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Old 11-18-2007, 06:59 PM    (permalink
M.O.T.H.
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My hats off to Campbell but, goodlord...our pass coverage was flat out awful. Mccardell had about 3 wide open receptions, Randel El was left uncovered a bunch of times, and dont even get me started when it comes to a lot of the coverage on Moss. ugh.

Also...I cant wait to get Reeves out of here. I've never seen a corner give up as much cushion as him.
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Old 11-18-2007, 07:06 PM    (permalink
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Gotta give props to the Boys. They are the class of the NFC right now.

However, I think if the Skins have Taylor & Rogers for that game the Skins win it.

Should be a good game in DC in December regardless of the standings.
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Old 11-18-2007, 08:02 PM    (permalink
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Something I noticed after Roy gave up the touchdown to Cooley, was that this was the first time I've actually seen a coach talking to him. Which leads me to believe that touchdown was one of the few that have actually been his fault.
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Old 11-18-2007, 08:08 PM    (permalink
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I like Roy but, I think it would be best for both parties if they were to part ways. Yeah, I like Roy but, I dont like him in this defense at all. He's getting torn apart week after week. Maybe he should bulk up once again and play some LB somewhere...He's a liability out there.

This being said...i dont see any way we trade Roy.
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Old 11-18-2007, 08:17 PM    (permalink
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Roy, spears, and reeves are all weak points of this defense. Roy and Reeves got exposed for what they are tonight. I kept hoping they had improved, but no, same mistake's, same ******** from them.

This D would probably be better with Watkins at FS and Hamlin at SS to tell the truth. Ham is prob not as good in run support as Roy but he is good enough and his ability to play decent coverage makes him a better choice in this defense.

If you wanna get pressure, you have to have confidence that your safeties will be where they need to be and Roy never is.

Henry looked slow tonight too, I hope we can keep him off the field as much as possible against the Jets and give him a chance to play near 100% against GB
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Old 11-18-2007, 08:20 PM    (permalink
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I wouldnt say Spears is a weak point. Maybe as a pass-rusher...we all know he has been a big disappoinment in that department but, as a run stuffer he is fantastic. You take him away...we're def. worse against the rush.
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Old 11-18-2007, 10:30 PM    (permalink
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I really have nothing more to add about Roy other than he should not be playing in anything other than Special Teams. He does not look like a professional football player out there.

Other Observations (Negative):
1) We are not run blocking AT ALL. Especially the Tackles.
2) We played very conservatively on D.
3) Our Kickoff Coverage is going backawards
4) Tank is horrid versus the Run. Just abysmal.
5) Where were our other 3 LB this game?

Positive:
1) TO is being used deep effectively
2) Ware
3) Miles Austin looks to break one soon. Much much better than Thompson. Looks so much faster.
4) Ratliff
5) 9-1
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:08 PM    (permalink
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Really don't know what you guys are talking about, unless its just blatant scapegoat-seeking.

Roy broke down on multiple occasions, but really, with the possible exception of Newman, who on the D didn't? Hamlin gave up a horrible TD pass to Moss, Reeves was routinely giving up plays in front of him, Henry fell down twice for big gains, and was picked on multiple other times, Watkins was in the area for more than a few key completions......I mean, what more is there to say. In addition, Roy made the key tackle of the game, making an unbelievable take down when it looked like Cooley was going to convert yet another 3rd and long, setting Washington up with 1st and 10 inside the Cowboys territory and possibly setting up a 17-7 lead. Instead, they're punting and Dallas goes right back the other way for our first lead.

Roy led the team in tackling, he was active in the run game, and made some key stops. Did he allow some completions? Hell yes, he did, but so did everyone else.

Look, I'm every bit as frustrated by this performance as anyone else here, but the reality of this game is as follows:

1) Campbell played by far his best game as a pro. He made the proper reads, put the ball on the money, and kept his composure throughout.

2) Washington's O-line played one of the best games I've seen by a unit all year. DeMarcus was tearing up the place out there, and we still only managed one sack all day long...and on the occasions when we did break through, Campbell was able to stick a throw under pressure or avoid the rusher just enough to get it off. Superb O-line play.

3) Our defense was willing to give up the underneath stuff all afternoon and wait for Campbell to make a mistake. He didn't until that final pick by T-New. I would have liked to see us adjust and throw more exotic stuff their way, and play a little more man-to-man with a single safety deep while blitzing up front, but Phillips didn't seem to want to take that risk.

4) For the 4th consecutive game, our running game has failed to show up. This follows a pattern we've seen each of the last two years with Parcells, with a dominant run-O early that has tailed off as the year wore on--exactly the opposite of what you would expect.

5) Gurode has got to get it under control. He single-handedly killed our first two drives of the game (although no one made Romo throw the ball up for grabs like he did), and was on the verge of over-throwing Romo multiple other times throughout the game. W.T.F?

6) Why did we wait so long to attack deep. We expected to see a lot of Cover 2 coming in, but they were bringing heat and taking away the short stuff all throughout the first part of the game. I was screaming for us to take a shot from the beginning of the 2nd on, and it finally happened with the deep one to Crayton that caused the PI and set up our 2nd TD. Coincedentally, that was also the beginning of our 2nd half run. Hmmm.


