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View Poll Results: Who will win the NBA Championship in 2013?
Miami Heat 15 26.79%
Miami Heat 3 5.36%
Miami Heat 31 55.36%
Miami Heat 6 10.71%
Miami Heat 1 1.79%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-07-2012, 03:59 AM    (permalink
wogitalia
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We're talking about likability. Favre is an egotistical asshole, Duncan is a great team leader but tends to complain a lot, KG is a huge douchebag, Shaq is a malcontent that can't stay with a team (or was), Pierce has the wheelchair incident and has always been douchey, and Kobe is a rapist asshole. Wade got the benefit of the most calls ever in a series, Durant whatever, Rose has the charisma of a doorknob, Chris Paul is a massive flopper and also a douche, Penny is an ass, Grant Hill I love but was hurt too often, MJ is the biggest asshole of all time, Larry Johnson was not a superstar, and the latter two are fine but not Nash likable.

We aren't talking about how good they are, just likable.
I explained why I find him less likeable than a lot of players. I also added why a lot of people love him.

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ya you've never seen Nash play if you don't think he tries on defense, he may suck at it, but he certainly has always tried
He is a lazy defender, defense is probably 90% effort, LeBron didn't suddenly learn to play defense, he started giving an effort on defense, a guy like Rodman wasn't one of the best defenders because he was bigger, stronger and faster, he was one of the best because he tried and worked harder and used everything he had. Nash had the natural athletic ability to be a very good defender and he is one of the very worst, ever. He is a lazy defender, who spend the most part of his career hiding on defense, a personality his entire team assumed. There is just no reason outside of laziness that Nash (in his prime at least) shouldn't have been at least an average defender. The guy is very smart, physically above average, had good size for the position but didn't have the mentality or desire to defend, I call it lazy, you can call it whatever term you think best describes that.

Plenty of players have been better at passing than Nash. Not saying Nash isn't a great passer because he is, but plenty have been as good or better.

Phoenix got plenty of media attention, Nash has two MVPs (a media award) that he didn't deserve to testify at the over saturation of Nash in the media. I can't comment on the coverage in the USA obviously, but his coverage was saturated online and in Australia compared to his ability, culminating in the aforementioned MVPs.

Again... I never said I dislike him, I actually really like Nash, I just don't find him that likeable because of everything I've mentioned and I know there are plenty of others who share the view.

Likeable is purely opinion anyway so it's a pointless thing to argue, I simply said that I don't find Nash close to the most likeable player in recent times, which makes me 100% right, if someone else finds him the most likeable to them, they are 100% right as well. It's a personal opinion.

For mine Nash's disdain for defense and media saturation makes him less likeable than someone like Kobe who has a pathological desire to be the best and work the hardest. I'd almost certainly prefer to have a beer with Nash but I like Kobe Bryant more when it comes to basketball and ultimately the basketball side is what matters most.
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:26 AM    (permalink
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Nash had the natural athletic ability to be a very good defender and he is one of the very worst


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Old 06-07-2012, 06:20 AM    (permalink
wogitalia
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Nash is a fantastic athlete, one of the best laterally in the league. In short, anyone that can do what he can do offensively is an above average athlete, it takes more athletic ability to be what he is on offense than it would to be an average defender.

Don't get me wrong, he isn't the best athlete but he is a good athlete.
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Old 06-07-2012, 09:00 AM    (permalink
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I can't even fathom how you can watch Nash for more than 5 minutes and come away thinking that he is a fantastic athlete. Seriously what?

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Old 06-07-2012, 11:13 AM    (permalink
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Just to throw wogi a bone here, Nash does have excellent quickness and agility, both things that can help you excel on defense. I don't think anyone expects him to be Tony Allen, but closing out on open jumpshots and getting in the passing lanes goes a long way towards the overall team defense.
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Old 06-07-2012, 11:19 AM    (permalink
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I love Steve Nash but Nash would never be able to guard Rose or Westbrook, who are fantastic athletes.

All of Nash's game is based on his court sense and the space he gets because of it.

Durant is extremely likable. He has the potential to be the most humble superstar ever.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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Stockton was a short stiff white guy. Tell me he can't play D.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:49 PM    (permalink
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Nash is an awful defender bc he just has no understanding of defense. He's lost so often, blows his assignment constantly, just doesn't know how to use his body or anticipation skills at all, he's just lost on defense. It's puzzling to see. It's not a lack of effort, the guy just looks lost on that end of the floor.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:52 PM    (permalink
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I love Steve Nash but Nash would never be able to guard Rose or Westbrook, who are fantastic athletes.

