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Old 04-13-2008, 08:46 PM    (permalink
Packman1957
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First of all, I apologize for being a dick, but the whole "my time is too valuable for this" thing irritates me to no end.
First of all I appreciate your apology, and please everyone accept mine (as I re-read some my posts I see that I get a little arrogant too) And its not that my time is too valuable. The biggest reason I kind of stopped arguing was because I said pretty much all I can say. But I will answer your question.

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As for the QB thing, if you give me just one example, I'll concede that there is a possibility it could happen. The thing is, you won't be able to.
Alright I'll answer the question but its not the kind of answer you are looking for I think....

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Please, in the sake of argument, name me one time this has ever happened in the history of the NFL draft: A team using a first round pick on a QB they never, ever, ever intend to start.

Really, I mean it. I want to know if this has ever happened before, and if it has, how long that GM stuck around.
See I don't think thats how they intend on using him though unless Rodgers stays completely healthy. And I guess I believe thats not likely IMO. I would be very surprised if Aaron Rodgers made it through every season, without getting injured. That's why I think Brohm will play. And I personally believe TT has been quoted to saying every team should have 2 starting caliber QB's on there roster. And if you notice, the first year he took over in '05 he took Aaron Rodgers with the 24th selection to further prove his theory. You could say this was pure coincidence since Rodgers was the BPA, but he still did take Rodgers. And that left us with Favre and Rodgers, two starting caliber QB's. Now back to the injury situation with Rodgers. I think TT sees that if Aaron Rodgers runs this team we are going to need a competent backup behind him, due to his history with injuries. I think its just a little alarming that he has had 3 injuries in the past 3 seasons and he only played in one meaningful contest. And maybe I am going a little paranoid over it. Obviously most people disagree with what I have to say regarding some athletes are more durable than others...but that is a big part of my argument of why we could consider taking Brohm. Rodgers has proved to be very fragile so far and like I said its kind of alarming...especially considering we have no competent backup at QB on our roster right now.

But this isn't the only reason why I think the idea of taking Brohm makes sense. I don't plan on taking him just to backup Rodgers. Brohm can determine his own fate. By taking Brohm, you are enhancing the competition and allowing one to emerge as the starter (this was said by a Packerchatter poster for quoting purposes). I think every Packer fan will say by doing this we are sending the wrong message to Aaron Rodgers. I really don't think Aaron Rodgers is going to be sad if we took a QB, if anything it should motivate him to do well. I think he has a good self-esteem and believes he is the starter and it's his job to lose IMO. So I guess I don't see how competition will hurt him. If he really is as good as Brohm (which as of now I believe he is), he will win the starting job. I know people will say this is Aaron Rodgers first year as starter, we haven't given him a chance. The fact is he will get his chance, and lets face it if he is good enough and remains healthy he will remain the starter. But if he is not good, or he cannot stay healthy for an extended period of time which IMO doesn't seem out of the question (the injury part of course), than we have our insurance policy in place with Brohm.

Which leads me to my last point....the QB position is probably the single most important position on the football field and it takes precedence over other positions. Of course you want guys who can contribute, I agree whole heartedly. But the QB position is just that important IMO. I mean look at the franchises who struggled with QB play after drafting one, Joey Harrington for the Lions, Kyle Boller for the Ravens, Ryan Leaf for the Chargers, Akili Smith for the Bengals, Tim Couch for the Browns, and so on and so forth. The only team that got by was the Ravens solely based on there defense. I am not saying its a bad idea to expect big things from your QB, and tell him you're our guy but look at all of theose teams that struggled for the next 4-5 years because they had no backup plan. By taking a QB here you're increasing your chances of success at the position. And the bottom line is IMO there is not one position that is more important to hit on than QB. Sometimes its powerful enough to gurantee your franchise decades of playoff appearances and superbowl contention (most notably when you hit it big). But the key thing is, you have to look at the teams that miss on QB in the draft. As I explained above it sets them in a deep hole that is hard to dig out of (and those mentioned above are just a few examples). Although I have the utmost confidence in Rodgers, and I believe he is our guy...the jury is still out on him. I just like the idea of having a backup plan in place if this doesn't work out.

