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Old 02-21-2007, 10:02 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by JoeMontainya
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For real, everyone is way underrating Frye's arm. His arm is not Brett Favre's but it is not as weka like Brees' or Penningtons' in a sense, though those two's games are all about making reads and using great accuracy on their throws. If we get 2 good guards and Adrian Peterson then Frye will actually get a chance to throw this year and we'll find out if he can win games with a running game and protection.
Heres the difference, when Charlie throws harder, his accurancy dramatically decreases. I think this is due to him either rushing it (OL) or he just isnt very calm in the pocket. I liked it alot better when Anderson played and hes was supposed to be our 3rd string QB.
i have to agree with you joe, 100%. i dont think charlie's arm is as weak as chad's. but its nothing special. and while his problems can be fixed. a few of my buddies have settled on anderson. he compares to tom brady of yesterday. a helacious arm. quick read's. not very mobile but great pocket presence. i do like charlie's mobility, thats def. a plus for him. but if anderson can improve his decision making and work on his accuracy, then its not a contest on who would start between the 2.
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Old 02-21-2007, 10:44 PM    (permalink
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I think frye needs to mature. He needs to know that he doesn't have to make a play everytime and it's okay to throw the ball away.
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Old 02-22-2007, 08:46 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by kalbears13
I think frye needs to mature. He needs to know that he doesn't have to make a play everytime and it's okay to throw the ball away.
= needing a running game to rely on.


A running game would do so much for this team, and it is so obvious. It would take pressure off Frye to make a play, slow down the pass rush, keep our defense off the field, and so on. While we have a lot of wholes, a running game would easily make the most impact, if filled. Even this last year, if we could have run the ball, i can confidently say we would have won 6-8 games.

For our team, it all starts with being able to run the ball.
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:15 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Freddy G
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Originally Posted by kalbears13
I think frye needs to mature. He needs to know that he doesn't have to make a play everytime and it's okay to throw the ball away.
= needing a running game to rely on.


A running game would do so much for this team, and it is so obvious. It would take pressure off Frye to make a play, slow down the pass rush, keep our defense off the field, and so on. While we have a lot of wholes, a running game would easily make the most impact, if filled. Even this last year, if we could have run the ball, i can confidently say we would have won 6-8 games.

For our team, it all starts with being able to run the ball.
True, and running the ball starts with the o-line. Sure, it's nice to have a stud like AD in the backfield, but we don't need him. Look at Denver. They've consistently run the ball very well with decent RB's, then other teams overrate their RB's and pay way too much for them, IMO. But the key is the o-line. Mike Bell would've ran for 14 yards if he played for the Brown's this year.
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Old 02-22-2007, 12:21 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by RoyHall#1
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Originally Posted by Freddy G
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Originally Posted by kalbears13
I think frye needs to mature. He needs to know that he doesn't have to make a play everytime and it's okay to throw the ball away.
= needing a running game to rely on.


A running game would do so much for this team, and it is so obvious. It would take pressure off Frye to make a play, slow down the pass rush, keep our defense off the field, and so on. While we have a lot of wholes, a running game would easily make the most impact, if filled. Even this last year, if we could have run the ball, i can confidently say we would have won 6-8 games.

For our team, it all starts with being able to run the ball.
True, and running the ball starts with the o-line. Sure, it's nice to have a stud like AD in the backfield, but we don't need him. Look at Denver. They've consistently run the ball very well with decent RB's, then other teams overrate their RB's and pay way too much for them, IMO. But the key is the o-line. Mike Bell would've ran for 14 yards if he played for the Brown's this year.

Obviously it starts with the OL, but by no means does that mean you need a great OL. The RB must still be able to take advantage of the opportunities presented...something Drounghns just didn't do last year. Of course i think the line was/is bad, but IMO, it can be relatively easily fixed.

I think it safe to assume we will get at least one solid OL in FA, most likely a starter. It may not be a super star, but he has to be better than what we have. Combine that with the fact that our C and OTs are all good run blockers, we would really only have the one whole left to fill at OG. Hopefully it will be Smith or Sowells, or maybe a draft pick. All i am saying is we really aren't that far off.

Just look at backs like LJ, Tiki, Stephen Jackson, and Maroney/Dillen. While their lines are solid, and maybe even underrated slightly, fact remains is that the concensous regards them as merely average/solid. Yet a great makes them look pretty good. So, right now we are in a position to get a great (potenial) back, and some solid OL in FA and draft....works for me. :)
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Old 02-22-2007, 12:31 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyHall#1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freddy G
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalbears13
I think frye needs to mature. He needs to know that he doesn't have to make a play everytime and it's okay to throw the ball away.
= needing a running game to rely on.


