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Old 08-02-2008, 05:39 AM    (permalink
Ruken
 
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I cant wait till DA shuts all you BQ homers up.

I pray that rogers stays motivated because if so I think our D will surprise quite a few people
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Old 08-02-2008, 12:58 PM    (permalink
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I cant wait till DA shuts all you BQ homers up.

I pray that rogers stays motivated because if so I think our D will surprise quite a few people
you'd better get used to Quinn because it's only a matter of time before his is the starter. There is no way that he Browns are going to continue to pay both Anderson and Quinn big money. Trade value for Anderson after this year will be high and that would be the best move for the Browns, to trade him. The Chargers went through basically the same thing with Brees and Rivers and they let Brees go and let Rivers take over the team. I see the same thing transpiring in Cleveland.
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Old 08-02-2008, 03:29 PM    (permalink
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I think DA will have another good year and we trade Quinn. Quinn is not making a high salary b/c his contract is incentive loaded, and afterall he was only the 22nd overall pick and is making a low salary for a QB. DA has looked good in camp so far and Quinn not so much...and barring injury Quinn won't play this year. I think Brady is odd man out not Derek. DA's game is perfect in our offense.
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Old 08-02-2008, 04:28 PM    (permalink
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I think DA will have another good year and we trade Quinn. Quinn is not making a high salary b/c his contract is incentive loaded, and afterall he was only the 22nd overall pick and is making a low salary for a QB. DA has looked good in camp so far and Quinn not so much...and barring injury Quinn won't play this year. I think Brady is odd man out not Derek. DA's game is perfect in our offense.
Then trading those picks for Quinn was an utter waste. No team is going to give you even a first rounder for Quinn nor anything close to what Savage gave up to get him. No teams in the NFL are in dire need to trade draft picks for young unproven QBs.
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Old 08-02-2008, 05:40 PM    (permalink
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Considering how terrible the QB class is for the 2009 draft added with the fact that franchise QBs almost never hit the free agent market, I don't think that Savage's asking price of a first round pick would be out of the question for a team like Minnesota or Chicago as long as they don't pick in the top 10. Quinn is a fine prospect and lots of people think he can definitely be a franchise QB.

Lots of teams might want a QB next offseason like Chicago, Minnesota, Detroit, Carolina, Tampa Bay, the Jets, Chiefs, 49ers, and other wildcards like the Cardinals, Seahawks, Rams, Bills, and the like could join that group depending on this season. As long as we get something in the ballpark of the 22nd pick overall in value for one of our two young high profile QBs it won't be an utter waste, and I seriously doubt we trade one for anything less. Just keep both until we get a deal for them we like. You need two good QBs nowadays.
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Old 08-02-2008, 08:42 PM    (permalink
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I feel like even if Savage sees that Quinn is worse than Anderson, he'll trade Anderson because he would be worth wayyy more. (As long as the worseness isn't that much.)
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Old 08-03-2008, 07:12 AM    (permalink
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Even though Quinn is unproven, he is still by far a better prospect than any of the guys available in the next draft...so it wouldn't surprise if he did fetch a first rounder.

However, i am not sure it really matters cuz in the end Quinn will most likely be our QB unless Anderson really cements himself as our legit QB (ie: superbowl birth).
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Old 08-03-2008, 07:00 PM    (permalink
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DA was in his first year as a fulltime starter last year and in that system, so I think he should get better this year, otherwise he might be moved next offseason. If we have another year from him in the vicinity of 4000 yds. and 30 TDs then I think he becomes the clearcut franchise QB and Quinn will be moved.