Now even I admit there are flaws to my plan, most notably the money we pay to Brohm as a first round pick. But on a positive note we are picking at #30, which is pretty far down the list, so in that case we don't got to pay an arm and a leg. Believe me if we were picking in the top 15 I wouldn't be debating this...but since we are at 30 its a little different story. According to how I rate Brohm, if he is there at #30 he would probably be my BPA as I got him rated pretty high. But I guess we never know who will be there at #30 though.

Another flaw could be we don't have the luxury? Maybe...but we do have two 2nd rounders, a 3rd rounder, two 4th rounders (one being the comp pick), and so on. I think we still can find some quality players in those rounds.

Now if everything goes well over the next couple of years for Rodgers both on the field and durability wise, than we can look at the possibility of trading Brohm. Some will say, well at that point we are not going to be getting good return on investment and essentially we wasted the first rounder. Maybe...but I still think we can get something good in return as long as Brohm doesn't have the makings of a bust.

So basically my whole philisophy boils down too I would rather have a backup plan in place ahead of time rather than later on. I know Aaron Rodgers deserve his shot, I won't disagree. But I would rather be safe than sorry.

I just want too add if we can add a good backup through trade I am all for it.
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Old 04-13-2008, 09:06 PM    (permalink
mqtirishfan
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I see your point, but in order for us to take a first round QB, it would only be with the intent of replacing A-Rod. That's why we took A-Rod in the first place, to replace Favre. Your idea is still to have a guy that until A-Rod is gone will never start, but you even admit that you're assuming A-Rod to be our franchise guy. In this case, you're either suggesting that we take a guy to sit behind A-Rod for the 10 or so years he's going to play, or you're saying A-Rod is too injury prone to be a franchise guy, in which case we should take a QB to replace him.

You're missing that major flaw: A-Rod figures to be our franchise guy. Brohm, if we took him in the first and spent the eventual money on him, would also have to figure to be our franchise guy. It would simply be a bad choice, and no GM would ever make it. Can you imagine TT going up to the podium and explaining how the Packers are very excited to get a game-breaking clipboard holder? That's how he'd have to spin it if he made that pick, because the only other way he could spin it is to say that he isn't confident in Rodgers, which is a bad thing to say as you tell the fan base that you're still intending for him to be the guy you build your franchise around.

Still, the biggest problem is the opportunity cost. You're missing out on a guy that you would expect to start for your franchise for years. At the end of the first, you're still picking from guys who figure to be major factors in the future, and we have major holes at CB and OT going into the future. Clifton, Tauscher, Harris and Woodson will start this year, making one of those two picks backups for the year. However, they're all in their 30s, and they won't be around for very long. Having an impact player in their place is something that is very important to the future of the Packers. Your competition theory with Rodgers would be a great idea in the third round.

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Old 04-13-2008, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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I see your point, but in order for us to take a first round QB, it would only be with the intent of replacing A-Rod. That's why we took A-Rod in the first place, to replace Favre. Your idea is still to have a guy that until A-Rod is gone will never start, but you even admit that you're assuming A-Rod to be our franchise guy. In this case, you're either suggesting that we take a guy to sit behind A-Rod for the 10 or so years he's going to play, or you're saying A-Rod is too injury prone to be a franchise guy, in which case we should take a QB to replace him.

You're missing that major flaw: A-Rod figures to be our franchise guy. Brohm, if we took him in the first and spent the eventual money on him, would also have to figure to be our franchise guy. It would simply be a bad choice, and no GM would ever make it. Can you imagine TT going up to the podium and explaining how the Packers are very excited to get a game-breaking clipboard holder? That's how he'd have to spin it if he made that pick, because the only other way he could spin it is to say that he isn't confident in Rodgers, which is a bad thing to say as you tell the fan base that you're still intending for him to be the guy you build your franchise around.