All of Nash's game is based on his court sense and the space he gets because of it.

Durant is extremely likable. He has the potential to be the most humble superstar ever.
Yeah, but Rose and Westbrook can't even guard each other either! They would each get their own facing each other. These guys don't get shutdown by anyone except themselves if they're having an off day.

But on the other end, neither Rose or Westbrook help their team out as much as Nash helps out his teammates. If you want a choose a guy to win in a 1 on 1 game, then you go with Rose/Westbrook over Nash.... but if you're a fan of "team" basketball, you love Nash more at the PG position.

Chicago and OKC are still very good teams without Rose/Westbrook. PHX without Nash is a catastrophy.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, but Rose and Westbrook can't even guard each other either! They would each get their own facing each other. These guys don't get shutdown by anyone except themselves if they're having an off day.

But on the other end, neither Rose or Westbrook help their team out as much as Nash helps out his teammates. If you want a choose a guy to win in a 1 on 1 game, then you go with Rose/Westbrook over Nash.... but if you're a fan of "team" basketball, you love Nash more at the PG position.

Chicago and OKC are still very good teams without Rose/Westbrook. PHX without Nash is a catastrophy.
Nash is such a liability on defense that I personally wouldn't want him on my team, no matter how good he is on the offensive side of the ball. He didn't win a ring for a reason. He's just awful on defense, and that gets magnified in the playoffs.

Forget 1 on 1 defense, defense is played as a unit, and he's so lost and blows his assignments so much, it just kills you in the playoffs.
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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Nash is no worse of a defender than Jeremy Lin, so shut up BBD. He's bad at it, but he tries hard and can draw charges if he has to. Nash just doesn't have the lateral quickness to make it work on defense, but I'd gladly take him on my team because he's a fantastic leader, an amazing guy, and one of the best runners of an offense ever.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:28 PM    (permalink
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Nash is no worse of a defender than Jeremy Lin, so shut up BBD. He's bad at it, but he tries hard and can draw charges if he has to. Nash just doesn't have the lateral quickness to make it work on defense, but I'd gladly take him on my team because he's a fantastic leader, an amazing guy, and one of the best runners of an offense ever.
Lin is young and developing, Nash is old. You're ridiculous with your hate for Lin.

And Lin is 10X more athletic than Nash, so by your very own definition of what you need to be a good defender, Lin has more potential to grow as a defender than Nash does.

Keep hating.

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Old 06-07-2012, 02:50 PM    (permalink
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Itís almost like a Hollywood script for OKC. They went through Dallas. Then they went through the Lakers. Then they went through us. Those three teams represent 10 of the last 13 championships. And now theyíre going to go to the Finals and play either Boston or Miami. And that will be 11 of the last 13 championships. I donít know if anybody has gone through a playoff playing those kinds of teams. Itís just incredible, and I think itís pretty cool for them.
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I was thinking about this earlier. I really hope they complete the run.

SA must have felt like they were watching a changing of the guard.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:56 PM    (permalink
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Pop is ******* awesome.

interesting to see talent beat out coaching/vet smarts in that series.

So far, it's the opposite in the East, but that's not over.
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:05 PM    (permalink
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Pop is ******* awesome.

interesting to see talent beat out coaching/vet smarts in that series.

So far, it's the opposite in the East, but that's not over.
really think Miami still has a legitimate shot. especially if Bosh is as healthy as expected. I feel much more confident that OKC will beat either team, however, after this series. they're just too good and Durant is officially a closer
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:22 PM    (permalink
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Anyone that didn't think Durant was a closer before this series needs to get their heads checked. If Russ would quit begging for the ball down the stretch, most games would get put away pretty handily. KD is unguardable, can put up a good shot against anyone and he's shooting 95% from the line in the playoffs. His efficiency is off the charts.
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:26 PM    (permalink
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Anyone that didn't think Durant was a closer before this series needs to get their heads checked. If Russ would quit begging for the ball down the stretch, most games would get put away pretty handily. KD is unguardable, can put up a good shot against anyone and he's shooting 95% from the line in the playoffs. His efficiency is off the charts.
not that I didn't think KD was a closer, but I don't catch a lot of Thunder games
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:29 PM    (permalink
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And is it just me, or has Durant hit just about every buzzer beating shot he puts up at the end of quarters..?
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:33 PM    (permalink
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And is it just me, or has Durant hit just about every buzzer beating shot he puts up at the end of quarters..?
Every time I turn around he's hitting one it seems.
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I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:47 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by wogitalia View Post
Stoudemire has been fine especially before he had the human blackhole and especially considering his knees are getting to be Penny Hardaway level bad.

