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Old 02-18-2008, 09:56 PM    (permalink
someone447
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Originally Posted by Jay View Post
And there is absolutely zero proof that he ever did. Period.
Dude. You must be incredibly naive. You wouldn't break the rules if you weren't going to use it.
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Old 02-18-2008, 09:58 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Bigburt63 View Post
Is it completely unrealistic for an employee to be overzealous and perform an illegal (even bending the rules slightly) task for their employer, thinking that it would please the boss? It is not entirely unthinkable for the patriots to have turned him down if he came forward with the tape, and for them to have never ordered the taping of the walkthrough in the first place.
If this was the first time BB has been accused of breaking rules regarding illegal videotaping, I would agree with you 100%. But he has already shown that he will break the rules. If Pacman was arrested for something in a strip club tomorrow, you would believe it is probably true, wouldn't you?
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:02 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Billingsley26 View Post
Well, something isnt sitting right with me. If he supposedly has all this info, then the peices would be fitting according to him. In fact it is quite the opposite. Pioli is exposing him for what hes worth, and esposing things Walsh is saying, and proving them to be lies. If he had the tapes this would be out already. I odnt believe this Walsh character one bit. He is living a lie.
Read the original link as to why they haven't been released yet. He wants to make sure he is safe from lawsuits.
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:04 PM    (permalink
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For the record, I am completely against Congress getting involved in this in any way, shape, or form.
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:06 PM    (permalink
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Read the original link as to why they haven't been released yet. He wants to make sure he is safe from lawsuits.
I have read all of that. I have also read articles in whic Scott Pioli as said that this guy's bio is a lie. Everything he claims to have done or accomplish in his life is a lie. I can only attribute this to him living a lie.
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by skarocksoi View Post
If he's trying to gain an advantage out of everything, why do you believe that he wouldn't use it in the games? That seems like the biggest advantage of them all.
I said he walks along the grey areas. In his opinion, it was OK to tape anything he wanted as long as it wasn't used in game. From 2000-2006, it was known that he was doing it and never a problem, which you know, is why he was never penalized for doing the same thing that he got penalized for doing this year.

I love it how everyone jumps to the defense of stealing signals as long as it wasn't done with a camera. I also love it that everyone automatically assumes the same signals are used in every game all year. That is comical.

And I am not repeating what the video was used for again. I've already gone over that at least five times in this thread. They've been talking about what he used it for here almost all season. But no one wants to hear that. That should be my new sign...
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:08 PM    (permalink
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Dude. You must be incredibly naive. You wouldn't break the rules if you weren't going to use it.
Where's your proof that it was used in game? If I need to find proof that other teams video taped, you need to find proof that the Patriots used what they filmed in game. Until then, you've got nothing.

But by your rules, you are incredibly naive to think the Patriots were the only team in the league taping signals.
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:12 PM    (permalink
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Where's your proof that it was used in game? If I need to find proof that other teams video taped, you need to find proof that the Patriots used what they filmed in game. Until then, you've got nothing.

But by your rules, you are incredibly naive to think the Patriots were the only team in the league taping signals.
When did I ever say they were the only team in the league taping signals? You are right, I would be incredibly naive to think that. The Patriots were the only team that got caught. Like I said, I have no problem with them cheating, but if they got caught they have to own up to it.

Earlier in this thread I even said, If you ain't cheatin' you ain't tryin'.
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:17 PM    (permalink
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Hmm... I was hoping we could argue in circles all night. Can you maybe go back and disagree with me on something, this is no fun. Trust me, it's better for us both. Awesome.
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Old 02-19-2008, 09:25 AM    (permalink
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If this was the first time BB has been accused of breaking rules regarding illegal videotaping, I would agree with you 100%. But he has already shown that he will break the rules. If Pacman was arrested for something in a strip club tomorrow, you would believe it is probably true, wouldn't you?
What BB did in the Jets game is very different from what walsh is accusing them of having done before the superbowl. They taped teams to keep a record of the tendencies in play calling, compared to taping part of a team's gameplan before the game starts. One is going into the grey area, and one is all out cheating.

I may believe it to be true, but I could in no way prove that it was true.
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:09 PM    (permalink
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god i hope they strip the patriots of their SB Titles. If only to see the reaction of their fans. Undoubtedlty the most obnoxious fans the NFL has ever produced. You would think the "greatest team in the history of the NFL" with the "greatest QB in the history of the NFL" with the "greatest coach in the history of the NFL" would give it a rest already but I guess the Patriots fans are on the Robert Kraft payroll and must constnatly defend these sleazebags. Now that the greatest QB, Coach and team debates have been lost I guess they have to defend themselves from becoming "the greatest cheaters in the History of the NFL"
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:18 PM    (permalink
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What BB did in the Jets game is very different from what walsh is accusing them of having done before the superbowl. They taped teams to keep a record of the tendencies in play calling, compared to taping part of a team's gameplan before the game starts. One is going into the grey area, and one is all out cheating.