Still, the biggest problem is the opportunity cost. You're missing out on a guy that you would expect to start for your franchise for years. At the end of the first, you're still picking from guys who figure to be major factors in the future, and we have major holes at CB and OT going into the future. Clifton, Tauscher, Harris and Woodson will start this year, making one of those two picks backups for the year. However, they're all in their 30s, and they won't be around for very long. Having an impact player in their place is something that is very important to the future of the Packers. Your competition theory with Rodgers would be a great idea in the third round.
See I figured that was coming, and I admit its an excellent point in your second paragraph. What would TT say to the fans? That one is hard to make a comeback on. In fact its very hard to make a comeback on. And you honestly probably got the best on me on that one The message is definitely shady no matter how you want to look at it. I would just hope that TT & MM would have a discussion with Rodgers about the pick, and explain why they chose him, but yet still reiterate that Rodgers is still there guy. I think Rodgers is a tough kid too, I really don't think he would personally be bothered that much, as he is pretty laid back. I think he would rise up to the challenge. But as for the fans...you got me there.

Still I don't think TT is trying to please the fans with his picks as I don't think many approved of his Justin Harrell pick, I think he is making the pick that he thinks is best for the franchise (and I know you hate me for just saying that sentence). I know CB, OT, TE, and everything else we need has to be addressed in this draft and I really believe we can find some guys in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. But again I am going to repeat myself in what I said in my previous post. I think the QB position holds more precedence than any other position on the football field.

And I am just curious as you mentioned a 3rd round QB. Who do you have in mind? And I don't mean this in a negative way when I ask what is your plan for a backup QB this season?

But let me tell ya, you just just made a very valid argument.
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Old 04-13-2008, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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Still I don't think TT is trying to please the fans with his picks as I don't think many approved of his Justin Harrell pick, I think he is making the pick that he thinks is best for the franchise (and I know you hate me for just saying that sentence). I know CB, OT, TE, and everything else we need has to be addressed in this draft and I really believe we can find some guys in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. But again I am going to repeat myself in what I said in my previous post. I think the QB position holds more precedence than any other position on the football field.

And I am just curious as you mentioned a 3rd round QB. Who do you have in mind? And I don't mean this in a negative way when I ask what is your plan for a backup QB this season?

But let me tell ya, you just just made a very valid argument.
You're 100% right about Thompson not trying to please the fans with his picks. He makes the pick that's best for the team, like you said. QB definitely is not the best pick for the team.

You say that we can address the other positions later in the draft, but why are you so against taking a QB later instead? That'd make much more sense. Then we can take a corner in the first who we'll know will contribute for sure, as well as a TE with a second who will play immediately as the #2 tightend. A QB we don't know if he would ever play, and we'd hope that he never would. The QB position may be more important than those other positions, but we already have a franchise QB for the future in Rodgers.

I actually would prefer to wait until the 4th for a QB, but here are some that should be available in the third-fifth range in order of how I like them for us: Class 1 Andre' Woodson, John David Booty, Class 2 Josh Johnson, Class 3 Erik Ainge, Kevin O'Connell

Also I'd like to ask you this. Do you think it would make sense for the Raiders to draft Matt Ryan for an insurance policy and competition with Russell?
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Old 04-13-2008, 10:51 PM    (permalink
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See I figured that was coming, and I admit its an excellent point in your second paragraph. What would TT say to the fans? That one is hard to make a comeback on. In fact its very hard to make a comeback on. And you honestly probably got the best on me on that one The message is definitely shady no matter how you want to look at it. I would just hope that TT & MM would have a discussion with Rodgers about the pick, and explain why they chose him, but yet still reiterate that Rodgers is still there guy. I think Rodgers is a tough kid too, I really don't think he would personally be bothered that much, as he is pretty laid back. I think he would rise up to the challenge. But as for the fans...you got me there.

Still I don't think TT is trying to please the fans with his picks as I don't think many approved of his Justin Harrell pick, I think he is making the pick that he thinks is best for the franchise (and I know you hate me for just saying that sentence). I know CB, OT, TE, and everything else we need has to be addressed in this draft and I really believe we can find some guys in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. But again I am going to repeat myself in what I said in my previous post. I think the QB position holds more precedence than any other position on the football field.

And I am just curious as you mentioned a 3rd round QB. Who do you have in mind? And I don't mean this in a negative way when I ask what is your plan for a backup QB this season?

But let me tell ya, you just just made a very valid argument.

