILB Stanford Keglar, Purdue- visit
ILB Bryan Kehl, BYU- visit
ILB Joey Larocque, Oregon State- workout
ILB Jared Mayo, Tennessee- visit
CB Tyvon Branch, Connecticut- visit
CB Reggie Corner, Akron- workout
CB Charles Godfrey, Iowa- workout & visit
*CB Antwaun Molden, Eastern Kentucky- workout & visit
CB Darnell Terrell, Missouri- workout & visit
S Josh Barrett Arizona State- visit
S Tyrell Johnson, Arkansas State- visit
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Old 04-01-2008, 01:07 PM    (permalink
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As reported previously on the Orange and Brown Report, the Cleveland organization has continued scouting potential Day One draft picks into the month of April, a sign that the organization may be eyeing getting back into the first three rounds of the draft. But something even bigger may be in the works.

Phil Savage has reportedly been in talks regarding a multi-team deal which would remake the face of the Cleveland Browns in short order, positioning the team to run the gauntlet in 2008 at the cost of depth at the quarterback position.

Reports out of Minnesota suggest that the team is considering swapping quarterback Derek Anderson to the Vikings in a complex deal that would involve at least one other club, namely the San Diego Chargers. In return for Anderson, RB Jamal Lewis, a 2009 first day pick, and an unnamed defensive player, the Browns would receive OT Bryant McKinnie, QB Kelly Holcomb, MLB Matt Wilhelm, and RB Michael Turner.

It is important to note that these reports are not confirmed by either club, and multi-team deals are notoriously difficult to pull off in these days of the salary cap.

Last season, the Browns were fortunate with their injury situation, but suffered with porous run defense. The deal, if consummated, would install Brady Quinn as the team's quarterback, with Holcomb as a backup, shore up the middle of the linebacker corps and provide the team with truly terrifying depth at offensive tackle.

One key aspect of the trade which may be weighing on the minds of Browns executives is its crowd-pleasing nature. "We think we've worked in every single player that's been obsessed about in the OBR's online forums over the last four years", a source close to the deal told the Orange and Brown Report. The source continues to say that the team hopes, by landing these players, "to move forward into reading a brand new generation of insane trade threads". It's an intriguing prospect: for a team which has seen its season ticket waiting list turn into unsold seats in recent years
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Old 04-01-2008, 02:19 PM    (permalink
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Seeing as Turner is no longer on the Chargers anymore, I have to believe that report is false.
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Old 04-01-2008, 10:20 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by jriles0522 View Post
As reported previously on the Orange and Brown Report, the Cleveland organization has continued scouting potential Day One draft picks into the month of April, a sign that the organization may be eyeing getting back into the first three rounds of the draft. But something even bigger may be in the works.

Phil Savage has reportedly been in talks regarding a multi-team deal which would remake the face of the Cleveland Browns in short order, positioning the team to run the gauntlet in 2008 at the cost of depth at the quarterback position.

Reports out of Minnesota suggest that the team is considering swapping quarterback Derek Anderson to the Vikings in a complex deal that would involve at least one other club, namely the San Diego Chargers. In return for Anderson, RB Jamal Lewis, a 2009 first day pick, and an unnamed defensive player, the Browns would receive OT Bryant McKinnie, QB Kelly Holcomb, MLB Matt Wilhelm, and RB Michael Turner.

It is important to note that these reports are not confirmed by either club, and multi-team deals are notoriously difficult to pull off in these days of the salary cap.

Last season, the Browns were fortunate with their injury situation, but suffered with porous run defense. The deal, if consummated, would install Brady Quinn as the team's quarterback, with Holcomb as a backup, shore up the middle of the linebacker corps and provide the team with truly terrifying depth at offensive tackle.