A running game would do so much for this team, and it is so obvious. It would take pressure off Frye to make a play, slow down the pass rush, keep our defense off the field, and so on. While we have a lot of wholes, a running game would easily make the most impact, if filled. Even this last year, if we could have run the ball, i can confidently say we would have won 6-8 games.

For our team, it all starts with being able to run the ball.
True, and running the ball starts with the o-line. Sure, it's nice to have a stud like AD in the backfield, but we don't need him. Look at Denver. They've consistently run the ball very well with decent RB's, then other teams overrate their RB's and pay way too much for them, IMO. But the key is the o-line. Mike Bell would've ran for 14 yards if he played for the Brown's this year.
It works both ways though. I don't think LT played with any pro bowl lineman until they picked up mcneill.
the rest of the line was just goff (3rd round by the bengals) Hardwick (3rd round) Deilman (was he even drafted?) and olivea (7th round).

Great RB can make an average line look good and visa versa. I think Thomas warrants a long look but there is some decent depth at the top of the second and third rounds on the oline that we can get (staley, grubbs, sears, ugoh, beekman, kalil, etc.) If we could somehow get 2 OL, a guy like mcbean or that hawaiian guy and peterson i'd prolly die.
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Old 02-22-2007, 05:38 PM    (permalink
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I'll agree with Freddy that a great RB can make an average OL look good. With that being the case, I'd like the draft to look like this, after we sign Dielman of course. :D
1st-AD
2nd-Staley/Grubbs/Sears(and I already know about Phil not taking interior OL early, please don't tell me)
3rd-Mcbean, Alama-Francis, Best DL
4rd-Doug Datish, he's the the swing C/OG Phil wants


I'm not doing the rest right now, I'm coming off the flu so I'm tired. How's that draft look though?
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Old 02-22-2007, 05:42 PM    (permalink
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First, I'm real pissed off the cavs didn't get mike bibby.

Anyway, Adalius Thomas wasn't franchised so the door is open for us to make a positive move in FA with him and ideally steinbach or deilman.

That would push CB up on our need list IMO, especially if Ross, Hughes, or someone like Houston is there at the top of the 2nd.

Finally, I read that K2s rehab from microfracture surgery will take about 3-4 months and is more involved than it was initially led on to be. I really think he could be out of the league in 3-4 years, the list of successful comebacks from that kind of surgery in the nfl is not glamorous and considering the browns luck i wouldn't be shocked if that was the case.
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Old 02-22-2007, 05:44 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jriles0522
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyHall#1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freddy G
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalbears13
I think frye needs to mature. He needs to know that he doesn't have to make a play everytime and it's okay to throw the ball away.
= needing a running game to rely on.


A running game would do so much for this team, and it is so obvious. It would take pressure off Frye to make a play, slow down the pass rush, keep our defense off the field, and so on. While we have a lot of wholes, a running game would easily make the most impact, if filled. Even this last year, if we could have run the ball, i can confidently say we would have won 6-8 games.

For our team, it all starts with being able to run the ball.
True, and running the ball starts with the o-line. Sure, it's nice to have a stud like AD in the backfield, but we don't need him. Look at Denver. They've consistently run the ball very well with decent RB's, then other teams overrate their RB's and pay way too much for them, IMO. But the key is the o-line. Mike Bell would've ran for 14 yards if he played for the Brown's this year.
It works both ways though. I don't think LT played with any pro bowl lineman until they picked up mcneill.
the rest of the line was just goff (3rd round by the bengals) Hardwick (3rd round) Deilman (was he even drafted?) and olivea (7th round).

Great RB can make an average line look good and visa versa. I think Thomas warrants a long look but there is some decent depth at the top of the second and third rounds on the oline that we can get (staley, grubbs, sears, ugoh, beekman, kalil, etc.) If we could somehow get 2 OL, a guy like mcbean or that hawaiian guy and peterson i'd prolly die.
Yes, it works both ways, but I think it works better with a great Oline than a great RB. Also, the Browns do not have an "average" line right now but if we do get a solid starter in free agency and draft 2 olinemen in the draft, one of them being in round 2 (maybe 3, if abiamari is there in rd 2)(or Carriker ) we could have an average line next year.

However, Peterson will only be a rookie and won't be great yet, so it's unrealistic to expect much from our running game next year, but the future is bright. (Where have I heard that before? Oh yeah, with every Cleveland team I've ever watched that's never lived up to their "potential." I hate that word. :evil:)
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Old 02-22-2007, 05:45 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Hail Browns
I'll agree with Freddy that a great RB can make an average OL look good. With that being the case, I'd like the draft to look like this, after we sign Dielman of course. :D
1st-AD
2nd-Staley/Grubbs/Sears(and I already know about Phil not taking interior OL early, please don't tell me)
3rd-Mcbean, Alama-Francis, Best DL
4rd-Doug Datish, he's the the swing C/OG Phil wants


I'm not doing the rest right now, I'm coming off the flu so I'm tired. How's that draft look though?
thats exactly what i said in my post a few up from here.
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Old 02-22-2007, 05:58 PM    (permalink
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First, I'm real pissed off the cavs didn't get mike bibby.