As for this year, it's almost got to be Rodgers or bust, because even if we took a first round QB, there's no way he'd be ready this year. The learning curve for an NFL QB is simply too high for us to compete in the playoffs with a rookie QB unless he's one of the most prepared QBs in recent history. If we took a QB, I'd want it to be a developmental guy in the mid-rounds who can be an emergency plan if A-Rod doesn't pan out, but if all goes well, and both show their worth, we have the 2 good QBs and we can get some trade value for him. That's the problem with the first round pick: you can't possibly get a first round value out of the pick unless things go south with Rodgers. I'd love to give a guy like Booty a shot, because I think he fits the system fairly well, and might be a guy that can stick with the team as a backup, simply because he might not have starting potential. I completely agree that we need a quality backup. It's insane to prefer a poor backup to a good one, but it's all about the value and opportunity cost.
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Old 04-13-2008, 11:12 PM    (permalink
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Also I'd like to ask you this. Do you think it would make sense for the Raiders to draft Matt Ryan for an insurance policy and competition with Russell?
I think when you bring up the Raiders you are bringing up a whole different situation. And no I wouldn't touch Matt Ryan if I were the Raiders. In a previous post I had mentioned that if the Packers were picking in the top 15, I wouldn't touch a QB simply based on how much money I would be paying a backup. Top that off the Raiders don't have nearly as much luxury with there pick as we do with ours. They have pressing needs that have to be addressed (starting spots), plus they can land a high impact player at that spot. I know the draft hasn't happened yet, but chances are we are probably not going to be able to get a high impact guy. I mean there are some solid players out there dont get me wrong, but not high impact players like Darren McFadden, Glenn Dorsey, etc.... Top that off I don't think JaMarcus Russell really has much of an injury histroy on him...maybe a little I think but nothing serious.

So to answer your question, absolutely not.

But I see where you guys are coming from...but my question who would backup Rodgers this year. I don't think a John David Booty would be able step in right away. Which leads me to one conclusion we would still have to pick one up right? Who would you guys suggest? Or are you guys suggesting John David Booty be the backup for this year. Just curious.
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Old 04-14-2008, 07:43 AM    (permalink
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U dont want him to step in right away right?
Even if he is so injury prone he will last about 4 in the worst case. Thats enough for such a guy to pick the Game up. U dont want a guy that can contribute right away and possibly start a QB Controversy.

Imagine the Giants last year. If they wouldve had say Brady Quinn, what wouldve happened? Starters, especially first year starters, tend to play weak. And u dont want a fan base to start screaming for his head and wanting another QB to start. I mean if the giants took out Eli and put in Quinn, would they have ever won the SB?

A Qb Controversy is nothing pretty, let a bears fan tell u that
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Old 04-14-2008, 07:54 AM    (permalink
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Packers
Vikings
Bears
Lions

Records predicted AFTER the draft and post-training camp rosters are set.
Bears could surpass the Vikings with a better draft.....
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Old 04-14-2008, 08:18 AM    (permalink
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Packers are a huge question mark with Rodgers at QB but this division stinks at QB anyways and the Pack have a very solid D. It will be interesting to see if Ryan Grant can repeat his performance without Favre loosing up defenses for him.
Minnesota - Actually I believe they will win the Division as Jackson progresses in his 2nd year of starting, but Jackson is still a question mark as is Peterson's ability to stay healthy. Peterson just wasn't the same the last 7 games of the season after getting injured and missing 2 games.
Chicago could still win the Division even with Grossman starting, he is as good as Rodgers or Jackson right now but Benson will have to have a breakout season behind an aging OL. They still have a very solid defense.
Detroit just plain stinks(Thanks Matt Millen), and right now for a team that wants to pound the ball on offense, they have no RB and on defense, they have so many holes, they'll remain the sieve they were last year.
Face it folks, this division is weak, weak and more weak and 8 wins could get the job done.
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Old 04-16-2008, 08:32 AM    (permalink
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Tuesday, April 15, 2008
Check out the 2008 NFC North schedules here
Detroit Lions

Sept. 7, at Atlanta Falcons, 1 p.m.

Sept. 14, Green Bay Packers, 1 p.m.

Sept. 21, at San Francisco 49ers, 4 p.m.

Sept. 28, bye

Oct. 5, Chicago Bears, 1 p.m.