I'm not that concerned with trade value considering lots of teams will need QBs next year and the market will be really crappy. Teams like Chicago or Minnesota could draft a rookie with the deck stacked against him in terms of being a good player, or they could have Grossman, Tarvaris Jackson, or JD Booty or the like instead of trading a first rounder for a high potential guy like Quinn or DA.
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Old 08-04-2008, 12:29 AM    (permalink
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you'd better get used to Quinn because it's only a matter of time before his is the starter. There is no way that he Browns are going to continue to pay both Anderson and Quinn big money. Trade value for Anderson after this year will be high and that would be the best move for the Browns, to trade him. The Chargers went through basically the same thing with Brees and Rivers and they let Brees go and let Rivers take over the team. I see the same thing transpiring in Cleveland.
If Anderson has another big year, Quinn will definitely be gone. In case you have forgotten Schaub fetched a high price based on potential. The San Diego example is a poor one to use. Brees was coming off a serve injury which made the choice of Rivers a lot easier.
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Old 08-04-2008, 12:33 AM    (permalink
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Then trading those picks for Quinn was an utter waste. No team is going to give you even a first rounder for Quinn nor anything close to what Savage gave up to get him. No teams in the NFL are in dire need to trade draft picks for young unproven QBs.
See Houston and they improved dramatically. QB's with potential are always in demand. If Quinn can get into a game either because of an injury to Anderson or late in a game and can show potential, he may well fetch more than Savage paid for him. Quinn will have 2 years of pro learning under his belt and that often impresses GM's a lot more than an unproven rookie.
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Old 08-04-2008, 12:38 AM    (permalink
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Considering how terrible the QB class is for the 2009 draft added with the fact that franchise QBs almost never hit the free agent market, I don't think that Savage's asking price of a first round pick would be out of the question for a team like Minnesota or Chicago as long as they don't pick in the top 10. Quinn is a fine prospect and lots of people think he can definitely be a franchise QB.

Lots of teams might want a QB next offseason like Chicago, Minnesota, Detroit, Carolina, Tampa Bay, the Jets, Chiefs, 49ers, and other wildcards like the Cardinals, Seahawks, Rams, Bills, and the like could join that group depending on this season. As long as we get something in the ballpark of the 22nd pick overall in value for one of our two young high profile QBs it won't be an utter waste, and I seriously doubt we trade one for anything less. Just keep both until we get a deal for them we like. You need two good QBs nowadays.
I agree with a lot of what you are saying but I have to take exception to the idea that we can keep both. For sure one of the 2 will be traded by the next draft. The one who loses out will not be a happy camper.
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Old 08-04-2008, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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See Houston and they improved dramatically. QB's with potential are always in demand. If Quinn can get into a game either because of an injury to Anderson or late in a game and can show potential, he may well fetch more than Savage paid for him. Quinn will have 2 years of pro learning under his belt and that often impresses GM's a lot more than an unproven rookie.
San Diego did know how good Brees was though. Even though the whole thing worked out for them ok because Rivers is a good QB. What I'm really getting at is that Savage is not going to get back what he gave up to get him in 2007. If your so so sure that the Browns are going to keep Anderson why didn't they give him a better deal to lock him up longer? If he's a franchise QB then Savage should have at least offered him a lucrative long term deal.
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Old 08-04-2008, 11:09 AM    (permalink
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I agree with a lot of what you are saying but I have to take exception to the idea that we can keep both. For sure one of the 2 will be traded by the next draft. The one who loses out will not be a happy camper.
I mean for one more year if we don't get good offers. I don't think us not getting good offers for either Quinn or DA is that likely of a scenario anyways, but if it does happen I think Savage would hold onto them both for the 2009 season too at least - unless Quinn really throws a bitchy fit.
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Old 08-04-2008, 11:12 AM    (permalink
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I mean for one more year if we don't get good offers. I don't think us not getting good offers for either Quinn or DA is that likely of a scenario anyways, but if it does happen I think Savage would hold onto them both for the 2009 season too at least - unless Quinn really throws a bitchy fit.
why get rid of one?

With Quinn not playing he can't meet his escalators and DA isn't exactly expensive as far as QB's go.

Now if Quinn outplays and gets the starting spot, then I can see DA not being worth the $$$ to be on the bench.. but outside of that Quinns contract is probably around the same as a very good backup QB.
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Old 08-04-2008, 11:13 AM    (permalink
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See Houston and they improved dramatically. QB's with potential are always in demand. If Quinn can get into a game either because of an injury to Anderson or late in a game and can show potential, he may well fetch more than Savage paid for him. Quinn will have 2 years of pro learning under his belt and that often impresses GM's a lot more than an unproven rookie.
Schaub had also been battletested. Quinn has yet to make it into a meaningful game.