I may believe it to be true, but I could in no way prove that it was true.
Does the court use a person's history of abuse against them in a murder case? Of course, why is it any different to do that with BB?
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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god i hope they strip the patriots of their SB Titles. If only to see the reaction of their fans. Undoubtedlty the most obnoxious fans the NFL has ever produced. You would think the "greatest team in the history of the NFL" with the "greatest QB in the history of the NFL" with the "greatest coach in the history of the NFL" would give it a rest already but I guess the Patriots fans are on the Robert Kraft payroll and must constnatly defend these sleazebags. Now that the greatest QB, Coach and team debates have been lost I guess they have to defend themselves from becoming "the greatest cheaters in the History of the NFL"
As much as I hate him, BB has a legitimate claim to being the best coach ever.

They obviously can't become "the greatest cheaters in the history of the NFL" that would have to be someone who was good enough to not get caught.
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:28 PM    (permalink
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god i hope they strip the patriots of their SB Titles. If only to see the reaction of their fans. Undoubtedlty the most obnoxious fans the NFL has ever produced. You would think the "greatest team in the history of the NFL" with the "greatest QB in the history of the NFL" with the "greatest coach in the history of the NFL" would give it a rest already but I guess the Patriots fans are on the Robert Kraft payroll and must constnatly defend these sleazebags. Now that the greatest QB, Coach and team debates have been lost I guess they have to defend themselves from becoming "the greatest cheaters in the History of the NFL"
Never once have I said that Brady is the best QB ever, the patriots are the best team ever, or that BB is the best coach ever. I hate comparing teams,players, coaches from different eras becuase they are all completely different.
I really don't see how they can have their SB titles stripped, as it can be proven that Walsh taped the walkthrough (he admits that). But it cannot be proven that the coaches had any knowledge of the tapes being in existance, nevermind having used them.
Did they tape the Jets game this past season, yes. Did they get caught, yes. Is this proof that they taped the rams walkthrough, no.
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:30 PM    (permalink
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Does the court use a person's history of abuse against them in a murder case? Of course, why is it any different to do that with BB?
Usually in a murder case, the prosecution has more evidence than just one person (walsh).
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:49 PM    (permalink
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did they say they only have Walsh?
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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did they say they only have Walsh?
He's the one with the tapes regarding the rams walkthrough. He may come out and say there are others, but I don't believe that he has thus far. If he does it could be a little bit different
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Old 02-19-2008, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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As much as I hate him, BB has a legitimate claim to being the best coach ever.

They obviously can't become "the greatest cheaters in the history of the NFL" that would have to be someone who was good enough to not get caught.
Before the cheating he still would have had a hard part getting past Lombardi who was almost perfect. Before the cheating he would have been in the conversation though. You really need to let the careers end because when all is said and done, Parcells may end up getting the credit depending what his disciples do. Right now BB is head and shoulders above the rest but wait ten years and see if any of the other Parcells coaches have success. If they do I think Parcells may vault ahead of BB. Not only would he have two rings but he would also have taught the next generation
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Old 02-19-2008, 01:01 PM    (permalink
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Never once have I said that Brady is the best QB ever, the patriots are the best team ever, or that BB is the best coach ever. I hate comparing teams,players, coaches from different eras becuase they are all completely different.
I really don't see how they can have their SB titles stripped, as it can be proven that Walsh taped the walkthrough (he admits that). But it cannot be proven that the coaches had any knowledge of the tapes being in existance, nevermind having used them.
Did they tape the Jets game this past season, yes. Did they get caught, yes. Is this proof that they taped the rams walkthrough, no.
You may not have but something happened to the patriots fan base after the panthers SB game. you got a bunch of yahoos that go around making the most ridiculous claims. Just look at this site. There is a thread that in all seriousness states that Tom Brady is the greatest QB of all time. Feel sorry for the oldtimers because your bandwagon is going to have to be fumigated after this batch leaves to go root for the Celtics or Red Sox

As to whether it can be stripped? Anything is possible once public relations comes into play. If there is an actual tape of the Rams walk through, that's enough in my book. Who authorized it doesnt matter. That's for the law courts. This is an internal matter where the proof needed is lower. It is simply going to come down to whether the fans want the title stripped or not. Goodell owes his job to Kraft so he'll defend him up to a point but if there is an outcry over nthe punishment and people demand the Patriots be stripped, they will be stripped
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Old 02-19-2008, 02:15 PM    (permalink
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Aww... the poor babies couldn't handle the fact that the Rams might have spied on the Pats and had to lock the thread. That's rich. I think it is hysterical the reaction that thread got, and that people thought it was OK to insult me personally over having the audacity to raise a valid question that was presented six years ago. And to do it all without even knowing my opinion on the situation.