Oct. 12, at Minnesota Vikings, 1 p.m.

Oct. 19, at Houston Texans, 4 p.m.

Oct. 26, Washington Redskins, 1 p.m.

Nov. 2, at Chicago Bears, 1 p.m.

Nov. 9, Jacksonville Jaguars, 1 p.m.

Nov. 16, at Carolina Panthers, 1 p.m.

Nov. 23, Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 1 p.m.

Nov. 27 (Thursday), Tennessee Titans, 12:30 p.m.

Dec. 7, Minnesota Vikings, 1 p.m.

Dec. 14, at Indianapolis Colts, 1 p.m.

Dec. 21, New Orleans Saints, 1 p.m.

Dec. 28, at Green Bay Packers, 1 p.m.

Chicago Bears

Sept. 7, at Indianapolis Colts, 8:15 p.m.

Sept. 14, at Carolina Panthers, 1 p.m.

Sept. 21, Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 1 p.m.

Sept. 28, Philadelphia Eagles, 8:15 p.m.

Oct. 5, at Detroit Lions, 1 p.m.

Oct. 12, at Atlanta Falcons, 1 p.m.

Oct. 19, Minnesota Vikings, 1 p.m.

Oct. 26, bye

Nov. 2, Detroit Lions, 1 p.m.

Nov. 9, Tennessee Titans, 1 p.m.

Nov. 16, at Green Bay Packers, 1 p.m.

Nov. 23, at St. Louis Rams, 1 p.m.

Nov. 30, at Minnesota Vikings, 8:15 p.m.

Dec. 7, Jacksonville Jaguars, 1 p.m.

Dec. 11 (Thursday), New Orleans Saints, 8:15 p.m.

Dec. 22 (Monday), Green Bay Packers, 8:30 p.m.

Dec. 28, at Houston Texans, 1 p.m.

Green Bay Packers

Sept. 8 (Monday), Minnesota Vikings, 7 p.m.

Sept. 14, at Detroit Lions. 1 p.m.

Sept. 21, Dallas Cowboys. 8:15 p.m.

Sept. 28, at Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 1 p.m.

Oct. 5, Atlanta Falcons, 1 p.m.

Oct. 12, at Seattle Seahawks, 4:15 p.m.

Oct. 19, Indianapolis Colts, 4:15 p.m.

Oct. 26, bye

Nov. 2, at Tennessee Titans, 1 p.m.

Nov. 9, at Minnesota Vikings, 1 p.m.

Nov. 16, Chicago Bears, 1 p.m.

Nov. 24 (Monday), at New Orleans Saints, 8:30 p.m.

Nov. 30, Carolina Panthers, 1 p.m.

Dec. 7, Houston Texans, 1 p.m.

Dec. 14, at Jacksonville Jaguars, 1 p.m.

Dec. 22 (Monday), at Chicago Bears, 8:30 p.m.

Dec. 28, Detroit Lions, 1 p.m.

Minnesota Vikings

Sept. 8 (Monday), at Green Bay Packers, 7 p.m.

Sept. 14, Indianapolis Colts, 1 p.m.

Sept. 21, Carolina Panthers, 1 p.m.

Sept. 28, at Tennessee Titans, 1 p.m.

Oct. 6 (Monday), at New Orleans Saints, 8:30 p.m.

Oct. 12, Detroit Lions, 1 p.m.

Oct. 19, at Chicago Bears, 1 p.m.

Oct. 26, bye

Nov. 2, Houston Texans, 1 p.m.

Nov. 9, Green Bay Packers, 1 p.m.

Nov. 16, at Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 1 p.m.

Nov. 23, at Jacksonville Jaguars, 1 p.m.

Nov. 30, Chicago Bears, 8:15 p.m.

Dec. 7, at Detroit Lions, 1 p.m.

Dec. 14, at Arizona Cardinals, 4:05 p.m.

Dec. 21, Atlanta Falcons, 1 p.m.

Dec. 28, New York Giants, 1 p.m.


Looking at the schedules I would say Minny has the toughest road and by strength of schedule it appears I am right.

I do not think there is any clear cut favorite to win it at this point.

Chi town has ? on offense
GB is A-Rod the man?
Minny QB? and tough schedule.
Det We are the Lions anything is possable.

