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Old 01-15-2008, 01:53 PM    (permalink
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best QB ever I'm not sure, there have been other good ones too... but to me he's the best in the NFL right now, hands down.

Manning never had to do anything without a fantastic receiving corps and a great O-line. Brady didn't have those things until this season. Plus, Brady actually gets his team through the playoffs more than once.
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Old 01-15-2008, 01:55 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by ImBrotherCain View Post
Ok so Brady Beats out Favre... How about

1. Consecutive Starts by a QB: 253
2. Most Wins by a QB: 160
3. Most TDs: 442
4. Most Yards: 61,665
5. Most Att and Comp
6. Been to 2 Superbowls and won one.
7 Named the league MVP 3 consecutive times (Only player to win 3 let alone consecutively)
8. 9 probowls and 6 Allpro selections.
9. And my personal favorite... The way he plays the game and his love for it


EDIT---- Yes superbowls matter but to me they are a product of the team not solely the QB therefor i do not believe it should weigh heavily on who is dubbed "The Best QB of all time" seeing as there will never be a general consensus.
1, 2, 3, 4, 5 can be done just by starting for a long time
6, brady did better

not saying brady is better, or as good, this is just something that has amazed me for a long time. Favre breaking the career records is pretty logical since he's started for nearly 2 decades (which is a testament to his toughness)
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Old 01-15-2008, 01:56 PM    (permalink
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Favre > Brady . . . but I love them both.
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Addict View Post
1, 2, 3, 4, 5 can be done just by starting for a long time
6, brady did better

not saying brady is better, or as good, this is just something that has amazed me for a long time. Favre breaking the career records is pretty logical since he's started for nearly 2 decades (which is a testament to his toughness)
Very very true but how many people can start that long and still put up numbers? Look at the year Favre had, he came in 2nd in MVP voting... Yes it be a distant second but he still got a vote.
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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best QB ever I'm not sure, there have been other good ones too... but to me he's the best in the NFL right now, hands down.

Manning never had to do anything without a fantastic receiving corps and a great O-line. Brady didn't have those things until this season. Plus, Brady actually gets his team through the playoffs more than once.
We don't know how good Dallas Clark, Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison are without Manning. Would they still be great? Probably. But Manning makes receivers better. He makes O-Lines better. For me, it comes down to:

What does Brady do better than Manning?

What does Manning do better than Brady?

And I can't come up with a decision based on those questions. Let's also point out:

Moss>Harrison
Stallworth Welker>Clark
and before this year...

New England D>Indy's D
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:11 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by CutlerChris View Post
We don't know how good Dallas Clark, Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison are without Manning. Would they still be great? Probably. But Manning makes receivers better. He makes O-Lines better. For me, it comes down to:

What does Brady do better than Manning?

What does Manning do better than Brady?

And I can't come up with a decision based on those questions. Let's also point out:

Moss>Harrison
Stallworth Welker>Clark
and before this year...

New England D>Indy's D
Not to troll but wouldnt it be GonzalezWatson

Just to help prove your point.... i think
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:13 PM    (permalink
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Not to troll but wouldnt it be GonzalezWatson

Just to help prove your point.... i think
Actually I made a mistake. I should have put Stokely instead of Welker, beause I was trying to compare Manning's 2004 weapons with Brady's 2007.

So:
Moss>Harrison
Stallworth Welker>Stokely.
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:27 PM    (permalink
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Very very true but how many people can start that long and still put up numbers? Look at the year Favre had, he came in 2nd in MVP voting... Yes it be a distant second but he still got a vote.
I didn't say it to downplay favre, I'm just saying, anyone starting for as long as he did is bound to break career records.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CutlerChris View Post
Actually I made a mistake. I should have put Stokely instead of Welker, beause I was trying to compare Manning's 2004 weapons with Brady's 2007.