One key aspect of the trade which may be weighing on the minds of Browns executives is its crowd-pleasing nature. "We think we've worked in every single player that's been obsessed about in the OBR's online forums over the last four years", a source close to the deal told the Orange and Brown Report. The source continues to say that the team hopes, by landing these players, "to move forward into reading a brand new generation of insane trade threads". It's an intriguing prospect: for a team which has seen its season ticket waiting list turn into unsold seats in recent years
APRIL FOOLS! Yes, this story was part of our yearly April first idiocy. We're well aware that Michael Turner is no longer with the Falcons and that Kelly Holcomb isn't with the Vikings. That, plus the letters that start each paragraph, are hints that we were just messin' with ya'll. Hope you aren't disappointed that this trade isn't real ;-)

thats why i didnt post that. there was no way that could be true.
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Old 04-03-2008, 08:34 AM    (permalink
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and what might be most amazing is that bentley is not in the mix in terms of overall depth. this doesn't seem to bode well for sowells either. how many OLs do we normally carry during the regular season?
I do believe we usually keep 9 linemen. Since we have so much versatility I think we'll keep Thomas, Steinbach, Fraley, Shaffer, Tucker, Hadnot, McKinney, Friedman, and one more guy who is probably a tackle and not a guard/center. Sowells will have to earn his spot this year, he can be a right tackle as well as a guard.
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Old 04-04-2008, 01:49 AM    (permalink
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I do believe we usually keep 9 linemen. Since we have so much versatility I think we'll keep Thomas, Steinbach, Fraley, Shaffer, Tucker, Hadnot, McKinney, Friedman, and one more guy who is probably a tackle and not a guard/center. Sowells will have to earn his spot this year, he can be a right tackle as well as a guard.
courtesy of: http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/roster.php?sort=2

Hadnot, Rex OL 6-2 325 01/28/1982

57 Bentley, L OL 6-2 309 11/07/1979

70 Dorsey, N OL 6-7 335 09/09/1983
66 Fraley, H OL 6-2 315 09/21/1977
62 Friedman, L OL 6-3 295 08/13/1976
63 Louis, C OL 6-8 300 08/24/1984
68 McKinney, S OL 6-3 315 06/12/1979
50 Philip, M OL 6-1 307 02/03/1982
77 Shaffer, K OL 6-5 325 03/02/1980
61 Sowells, I OL 6-3 325 05/04/1982
65 Steinbach, E OL 6-6 295 04/04/1980
73 Thomas, Joe OL 6-6 315 12/04/1984
72 Tucker, Ryan OL 6-6 320 06/12/1975

OK, bentley started on the DL, IIRC mckinney got hurt and went to the DL.

philip & lewis i don't remember. were either on the taxi/practice squad?

still hard to tell exactly how many OL's we carry.

tucker is 33, fraley 31. i could see hadnot replacing one of these two in 2009.
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Old 04-04-2008, 10:31 AM    (permalink
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i firmly believe our OL depth chart will look like this next year

LT- J.Thomas/K.Shaffer
LG- E.Steinbach/L.Friedman
C- H.Fraley/S.McKinney
RG- R.Hadnot/S.McKinney/R.Tucker
RT- K.Shaffer/R.Tucker

Sowells might compete for a backup role at G or T. but he's really gotta step it up this year.
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Old 04-04-2008, 03:10 PM    (permalink
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i firmly believe our OL depth chart will look like this next year

LT- J.Thomas/K.Shaffer
LG- E.Steinbach/L.Friedman
C- H.Fraley/S.McKinney
RG- R.Hadnot/S.McKinney/R.Tucker
RT- K.Shaffer/R.Tucker

Sowells might compete for a backup role at G or T. but he's really gotta step it up this year.
while hadnot may start, i think he & tucker are the major swingmen if people get hurt. if fraley goes down, i think hadnot makes more sense as the backup C over mckinney - the center also has to call out line protection, which hadnot will have had to do already in spot duty as center.

what makes life complicated is what happens when a OT goes down. for the sake of line cohesion, i'd leave shaffer on the right side and move steinbach over in a pinch for thomas, & move hadnot to LG.
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Old 04-04-2008, 03:16 PM    (permalink
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I dont think Tucker won't start unless he gets hurt at some point. Hadnot and McKinney will give Ryan all he can handle though in terms of competition, they're both young starting quality guards. Tucker played very well at guard towards the end of last season which is why he should keep his job.
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Old 04-04-2008, 06:23 PM    (permalink
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I dont think Tucker won't start unless he gets hurt at some point. Hadnot and McKinney will give Ryan all he can handle though in terms of competition, they're both young starting quality guards. Tucker played very well at guard towards the end of last season which is why he should keep his job.
i completely agree. but here's a question. when McKinney went down, who else was going to play guard? Arguably, Tucker was the best player on the OL that wasn't starting. Friedman is really only an emergency player(his main purpose is the wedge on specials) and he mainly only plays the LG spot. Sowells had(and still has) yet to prove he can play at a high level.