I guess I will make my prediction after the draft and preseason.

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Old 04-17-2008, 02:22 AM    (permalink
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The Vikings should win it straight out.

Even with Jackson at QB.

They have everything but a QB.

Like the Bears a few years back.

The Lions stink, the Bears are on the downfall, the Packers will face a huge adjustment to life after Favre. Rodgers can't come in and replace Favre from the get go. He was a VERY special quarterback who made everyone around him better.

After the draft, the Vikes may damn well be a team without a weakness.

If they can get a legitimate defensive end and young stud QB, they'll be ready to rock. TE, offensive line, and other depth should be addressed as well.

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Old 04-17-2008, 10:26 AM    (permalink
Gay Ork Wang
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wow, can u say homer?
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Old 04-17-2008, 01:59 PM    (permalink
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Homer? Beyond the Cowboys and maybe the Giants who the Vikings killed by the way, no team looks better than the Vikings right now in the NFC.

The NFC is weak as hell.

Part of the reason why most were shocked that the Giants won the Super Bowl. The AFC is loaded with top teams. Much better competition.
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Old 04-17-2008, 02:02 PM    (permalink
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Homer? Beyond the Cowboys and maybe the Giants who the Vikings killed by the way, no team looks better than the Vikings right now in the NFC.

The NFC is weak as hell.

Part of the reason why most were shocked that the Giants won the Super Bowl. The AFC is loaded with top teams. Much better competition.
Yeah, I mean the Vikings obviously have no questions at QB, WR, TE, the whole right side of the O-Line, DE, LB, CB and S, not to mention the coaching staff. What have the Vikings done to leap frog every team that did better than them last year?
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:03 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, I mean the Vikings obviously have no questions at QB, WR, TE, the whole right side of the O-Line, DE, LB, CB and S, not to mention the coaching staff. What have the Vikings done to leap frog every team that did better than them last year?
Or a RB who has yet to prove, in College OR the pros, that he can actually stay healthy.

AD is a FANTASTIC BACK. Surreal, even. Until he gets injured. How many years has it been since he HASN'T gotten injured? I'm sorry, but really... you can't count on him. From week 10 on last season, THE PLAYOFF RACE, he was mediocre. Some weeks downright pitiful. 14 FOR 3 YARDS PITIFUL.

Behind him you have a decent back, yes, but a backfield of Chester Taylor and (wait, what's your QBs name again..? I mean, why bother remembering.. really) TARVARIS JACKSON, is a little less than intimidating. In fact, I'd put it among the bottom 5 in the league.

So the Vikings amongst the best in the NFC? LOL. Not so much.

It is STILL the Packer's division to win. Our offense is still the best in the division, even if Rodgers is only mediocre and so is our defense.

You can argue that the Bears or Vikings are better at certain spots, but the Packers are top 10, maybe top 5, in the entire league at every defensive area. Dline, linebackers, dbacks.

If you say "well, what if Rodgers gets injured AGAIN?" I'll cry. It is a valid arguement and I don't have a great answer. We need a decent/mediocre backup. Even that would give us a MUCH better offense than the Vikings, though, with Ryan Grant and a much better receiving core.

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Old 04-19-2008, 02:17 PM    (permalink
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The Vikings should win it straight out.

Even with Jackson at QB.

They have everything but a QB.

HAHAHAHAHHAH WHAT??!?!??!?!?!?!

Like the Bears a few years back.

The Lions stink, the Bears are on the downfall, the Packers will face a huge adjustment to life after Favre. Rodgers can't come in and replace Favre from the get go. He was a VERY special quarterback who made everyone around him better.

After the draft, the Vikes may damn well be a team without a weakness.

If they can get a legitimate defensive end and young stud QB, they'll be ready to rock. TE, offensive line, and other depth should be addressed as well.

Last time I checked Green Bay is still better despite losing Favre. Plus we'll probably draft a CB and we have such a young team that didnt even reach its full potential last year. We have better WR's than MIN, better OL, better TE's, better DE's, more depth at DT, better MLB, better WLB, better CB's, and our safties are getting better. Plus despite not starting yet, Rodgers is probably gonna be better than Jackson. Plus Grant isnt that far off from AD.