Crennel calling him "Erratic" isn't going to help either.
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Old 08-04-2008, 01:46 PM    (permalink
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keep in mind Quinn is playing with WRs and OLinemen who aren't gonna make the team for the most part, and has been playing mostly against the first team defense. That mixture makes any QB look not as good as he is, plus Quinn has never been a "practice" QB really. Quinn was a first round pick even if he isn't experienced, Schaub was a 3rd rounder and was in the league for like 3 years when he got traded.
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Old 08-04-2008, 02:49 PM    (permalink
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This arguement is so lame, old and annoying. Who cares people? Both sides are wrong. Brady Quinn supporters are wrong and Derek Anderson supporters are wrong. Why? Because as Cleveland Browns fans we(and I don't) give a crap who are starting QB is as long as he wins games for us. Why should it matter who was drafted where, who is making the most money, who is the fan favorite or who is the best looking??? I really don't care if we wasted 40 first round picks on Brady Quinn and he sits behind Derek Anderson as long as Anderson can win us 11 games a year and run us deep into the post season year in and year out with a chance at a Championship every post season. That my friends is the real correct answer in regards to who should be are quarterback.
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Old 08-04-2008, 05:49 PM    (permalink
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This arguement is so lame, old and annoying. Who cares people? Both sides are wrong. Brady Quinn supporters are wrong and Derek Anderson supporters are wrong. Why? Because as Cleveland Browns fans we(and I don't) give a crap who are starting QB is as long as he wins games for us. Why should it matter who was drafted where, who is making the most money, who is the fan favorite or who is the best looking??? I really don't care if we wasted 40 first round picks on Brady Quinn and he sits behind Derek Anderson as long as Anderson can win us 11 games a year and run us deep into the post season year in and year out with a chance at a Championship every post season. That my friends is the real correct answer in regards to who should be are quarterback.
You should care about what you gave up to get him. Those picks could have been spent on other players that could be on the field improving your team.
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Old 08-05-2008, 12:25 AM    (permalink
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You should care about what you gave up to get him. Those picks could have been spent on other players that could be on the field improving your team.
No I don't. What if we didn't and Anderson still sucked? Maybe giving up those picks to get Brady motivated Anderson in a way that made him better? You all look at everything as if there has to be a negative no matter what. The only way you should look at it is the best player plays regardless of picks, status or money and that player will give this team the best chance to win regarless of any of those circumstances as well.
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Old 08-05-2008, 02:11 PM    (permalink
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We basically gave up a 3rd from 2007 and a 1st from 2008 to get Quinn (b/c we took Wright in round 2 last year and would've taken him in early round 2 just the same). Backup QBs are very important in this day an age of the NFL, and chances are we're gonna get at least most of the value back for him. Having a very good backup QB at the very least and then probably getting a first or a second and third for him is not a waste. It would have sucked if we gave up a top 10 pick in the past draft, but thankfully it only turned out to be a 22nd overall pick (and he was the 22nd overall pick last year).
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Old 08-05-2008, 08:34 PM    (permalink
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We basically gave up a 3rd from 2007 and a 1st from 2008 to get Quinn (b/c we took Wright in round 2 last year and would've taken him in early round 2 just the same). Backup QBs are very important in this day an age of the NFL, and chances are we're gonna get at least most of the value back for him. Having a very good backup QB at the very least and then probably getting a first or a second and third for him is not a waste. It would have sucked if we gave up a top 10 pick in the past draft, but thankfully it only turned out to be a 22nd overall pick (and he was the 22nd overall pick last year).
to get quinn we gave up our 2nd round pick (at 36) in 2007 plus our 2008 1st round pick.

this year's pick could have been:

22 Dallas Jones, Felix RB
23 Pittsburgh Mendenhall, Rashard RB
24 Tennessee Johnson, Chris RB
25 Dallas Jenkins, Mike CB
26 Houston Brown, Duane OT
27 San Diego Cason, Antoine CB
28 Seattle Jackson, Lawrence DE
29 San Francisco Balmer, Kentwan DE
30 NY Jets Keller, Dustin TE
31 NY Giants Phillips, Kenny FS

at 36, you generally have the chance to snag a guy that slipped but was still a legit 1st round pick. for our needs, last year's 2nd round pick could have been a lamarr woodley or david harris either who'd look pretty good in place of peek or davis. would we have taken wright instead of either of those two LBs? maybe, but we still could have still gotten wright by giving up our 3rd, 4th & swapped 6th round picks.