the running game really picked up when Tucker took over at RG. but was that b/c he's that much better than Mckinney or b/c defenses started play the pass more b/c of DA? In classic Romeo style, it's Tucker's job to lose, i just really think that Hadnot will outplay him considerably. i dont think McKinney will be in the equation at all, i never thought he was that good. he also had to many penalties for my liking.
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Old 04-04-2008, 07:38 PM    (permalink
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Well last year Tucker was gonna start at right guard until the steroid suspension at which point the job went to McKinney by default until he went on the I.R. I think Tucker has the job until he gets hurt or suspended b/c I don't think he's gonna play his way out of the starting lineup. Tucker is a leader on the field too and a good pass blocker for a right guard too to boot.
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Old 04-05-2008, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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In your opinions should we draft a RB this year or is everyone satisfied with Jerome Harrison and Wright?

I personally want to draft a large back this year at some point. I really like Jerome Harrison and want him to be our change of pace and third down back, but he needs to work on his blocking this offseason. Wright is good depth, but I feel he isnt in our future plans.
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Old 04-05-2008, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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I'm against it. A back in the 4th round or later is not going to be any better than Wright or Harrison IMO. It can wait til next year.
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Old 04-05-2008, 04:33 PM    (permalink
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Its smart to draft one this year as opposed to next year because of the abnormal depth at the RB position in the draft. This means the overall available talent in later rounds might be equal to earlier rounds in next years draft.

EX: a player going in RD4 this year might go in RD2-3 next year.

If Jamal Lewis gets hurt there isnt a RB on the roster that can carry the load and that scares me. The speed RB's we have (Harrison and Wright) dont allways fair well in later December and playoff time when its cold. Cleveland is a power running team and allways has been due to the climate and I think we need a guy that can run between the tackles 15 times in a game if he has to. Not to mention our team relied heavily on the 3rd down passing game which requires a back that can block. i dont think harrison or Wright are par on that level.

I would love to have Matt Forte, but dont think he will be there in RD4. Im not trying to say draft one in RD4 though. I actually prefer a LB or CB in that slot. The good news is that our OL is good and deep which traditionally allows a team to get by with a lesser talented RB and tends to hide their weaknesses.

IMO unless we draft one in RD4 we wont draft one at all. Last year we carried 3 RB's on the roster and i cant see wasting a later round pick on a RB unless were sure he will make the team somehow. Many teams use there #3 RB on special teams in the return game but because we dont need to do that it eliminates the value of having 3 RB's to an extent. i guess in conclusion if we draft a RB in 2008 it would have to be a more physical styled RB early in the draft that has the capability of playing. We will not waste a pick on a change of pace back to be 4rth string because Romeo doesnt like to play rookies.

Last edited by DawgBone : 04-05-2008 at 04:41 PM.
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Old 04-05-2008, 09:07 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by DawgBone View Post
Its smart to draft one this year as opposed to next year because of the abnormal depth at the RB position in the draft. This means the overall available talent in later rounds might be equal to earlier rounds in next years draft.

EX: a player going in RD4 this year might go in RD2-3 next year.

If Jamal Lewis gets hurt there isnt a RB on the roster that can carry the load and that scares me. The speed RB's we have (Harrison and Wright) dont allways fair well in later December and playoff time when its cold. Cleveland is a power running team and allways has been due to the climate and I think we need a guy that can run between the tackles 15 times in a game if he has to. Not to mention our team relied heavily on the 3rd down passing game which requires a back that can block. i dont think harrison or Wright are par on that level.

I would love to have Matt Forte, but dont think he will be there in RD4. Im not trying to say draft one in RD4 though. I actually prefer a LB or CB in that slot. The good news is that our OL is good and deep which traditionally allows a team to get by with a lesser talented RB and tends to hide their weaknesses.