Johnson is better than he ever was in Phoenix.

Marion is old now and didn't improve or decline any more than one would expect when his age is considered with or without Nash.

Nowitzki and the Mavs in general got better after he left.

Both Jason and Quentin Richardson declined by just about any measure the year they joined Nash.
Apologies if this is jumping on too late, but it's worth commenting.

Stoudemire had been fine for one year when he was the principal offensive weapon in New York and had a reasonable Point Guard getting the ball to him in Raymond Felton. Fine and good. Then he became the 2nd Weapon behind Carmelo and his PG was replaced with Chauncey Billups, who was technically a downgrade as far as who he was at the time versus what Felton was. Then his knees caved in on him and that's the story she wrote.

Johnson was very young when he bolted from Pheonix for the megadeals in Atlanta. Nevermind whether he's worth the money he's gotten; do you really think his career or ability wouldn't have progressed the same way had he stayed, if not potentially better?

Didn't Marion leave Pheonix for what at the time was a bottom-feeder that he couldn't help lift up and had to find redemption as a grizzled role player in Dallas in '11?

It took Nowitzki and the Mavs a couple of years to get to the Finals after saying good-bye to Nash. How much of it had to do with Nash leaving? I would say very little, unless Devin Harris was substantially better defensively and Erick Dampier somehow someway proved to be worth the money he got that could've been used to keep Nash.

By all accounts Jason Richardson was on the decline of his career, though it's arguable that Nash helped keep him afloat long than he should've- look at his impact, or lack thereof, in Orlando.

And Quentin Richardson? When Pheonix got him he was a role player from the Clippers who probably had promise but hadn't yet shown himself to be anything more than an occasionally lethal volume shooter from the 3-Line. And in the end, back injuries did in his potential.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
Lin is young and developing, Nash is old. You're ridiculous with your hate for Lin.

And Lin is 10X more athletic than Nash, so by your very own definition of what you need to be a good defender, Lin has more potential to grow as a defender than Nash does.

Keep hating.

#KnicksIn2013
Why are the Knicks going after Nash? I take it, you're not a fan of those rumors.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:02 PM    (permalink
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I still feel bad for Q-Rich, for being traded four times in one offseason.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:11 PM    (permalink
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I'm going to assume OKC wins it all this year. I'll also go on record and say I don't think they repeat next year though.

The reason I look at is 1) they were the last team in terms of assists this year (that'll probably change a little when Maynor comes back)

2) Perkins and Ibaka yesterday combined for 7 rebounds.

3) They have absolutely no post game.

I think they were like last year's dallas mavericks in that they caught lightning in a bottle and everything clicked for them this year. When everybody's making shots, it's impossible to beat them but I think some team will find the right defensive scheme to beat them.

A lot of their road playoff wins have been by a very slim margin.

The thing working for them though, is that there's not a lot of teams in the West that have something building right now. Maybe if we can make a big move or two. If the Clippers are smart they'd trade Blake for Dwight.

They do have two top ten players (one being the best in the league) in the league which always helps though.

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Old 06-07-2012, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/celti...-on-espn-radio

It sounds like this kid needs to get his ass kicked or at least punched in the face to take down his happy go lucky enthusiasm.
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Old 06-07-2012, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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http://tracking.si.com/2012/06/06/su...ign-and-trade/

Suns have an agreement with point guard Steve Nash that if free-agent Nash chooses to leave the Desert for another locale, the team would do a sign-and-trade both to maximize Nashís salary and to make sure it gets something in return.

Because of this, a suitorís cap space will not be an issue, and Nash will have his pick of destinations when he hits the market in July.

Kyler also writes that Nash wants a three-year deal, and that more than half the league is willing to go that long. The Suns supposedly are willing to offer Nash $10 million per season.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Opens up the list of suitors for Nash...
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