There was tons of stuff to complain about in this one. Roy didn't light the world on fire with his coverage, not saying he did. But overall I thought he was our 3rd best player today on that side of the ball. To simply throw the blanket of "Roy sucks in coverage, he must go!" over what happened today is extremely simple-minded, at least imho.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:11 PM    (permalink
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DMW, sorry to say this, but Roy Williams made 1 good play and about 10 bad plays.

His one good play was a a LINEBACKER.

As a Safety, he was involved directly in giving up 2 TDs and every meaningful Redskin drive. He made no plays in coverage.

Roy Williams is like my neighborhood Christmas Trees. Lit up.

With respect to Reeves and Hamlin -- Hamlin is a SS and it was one play, Reeves we all admit is a nicel corner.

Roy is allegedly, according to Cowboys fans, an All Pro.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:16 PM    (permalink
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Good post as always DMW...

I still think we need to get better zone recognition. This has been a problem since day one....so why hasn't it been fixed yet?
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:25 PM    (permalink
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I am curious, how did Watkins play a bad game other than his penalty?

He played pretty well on the snaps I saw.

Hamlin, Reeves and Henry I get it. TNew and Watkins -- no.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:25 PM    (permalink
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To simply throw the blanket of "Roy sucks in coverage, he must go!" over what happened today is extremely simple-minded, at least imho.
I dont think anyone is saying that just off of today's performance. This is a weekly problem...he is a liability. He doesnt know how to cover...that is reality. He seems to be constantly confused...he cant play man...he's extremely weak in zone. I've really never seen anything like it, not out of a "safety" at least. Yes, he did make some nice tackles today but, he does that all the time...tackling is a strength...coverage is a major weakness and in our D...that makes him a liability. He's getting picked on and we havent seen much improvement here all year. It's getting a little old. I think he could be very successful elsewhere and our defense would be stronger w/ out him.

But, like I said before...I don't see any way he gets traded anytime soon.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:28 PM    (permalink
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Most of the touchdowns to TO looked like he was uncovered. Just bad zone coverage by Redskins. Good lord Campbell has gotten tons better. Redskins looked like a solid team.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:32 PM    (permalink
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I dont think anyone is saying that just off of today's performance. This is a weekly problem...he is a liability. He doesnt know how to cover...that is reality. He seems to be constantly confused...he cant play man...he's extremely weak in zone. I've really never seen anything like it, not out of a "safety" at least. Yes, he did make some nice tackles today but, he does that all the time...tackling is a strength...coverage is a major weakness and in our D...that makes him a liability. He's getting picked on and we havent seen much improvement here all year. It's getting a little old. I think he could be very successful elsewhere and our defense would be stronger w/ out him.

But, like I said before...I don't see any way he gets traded anytime soon.
We are playing 11 versus 10 when teams pass of First and Second.

We have dug so far down for excuses his making tackles consitutes good play.

Good god, I remember us measuring his impact in fumbles, TFLs and INTs.

Now it is "nice tackle for gain."
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:46 PM    (permalink
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Say what you want about Roy, but he hasn't gotten beat deep all year long. Not even in his (oft-referenced) horrible game against the Giants did he give up a deep one.

At this point, I have given up on him ever becoming good in coverage, but he hasn't been anywhere near the liability against the pass that most people have made him out to be. We have been a top 8 pass defense for most of this year, and this game was exactly the way you attack us: pass short, take advantage of our ridiculously soft coverages underneath and chip away down the field. Still, realize that it took the Skins over 50 passes to get the yards they got. We got (with the PI call that certainly would have been complete without the penalty) just as many yards on 20 less passes. You guys need to quit looking at totals and start looking at efficiency and consistency. While it was frustrating to watch, it wasn't exactly surprising. We gave them easy throws underneath, they took them. When they went down the field they had very little success outside of unbelievable one-handed catches. Our pass D has been solid all year long, though not quite elite, certainly.

Our problems with Roy have always been him giving up deep plays. This year, that has not happened. Not even once.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:56 PM    (permalink
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Say what you want about Roy, but he hasn't gotten beat deep all year long.
How can he? He ain't being asked to cover deep. Ever.

Face it DMW, this is the most silly argument we hear in his defense all year. It is repeated as often as the earth is flat in 1491.

Second, whoever he covers is open. All the time. Without fail. How can we play D in the playoffs with this situation?

Don't you guys get it, this guy costs you points versus good teams. He costs you points in a very meaningful and obvious way. Do we have to win every playoff game 35 - 30? Or lose to the Pats 52 - 35?

The guy is not a safety and not a 3-4 LB.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:56 PM    (permalink
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Roy isn't going to have the opportunity to get beat deep as often as he used to...he's nearly always playing lined up against the Tight End. It's not like he's getting asked to cover deep anymore.