IMO unless we draft one in RD4 we wont draft one at all. Last year we carried 3 RB's on the roster and i cant see wasting a later round pick on a RB unless were sure he will make the team somehow. Many teams use there #3 RB on special teams in the return game but because we dont need to do that it eliminates the value of having 3 RB's to an extent. i guess in conclusion if we draft a RB in 2008 it would have to be a more physical styled RB early in the draft that has the capability of playing. We will not waste a pick on a change of pace back to be 4rth string because Romeo doesnt like to play rookies.
If Lewis gets hurt then we just give Vickers a larger role.
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Old 04-06-2008, 02:53 AM    (permalink
barry
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Originally Posted by DawgBone View Post
Its smart to draft one this year as opposed to next year because of the abnormal depth at the RB position in the draft. This means the overall available talent in later rounds might be equal to earlier rounds in next years draft.

EX: a player going in RD4 this year might go in RD2-3 next year.
that's a good point. lots of good OLs this year also, which would help us if we had 1st & 2nd round picks since other players would slide.

Quote:
If Jamal Lewis gets hurt there isnt a RB on the roster that can carry the load and that scares me. The speed RB's we have (Harrison and Wright) dont allways fair well in later December and playoff time when its cold.
i wouldn't classify them as speed backs since neither can run a 4.6 40; they'll get run down by some LBs, not to mention most DBs.

jason wright is the kind of guy you'd want your sister to meet. he played high school ball out here (i live in s. cal.) before he went to NU. extremely high character kinda guy - and smart (pre-med) - which probably helped when carthon was still here with his overly complex offensive scheme.

i got to see the WSU offense when harrison played. he's a system back. he ran for big yards in the *PAC-10* for cryin' out loud. outside of foster at UCLA, i can't think of a single non-USC RB that's done anything in the NFL.

Quote:
Cleveland is a power running team and allways has been due to the climate and I think we need a guy that can run between the tackles 15 times in a game if he has to. Not to mention our team relied heavily on the 3rd down passing game which requires a back that can block. i dont think harrison or Wright are par on that level.
wright is the still the better blocker.

Quote:
I would love to have Matt Forte, but dont think he will be there in RD4. Im not trying to say draft one in RD4 though. I actually prefer a LB or CB in that slot. The good news is that our OL is good and deep which traditionally allows a team to get by with a lesser talented RB and tends to hide their weaknesses.
i like forte but he's not a secret anymore.

Quote:
IMO unless we draft one in RD4 we wont draft one at all. Last year we carried 3 RB's on the roster and i cant see wasting a later round pick on a RB unless were sure he will make the team somehow. Many teams use there #3 RB on special teams in the return game but because we dont need to do that it eliminates the value of having 3 RB's to an extent. i guess in conclusion if we draft a RB in 2008 it would have to be a more physical styled RB early in the draft that has the capability of playing. We will not waste a pick on a change of pace back to be 4rth string because Romeo doesnt like to play rookies.
with our offense, we should be able to attract a decent FA RB if that turns out to be the best option available.
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Old 04-06-2008, 11:24 AM    (permalink
DawgBone
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"i got to see the WSU offense when harrison played. he's a system back. he ran for big yards in the *PAC-10* for cryin' out loud. outside of foster at UCLA, i can't think of a single non-USC RB that's done anything in the NFL."

If your refering to Pac10 RB's? Then there is Steven Jackson and Lynch etc...but Im not sure if thats the point you were trying to make?

If Lewis goes down and it is December, we traditionally run the ball more (just like 2007). Cold weather is difficult to maximize speed because you get stiff so the power run game has allways been what we rely on. harrison and Wright are and will not be great factors when that time comes.

Someone mentioned Vickers and he did play some TB at Colorado, but it doesnt translate to the pros IMO. He was around 235 in college hes now bulked to around 250 so im sure hes lost alittle.

We looked at Owen Schmitt in the draft. If we took him in Rd4 or 5 then it might mean that Vickers could be the power back-up to Lewis I guess. And like another poster mentioned Schmitt can be a special teams force and down the line a #3 TE maybe in the mold of Frank Wycheck in the late 1990's.
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