Anyway, Adalius Thomas wasn't franchised so the door is open for us to make a positive move in FA with him and ideally steinbach or deilman.

That would push CB up on our need list IMO, especially if Ross, Hughes, or someone like Houston is there at the top of the 2nd.

Finally, I read that K2s rehab from microfracture surgery will take about 3-4 months and is more involved than it was initially led on to be. I really think he could be out of the league in 3-4 years, the list of successful comebacks from that kind of surgery in the nfl is not glamorous and considering the browns luck i wouldn't be shocked if that was the case.
I second that on Bibby, did you read that article today? It got my hopes up. That ends the Cav's chances of a title this year. Maybe next year...(I have heard that way too much.)
Good news on Thomas although I would much rather have Clements and I do not want to use a 2nd rd pick on a CB although it would definitely be a need if we let it go in Free agency.

I read that about K2 as well. He is TOUGH. Looks like he wasn't lying about playing on 1 knee (and playing darn good at that).
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Old 02-23-2007, 07:59 AM    (permalink
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INDIANAPOLIS -- There was good news for the Browns Friday morning as they won the coin toss with Tampa Bay and will pick third overallin April's NFL Draft.

The teams gathered at 7:45 a.m. to toss the coin. Tampa Bay's representative called heads, and the coin came up tails.
Source: http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=6480
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:41 AM    (permalink
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INDIANAPOLIS -- There was good news for the Browns Friday morning as they won the coin toss with Tampa Bay and will pick third overallin April's NFL Draft.

The teams gathered at 7:45 a.m. to toss the coin. Tampa Bay's representative called heads, and the coin came up tails.
Source: http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=6480
You beat Scott :D
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:49 AM    (permalink
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I checked the trade value chart and I like what I see :D

If the Vikings trade with us, AD will more than likely be there at 7, and we would get the Vikings 2nd and 4th rnd picks for sure, maybe their 2nd and 3rd. 5 picks on Day 1 sounds good to me.
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:51 AM    (permalink
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Also, If AD isnt there then Alan Branch will be! This trade is making more and more sense and I will be upset if we do not make it. The only downside is well have no chance at Thomas, but I can live with that.
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Old 02-23-2007, 09:10 AM    (permalink
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i think a trade with the vikes would be possible, but 2008 picks might be involved...maybe 2008 2nd round

but the chart also shows that potential that 3 3rd round picks could get us to move up with you guys

i personally like the idea of

vikes give 1st, 3rd, 6th, 2008 3rd, Kinechi Udeze (hoping the vikes pick up Kerney)
clevelan gives 1st

that value should be pretty equal because Udeze is at LEAST worth a 3rd round pick
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Old 02-23-2007, 09:27 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by crazyisme
i think a trade with the vikes would be possible, but 2008 picks might be involved...maybe 2008 2nd round

but the chart also shows that potential that 3 3rd round picks could get us to move up with you guys

i personally like the idea of

vikes give 1st, 3rd, 6th, 2008 3rd, Kinechi Udeze (hoping the vikes pick up Kerney)
clevelan gives 1st

that value should be pretty equal because Udeze is at LEAST worth a 3rd round pick
I don't think Udeze fits into a 3-4 defense. He's more of a 4-3 edge guy. He'd be of no value/interest to us. Give us a draft pick.
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Old 02-23-2007, 09:33 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by RoyHall#1
Also, If AD isnt there then Alan Branch will be! This trade is making more and more sense and I will be upset if we do not make it. The only downside is well have no chance at Thomas, but I can live with that.
Its not just us who needs to want to make the trade for it to happen. Personally, I don't see how the vikings can afford to. They have too many needs to address to be forfeiting the rest of their day 1 to get johnson, ESPECIALLY if one of the qbs appears to fall.

However if it does, and we are lucky enough to get their 2 and 3 rounders i'd be doing cartwheels in the street and i don't even know how. It's too hard to project what we'd do with all those picks although i think it makes Troy Smith a virtual lock to go to us.


We could also trade back up into the first round. Hell, we'd be in position to have one of the most epic drafts of all time. If you can't tell im officially so pumped if that would actually happen im saying prayers from now ill april 28th.

Also, if we get those extra picks, we could trade the top 2 and 3 rounders and the value works to get us to about the 20th pick. Just another idea to, if we take Quinn at 7, and lynch falls to 15-20. We'd have the ammo to go up and get him. Which would be hugeee. I don't think we could go wrong with this though assuming carriker falls to 20, which he prolly wont but hey we can dream.