We see the same problems week after week in our pass coverage. Reeves plays off w/ too much cushion, Roy gets picked apart all game by opposing tight ends, and we play a weak zone all over the field...especially in the middle of the field. We have given up way too many wide open receptions. This happens every week but, yesterday's game was worse than ever. Wide open catches on 3rd and long is just unacceptable. Our zone coverage as a whole is very weak.
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Old 11-18-2007, 11:59 PM    (permalink
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Our zone coverage as a whole is very weak.
One of the reasons is a) Our CB don't trust the safeties and b) Our ILB can't cover for crap unless it is Carp or Burnett.

Have yet to forget Bradie tyring to play zone versus the Lions last year or the Saints.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:01 AM    (permalink
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Carp and Burnett have not been great in coverage this season. Burnett at times has been downright awful. He's a big reason why we struggle in the middle of the field in our nickel packages at times. Obviously, he's better than Akin and Bradie in coverage but, he's not as great as some have made him out to be.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:04 AM    (permalink
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Carp and Burnett have not been great in coverage this season. Burnett at times has been downright awful. He's a big reason why we struggle in the middle of the field in our nickel packages at times. Obviously, he's better than Akin and Bradie in coverage but, he's not as great as some have made him out to be.
Well, I can disagree that Carp and Burnett have not been ideal but THEY DON'T GET TO PLAY!!!!!!!!!!!

We like to stockpile 1st and 2nd rounder for "depth" while we have 7th round corners, unloved FA, and inept SS wallowing around the Defensive backfield.

Seeign the amout of resources on our D in terms of $$$$$$$$ and seeing the performance makes me sick.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:41 AM    (permalink
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Ok, i'm out, it's blatantly obvious where this is going.....
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He was protecting his self
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From what? His leg?
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That leg has had it out for him since day 1.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:47 AM    (permalink
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Ok, i'm out, it's blatantly obvious where this is going.....
I'd love to see your thoughts in the 2008 dallas draft thread.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:48 AM    (permalink
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Well, I can disagree that Carp and Burnett have not been ideal but THEY DON'T GET TO PLAY!!!!!!!!!!!

We like to stockpile 1st and 2nd rounder for "depth" while we have 7th round corners, unloved FA, and inept SS wallowing around the Defensive backfield.

Seeign the amout of resources on our D in terms of $$$$$$$$ and seeing the performance makes me sick.
As always, that's just your idea. You don't know why Carpenter or Burnett don't start, maybe it's because for the coaches they're not good enough. I want to see Carpenter succeed like you, but so far he hasn't shown anything, other than that single performance against Seattle. Wade Phillips makes a great job with his LB, a lot of players had their beast season under Phillips. So there's a reason if Carpenter barely see the field.
And Bradie James hasn't been bad in coverage this year...

Yesterday we didn't give up so many pass yards because of poor coverages by James or the other LB's, it was because the WR's were wide open on the underneath routes all day.
I don't know why, but we played vanilla, we sat back and Campbell picked us apart. With the exception of the first drive, our defense wasn't bad until the Redskins had the ball with us leading 28 to 16. That drive really made me mad. We were afraid of getting beat deep, and we allowed the reskins WR's to be open in short and intermediate routes. It was sort of a prevent defense, and it sucked.
We need Anthony Henry back, Reeves can't cover the short routes...
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Old 11-19-2007, 05:41 AM    (permalink
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It's sad cause Jason was flawless all day, if he ran he would have a TD, but he tried to make the perfect cap on the drive by throwing a TD but did it to easily therefore throwing it short.
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:02 AM    (permalink
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As always, that's just your idea. You don't know why Carpenter or Burnett don't start, maybe it's because for the coaches they're not good enough. I want to see Carpenter succeed like you, but so far he hasn't shown anything, other than that single performance against Seattle. Wade Phillips makes a great job with his LB, a lot of players had their beast season under Phillips. So there's a reason if Carpenter barely see the field.
And Bradie James hasn't been bad in coverage this year...

Yesterday we didn't give up so many pass yards because of poor coverages by James or the other LB's, it was because the WR's were wide open on the underneath routes all day.
I don't know why, but we played vanilla, we sat back and Campbell picked us apart. With the exception of the first drive, our defense wasn't bad until the Redskins had the ball with us leading 28 to 16. That drive really made me mad. We were afraid of getting beat deep, and we allowed the reskins WR's to be open in short and intermediate routes. It was sort of a prevent defense, and it sucked.
We need Anthony Henry back, Reeves can't cover the short routes...
I agree we need healthy CB to play better but part of the reason our Corners play loose is b/c our safeties are not very good in coverage in Cover 1 -- Cover 2 -- 2 Deep.

Redskins have among the worst passing attacks in the NFL and they looked like All Stars yesterday. They really looked great. Good for them but ......

Recurring theme with our Pass Defense and Thule has rightly mentioned this team has yet to learn how to play proper Zone D -- which is even more than a bit disappointing.

Again, lots of money here and not the production to match IMHO. Just frustrating. I almost blew a vein in my head watching them yesterday and versus the Giants. Luckily neither Eli nor Cambell are special.

Last edited by cowboysforever : 11-19-2007 at 10:04 AM.
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