Personally, if it was the Rams and they were spying, I don't care. It doesn't change anything. I would like to thank everyone for proving an enormous point though and that you are all wishing and hoping and dreaming about all of this being true. Calling me a hypocrite is pretty funny considering it's one of those pot-kettle-black situations. But I wouldn't expect anything less from some of those people...
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Old 02-19-2008, 02:25 PM    (permalink
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Aww... the poor babies couldn't handle the fact that the Rams might have spied on the Pats and had to lock the thread. That's rich. I think it is hysterical the reaction that thread got, and that people thought it was OK to insult me personally over having the audacity to raise a valid question that was presented six years ago. And to do it all without even knowing my opinion on the situation.

Personally, if it was the Rams and they were spying, I don't care. It doesn't change anything. I would like to thank everyone for proving an enormous point though and that you are all wishing and hoping and dreaming about all of this being true. Calling me a hypocrite is pretty funny considering it's one of those pot-kettle-black situations. But I wouldn't expect anything less from some of those people...

you are ridiculous, honestly. So they Patriots saw a telescope in a house. That proves absolutley nothing, and there is no evidence that anything did happen. The Patriots, on the other hand, have been caught in the act. When more, for lack of a better word, evidence, comes out that sayus the Pats are cheaters, pepole will jump on it. When you bring up a random link from a random site that sayus something that no one has ever heard of anything about, of course no one is gonna belive you.
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Old 02-19-2008, 02:26 PM    (permalink
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Seriously? A guy, who u dont even know, watched through a Telescope how a SuperBowl team practices... and u compare that to Tapes of a former Member of the Pats (with or without evidence on them)?
I just dont get ur reasoning
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Old 02-19-2008, 02:49 PM    (permalink
Billingsley26
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Originally Posted by Bengals1690 View Post
you are ridiculous, honestly. So they Patriots saw a telescope in a house. That proves absolutley nothing, and there is no evidence that anything did happen. The Patriots, on the other hand, have been caught in the act. When more, for lack of a better word, evidence, comes out that sayus the Pats are cheaters, pepole will jump on it. When you bring up a random link from a random site that sayus something that no one has ever heard of anything about, of course no one is gonna belive you.
Yea, evidence that is SAID to be legit from a guy who is living a lie named Mat Walsh. If you call that evidence, then we are good to call that person in the window evidence too. Lol, this is hilarious. You call Matt Walsh's video evidence yet hes holding on to it like a baby. It aint evidence yet, and its just as much evidence as the person in the window with the telescope.
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Old 02-19-2008, 02:53 PM    (permalink
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I mean, how can this so called video, be called evidence? It has only been veiwed by Matt Walsh, who is living a lie, and has been exposed by Pioli. Godell hasnt seen the video and neither has anyone else. This guy has been proved to lie about things, hell he lies about his own life. Goodell isnt even calling this evidence. I dont know how this so called video is more evidence than the person in the window.
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Old 02-19-2008, 02:55 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bengals1690 View Post
you are ridiculous, honestly. So they Patriots saw a telescope in a house. That proves absolutley nothing, and there is no evidence that anything did happen. The Patriots, on the other hand, have been caught in the act. When more, for lack of a better word, evidence, comes out that sayus the Pats are cheaters, pepole will jump on it. When you bring up a random link from a random site that sayus something that no one has ever heard of anything about, of course no one is gonna belive you.
1. The New York times is a random site?
2. That was the point, to prove people will jump all over Pats fans for A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G.

Let me repeat that:

A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G

There's nothing ridiculous here. I have as much proof that the Rams spied on the Patriots as you have that the Patriots spied on the Rams. Yet I'm the asshole, and in trying to point out the hypocrisy of the situation, get called a hypocrite. It's humorous.

Suggest the Pats did something, completely unfounded, and the pile on effect begins.

But a Pats fan suggest someone else might have done something wrong, and the tears start to well up and we are either:

1. Hypocrites
2. Making excuses
3. Need to stop worrying about what other teams do.
4. Ridiculous/stupid/dummy-heads and a bunch of other second grade words.

All I want is consistency. People WANT the Pats to be the bad guys. They WANT to make this more than it is. It's a joke, and I am sick of it.
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