plus with savage's acumen in drafting for value, those two picks could be two pro bowl players we won't have.

the bottom line is that it was a high price to pay, but no one could have foreseen DA's level of success.
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Old 08-05-2008, 08:37 PM    (permalink
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to get quinn we gave up our 2nd round pick (at 36) in 2007 plus our 2008 1st round pick.

this year's pick could have been:

22 Dallas Jones, Felix RB
23 Pittsburgh Mendenhall, Rashard RB
24 Tennessee Johnson, Chris RB
25 Dallas Jenkins, Mike CB
26 Houston Brown, Duane OT
27 San Diego Cason, Antoine CB
28 Seattle Jackson, Lawrence DE
29 San Francisco Balmer, Kentwan DE
30 NY Jets Keller, Dustin TE
31 NY Giants Phillips, Kenny FS

at 36, you generally have the chance to snag a guy that slipped but was still a legit 1st round pick. for our needs, last year's 2nd round pick could have been a lamarr woodley or david harris either who'd look pretty good in place of peek or davis. would we have taken wright instead of either of those two LBs? maybe, but we still could have still gotten wright by giving up our 3rd, 4th & swapped 6th round picks.

plus with savage's acumen in drafting for value, those two picks could be two pro bowl players we won't have.

the bottom line is that it was a high price to pay, but no one could have foreseen DA's level of success.
Mike Jenkins, Cason, or Chris Johnson would have been very nice picks for the Browns.
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Old 08-05-2008, 08:40 PM    (permalink
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We would've taken Wright at 36 just the same. We wanted a CB and he was clearly higher on our board than any other CB left in round 2. We traded our 3rd to get back into the second to get him which was a good situation. Look at it this way: if Quinn turns out to be a good QB for us then it was worth the pick. If we get the value of that late first rounder back for Quinn it evens out. DA cost us no picks to acquire and we'll have him being a very good starting QB for us or him going elsewhere for picks. The fact that either DA or Quinn is gonna be good makes is a win/win situation. The only way it won't be is if we let Quinn's contract run out, trade him for nothing good, or if DA and Quinn both bomb.

It would have been nice to draft Mendenhall, Jenkins or whoever this year at 22, but if we can get a first in the future or something close to that (like what ATL got for Schaub let's say) then it won't matter that we didn't have a pick this year. It's not like we're not using Quinn at all anyways, you need a good backup and without him we'd have Frye is DA went down :(.
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Old 08-05-2008, 09:37 PM    (permalink
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Mike Jenkins, Cason, or Chris Johnson would have been very nice picks for the Browns.
Definitely would have been.

Still, it was the right decision to take Quinn and for whoever can't see that shouldn't voice their opinion. Quinn fell a lot and was arguably better than the QB the following year [Brian Brohm, Matt Ryan, Colt Brennon]. Anderson couldn't win the job in training camp and didn't show a glimpse of hope until Cincinnati game.

Anderson was a surprise, Quinn was the fall back option that at the time we so desperately needed. Quinn was a great choice and for us to grab him and Thomas was a great draft. We definitely can still use him for later draft picks or for the QB of the future.

Hindsight is 20/20 but even if we lose out on Quinn being drafted, it was still totally worth it as we have no idea that Anderson would emerge with that type of season and there are still questions if he can follow it up.

Savage definitely had the correct call.
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Old 08-06-2008, 02:05 AM    (permalink
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This arguement is so lame, old and annoying. Who cares people? Both sides are wrong. Brady Quinn supporters are wrong and Derek Anderson supporters are wrong. Why? Because as Cleveland Browns fans we(and I don't) give a crap who are starting QB is as long as he wins games for us. Why should it matter who was drafted where, who is making the most money, who is the fan favorite or who is the best looking??? I really don't care if we wasted 40 first round picks on Brady Quinn and he sits behind Derek Anderson as long as Anderson can win us 11 games a year and run us deep into the post season year in and year out with a chance at a Championship every post season. That my friends is the real correct answer in regards to who should be are quarterback.
I agree, I don't care who ends up as our starter as long as he can produce victories and I have a lot of confidence in Savage and Crennel to make the right decisions.
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