If any team is gonna take our title it will be Chicago.
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:20 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, I mean the Vikings obviously have no questions at QB, WR, TE, the whole right side of the O-Line, DE, LB, CB and S, not to mention the coaching staff. What have the Vikings done to leap frog every team that did better than them last year?
Do you say these things just for the sake of being a giant homer?

QB is a question mark for sure but it is a question mark for every team in the division.

WR is no longer a question mark with the signing of Berrian. Rice should develop from his first year into a very good 2nd WR and Wade is great in the slot.

TE is for sure a question mark depending on how the draft goes.

You are completly wrong about the whole right side of the line. Herrera is an excellent RG and as much as I do not like Cook he is a pretty damn good run blocking RT. I still think we need an upgrade at RT so that for sure is a question mark.

DE is our biggest position of need but if we trade for Allen we will have one of the best D-Lines in the NFL. From everything I have heard this will be our biggest priority come draft day.

I have no clue where you get LB as a need. Last year we had a very solid LB corp. LB was one of our strong points all of last year. Saying LB is a question mark for our team is a stupid statement.

Saying CB is a question mark is another incredibly stupid statement. We have 4 very capable starters. Winfield and Griffin are a very strong starting two.

S is a question mark for sure as far a depth. We still have no replacement for Sharper for when he retires. Other then that I just have no clue how you can see it is a question. Sharper and Williams are very capable and IMO pretty damn good starters.

So it seems to me that you just threw some ridiculous statements out there with no real prove at all.

As for as RB being a question mark we have Taylor and Peterson, two damn good RB's. I would argue that Peterson was injured because around mid season teams realized they could just stack the box every play and we could not capitilize. Do you really expect a rookie RB to continue to dominate every game with 9 guys in the box every play? It is stupid to say that RB is a question coming into next season. As far as injuries we have a very capable backup in Taylor, I guess time will tell is AD gets injured or not but either way RB is not a concern at all.
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:23 PM    (permalink
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Matt Birk will be 32, though C's do have good lifespans i think
Hutch will be 31, so who knows there
McKinnie will be 29 so he still has some left

(Hope my math isnt wrong)
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:32 PM    (permalink
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Matt Birk will be 32, though C's do have good lifespans i think
Hutch will be 31, so who knows there
McKinnie will be 29 so he still has some left

(Hope my math isnt wrong)
Are you trying to argue that the left side of our line is a need? That is just wrong.

The statement "Plus Grant isnt that far off from AD" shoud have gotten you banned on the spot Neko, that is just wrong. If you make statements, back them up.
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:45 PM    (permalink
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Oh I forgot, if Rodgers gets injured Favre is going to come back. Win/win!
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:47 PM    (permalink
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Oh I forgot, if Rodgers gets injured Favre is going to come back. Win/win!
So you only response to everything I just said is if Rodgers is injured Favre is coming back, which is based on a rumour that in all likelyhood is just Favre missing the game and talking out of his ass?
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:51 PM    (permalink
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Do you say these things just for the sake of being a giant homer?

QB is a question mark for sure but it is a question mark for every team in the division.

WR is no longer a question mark with the signing of Berrian. Rice should develop from his first year into a very good 2nd WR and Wade is great in the slot.

TE is for sure a question mark depending on how the draft goes.

You are completly wrong about the whole right side of the line. Herrera is an excellent RG and as much as I do not like Cook he is a pretty damn good run blocking RT. I still think we need an upgrade at RT so that for sure is a question mark.

DE is our biggest position of need but if we trade for Allen we will have one of the best D-Lines in the NFL. From everything I have heard this will be our biggest priority come draft day.

I have no clue where you get LB as a need. Last year we had a very solid LB corp. LB was one of our strong points all of last year. Saying LB is a question mark for our team is a stupid statement.

Saying CB is a question mark is another incredibly stupid statement. We have 4 very capable starters. Winfield and Griffin are a very strong starting two.

S is a question mark for sure as far a depth. We still have no replacement for Sharper for when he retires. Other then that I just have no clue how you can see it is a question. Sharper and Williams are very capable and IMO pretty damn good starters.

So it seems to me that you just threw some ridiculous statements out there with no real prove at all.