How about this:
1. Peterson
1b. Carriker
2. Grubbs/Sears/Staley/Tyler/Abiamiri
3. McBean/Hawaii 5-0, etc/Beekman/T. Smith/a CB
:twisted:
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Old 02-23-2007, 10:50 AM    (permalink
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wouldn't it be great if the fate of the browns was changed by one coin flip. :D
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Old 02-23-2007, 11:46 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by RoyHall#1
Also, If AD isnt there then Alan Branch will be! This trade is making more and more sense and I will be upset if we do not make it. The only downside is well have no chance at Thomas, but I can live with that.
Its not just us who needs to want to make the trade for it to happen. Personally, I don't see how the vikings can afford to. They have too many needs to address to be forfeiting the rest of their day 1 to get johnson, ESPECIALLY if one of the qbs appears to fall.

However if it does, and we are lucky enough to get their 2 and 3 rounders i'd be doing cartwheels in the street and i don't even know how. It's too hard to project what we'd do with all those picks although i think it makes Troy Smith a virtual lock to go to us.


We could also trade back up into the first round. Hell, we'd be in position to have one of the most epic drafts of all time. If you can't tell im officially so pumped if that would actually happen im saying prayers from now ill april 28th.

Also, if we get those extra picks, we could trade the top 2 and 3 rounders and the value works to get us to about the 20th pick. Just another idea to, if we take Quinn at 7, and lynch falls to 15-20. We'd have the ammo to go up and get him. Which would be hugeee. I don't think we could go wrong with this though assuming carriker falls to 20, which he prolly wont but hey we can dream.

How about this:
1. Peterson
1b. Carriker
2. Grubbs/Sears/Staley/Tyler/Abiamiri
3. McBean/Hawaii 5-0, etc/Beekman/T. Smith/a CB
:twisted:
I love it when you talk like that. :twisted:
We'd still have another pick on Day 1 that you didn't say if we trade up to get Carriker ( as long as we don't trade too far up).
And, personally I wouldn't be a fan of this, but we could trade our 1st round pick to the middle of the first round for Carriker and have about 5 more picks, at least 2 of them on day 1. :D

But I like your draft better with Peterson as our pick. I would be neutral about trading down for Carriker after that but as for right now I am against it.
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Old 02-23-2007, 01:23 PM    (permalink
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I just had a revelation.

The Browns players who get hurt always have a clean bill of health in college (Winslow, Edwards, Jones, Brown, etc)

2 of our top targets in this year's draft have been injured in college, Thomas with a torn ACL and Peterson with the ankle and collar bone.

WHAT IF, we draft injured guys, so they already have their injuries OUT OF THE WAY, before they get to us and stay healthy forever.
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Old 02-23-2007, 02:05 PM    (permalink
Freddy G
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jriles0522
I just had a revelation.

The Browns players who get hurt always have a clean bill of health in college (Winslow, Edwards, Jones, Brown, etc)

2 of our top targets in this year's draft have been injured in college, Thomas with a torn ACL and Peterson with the ankle and collar bone.

WHAT IF, we draft injured guys, so they already have their injuries OUT OF THE WAY, before they get to us and stay healthy forever.
Sounds good :D ....but this ******* CLEVELAND!......They would die in a plane crash on the way here.
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Old 02-23-2007, 02:15 PM    (permalink
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guys you are forgetting something though kamerion wimbley broke the curse of our first round draft picks being injured.
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Old 02-23-2007, 02:43 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Freddy G
Quote:
Originally Posted by jriles0522
I just had a revelation.

The Browns players who get hurt always have a clean bill of health in college (Winslow, Edwards, Jones, Brown, etc)

2 of our top targets in this year's draft have been injured in college, Thomas with a torn ACL and Peterson with the ankle and collar bone.

WHAT IF, we draft injured guys, so they already have their injuries OUT OF THE WAY, before they get to us and stay healthy forever.
Sounds good :D ....but this *********** CLEVELAND!......They would die in a plane crash on the way here.
Yeah, it might be worse if they've already had problems. Like they'd drown in all the snow we have in ohio, but I like the thinking jriles. :D
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Old 02-23-2007, 03:15 PM    (permalink
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im saying prayers from now ill april 28th.
i'll say them with you.


i'd love to see a trade with the viks. it does work out and is entirely possible. and rumors are there set on that young QB they have. so they REALLY need a wide out.

i woulnt mind if we traded back up into the first rnd for carriker. or possibly even levi brown if he slipped. troy smith could be a lock, or micheal bush. and with the 3rd rnd pick we could take that DE from Hawaii.
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