So:
Moss>Harrison
Stallworth Welker>Stokely.
And before '07 brady had absolutely nobody outiside of Deion Branch...
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:31 PM    (permalink
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You forgot to mention how the Pats have been getting favorable calls since the tuck rule...that should cancel out one of those super bowl wins...I know coulda, shoulda, woulda, but everytime I see that replay its disturbing that they ruled it incomplete and they went on to win the super bowl that year, alot of people said and feel like if that call went the other way, there is no telling how it affects the rest of his career or the patriots dynasty
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Old 01-15-2008, 02:50 PM    (permalink
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I didn't say it to downplay favre, I'm just saying, anyone starting for as long as he did is bound to break career records.
That is the worst argument ever... You need to be incredible to start for that long. Vinny Testerverde has about as many games played as Favre. John Elway played for 15+ years. Montana played for 15 years. Warren Moon played for 17 years(15 starting.) Yet none of them set records, or even got close to the records Favre has. How many 38 year olds are in contention for the MVP award? Maybe John Elway was. Can you tell me another that was? The longevity of his playing career is testament to his greatness, not a detraction.
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Old 01-15-2008, 03:00 PM    (permalink
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Tom will never be considered the greatest QB. Hmm why you ask?

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Old 01-15-2008, 03:13 PM    (permalink
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I didn't say it to downplay favre, I'm just saying, anyone starting for as long as he did is bound to break career records.



And before '07 brady had absolutely nobody outiside of Deion Branch...
And before '07 Brady never put up numbers similar to Manning's '04 season either. Plus if people are going to say "now that Brady has weapons he can do just as good as Manning", its important he a) Does it more than once, and B) people recognize Brady's offense now is one witharguably more and better weapons then Manning had in 2004.
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Old 01-15-2008, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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I agree. Tom is my favorite sportsman and he is the greatest football player in history.

Oh, and don't forget about his girlfriend!
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Old 01-15-2008, 03:28 PM    (permalink
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8 is completely wrong. Peyton had a better passer rating, and plenty of QBs have thrown less interceptions in a year. I don't doubt the ratio though.
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Old 01-15-2008, 03:35 PM    (permalink
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Brady is incredible....Favre has been quite the storied QB as well but Montana is simply the greatest of all time hands down. No one ....NO ONE is as clutch as Joe Cool was.
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Old 01-15-2008, 05:03 PM    (permalink
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Im not sure, but pretty much every pass i saw brady throw this year was either a fade to Randy Moss or a screen/hitch route to Welker or a RB... im gonna go lok some stats up now. If you quote it it will be eaiser to read.

in CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA LNG TD INT SACK RAT

Pass Thrown: Behind line 63 84 469 75.0 5.58 42 1 0 0.0 91.8

Pass Thrown: 1-10 yds. 249 329 2196 75.7 6.68 43 31 0 0.0 124.4

Pass Thrown: 11-20 yds. 60 105 1065 57.1 10.14 37 5 5 0.0 88.

Pass Thrown: 21-30 yds. 13 35 454 37.1 12.97 69 5 2 0.0 100.9

Pass Thrown: 31-40 yds. 6 9 256 66.7 28.44 63 3 1 0.0 109.7

Pass Thrown: 41+ yds. 7 16 366 43.8 22.88 65 5 0 0.0 130.2



the passes thrown 1-10 yards make up for about half of the yards and 3/5 of his tds. His Completion % 21-31 yards is only 37%, which seems low. Im not exactly sure what the average is though
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Old 01-15-2008, 05:12 PM    (permalink
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I think if Brady puts up another season like this and wins two more super bowls there just couldn't be any denying it that he's the best. Montanas number one right now,farve not even in my top five, I love the guy, but if I had to choose who my starting qb was, he wouldn't make my top five. I know ill get slammed for that opinion.
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Old 01-15-2008, 05:19 PM    (permalink
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Brady is hardly even top 10 in my book
I dont think any QB should be considered for GOAT until the end of their career and until they retire.

My top 10
1-Johnny Unitas- oh how we forget of the greats before out time
2-Montana- The greatest leader ever
3-Elway- Until the end of his career never had too much talent, but was highly sucessful
4-Favre- The records speak for themselves, and a super bowl seperates him from Marino
5-Marino- The records
6-Baugh- First big time passer
7-Tarkenton- I loved watching his clips on ESPN Classic, i felt he was very dynamic
8-Young- Played great in the short time he did
9-Brady
10-Manning- After the Super Bowl Win i can consider him a top QB

On this subject i dont believe Favre has ever had a WR core as good as Bradys

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Old 01-15-2008, 05:32 PM    (permalink
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What happens if he wins his 4th title this year ? Surely they will be favourites for next year too (that'd make 5). How many does he have to win for you people to consider him a great ?