As for as RB being a question mark we have Taylor and Peterson, two damn good RB's. I would argue that Peterson was injured because around mid season teams realized they could just stack the box every play and we could not capitilize. Do you really expect a rookie RB to continue to dominate every game with 9 guys in the box every play? It is stupid to say that RB is a question coming into next season. As far as injuries we have a very capable backup in Taylor, I guess time will tell is AD gets injured or not but either way RB is not a concern at all.
QB is a definite question mark, regardless of the other teams. Unfortunately, your QB does not do better if the other QB sucks just as much.

WR is still a question mark. Overpaying for Berrian doesn't remove the question mark.

I understand that your o-line can run block. They simply aren't good at pass blocking.

Last I checked, you don't have Jared Allen, so your DEs still suck.

I should have specified. I don't think your LB group is complete. Obviously Henderson is very good, and Greenway made some serious steps last year coming off an injury, but I don't think Leber is that great.

Griffen has yet to really prove himself. He has great potential, but he has not broken out yet. Oh, and please tell me all 4 of your capable NFL starters on the roster. I'd love to hear this.
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Old 04-19-2008, 02:59 PM    (permalink
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Are you trying to argue that the left side of our line is a need? That is just wrong.

The statement "Plus Grant isnt that far off from AD" shoud have gotten you banned on the spot Neko, that is just wrong. If you make statements, back them up.
Grant was the leading rusher during the 2nd half of the year. Granted he didnt have to go through an entire season, but that is still very impressive. Do you honestly think Grant is just some pedestrian back?


THere I backed it up

Im not saying your left side is in need, its just a bit old, so are out OT's but we have a ton of young linemen
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Old 04-19-2008, 03:02 PM    (permalink
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QB is a definite question mark, regardless of the other teams. Unfortunately, your QB does not do better if the other QB sucks just as much.

WR is still a question mark. Overpaying for Berrian doesn't remove the question mark.

I understand that your o-line can run block. They simply aren't good at pass blocking.

Last I checked, you don't have Jared Allen, so your DEs still suck.

I should have specified. I don't think your LB group is complete. Obviously Henderson is very good, and Greenway made some serious steps last year coming off an injury, but I don't think Leber is that great.

Griffen has yet to really prove himself. He has great potential, but he has not broken out yet. Oh, and please tell me all 4 of your capable NFL starters on the roster. I'd love to hear this.
I never said QB wasn't a question mark. I just pointed out it is that way for every other team in the division and this is about who wins the North.

What does overpaying have to do with anything? That was the market and that is the kind of contract a guy like Berrian commands. He gives us a deep threat to pair with a very good young WR in Rice and a proven slot WR in Wade. Our WR should improve tenfold from last year. Sure, it is not a good and the Packers WR corp but that does not make WR a question mark.

We will be addressing the O-Line come draft day because of their pass blocking deficiencies.

Our DE's suck at pass rush yes, but I was merely pointing out that the draft is still to come.

The LB corp is complete. Sure, you don't like Leber but either way I am sure everyone on the forum can agree we have a solid line. Leber is very underated and not a question mark.

We have Winfield, Griffin, McCauley, Gordon. The former two have proven they are good starters in the league, especially in the Tampa 2 system. The later two are less proven but have made the most out of the playing time they have been given and should improve even more this year.

I really believe the only big question marks on the team are QB, TE, RT, DE and of course some depth.
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Old 04-19-2008, 03:31 PM    (permalink
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Grant was the leading rusher during the 2nd half of the year. Granted he didnt have to go through an entire season, but that is still very impressive. Do you honestly think Grant is just some pedestrian back?


THere I backed it up

Im not saying your left side is in need, its just a bit old, so are out OT's but we have a ton of young linemen
Grant also had the luxury of having one of the NFL's top passing attacks led by Brett Favre to open up the running lanes for him. Teams weren't game planning to stop Ryan Grant they were focused on stopping Favre. This year with Rodgers at the helm Ryan Grant should become more of the focus point for the opposing defenses we will see how good he really is.

When Grant is averaging 5.6 yards per carry over an entire season against constantly stacked boxes than maybe you can say he is in AD's league until then it's an absolutly absurd statement.
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