I'm sorry but to my mind he clearly got Manning covered and I have him ahead of Favre too. He's clearly a top 5 QB now and when its said and done he has a real chance to be considered the greatest ever.
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Old 01-15-2008, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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What happens if he wins his 4th title this year ? Surely they will be favourites for next year too (that'd make 5). How many does he have to win for you people to consider him a great ?

I'm sorry but to my mind he clearly got Manning covered and I have him ahead of Favre too. He's clearly a top 5 QB now and when its said and done he has a real chance to be considered the greatest ever.
Bradshaw has 4. The Steel Curtain was great..buttttttt New Englands D is verry solid near top 10 every Super Bowl Year. Brady is great yes. But the fact that you can bring up stuff like Belicheck, the Defense, the coaching, the lack of competition with in his own divsion etc etc etc etc etc etc stems me to believe that Brady needs to do a little more to get in Top 5 all time for me.
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-15-2008, 06:07 PM    (permalink
yo123
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Originally Posted by neko4 View Post
Brady is hardly even top 10 in my book
I dont think any QB should be considered for GOAT until the end of their career and until they retire.

My top 10
1-Johnny Unitas- oh how we forget of the greats before out time
2-Montana- The greatest leader ever
3-Elway- Until the end of his career never had too much talent, but was highly sucessful
4-Favre- The records speak for themselves, and a super bowl seperates him from Marino
5-Marino- The records
6-Baugh- First big time passer
7-Tarkenton- I loved watching his clips on ESPN Classic, i felt he was very dynamic
8-Young- Played great in the short time he did
9-Brady
10-Manning- After the Super Bowl Win i can consider him a top QB

On this subject i dont believe Favre has ever had a WR core as good as Bradys

Pretty decent list, nice to see a Packer fan realizing that Favre is a top 5 QB ever, not the best ever.
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Old 01-15-2008, 06:20 PM    (permalink
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I have Manning and Brady tied as CutlerChris does.
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Old 01-15-2008, 06:24 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by yo123 View Post
Pretty decent list, nice to see a Packer fan realizing that Favre is a top 5 QB ever, not the best ever.
There is no denying Favre deserves to be in discussion for GOAT. Most of us don't think he is number 1, but he has to be included in the discussion. Especially if Marino is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neko4 View Post
Brady is hardly even top 10 in my book
I dont think any QB should be considered for GOAT until the end of their career and until they retire.

My top 10
1-Johnny Unitas- oh how we forget of the greats before out time
2-Montana- The greatest leader ever
3-Elway- Until the end of his career never had too much talent, but was highly sucessful
4-Favre- The records speak for themselves, and a super bowl seperates him from Marino
5-Marino- The records
6-Baugh- First big time passer
7-Tarkenton- I loved watching his clips on ESPN Classic, i felt he was very dynamic
8-Young- Played great in the short time he did
9-Brady
10-Manning- After the Super Bowl Win i can consider him a top QB

On this subject i dont believe Favre has ever had a WR core as good as Bradys

I didn't forget Unitas, Baugh, or Tarkenton the game has changed so much, especially the QB position that I think it is impossible to compare them to the more recent QBs. The year before Montana came into the league, the rules were changed to open up the passing game. I think when the NFL started to crackdown on PI and illegal contact will also be seen as a cut off of being able to legitimately compare QBs.
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Last edited by someone447 : 01-15-2008 at 06:28 PM.
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Old 01-15-2008, 06:47 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Addict View Post
I didn't say it to downplay favre, I'm just saying, anyone starting for as long as he did is bound to break career records.



And before '07 brady had absolutely nobody outiside of Deion Branch...
Tell Testaverde that.
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Old 01-15-2008, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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Tom will never be considered the greatest QB. Hmm why you ask?

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The **** people come up with....astounding.
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